Shri Dasam Granth Sahib Does Not Support Manusamriti

[spnadmin]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

when there are doubts in your mind you need to ask questions. to ignore them and say i am a mortal i have no right question is not good.

Deepsingh ji

I agree - You do need to ask questions. Very often we find ourselves reading the "answers" to questions that no one ever asked. We are reading answers to issues raised for the sake of butting heads rather than achieving clarity. I think you should continue to ask about contradictions especially when those contradictions are raised by mere mortals -- who presume to know what the 10th Master wrote and what he meant. Find out if they really do know from the answers they give you.

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

Glimpse of the oldest available beerh of Sri Dasam Granth from 1698 AD


Glimpse of the oldest available beerh of Sri Dasam Granth from 1698 AD




Contents from the rare handwritten beerh of Sri Dasam Granth compiled in 1755 Bikrami (1698 A.D.), one year before the formation of Khalsa. The date when this historic beerh was compiled is given in the introductory paragraph. This beerh is preserved at Takhat Sri Patna Sahib. It is noteworthy that Guru Gobind Singh Sahib’s bani "Zafarnamah" which was written in 1704 A.D., six years after this beerh was compiled, does not feature in this beerh. Also noteworthy is the name of the granth that appears on the top, “Patshah Dasven Ju Ka Granth” (The Granth of the Tenth Master).

The year mentioned on this handwritten beerh is also significant because Bhai Kesar Singh Chibber too in Bansavalinama records that Guru Gobind Singh Sahib had himself compiled the Granth in 1755 Bikrami (1698 A.D.), and this Chhota Granth[1] was very dear to him. Evidently this is one of the oldest beerhs which Guru Sahib himself compiled before the formation of the Khalsa. Later compilations of the complete banees of Guru Gobind Singh Sahib is attributed to Bhai Mani Singh.

ਛੋਟਾ ਗਰੰਥ ਜੀ ਜਨਮੇ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਦਸਵੇਂ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹ ਕੇ ਧਾਮ।
ਸੰਮਤ ਸਤਾਰਾਂ ਸੈ ਪਚਵੰਜਾ, ਬਹੁਤ ਖਿਡਾਵੇ ਲਿਖਾਰੇ ਨਾਮ।
ਸਾਹਿਬ ਨੂੰ ਸੀ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਹਥੀਂ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਖਿਡਾਇਆ। ​

ਸਿਖਾਂ ਕੀਤੀ ਅਰਦਾਸ, 'ਜੀ ਅਗਲੇ (ਭਾਵ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ) ਨਾਲਿ ਚਾਹੀਏ ਰਲਾਇਆ'।
ਬਚਨ ਕੀਤਾ, 'ਗਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਹੈ ਉਹ, ਏਹ ਅਸਾਡੀ ਖੇਡ ਹੈ।'
ਨਾਲਿ ਨ ਮਿਲਾਇਆ ਆਹਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ, ਕਉਨ ਜਾਣੈ ਭੇਦ।​

ਸੋ ਦੋਨੋ ਗਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰ ਕਿਰ ਜਾਨੋ।​

ਵਡਾ ਹੈ ਟਿਕਾ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੁਟਕੇ ਪੋਥੀਆਂ ਪੁਤਰ ਪੋਤਰੇ ਕਿਰ ਪਛਾਨੋ​

(ਬੰਸਾਵਲੀਨਾਮਾ, ਭਾਈ ਕੇਸਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਛਿੱਬਰ) [1] Kesar Singh Chibber calls the granth as Chotta Granth (small granth) in relation to the status of Sri Guru Granth Sahib

​

​

The first paragraph is transcribed below:​

ੴਸ੍ਰੀਵਾਹਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ​

ਸ੍ਰੀਭਗਉਤੀਜੂਸਹਾਇ​

ਤਤਕਰਾ ਸੁਚੇਪੱਤ੍ਰਸ੍ਰੀਗ੍ਰਿੰਥਜੂਕਾ​

ਬਾਣੀ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹਦਸਵੇਂਜੂਕੇਗ੍ਰਿੰਥਕਾ​

ਸੰਬਤ 1755.ਮਿਤੀਅਸਾੜਬਦੀ1​

ਕੋਗ੍ਰਿੰਥਲਿਖਿਆ: ਤਵਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ​

ਸ੍ਰੀਮੁਖਵਾਕਪਾਤਿਸਾਹੀ10​

Picture Courtesy: Sant Sipahi Magazine
​

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• Smallest Beerh of Sri Dasam Granth
• A rare glimpse of the historic beerh prepared by Bhai Mani Singh Ji

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Thus said the Master...

ਕਿਤੇ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਸੇ ਕੀਟ ਕੋਟੈ ਬਨਾਏ ॥ ਕਿਤੇ ਰਾਮ ਸੇ ਮੇਟਿ ਡਾਰੇ ਉਪਾਏ ॥
Somewhere He hath created millions of servants like Krishna. Somewhere He hath effaced and then created (many) like Rama. (pg.98)
Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib





Guru's Sikhs

ਸਿਖ ਜੇ ਤਿਹਾਰੇ ਸਭ ਸੰਗਯਾ ਮਾਹਿ ਸਿੰਘ ਭਯੇ,
​

ਸਮਰ ਮੇ ਸਿੰਘ ਭਯੇ ਸਿੰਘ ਭਯੇ ਜਗ ਮੇ॥​

(ਕਵੀ ਗਵਾਲ, ਗੁਰ ਮਹਿਮਾ ਰਤਨਾਵਲੀ)​

A Sikh who utters your banee becomes Lion by definition,​

He becomes a Lion in the battlefield and a Lion in the real world.​

(Kavi Gawaal, Gur Mahima Ratnavali)​

​

Coming Soon

Gyani Sant Singh Maskeen does katha on the purpose of Charitropakhyan

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

His hand written pages and signature are there in Hazuri bir of 1698.

That is a good start. If authentication demonstrates that hand written pages match authenticated sample of Guru's handwriting, then we are off to a good start. Tell us more about authentication of pages in the Hazoori Bir.

We could even read a scholarly work by Dr. Jasbir Singh on the textual analysis of Dasam Granth at this link.

Textual Analysis History and Academic Issues of DG@@AMEPARAM@@/docinfo/13262850?access_key=key-me0tc478o5oahldgy7o@@AMEPARAM@@13262850@@AMEPARAM@@key-me0tc478o5oahldgy7o

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

That is a good start. If authentication demonstrates that hand written pages match authenticated sample of Guru's handwriting, then we are off to a good start. Tell us more about authentication of pages in the Hazoori Bir.

We could even read a scholarly work by Dr. Jasbir Singh on the textual analysis of Dasam Granth at this link.

Textual Analysis History and Academic Issues of DG

Dr Jasbir singh Mann is a biased party. He has not seen hazuri bir. How can he write about it when he has not seen it.

We called him for an international seminar at sacramento so that we could show him ceratin things. he kept quiet and called me one day before seminar saying he was not coming.

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

aad0002 ji

I had posted a verse from SGGS ji in the morning meaning that akal purakh himself is shiv and himself a
shakti. I do not see it here. Who has deleted it.

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

Deepsingh ji

I agree - You do need to ask questions. Very often we find ourselves reading the "answers" to questions that no one ever asked. We are reading answers to issues raised for the sake of butting heads rather than achieving clarity. I think you should continue to ask about contradictions especially when those contradictions are raised by mere mortals -- who presume to know what the 10th Master wrote and what he meant. Find out if they really do know from the answers they give you.

On religious scriptures there are no doubts. Neither these scriptures are academically analysed. Because domain of academics and spiritualism is not same.

These contradictions are not there but these have been created by mischief mongers.
Read akal takhat matta of 2006.

http://www.patshahi10.org/index.php...ahib-matta-2006&catid=36:hukamnamas&Itemid=74


This is in no way realted to deep singha s he is a genuine seeker.
Akal Takhat Sahib Matta 2006



"Those speaking against Dasam Granth are mischievous miscreants" - Akal Takhat Sahib

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[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

A deliberate Attempt by Jasbir Singh Mann to denigrate the members of the Sodhak Committee


A deliberate Attempt by Jasbir Singh Mann to denigrate the members of the Sodhak Committee



A deliberate Attempt by Jasbir Singh Mann to denigrate the members of the Sodhak Committee*


Jasbir Singh Mann in his article Debate on Dasam Granth; Issues and Evidence has listed the members of the Sodhak Committee (1897) along with their 'credentials'.
Comparing the name list which JS Mann has prepared with the original list of the members which appears in the Sodhak Committee report it is very evident that JS Mann has intentionally tried to discredit the competence of those who participated in the deliberations.
JS Mann has deliberately deleted the information about the academic, linguistic scholarship of most of the individuals. He has also skipped all information regarding the association these members had with various Sikh organizations.

JS Mann

Sodhak Committee Report

1. Mana Singh Hakim, known for correct recitation

1. Bhai Manna Singh Hakim, Secretary Gurmat Granth Pracharak Sabha,known for correct recitation. Has knowledge of English, Persian and Gurmukhi grammar

1. Bhai Narain Singh, Teacher

1. Bhai Narain Singh, Persian Scholarand Teacher Government School.

1. Bhai Thakar Singh, Clerk Municipal Committee

1. Bhai Thakar Singh, Clerk Municipal Committee. Proficient in Persian and Gurmukhi. Has knowledge ofPingal (Science of Poetry) and Raagas.

1. Bhai Hajura Singh, Secretary Lakar Mandi

1. Bhai Hazura Singh, Ragi Sri Darbar Sahib Amritsar, and SecretarySangat Lakar Mandi

1. Dharam Singh, Famous for Chhabil Sewa

1. Bhai Dharam Singh, Member Khalsa Sat Sangat Sabha

1. Bhai Sant Singh, Gurmukhi Teacher

1. Bhai Sant Singh, Gurmukhi Teacher in MB School

1. Bhai Darbara Singh with education of Giani

1. Bhai Darbara Singh, Proficient in English and Gurmukhi (Grandson of Giani Gian Singh)

1. Jaidial Singh, Middle pass

1. Bhai Jaidial Singh, Middle pass,Teacher MB Branch School

1. Gurdial Singh, Gurmukh Person

1. Bhai Gurdial Singh, Gurmukh Person

1. Kishan Singh Ji, Rice Dealer

1. Bhai Kishan Singh Ji and Ram Singh Ji, Keerti Singhs, Rice Dealer,Members Sat Sangat Sabha

1. Naran Singh,

1. Bhai Narain Singh, Secretary Khalsa Sat Sangat Sabha

Bhai Thakur Singh, Chaawlaanwale, Member Sat Sangat Sabha,
Bhai Partap Singh, Secretary Khalsa Vidyarathi Sabha,
Bhai Bhagwan Singh, Secretary Sangat Chaursti, Attari
Bhai Harnam Singh, Member Khalsa Vidyarathi Sabha
Bhai Harnam Singh, Clerk, Kila Gobindgarh
Bhai Boorh Singh, Secretary Sangat Katra Kalan
Bhai Tek Singh, Secretary Sangat Dauk Baba Sahib
Bhai Ram Singh Attar
Bhai Makhan Singh, Sweet Maker
Bhai Gurdial Singh
Bhai Ghanaya Singh
Bhai Teja Singh

1. Thakur Singh Rice Dealer,

1. Makhan Singh, Sweet Maker

To discredit the competence of the members he has intentionally chosen to highlight their occupation.
There are around 24 members listed in the Sodhak Committee report, whereas JS Mann lists only 13 members in his article.

In the original Sodhak Committee report 13 members are listed together in the end. JS Mann selectively chose to give only two names from these 13 members based on their occupation. He writes the name of Thakur Singh (Rice Dealer) and Makhan Singh (Sweet Maker) without mentioning their religious associations etc.
It is unethical and immoral to mould a historic document in order to prove a hypothesis. Though most of the assertions made by JS Mann in his article are non-historic and only based on conspiracy theories, this clear tampering with an important document from Sikh history speaks volumes about JS Mann's actual intent to misinform and mislead.
-------------------------------------------------

*A Note from The Sikh Encyclopedia about Sodhak Committee Report:

Another important task undertaken by the (Gurmat Granth Parcharak) Sabha was the preparation, at the instance of the Amritsar Singh Sabha, of an authentic recession of the Dasam Granth. Funds for the project were provided by the Sabha secretary, Bhai Manna Singh Hakim, himself. Thirty two different recessions were collected and several prominent scholars and theologians were invited to study them. They met at the Akal Takhat at Amritsar, and held formal discussions in a series of meetings between 13 June 1895 and 16 February 1896. A preliminary report entitled Report Sodhak (revision) Committee Dasam Patshah de Granth Sahib Di was sent to Sikh scholars and institutions, inviting their opinion. A second document, Report Dasam Granth di Sudhai Di was brought out on 11 February 1898. Basing its conclusions on a study of the old handwritten copies of the Dasam Granth preserved at Sri Takht Sahib at Patna and in other Sikh gurudwaras, this report affirmed that the Holy Volume was compiled at Anandpur Sahib in 1698.
Additional information:

CLICK HERE TO READ THE REPORT OF THE SODHAK COMMITTEE

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

Inder ji

You say these kinds of things in every forum where you write on just about every topic you latch onto. There should be no doubts (this is your premise and your premise only) and therefore no one should ever ask questions (this is the conclusion that you draw from your premise). And it really doesn't matter what the subject of a thread is because you will always at some point in the discussion make this claim.
The problem is -- in order for someone to agree that NO ONE SHOULD ASK QUESTIONS a person would have to agree with your premise that THERE SHOULD BE NO DOUBTS.

That equation is an speedy path to mind control and brainwashing. The kind of thing that goes on in Baba Deras on a regular basis. And of course our glorious Sikhi has never espoused mind control and brainwashing.

I think you need to go back to the very first post in this thread and consider whether the discussion has seriously veered away from the original purpose of the thread starter.

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

I am not surprised by this either, A deliberate Attempt by Jasbir Singh Mann to denigrate the members of the Sodhak Committee*

I posted the e-book and sat back and waited for you to produce this exact retort.

The problem is the retort is not a serious discussion of the issues raised by Jasbir Singh Mann.

BTW I clicked the link and this is where I ended
Not Found

The requested URL /patshahi10/1897report.pdf was not found on this server.

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

Inder ji

You say these kinds of things in every forum where you write on just about every topic you latch onto. There should be no doubts (this is your premise and your premise only) and therefore no one should ever ask questions (this is the conclusion that you draw from your premise). And it really doesn't matter what the subject of a thread is because you will always at some point in the discussion make this claim.
The problem is -- in order for someone to agree that NO ONE SHOULD ASK QUESTIONS a person would have to agree with your premise that THERE SHOULD BE NO DOUBTS.

That equation is an speedy path to mind control and brainwashing. The kind of thing that goes on in Baba Deras on a regular basis. And of course our glorious Sikhi has never espoused mind control and brainwashing.

I think you need to go back to the very first post in this thread and consider whether the discussion has seriously veered away from the original purpose of the thread starter.

What did i say?e be specific and post a reference.

Questions should be asked to clear impediment in the progress of spitiuality. here doubts are being created about our religious scritpures. Have you seen the edict of akal takhat sahib? People say openly they do not abide by sikh rehat maryada.

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

What did i say?e be specific and post a reference.

Questions should be asked to clear impediment in the progress of spitiuality. here doubts are being created about our religious scritpures. Have you seen the edict of akal takhat sahib? People say openly they do not abide by sikh rehat maryada.

Inder ji - Thank you for another excellent example of how 3 ideas have been merged so nothing makes any sense. If you yourself abide by the edit of Akal Takhat you would not be discussing any thing that would contribute to controversy about Dasam Granth. This edit was issued 2 or 3 years ago. Are you following it? Jathedar ji did not say that only the people who question the authenticity of Dasam Granth must be quiet. And those who believe in its authenticity are permitted to speak at length in any forum they choose.

Now onto the main point I would like to make. The Report of the Sodhak Committee can be criticized and it was.

Assessmen of Report of Sodhak Committeee - Gurtej Singh@@AMEPARAM@@/docinfo/13262650?access_key=key-9qccp6reebm2euopkn4@@AMEPARAM@@13262650@@AMEPARAM@@key-9qccp6reebm2euopkn4

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

I am not surprised by this either, A deliberate Attempt by Jasbir Singh Mann to denigrate the members of the Sodhak Committee*

I posted the e-book and sat back and waited for you to produce this exact retort.

The problem is the retort is not a serious discussion of the issues raised by Jasbir Singh Mann.

BTW I clicked the link and this is where I ended
Not Found

The requested URL /patshahi10/1897report.pdf was not found on this server.

Thank you for fixing the link veer ji, aad0002

I am surprised that you did not find the link.
Try again

A deliberate Attempt by Jasbir Singh Mann to denigrate the members of the Sodhak Committee

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

The problem is the retort is not a serious discussion of the issues raised by Jasbir Singh Mann.

Jasbir singh is on record not knowing anything about dasam Granth bani. A discussion took place on learning zone and he was caught beating about bush. Then he did not write further on this topic.
You want to see the reference?

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

Jasbir singh is on record not knowing anything about dasam Granth bani. A discussion took place on learning zone and he was caught beating about bush. Then he did not write further on this topic.
You want to see the reference?

Are you serious!

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

Inder ji - Thank you for another excellent example of how 3 ideas have been merged so nothing makes any sense. If you yourself abide by the edit of Akal Takhat you would not be discussing any thing that would contribute to controversy about Dasam Granth. This edit was issued 2 or 3 years ago. Are you following it? Jathedar ji did not say that only the people who question the authenticity of Dasam Granth must be quiet. And those who believe in its authenticity are permitted to speak at length in any forum they choose.

Now onto the main point I would like to make. The Report of the Sodhak Committee can be criticized and it was.

Assessmen of Report of Sodhak Committeee - Gurtej Singh

When the party did not abide by akal takhat issued a Hukamnama to counter these mischief mongers. That is when Gursikhs who abide by akal takhat started replying the slander group. That is when these sites came up.

You cite another person here who have very poor credentials and is the man who craeted this controversy out of nowhere.

 

[Inder singh]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

Are you serious!

You bet.I am absolutely serious. want to see and i will put the refrences here.

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

INDER SINGH WROTE..

<<<<<To discredit the competence of the members he has intentionally chosen to highlight their occupation.<<<<<<<<<<<< ABOUT JS MANN...

BUT THIS IS EXACTLY WHY HE DISAPPROVES OF PROF.INDER SINGH GHAGHHA....Because he was a DRIVER !! Bijlee board da driver !!! meaning what can we learn from a mere DRIVER ??

Isnt DRIVER an "Occupation"..and IF he accuses JS Mann of POINTING OUT OCCUPATIONS of people to DISCREDIT THEM.....why did he write off Prof Inder Singh Ghaggha simply becasue he used to be a DRIVER ??....and KA used to be Policeman ?

What is goose for the gander ??

Way BACK i asked soemone in a Private PM...about a Certain PHD who has done so much research on DG.....and is paraded by prodg on seminars and all...and accepted as THE authority on dg and suppsoedly UNBIASED...whether alll that "reserach" on DG (on which Foundation the Amrit/Khalsa/Panj Kakars etc etc " is supposed to STAND...has had any EFFECT on this RESEARCHER ?? TOTAL SILENCE !! by SINGH JI....despite passage of nearly a WEEK !!! Mona still stays MONA...and WHY ??
ISNT bani supposed to CHANGE PEOPLE ?? IF simply asking a question...expressing doubts..puts the entire Khalsa panth in DANGER..of disintegration....why double standards...all this delving deep into dg didnt do a single change in thsi person ?? I hope SINGH (or various aliases Singh1, singh2 shingh3, singh4, singh 5 and "Five Singhs"..whatever answers this question/doubt so that i can progress further...I am also waiting for PM reply)

 

[Inder singh]

INDER SINGH WROTE..

<<<<<To discredit the competence of the members he has intentionally chosen to highlight their occupation.<<<<<<<<<<<< ABOUT JS MANN...

BUT THIS IS EXACTLY WHY HE DISAPPROVES OF PROF.INDER SINGH GHAGHHA....Because he was a DRIVER !! Bijlee board da driver !!! meaning what can we learn from a mere DRIVER ??

He was not only a driver but also a convicted as a thief and jailed. want reference. I can furnish refrences if you wish. Now people say that kala afghana was just a figurehead as and real writer was somebody else as 8th standard policeman is not able to write 10 books in aperiod of two theree years.

No occupation is condemnable but blasphemy is certainly condemnable.

Way BACK i asked soemone in a Private PM...about a Certain PHD who has done so much research on DG.....and is paraded by prodg on seminars and all...and accepted as THE authority on dg and suppsoedly UNBIASED...whether alll that "reserach" on DG (on which Foundation the Amrit/Khalsa/Panj Kakars etc etc " is supposed to STAND...has had any EFFECT on this RESEARCHER ?? TOTAL SILENCE !! by SINGH JI....despite passage of nearly a WEEK !!! Mona still stays MONA...and WHY ??

You did not write staright. You wrote obliquely. We did bring this deficiency to his notice. he admitted it and he assured us that it was his weakness and he will become a khalsa in the near future.

There is no compromise on sikh rehat. Do not run in circles if you want to ask a question.

ISNT bani supposed to CHANGE PEOPLE ?? IF simply asking a question...expressing doubts..puts the entire Khalsa panth in DANGER..of disintegration....why double standards...all this delving deep into dg didnt do a single change in thsi person ?? I hope SINGH (or various aliases Singh1, singh2 shingh3, singh4, singh 5 and "Five Singhs"..whatever answers this question/doubt so that i can progress further...I am also waiting for PM reply)

What PM you are talking about? I did not receive any PM.

 

[spnadmin]

Re: Shri Dasham Granth Sahib does not support Manusamriti, Answers to S.Harmanjeet Si

You bet.I am absolutely serious. want to see and i will put the refrences here.

No, because I am a member of learning zone and can read anything at my leisure. What i am asking is how you can think that a conversation on the Internet "proves" that Jasbir Singh Mann was "beating around the bush." That is your impression. Not evidence of anything substantial to move this discussion forward.

At some point tonight or tomorrow I want to return to the points made by the thread starter in Post 1 to see how much we have really discussed versus how much we have been discussing your agenda.

 

[Inder singh]

No, because I am a member of learning zone and can read anything at my leisure. What i am asking is how you can think that a conversation on the Internet "proves" that Jasbir Singh Mann was "beating around the bush." That is your impression. Not evidence of anything substantial to move this discussion forward.

Because he was misquoting verses grossly. there was a question how can he say that the Granth is written by some hindu. he quoted a verse and he was caught. I have to dig and will put reference here.