• Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
    Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
    Sign up Log in

Hinduism Does Sikhism Confirm The Existence Of Hindu Gods/Goddesses?

Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
72
I feel if we analyse any philosophy with prejudiced view it would not be possible to understand and our interpretation may not justify the significance of that particular philosophy.

I feel when there are questions related to Hindu Mythological references in SGGS we take altogether different views.But how we justify the use of the word GOD in relation to SGGS.Here we feel exempted from the blame of promoting western philosophies rather Sikh philosophy

There is need to understand the messages of Gurbaani more deeply to avoid the conflicting views of reference of particular philosophy in SGGS.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Kanwaljit.Singh

Writer
SPNer
Jan 29, 2011
1,501
2,172
Vancouver, Canada
Obviously I am in stark disagreement with Kanwaljit Singh on the point that the devtas are avatars of Akaal Purakh. Akaal does not incarnate and therefore has no avatars. In full disclosure, I tend toward the vichaar of Sikh Missionary College Ludhiana which discourages the idea that Akaal incarnates.

SPNAdmin ji, I called them Avatari Purush which I believe means people who had some divinity or good qualities about them. They were mortals not walking God.

I don't believe Akaal Purakh can take an Avatar. Well here is what I think.. say at some point of time, God took 'birth' as Avatar in say Ayodhya. Since God was in Ayodhya, all life as we know it was taken away from the rest of universe. Or maybe the universe shrunk to the size of Ayodhya. But that didn't happen. Hence God cannot come as Avatar in one place or other. God is Ajooni and permeates the whole universe.
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
Manual for Basic Servicing Range Rover 1994 4.2 V8​

For maximum protection always use oil to fill the oil sump.DO NOT USE WATER
When filling up at a petrol station, use unleaded.DO NOT USE WATER
Always inflate the tyres with air.DO NOT USE WATER
Top up Brake reservoir with brake fluid. DO NOT USE WATER

Hello, Land Rover helpline, I have big problems, your manual mentioned water so many times, I have mistakenly topped up all my fluids with it, HELP
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jul 4, 2004
7,708
14,381
75
KUALA LUMPUR MALAYSIA
Harry Ji..GREAT. YOU Hit the nail right on its square head !! FLAT IN ALL THE WAY.
SIKHS are filling up their "Gaddeh" with WATER and then asking GURU JI..HEY Guru..you mentioned all those gods and goddesses so many times..we decided they were GOD !!..and now our gaddah has died !!cheerleadercheerleadercheerleadercheerleadercheerleadercheerleader
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jul 4, 2004
7,708
14,381
75
KUALA LUMPUR MALAYSIA
Ambarsariah Ji.. at the physical level..we may be living at opposite ends of the earth...hence the night nighty on your end....while its rise and shine at my end...BUT at the mental/spiritual/atmic level we are in perfect sync. A very nice weekend to you too ji..

Btw that relative of yours was a living person..here in Malaysia, there is a SHRINE under every tree and stone..even by the roadside....headstones for accident victims on the roadshoulder..where strangers bow as well hoping the dead one may just give them a lottery number..who knows ?? Every pippal tree, ancient tree with granled roots will be sure to have a shrine..chinese god, hindu god..thai god..buddhist god..depends on who came first...and even SIKHS matha tek at a few.....so IF I installed a Deva ranjit statue under a really old majestic looking tree..i can get a comfortbale income with no effort..in fact some of the "gods" look like ME..flowing white beards and yellow patkas..gingerteakaur:interestedmunda:
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
Gyaniji

I visualise everyone here in my head, I had always hoped you would look like Baba Deep Singh, please do not ruin it for me in the future by telling me you were an extra in 'the wizard of oz' as one of the munchkins

Flowing white beard and yellow patka sounds good to me:)
 
Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
72
The word executive should be considered merly as floowing the Hukum of the Creator .Nothing beyond this. In this context we all are executives of the Creator only.

We sre required to know the way references of Hindu mythology are being corroborated in SGGS .From Gurbaani we come to know how these mythologiclal references can be undersood in terms ofthe word GuRU/GuRu and GuR.One should not feel abhorrent about any word of Gurbaani because one can find these three words are related to the basic concept of the whole of Sikh Phlosophy.

I am simply presenting my observed views from Gurbaani.Anyone has full right to agree or disagree according to ones understanding of the subject matter.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jul 4, 2004
7,708
14,381
75
KUALA LUMPUR MALAYSIA
Harry ji,
Baba Deep Singh Ji is one of my favourites..along with Bhai mani Singh Ji.and Bhai Bachittar Singh Ji.......and the Sahibzadahs Ajit Singh Jhujaar Singh....( not to say that all the others in their hundred thusands are not in my head all the time)..BUT I can never never reach even a trillionth measure of the dust beneath their feet...all i can do is love them with all my power and will that i can emulate them in a tiny way....btw i share my birth date with baba deep singh ji.....have a nice weekend..Jios..I have a freedom march to attend tomorrow...:blueturban::redturban:
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
5,769
8,194
55
:)

Baba Deep Singh is one of my inspirations too, as a child, when we used to go to Amritsar, I would head for place where he was shaheed. In the picture below, I love the way he stands like a strong tree, unwavering, resolute, have a great march Gyaniji
 

Attachments

  • babadeepsingh4.jpg
    babadeepsingh4.jpg
    45 KB · Reads: 206

aristotle

SPNer
May 10, 2010
1,156
2,653
Ancient Greece
Do you think that Dasam Granth is simply poetry some of which is based on Hindu legends such as elements of the story of Durga to simple get people in the state of mind to fight regardless of whether she existed, has lots of arms or not?

Dasam Granth is no doubt a spiritual text, but when we talk about the same we miss the most basic point, it is not our Guru. Our Guru is Guru Granth Sahib Ji and no other spiritual text can replace our Guru. This point was validated by Guru Gobind Singh Ji himself when he bestowed the title of Guru on Guru Granth Sahib, ignoring all other parallel texts, even the Dasam Granth. So, we should stop blindly following the word-by-word translation of the Dasam Granth. There aren't any questions about the supremacy of the Akal Purakh and the non-existence of alleged Gods/Goddesses, you may find ample references from the Guru Granth Sahib Ji supporting the same.
Moreover, the author of Dasam Granth himself quotes at a number of instances that he doesn't believe in any other Gods/Goddesses except the Akal Purakh. You may find many such mentions in the Akal Ustat, Jaap Sahib and other Chapters of the Dasam Granth. Even in the alleged mythological texts like Chandi di Vaar, Krishnavtaar etc., the author seeks help from the Akal Purakh and praises his unique figure and all-pervading glory.

So, If you would ask me the conclusion in a single line, Even the Dasam Granth says that Gods/Goddesses dont exist at all and are just a part of moral stories which are simple fiction and have no relation with history or reality.
 

spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
SPNer
Jun 17, 2004
14,500
19,219
SPNAdmin ji, I called them Avatari Purush which I believe means people who had some divinity or good qualities about them. They were mortals not walking God.

I don't believe Akaal Purakh can take an Avatar. Well here is what I think.. say at some point of time, God took 'birth' as Avatar in say Ayodhya. Since God was in Ayodhya, all life as we know it was taken away from the rest of universe. Or maybe the universe shrunk to the size of Ayodhya. But that didn't happen. Hence God cannot come as Avatar in one place or other. God is Ajooni and permeates the whole universe.

Kanwaljit Singh ji

Thanks for this reminder. Akal is Ajooni. So for me: If Akal is Ajooni, then Akal has no need for avatars. If Akal permeates the whole universe, then why avatars? There are no avatars of Akaal. It is a contradiction in terms.

I do think pondering the God, avatar, Ayodhya connection makes Sikhi into the complex web of theories and stories that simple sanatan veda became over centuries. Why do we take the brilliant jewel of Sikhi and cloud it with complex theoretical propositions?
 

Verma1

SPNer
Oct 9, 2011
15
5
As someone who is both Hindu and Sikh, the existence of Hindu Gods and Goddesses is most definitely acknowledged in the Granth. Sikhism says that one should not just perform religious duties and just worship idols only without meditation as this will not bring 'Mukti'. In order to gain Mukti, one has to meditate oneself. At that time, people were occupied with going to Temples and performing rituals without meditating thinking they will achieve Mukti by taking part in religious activity. The Gurus reminded people that they also do need to meditate themselves as performing religious duties in the world ALONE will not mean Mukti.

Sikh's also have pictures of the Gurus in their homes, at the Temple, etc and that is the same as Hindus. Lord Rama, Krishna and the other Gods are incarnates of God and are Hindu Gurus, They came in the world to show people the right path. As time went on, people started to forget what our Gods taught us and instead of following their teachings to meditate, started to worship them only. It is fine to worship Gods and Goddesses as they are Hindu Gurus, but at the same time, actually doing what they taught us aswell. Hindus do not worship idols just to clarify, they worship Gods and Goddesses in the image of God, which is the same as how we worship Guru Nanak and other Gurus as well as having Their pictures at home.
 

Kanwaljit.Singh

Writer
SPNer
Jan 29, 2011
1,501
2,172
Vancouver, Canada
Sikh's also have pictures of the Gurus in their homes, at the Temple, etc and that is the same as Hindus.

Sikhs are not required to have the pictures in Gurudwaras or homes and the practice is not encouraged either.

And you could face backlash if you say that Hindu Gods were Human Gurus (just like people do if they say Jesus was not Son of God, but Human Prophet!)
 

Verma1

SPNer
Oct 9, 2011
15
5
About 3000 years down the line..maybe..Maharaja ranjit Singh could becoem a DEVTA as equivalent to the Raja of Dwarka..or the raja Dassareth..etc etc...SRI RANJIT...and this Devta would be concoted as an Avtaar..and making multiple journeys to Heaven swarahg..shooting magical arrows and flying on elephants..not farfetched...the Krishans and the Raams were just ordinary RAJAS..KINGS..who were made into Avtaars...there is a mandir to JAYALALITHA the actress cum politician..and shes not dead yet !! Anway SRI RANJIT is a much more credible avtaar becasue he made mincemeat of the marauding invaders who looted the land for a THOUSAND YEARS uninterrupted !! Imagien the Immense WEALTH they must have LOOTED by looking at the Treasure just discovered in one small Hindu mandir...already worth about 100,000 KROR and COUNTING !! This is small change compared to the vast treasures in the huge Mandirs that Gauri looted 17 times !!

2. The Brahma and all that about Mai in japji Sahib...what GURU JI is saying..What is BRahma..Vishnu Shivji Mai Ji..etc etc are ALL what MY GURU is to ME !! MY Guru is brahma..MY GURU is vishnu..MY GURU is Shivji..MY GURU is Mai the Devi goddess or whatever....Simple enough. Its NOT at all about Guru Ji endorsing/certifying/applauding/verifying..whatever about the existence/verasity/power/whatever of these brahmas vishnus...BECAUSE Gurbani clearly says in so many places..there are thousands upon thosuands of Brahms, vishnus shivjis and mais....so whats one Brahma ??..........BUT Guru Nanak jis "GURU" is ONE and ONE ONLY..there is NO Other like HIM..no other equal to HIM..none comparable to HIM...this si the BOTTOM LINE here.

Gyani Jurnail Singh - I STRONGLY disagree with you. Lord Vishnu did incarnate as Lord Rama and Lord Krishna. Hindu Gods and Goddesses ARE acknowledged in the Granth.

I think it highly ignorant of you to say that They were just rajas. THis is highly untrue and shows your lack of knowledge in Hinduism. Actually, Lord Rama and Krishna were Avtaars of God and came to the world to teach the right path, so in fact, they are Hindu Gurus.

As for the flying, swords, etc, they were from a different age....Sathyug and Treyta and they were the Aryans. This race was extremely advanced, so they flying swords, being able to see afar were all actually technology that was achieved by the people of that age and is symbolic. The flying plane that Ravana had...that was actually a plane! Do you not say today 'I;m flying to America' for example. Does not mean you are actually flying, you are talking about a plane!!!!! This all has deeper meanings and the humans during that era were extremely advanced in technology. The Vedas are the oldest Holy Scriptures in the History of Time and civilisation. Along with this advanced technology, Lord Rama and Lord Krishna were Avtaars so of cours they will have additional Powers. They came into the world to lead those drifting away from the Right Path back to the Right Path as well as teach people how to live, where they were drifting from the right way of living. The devils are symbolic of bad people at that time, the evil people. Even today, there is so much evil going on in the world that they would be seen as devils. Hindu Gods and Goddesses come to Earth and live like normal human beings in order to teach people the Spiritual Path so yes, they exist as Lord Vishnu, Lord Bramha and Lord Shiva. There are lots of Universes not just this one. In fact, The Vedas are full of extreme knowledge hence why they have been tried to be accessed by the Western world including Germany. They are immensely Spiritual and Scientific Scriptures.

In other words if you have no knowledge of Hinduism then do not talk about it.
 

Verma1

SPNer
Oct 9, 2011
15
5
In other words if you have no knowledge of Hinduism then do not talk about it.

or sikhism?

the words pot kettle and black come to mind

It is true that people really should not talk about Hindusim or Sikhism if they dont know a thing about it.

However this particular thread is about Hinduism, hence why I mentioned Hinduism only.

The more I am reading the posts on this forum, its making me realise just how ignorant people really are.
 
Aug 28, 2010
1,514
1,116
72
VERMA 1 ji,
I think you are over reacing in this regard.In the approach the way I find we all may be ignorant.But making conclusion about someone as ignorant is the reflection of your own way of thinking.
I feel you yourself are not familiar in depth of Hindu Philosophy.Here we can share our views on the fundamental cancepts of any philosophy not the "ism".That should make a difference in our participation.
If you say that Hindu GOD and GODDESES have been acknowledged in SGGS then you are grossly misunderstanding the Sikh Philosophy.I may tell you frankly there is no concept of GOD in Sikh philosophy and the references in sGGS for RAMA of KRISNA of Hindu philosophy are there to provde deepr knowledge and clear knowledge about the actual existence the way general people have been told about.
I think you should make some study of good literature on these issues so that you rself and others get intelligent not the ignorant.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Tejwant Singh

Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jun 30, 2004
5,028
7,188
Henderson, NV.
VERMA 1 ji,
I think you are over reacing in this regard.In the approach the way I find we all may be ignorant.But making conclusion about someone as ignorant is the reflection of your own way of thinking.
I feel you yourself are not familiar in depth of Hindu Philosophy.Here we can share our views on the fundamental cancepts of any philosophy not the "ism".That should make a difference in our participation.
If you say that Hindu GOD and GODDESES have been acknowledged in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji then you are grossly misunderstanding the Sikh Philosophy.I may tell you frankly there is no concept of GOD in Sikh philosophy and the references in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji for RAMA of KRISNA of Hindu philosophy are there to provde deepr knowledge and clear knowledge about the actual existence the way general people have been told about.
I think you should make some study of good literature on these issues so that you rself and others get intelligent not the ignorant.

Prakash.S.Bagga

Prakash ji,

Guru Fateh.

Well said. No one could have put it better and I thank you for that. Verma ji does need to have deeper studies about Sikhism. He is welcome to ask as many questions as he likes in here to clear his doubts. After all Sikhi is all about learning rather than jumping to conclusions with little or no knowledge of the subject.

Thanks once again

Regards

Tejwant Singh
 

Astroboy

ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
Writer
SPNer
Jul 14, 2007
4,576
1,609
Harry Ji,
...and Guru Ji told his Sikhs..see for yourself..the TRUTH. OK Now lets throw all this havan stuff in the Bonfire and go home...when all the ghee and stuff was thrown on the fire..it Roared up skywards..and the people far away thought..OH the DEVI has shown up..and blessed Guru ji.. This story is concoted to prove that the GURU was adevotee of teh DEVI and the KHALSA is actually the DEVI's CREATION via her BOON !!

Well some writers of Sikh history (as explained by Prof. Sahib Singh) have a fictional imagination attached to their writings. Prof. said he found many discrepancies amongst the writers.

The scholars of today have to take this a step further and not sweep it under the rug. The information will be intriguing, I believe.
 

❤️ CLICK HERE TO JOIN SPN MOBILE PLATFORM

Top