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Does God Control Everything?

Nov 13, 2022
1
0
23
Sat Sri Brothers and Sister,
I have one question which has been on my mind for many-many years and for which I am until today unable to find a satisfactory answer. This question can be summarize as "Does God control everything in the Universe?" Allow me to explain myself...

In the Guru Granth Sahib, there appears countless times verses stating to the effect that :- "God is in charge and controls everything in the Universe. That nothing happens which is outside the Will of God. That God is the doer of all. That literally God IS All." These are not exact verses from the Granth Sahib but rather my understanding of verses. I do not think it would be necessary to quote any verses from the Granth Sahib as anyone reading it will bound to find countless verses stating to the effect.

The problem I find is elsewhere the Granth Sahib (and many other holy scriptures) also state that: "Man is responsible for his actions. That Man has free will and can and should decide what is right and wrong."

My dear brothers and sisters, I am confused! To my thinking both statements are contradictory. If God is the controller and doer of all, how can Man have free will? If man has free will, then how can God be said to control and do EVERYTHING? If free will is within the Will of God, how can we say it is FREE?
If free will is an illusion, then why does God punish Man by sending him to hell or reward him by sending him to heaven? What need be there for a heaven or hell if all that man does is according to His Will?

I am utterly confused and puzzled by this enigma! I have searched for an answer in many books and scriptures but the answer eludes me. I have searched through this website and found only ONE thread discussing free will. Kudos to Etinder for his lengthily exposition on free will. While I found his discussion very enlightening on the topic of free will, it still did not resolve my conflict. This is because Etinder choose to discuss free will from the philosophical point of view, leaving God out of the question. What I need is an explanation from Gurbani i.e. a theological or religious point of view.

If there be among you an enlightened one who can solve this mystery for me I shall forever be great full to him or her.

Thank you in advance.

Guru Ki Fateh
Balbinder Singh
Ipoh, Perak
Malaysia
Nothing is as cleverer as the human beings on this planet earth .

The Human beings are the only cleverer creatures , who even don't spare GOD in their cleverer tricks to survival .

GOD is just used as the scapegoat by human beings their survival and fulfillment of their desires .

Those who talk about sin , bad ,evil even they know that nothing sort of that thing exists ,

The desire of one human being is a sin for another human being .


All over the world , religions are only made for this :

"I can do all the things , If you do any of these things what I do , You have committed a crime , sin , evil"

Each and every human being follows the above line whether directly or indirectly .

Even if there is .001 truth in this world , then that truth is the fodder for justification for those commit falsehood and tell lie.
Waheguru ji ka Khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh 🙏🏻
For example:- if we have to stand on one leg we have two options to either stand on left or right. This is human's will. To either choose good or bad deeds. But we can't put our both legs in air it's our limitation. Either you did good or bad power of doing work comes from God only. If we did good we get good results and vice versa so everything is in hukam of God and to decide what to do God gives us understanding and mind like if we procastinate we fail its hukam of God. Hukam means niyam or rules.
Hope you understand or hope I m right in this understanding 🙏🏻🙏🏻
 
Jan 5, 2023
2
1
54
Sat Sri Brothers and Sister,
I have one question which has been on my mind for many-many years and for which I am until today unable to find a satisfactory answer. This question can be summarize as "Does God control everything in the Universe?" Allow me to explain myself...

In the Guru Granth Sahib, there appears countless times verses stating to the effect that :- "God is in charge and controls everything in the Universe. That nothing happens which is outside the Will of God. That God is the doer of all. That literally God IS All." These are not exact verses from the Granth Sahib but rather my understanding of verses. I do not think it would be necessary to quote any verses from the Granth Sahib as anyone reading it will bound to find countless verses stating to the effect.

The problem I find is elsewhere the Granth Sahib (and many other holy scriptures) also state that: "Man is responsible for his actions. That Man has free will and can and should decide what is right and wrong."

My dear brothers and sisters, I am confused! To my thinking both statements are contradictory. If God is the controller and doer of all, how can Man have free will? If man has free will, then how can God be said to control and do EVERYTHING? If free will is within the Will of God, how can we say it is FREE?
If free will is an illusion, then why does God punish Man by sending him to hell or reward him by sending him to heaven? What need be there for a heaven or hell if all that man does is according to His Will?

I am utterly confused and puzzled by this enigma! I have searched for an answer in many books and scriptures but the answer eludes me. I have searched through this website and found only ONE thread discussing free will. Kudos to Etinder for his lengthily exposition on free will. While I found his discussion very enlightening on the topic of free will, it still did not resolve my conflict. This is because Etinder choose to discuss free will from the philosophical point of view, leaving God out of the question. What I need is an explanation from Gurbani i.e. a theological or religious point of view.

If there be among you an enlightened one who can solve this mystery for me I shall forever be great full to him or her.

Thank you in advance.

Guru Ki Fateh
Balbinder Singh
Ipoh, Perak
Malaysia
Well, there's an understanding to all the verses of Japuji v specially of the verses mentioned here referring to God's Will in everything. There's no confusio
Sat Sri Brothers and Sister,
I have one question which has been on my mind for many-many years and for which I am until today unable to find a satisfactory answer. This question can be summarize as "Does God control everything in the Universe?" Allow me to explain myself...

In the Guru Granth Sahib, there appears countless times verses stating to the effect that :- "God is in charge and controls everything in the Universe. That nothing happens which is outside the Will of God. That God is the doer of all. That literally God IS All." These are not exact verses from the Granth Sahib but rather my understanding of verses. I do not think it would be necessary to quote any verses from the Granth Sahib as anyone reading it will bound to find countless verses stating to the effect.

The problem I find is elsewhere the Granth Sahib (and many other holy scriptures) also state that: "Man is responsible for his actions. That Man has free will and can and should decide what is right and wrong."

My dear brothers and sisters, I am confused! To my thinking both statements are contradictory. If God is the controller and doer of all, how can Man have free will? If man has free will, then how can God be said to control and do EVERYTHING? If free will is within the Will of God, how can we say it is FREE?
If free will is an illusion, then why does God punish Man by sending him to hell or reward him by sending him to heaven? What need be there for a heaven or hell if all that man does is according to His Will?

I am utterly confused and puzzled by this enigma! I have searched for an answer in many books and scriptures but the answer eludes me. I have searched through this website and found only ONE thread discussing free will. Kudos to Etinder for his lengthily exposition on free will. While I found his discussion very enlightening on the topic of free will, it still did not resolve my conflict. This is because Etinder choose to discuss free will from the philosophical point of view, leaving God out of the question. What I need is an explanation from Gurbani i.e. a theological or religious point of view.

If there be among you an enlightened one who can solve this mystery for me I shall forever be great full to him or her.

Thank you in advance.

Guru Ki Fateh
Balbinder Singh
Ipoh, Perak
Malaysia

n or contradiction to what's written in Japuji. The only problem is our level of understanding to the highest form and state of mind of the person who's written it that's Nanak. It's like a Nursery kid trying to understand a PhD Man's theorem. Nanak wrote this Divine Law after years of Meditation, Observation, Questioning as we do, travel, discussions etc etc ...... and he got his reply embedded within him then written in his words.
And we want the reply across the table like a Maths problem.

But yes we can understand too again if God Wills .... else we too are disillusioned n wander.

Anyway I'm fully satisfied by entire Japuji n what Nanak wanted to deliver though by words but well get it by our Meditation n own experience n own destiny ......

And I can make it simpler by delivering Nanaks words n Gods ways but in person ...... writing it down to explain Nanaks Finding Divine Law is impossible.
It needs expression n personal touch of dialogue.

But by Gods will 🙏🥰
 

Dalvinder Singh Grewal

Writer
Historian
SPNer
Jan 3, 2010
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God controls everything as evidenced by Sri Gur Granth Sahib. Some quotes are given below:

ਆਪੇ ਧਰਤੀ ਆਪੇ ਹੈ ਰਾਹਕੁ ਆਪਿ ਜੰਮਾਇ ਪੀਸਾਵੈ ||ਆਪਿ ਪਕਾਵੈ ਆਪਿ ਭਾਂਡੇ ਦੇਇ ਪਰੋਸੈ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਬਹਿ ਖਾਵੈ || ਆਪੇ ਜਲੁ ਆਪੇ ਦੇ ਛਿੰਗਾ ਆਪੇ ਚੁਲੀ ਭਰਾਵੈ ||
ਆਪੇ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਸਦਿ ਹਾਲੈ ਆਪੇ ਵਿਦਾ ਕਰਾਵੈ || ਜਿਸ ਨੋ ਕਿਰਪਾਲੁ ਹੋਵੈ ਹਰਿ ਆਪੇ ਤਿਸ ਨੋ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਮਨਾਵੈ |||| ਸਲੋਕ ਮਃ ੩ || ਰਮ ਧਰਮ ਸਭਿ ਬੰਧਨਾ ਪਾਪ ਪੁੰਨ ਸਨਬੰਧੁ || ਮਮਤਾ ਮੋਹੁ ਸੁ ਬੰਧਨਾ ਪੁਤ੍ਰ ਕਲਤ੍ਰ ਸੁ ਧੰਧੁ || ਜਹ ਦੇਖਾ ਤਹ ਜੇਵਰੀ ਮਾਇਆ ਕਾ ਸਨਬੰਧੁ || ਨਾਨਕ ਸਚੇ ਨਾਮ ਬਿਨੁ ਵਰਤਣਿ ਵਰਤੈ ਅੰਧੁ |||| ਮਃ ੪ || ਅੰਧੇ ਚਾਨਣੁ ਤਾ ਥੀਐ ਜਾ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਮਿਲੈ ਰਜਾਇ || ਬੰਧਨ ਤੋੜੈ ਸਚਿ ਵਸੈ ਅਗਿਆਨੁ ਅਧੇਰਾ ਜਾਇ || ਸਭੁ ਕਿਛੁ ਦੇਖੈ ਤਿਸੈ ਕਾ ਜਿਨਿ ਕੀਆ ਤਨੁ ਸਾਜਿ || ਨਾਨਕ ਸਰਣਿ ਕਰਤਾਰ ਕੀ ਕਰਤਾ ਰਾਖੈ ਲਾਜ |||| ਪਉੜੀ || ਜਦਹੁ ਆਪੇ ਥਾਟੁ ਕੀਆ ਬਹਿ ਕਰਤੈ ਤਦਹੁ ਪੁਛਿ ਨ ਸੇਵਕੁ ਬੀਆ || ਤਦਹੁ ਕਿਆ ਕੋ ਲੇਵੈ ਕਿਆ ਕੋ ਦੇਵੈ ਜਾਂ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਦੂਜਾ ਕੀਆ || ਫਿਰਿ ਆਪੇ ਜਗਤੁ ਉਪਾਇਆ ਕਰਤੈ ਦਾਨੁ ਸਭਨਾ ਕਉ ਦੀਆ || ਆਪੇ ਸੇਵ ਬਣਾਈਅਨੁ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਆਪੇ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਪੀਆ || ਆਪਿ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਆਕਾਰੁ ਹੈ ਆਪੇ ਆਪੇ ਕਰੈ ਸੁ ਥੀਆ |||| ਸਲੋਕ ਮਃ ੩ || ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਸੇਵਹਿ ਸਦ ਸਾਚਾ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਸਹਜਿ ਪਿਆਰਿ || ਸਦਾ ਅਨੰਦਿ ਗਾਵਹਿ ਗੁਣ ਸਾਚੇ ਅਰਧਿ ਉਰਧਿ ਉਰਿ ਧਾਰਿ || ਅੰਤਰਿ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਮੁ ਵਸਿਆ ਧੁਰਿ ਕਰਮੁ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਕਰਤਾਰਿ || ਨਾਨਕ ਆਪਿ ਮਿਲਾਇਅਨੁ ਆਪੇ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਧਾਰਿ |||| ਮਃ ੩ || ਕਹਿਐ ਕਥਿਐ ਨ ਪਾਈਐ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਰਹੈ ਸਦਾ ਗੁਣ ਗਾਇ || ਵਿਣੁ ਕਰਮੈ ਕਿਨੈ ਨ ਪਾਇਓ ਭਉਕਿ ਮੁਏ ਬਿਲਲਾਇ || ਗੁਰ ਕੈ ਸਬਦਿ ਮਨੁ ਤਨੁ ਭਿਜੈ ਆਪਿ ਵਸੈ ਮਨਿ ਆਇ || ਨਾਨਕ ਨਦਰੀ ਪਾਈਐ ਆਪੇ ਲਏ ਮਿਲਾਇ |||| ਪਉੜੀ || ਆਪੇ ਵੇਦ ਪੁਰਾਣ ਸਭਿ ਸਾਸਤ ਆਪਿ ਕਥੈ ਆਪਿ ਭੀਜੈ || ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਬਹਿ ਪੂਜੇ ਕਰਤਾ ਆਪਿ ਪਰਪੰਚੁ ਕਰੀਜੈ || ਆਪਿ ਪਰਵਿਰਤਿ ਆਪਿ ਨਿਰਵਿਰਤੀ ਆਪੇ ਅਕਥੁ ਕਥੀਜੈ || ਆਪੇ ਪੁੰਨੁ ਸਭੁ ਆਪਿ ਕਰਾਏ ਆਪਿ ਅਲਿਪਤੁ ਵਰਤੀਜੈ || ਆਪੇ ਸੁਖੁ ਦੁਖੁ ਦੇਵੈ ਕਰਤਾ ਆਪੇ ਬਖਸ ਕਰੀਜੈ |||| (੫੫੦-੫੫੧)

ਆਪੇ ਖਾਣੀ ਆਪੇ ਬਾਣੀ ਆਪੇ ਖੰਡ ਵਰਭੰਡ ਕਰੇ || ਆਪਿ ਸਮੁੰਦੁ ਆਪਿ ਹੈ|| ਸਾਗਰੁ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਵਿਚਿ ਰਤਨ ਧਰੇ |||| ਆਪਿ ਲਹਾਏ ਕਰੇ ਜਿਸੁ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਜਿਸ ਨੋ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਕਰੇ ਹਰੇ || ਆਪੇ ਭਉਜਲੁ ਆਪਿ ਹੈ ਬੋਹਿਥਾ ਆਪੇ ਖੇਵਟੁ ਆਪਿ ਤਰੇ || ਆਪੇ ਕਰੇ ਕਰਾਏ ਕਰਤਾ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਦੂਜਾ ਤੁਝੈ ਸਰੇ |||| (੫੫੨)

ਆਪੇ ਪਾਰਸੁ ਆਪਿ ਧਾਤੁ ਹੈ ਆਪਿ ਕੀਤੋਨੁ ਕੰਚਨੁ || ਆਪੇ ਠਾਕੁਰੁ ਸੇਵਕੁ ਆਪੇ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਪਾਪ ਖੰਡਨੁ || ਆਪੇ ਸਭਿ ਘਟ ਭੋਗਵੈ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਸਭੁ ਅੰਜਨੁ || ਆਪਿ ਬਿਬੇਕੁ ਆਪਿ ਸਭੁ ਬੇਤਾ ਆਪੇ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਭੰਜਨੁ || ਜਨੁ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਸਾਲਾਹਿ ਨ ਰਜੈ ਤੁਧੁ ਕਰਤੇ ਤੂ ਹਰਿ ਸੁਖਦਾਤਾ ਵਡਨੁਆਪੇ ਸਭ ਘਟ ਅੰਦਰੇ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਬਾਹਰਿ ||ਆਪੇ ਗੁਪਤੁ ਵਰਤਦਾ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਜਾਹਰਿ |||| ਜੁਗ ਛਤੀਹ ਗੁਬਾਰੁ ਕਰਿਵਰਤਿਆ ਸੁੰਨਾਹਰਿ || ਓਥੈ ਵੇਦ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਨ ਸਾਸਤਾ ਆਪੇ ਹਰਿ ਨਰਹਰਿ || ਬੈਠਾ ਤਾੜੀ ਲਾਇ ਆਪਿ ਸਭ ਦੂਹੀ ਬਾਹਰਿ || ਆਪਣੀ ਮਿਤਿ ਆਪਿ ਜਾਣਦਾ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਗਉਹਰੁ || ੧੮ || (੫੫੫)
 

P J Singh

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Oct 7, 2022
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Hi, I wrote a long post, it just disappeared because it asked me to login. I can not find wherre it has gone, can anyone in the admin please help me retrieve it.

As I posted, it asked me to login and I had to retrieve my password; meanwhile it is gone. Any help please. Thanks
 

Admin

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Usually, if you are logged in, the responses are saved as draft in this message box automatically. However, if you do not see the message here then it looks like your response was lost. If the responses are bigger in nature, it is always better to write it elsewhere and save it like in NotePad (windows) or Notes (macs). Our apologies for the inconvenience it may have caused. Thank you ji
 

Naushad

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Sep 14, 2022
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Waheguru ji ka Khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh 🙏🏻
For example:- if we have to stand on one leg we have two options to either stand on left or right. This is human's will. To either choose good or bad deeds. But we can't put our both legs in air it's our limitation. Either you did good or bad power of doing work comes from God only. If we did good we get good results and vice versa so everything is in hukam of God and to decide what to do God gives us understanding and mind like if we procastinate we fail its hukam of God. Hukam means niyam or rules.
Hope you understand or hope I m right in this understanding 🙏🏻🙏🏻
Let's look at events in our lives in terms of control.
Predestination- everything is written down by God before it happens.
Freewill- these are circles of responsibility each of us carry that causes some thing to happen.
Control- is it Predestination or freewill
Let's look at an example
A driver is driving down a road where there are parked 🚗 cars. A child runs into the road form behind a parked car and is run over.
The event is Predestined. It is written down by God.
The driver carries CIRCLE of free will responsibility that can cause the accident. Did he maintain his car brakes etc according to the law of the land.? Did he maintain due care and attention? Was he drunk? etc . A Yes means the driver free will contributed to the Predestined accident.
The child also carries CIRCLE of free will responsibility. Was the child trained in road safety? Was the child physically fit, eyesight, mobility etc? So you can the child's free will can also contribute to the Predestined accident.
God tests us on actions that cause the Predestined events.
In case of natural events
If we live near a river we a prone to flooding. We have historical facts
We are now aware of fault lines that can cause earth quakes. Man is causing global warming etc. etc.
Everything that is born has to die. A person's body is in perpetual decay and has to die. Disease is part and parcel of our biological make-up.
So the only thing that survives bodily death is the Soul. The make-up of the soul is beyond human comprehension. We will only know this when we die.
So we are judged according to our circles of free will responsibility.
The reward is in the next stage of our souls journey.
I hope this clarify your quetion
 

kanwar238

SPNer
Oct 2, 2012
11
1
AUSTRALIA
Sat Sri Brothers and Sister,
I have one question which has been on my mind for many-many years and for which I am until today unable to find a satisfactory answer. This question can be summarize as "Does God control everything in the Universe?" Allow me to explain myself...

In the Guru Granth Sahib, there appears countless times verses stating to the effect that :- "God is in charge and controls everything in the Universe. That nothing happens which is outside the Will of God. That God is the doer of all. That literally God IS All." These are not exact verses from the Granth Sahib but rather my understanding of verses. I do not think it would be necessary to quote any verses from the Granth Sahib as anyone reading it will bound to find countless verses stating to the effect.

The problem I find is elsewhere the Granth Sahib (and many other holy scriptures) also state that: "Man is responsible for his actions. That Man has free will and can and should decide what is right and wrong."

My dear brothers and sisters, I am confused! To my thinking both statements are contradictory. If God is the controller and doer of all, how can Man have free will? If man has free will, then how can God be said to control and do EVERYTHING? If free will is within the Will of God, how can we say it is FREE?
If free will is an illusion, then why does God punish Man by sending him to hell or reward him by sending him to heaven? What need be there for a heaven or hell if all that man does is according to His Will?

I am utterly confused and puzzled by this enigma! I have searched for an answer in many books and scriptures but the answer eludes me. I have searched through this website and found only ONE thread discussing free will. Kudos to Etinder for his lengthily exposition on free will. While I found his discussion very enlightening on the topic of free will, it still did not resolve my conflict. This is because Etinder choose to discuss free will from the philosophical point of view, leaving God out of the question. What I need is an explanation from Gurbani i.e. a theological or religious point of view.

If there be among you an enlightened one who can solve this mystery for me I shall forever be great full to him or her.

Thank you in advance.

Guru Ki Fateh
Balbinder Singh
Ipoh, Perak
Malays
 

Attachments

  • 01-RAB DI PACHAN.pdf
    162.2 KB · Reads: 149

kanwar238

SPNer
Oct 2, 2012
11
1
AUSTRALIA
Sat Sri Brothers and Sister,
I have one question which has been on my mind for many-many years and for which I am until today unable to find a satisfactory answer. This question can be summarize as "Does God control everything in the Universe?" Allow me to explain myself...

In the Guru Granth Sahib, there appears countless times verses stating to the effect that :- "God is in charge and controls everything in the Universe. That nothing happens which is outside the Will of God. That God is the doer of all. That literally God IS All." These are not exact verses from the Granth Sahib but rather my understanding of verses. I do not think it would be necessary to quote any verses from the Granth Sahib as anyone reading it will bound to find countless verses stating to the effect.

The problem I find is elsewhere the Granth Sahib (and many other holy scriptures) also state that: "Man is responsible for his actions. That Man has free will and can and should decide what is right and wrong."

My dear brothers and sisters, I am confused! To my thinking both statements are contradictory. If God is the controller and doer of all, how can Man have free will? If man has free will, then how can God be said to control and do EVERYTHING? If free will is within the Will of God, how can we say it is FREE?
If free will is an illusion, then why does God punish Man by sending him to hell or reward him by sending him to heaven? What need be there for a heaven or hell if all that man does is according to His Will?

I am utterly confused and puzzled by this enigma! I have searched for an answer in many books and scriptures but the answer eludes me. I have searched through this website and found only ONE thread discussing free will. Kudos to Etinder for his lengthily exposition on free will. While I found his discussion very enlightening on the topic of free will, it still did not resolve my conflict. This is because Etinder choose to discuss free will from the philosophical point of view, leaving God out of the question. What I need is an explanation from Gurbani i.e. a theological or religious point of view.

If there be among you an enlightened one who can solve this mystery for me I shall forever be great full to him or her.

Thank you in advance.

Guru Ki Fateh
Balbinder Singh
Ipoh, Perak
Malaysia
It is necessary to understand GOD . According to Gurbani God is (1) Law of Nature i.e. HUKAM, (2) God is Divine Virtues i.e. GUNI NIDHAN (3) God is Divine Wisdom i.e. your own Wisdom. as said: gur paramaesar eaeko jaan |GGS page 864 GUR means your own knowledge or wisdom . It is said your wisdom and the GOD is to be considered as one and the same thing. Similarly it is again said:
naanak sodhae sinmrith baedh | paarabreham gur naahee bhaedh (GGS page 1142) Gur mean your wisdom or your knowledge.
Nanak has studied the Simritees and the Vedas. It means Guru Nanak studied all the available literature and he has concluded that There is no difference between the Supreme Lord God and the wisdom or your knowledge. According to this when an act is done it is done according to your knowledge and your wisdom. Its reward or punishment is received here in this world. Your conscience will also work to give you reward or punishment.
Detailed article in Punjabi is attached as PDF.
 

Attachments

  • 01-RAB DI PACHAN.pdf
    162.2 KB · Reads: 150

swarn bains

Poet
SPNer
Apr 8, 2012
774
187
God created the creation. according sikh philosophy you get what you earn. so whatever credentials one gets takes with him . when he or she takes birth those credentials are the base one follows but not necessarily he or she is independent to do whaterver he does. Your soul is God and coppies everything what you do through your mind. at the end while dieing the account is analized and credentials credited to you. remember you get what you earn . God or any other entitiy has no input in it but your credits are given back to you
 

kanwar238

SPNer
Oct 2, 2012
11
1
AUSTRALIA
The important thing is to understand the concept of God. Gurbani has made it clear that God is within you. It is therefore necessary to understand the God which is within every body and that is conscience. Every person performs all deeds according to his or her conscience. Then the Law of Nature acts within the body and the result is reward or the punishment. The things end here when the death occurs.
 

P J Singh

SPNer
Oct 7, 2022
26
2
Mr. Kanwar ji: Gur Fetah:
A Great thought!
As you put it: "God which is within every body and that is conscience. Every person performs all deeds according to his or her conscience" . Can you please help me and others understand if the same God is in everyone which you identify as conscience then why everyone has a different conscience. Alternatively, if the conscience is not different and everyone has the same conscience then why people act and think differently. Hope to hear your thoughts. Guru Fetah!
 

kanwar238

SPNer
Oct 2, 2012
11
1
AUSTRALIA
Dear friends, Sat Sri Akal

Before going to the proposition, I would like to say that Gurbani is a philosophy to lead a practical and meaningful life. Gurbani takes us out from delusions and illusions.

Now considering the concept of God, according to Gurbani, while describing various KHANDS IN JAP JI BANI that is stages to become a virtues person it is provided that every person is supposed to get enlightened with divine wisdom and divine virtues. Accordingly, every enlightened person is supposed to behave in the society with divine virtues. Therefore, while in SARAM KHAND every enlightened person is supposed to practice godly virtues. This is a process of training one’s conscience with godly qualities and godly virtues. This is like creating one’s own God within oneself. In Gurbani It is said: “thithai gharreeai surath math man budh |” ਤਿਥੈ ਘੜੀਐ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਮਤਿ ਮਨਿ ਬੁਧਿ ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-8) SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH is the conscience and it is to be trained. Thus, the conscience which is God within oneself is to be created by obtaining knowledge of Godly or divine virtues.

The problem is that the conscience of every person is not properly and equally enlightened or trained. The reason is that everybody does not get proper knowledge. Thus, the God is created according to the knowledge that is grasped by any person. It is explained in Gurbani as ਏ ਮਨ ਜੈਸਾ ਸੇਵਹਿ ਤੈਸਾ ਹੋਵਹਿ ਤੇਹੇ ਕਰਮ ਕਮਾਇ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-755) that means one creates one’s own God (conscience) according to the knowledge obtained by anyone.

Everybody knows that there are unscrupulous persons who misguide the innocent persons and exploit them. Such misguided innocent persons develop devil like qualities and their deeds are also devilish.

Gurbani clearly explains that your wisdom is your God. Guru Sahib says “ਗੁਰੁ ਪਰਮੇਸਰੁ ਏਕੋ ਜਾਣੁ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-864)” Gur here means knowledge or divine wisdom according to this it means that your divine wisdom should be treated as God. This is further stated: “ਨਾਨਕ ਸੋਧੇ ਸਿੰਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ ਬੇਦ ॥ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਗੁਰ ਨਾਹੀ ਭੇਦ॥” (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-1142) It means that Guru Sahib have studied all the available literature and it is concluded that there is no difference between the God and the divine wisdom.

It can thus be concluded by saying that everyone creates one’s own GOD. In case the proper and good divine wisdom is obtained and godly virtues are practiced one becomes Godly like saint and if bad or corrupt knowledge is grasped one becomes devil. Thus, everyone behaves according to the knowledge one obtains. There is no God siting in the sky to make anyone saint or devil. Gurbani explains this by saying “ਏ ਮਨ ਜੈਸਾ ਸੇਵਹਿ ਤੈਸਾ ਹੋਵਹਿ ਤੇਹੇ ਕਰਮ ਕਮਾਇ॥ This means that one behaves according to the knowledge which is grasped by anyone. God from sky does not make anything. This is the law of Nature.

I hope the concept would be clear. In case more clarification is required that shall be provided.
 

kanwar238

SPNer
Oct 2, 2012
11
1
AUSTRALIA
Mr. Kanwar ji: Gur Fetah:
A Great thought!
As you put it: "God which is within every body and that is conscience. Every person performs all deeds according to his or her conscience" . Can you please help me and others understand if the same God is in everyone which you identify as conscience then why everyone has a different conscience. Alternatively, if the conscience is not different and everyone has the same conscience then why people act and think differently. Hope to hear your thoughts. Guru Fetah!
Dear friends, Sat Sri Akal

Before going to the proposition, I would like to say that Gurbani is a philosophy to lead a practical and meaningful life. Gurbani takes us out from delusions and illusions.

Now considering the concept of God, according to Gurbani, while describing various KHANDS IN JAP JI BANI that is stages to become a virtues person it is provided that every person is supposed to get enlightened with divine wisdom and divine virtues. Accordingly, every enlightened person is supposed to behave in the society with divine virtues. Therefore, while in SARAM KHAND every enlightened person is supposed to practice godly virtues. This is a process of training one’s conscience with godly qualities and godly virtues. This is like creating one’s own God within oneself. In Gurbani It is said: “thithai gharreeai surath math man budh |” ਤਿਥੈ ਘੜੀਐ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਮਤਿ ਮਨਿ ਬੁਧਿ ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-8) SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH is the conscience and it is to be trained. Thus, the conscience which is God within oneself is to be created by obtaining knowledge of Godly or divine virtues.

The problem is that the conscience of every person is not properly and equally enlightened or trained. The reason is that everybody does not get proper knowledge. Thus, the God is created according to the knowledge that is grasped by any person. It is explained in Gurbani as ਏ ਮਨ ਜੈਸਾ ਸੇਵਹਿ ਤੈਸਾ ਹੋਵਹਿ ਤੇਹੇ ਕਰਮ ਕਮਾਇ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-755) that means one creates one’s own God (conscience) according to the knowledge obtained by anyone.

Everybody knows that there are unscrupulous persons who misguide the innocent persons and exploit them. Such misguided innocent persons develop devil like qualities and their deeds are also devilish.

Gurbani clearly explains that your wisdom is your God. Guru Sahib says “ਗੁਰੁ ਪਰਮੇਸਰੁ ਏਕੋ ਜਾਣੁ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-864)” Gur here means knowledge or divine wisdom according to this it means that your divine wisdom should be treated as God. This is further stated: “ਨਾਨਕ ਸੋਧੇ ਸਿੰਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ ਬੇਦ ॥ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਗੁਰ ਨਾਹੀ ਭੇਦ॥” (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-1142) It means that Guru Sahib have studied all the available literature and it is concluded that there is no difference between the God and the divine wisdom.

It can thus be concluded by saying that everyone creates one’s own GOD. In case the proper and good divine wisdom is obtained and godly virtues are practiced one becomes Godly like saint and if bad or corrupt knowledge is grasped one becomes devil. Thus, everyone behaves according to the knowledge one obtains. There is no God siting in the sky to make anyone saint or devil. Gurbani explains this by saying “ਏ ਮਨ ਜੈਸਾ ਸੇਵਹਿ ਤੈਸਾ ਹੋਵਹਿ ਤੇਹੇ ਕਰਮ ਕਮਾਇ॥ This means that one behaves according to the knowledge which is grasped by anyone. God from sky does not make anything. This is the law of Nature.

I hope the concept would be clear. In case more clarification is required that shall be provided.
 

P J Singh

SPNer
Oct 7, 2022
26
2
SS Kanwar Ji:
Guru Fetah. Thank for your response to my specific question that was directed to draw upon your wisdom. Your answer is quite enlightening and I agree that we all have an essence of "God" in us as it is frequently referred to as "Jot". As we progressively grasp divine wisdom, this "jot" in us gets manifested as our personal God within us - it is merely the cluster of virtues that lights up our actions and our journey through this Bhav Sagar. Did I get it right? I hope I got it right.

I therefore submit to you the followings;

First, although what we are sharing is very intriguing, we are diverging from the theme of this thread which is : " if God is doing everything than why we are held accountable for our actions". Although I agree and subscribe to the view that Dr. DS Grewal shared on this thread, his answer is only partial. He addressed the first part of the question but did not answer the second part "why we are held accountable". Regardless, let us please park this for time being as not to confuse the following observation from your response:

You write: "This is a process of training one’s conscience with godly qualities and godly virtues. This is like creating one’s own God within oneself. In Gurbani It is said: “thithai gharreeai surath math man budh ਤਿਥੈ ਘੜੀਐ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਮਤਿ ਮਨਿ ਬੁਧਿ ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-8) SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH is the conscience and it is to be trained."

This suggests that the God/conscience that we are to train is somehow split into four parts: SURT, MAAT, MAAN, BUDH and we are to train them using divine wisdom. Can you please help me understand how a unitary entity conscience is split into four parts all by itself before we talk about training them with divine wisdom. It raises a number of questions, what is SURT and how does it emerge; what is MAAT and how does it emerge; what is MAAN and how does it emerge; what is BUDH and how does it emerge;

Further down you write:

"It is explained in Gurbani as ਏ ਮਨ ਜੈਸਾ ਸੇਵਹਿ ਤੈਸਾ ਹੋਵਹਿ ਤੇਹੇ ਕਰਮ ਕਮਾਇ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-755) that means one creates one’s own God (conscience) according to the knowledge obtained by anyone"

If I read this carefully this suggests that "MAAN" is now being referred to as God (conscience). It raises the question what happened to SURT, MAAT, and BUDH which were part of conscience in the preceding quote -- are they not relevant any more when we talk about conscience or God in us.

One final question, in your response you rightly said that WE need to grasp divine wisdom to develop our personal God (conscience). Since our capacity to grasp wisdom varies so does our conscience and ability to do good in this world. What do you think who is this mystical "WE" who has to do all this work?

Guru Fetah
 
Last edited:

kanwar238

SPNer
Oct 2, 2012
11
1
AUSTRALIA
S. P.J. Singh Ji, Sat Sri Akal

Your first question is " if God is doing everything than why we are held accountable for our actions".? This is a common belief inculcated in our mind that one gets punishment of one’s deed performed in this world. To bring out of this belief Guru Sahib put one question: ਜਬ ਕਛੁ ਨ ਸੀਓ ਤਬ ਕਿਆ ਕਰਤਾ ਕਵਨ ਕਰਮ ਕਰਿ ਆਇਆ ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-748) Which means that when there was nothing before and for which deeds the first person came in this world? It is simply a Law of Nature. Nobody comes in this world because of previous deeds or KARMAS. Previously people used to have 8 or more than that children and now they are having one or two children only. What does it mean.?

In fact, till the concept of God is not understood properly, then this question shall keep bothering all the times. In this respect, one thing I believe, that everybody agrees that God is within us. Now the God, which is within us, acts in two ways: First form is our conscience or our knowledge or our divine wisdom. The second form of God which is within us is Law of Nature. First form of God which is our wisdom according to this form of God we perform our deeds. The second form of God is the reaction in our body for the deeds performed, that is law of Nature. By this law our body reacts, that is our Hormones in the body effect our inner working of the body. Good deeds create good hormones and bad deed create bad hormones. This is the reward or the punishment. And this is the law of Nature. Supposing we eat junk food this is our action, and it is going to affect our body that is the natural reaction or process. This is act of God which is Law of Nature. We may realise it immediately or after some time. Immediate reaction has taken place in our body. This may be realised within us immediately or it may remain in dormant for some time. This will affect our body and we shall feel its pinch after a long time. That reaction is the punishment. This process is explained in Gurbani as:: ਘਰੀ ਘਰੀ ਕਾ ਲੇਖਾ ਮਾਗੈ ਕਾਇਥੁ ਚੇਤੂ ਨਾਉ ॥1॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥(ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-1104) gharee gharee kaa laekhaa maagai kaaeith chaethoo naao |1| rehaao | It means: The reaction is stored in our conscious or unconscious mind and this will cause some effect on our body sooner or later. This is the law of nature. You may call it that the God within us is recording our deeds. This in fact is the cause of reaction in our body. It tantamounts to get punishment or the reward accordingly. Everything happens inside the body automatically.

Now the second thing about our mind is that everybody believes that all acts are done according to one’s mind that is MAAN. This is why mind is treated as a king in the body. At the same time, Mind is always crazy to do many wrong and bad things and therefore, it is required to be kept under control. This why it is said that don’t go after the mind. ਮਨ ਕੀ ਮਤਿ ਤਿਆਗਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਜਨ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਬੂਝਿ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਈਐ ਰੇ ॥(ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-218) It means do not go after the mind you should understand Hukam that is Law of Nature and while keeping this in view or by understanding and following the law of nature, you will get comforts. It is again said: ਗੁਰ ਕੀ ਮਤਿ ਤੂੰ ਲੇਹਿ ਇਆਨੇ ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-288) Gurbani clearly advises that don’t go after the mind and get guidance from Gur that is from your wisdom. It means that the mind is to be controlled by one’s wisdom.

The other thing about SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH, Maan, as stated earlier, most of the times crazy to do wrong or bad things and therefore, it is to be controlled and trained to go in right direction by BUDH. At the same time BUDH is to get knowledge from various sources and the knowledge, which is available may not be good knowledge. Many times knowledge which is provided may be misleading and therefore, it is to be analysed. It is necessary to evaluate the knowledge which is being provided and find which is good, reasonable, and logically correct and which is incorrect. This is done by SURT that is your active and awakened mind or wisdom BUDH. After proper examination of the knowledge, it is to be imbibed. This properly tested knowledge is stored in MAAT, and it becomes your nature, SUBHA and YOU act according to the knowledge which is stored in MAAT. Thus, SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH relate to each other. This is all scientific. When the SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH are aligned properly the man becomes SACHIAR. And this is the purpose of Gurbani.

Please make it sure that you must point out your reaction. Do you like it or not? Even if you don’t like it, please say it.
 

kanwar238

SPNer
Oct 2, 2012
11
1
AUSTRALIA
SS Kanwar Ji:
Guru Fetah. Thank for your response to my specific question that was directed to draw upon your wisdom. Your answer is quite enlightening and I agree that we all have an essence of "God" in us as it is frequently referred to as "Jot". As we progressively grasp divine wisdom, this "jot" in us gets manifested as our personal God within us - it is merely the cluster of virtues that lights up our actions and our journey through this Bhav Sagar. Did I get it right? I hope I got it right.

I therefore submit to you the followings;

First, although what we are sharing is very intriguing, we are diverging from the theme of this thread which is : " if God is doing everything than why we are held accountable for our actions". Although I agree and subscribe to the view that Dr. DS Grewal shared on this thread, his answer is only partial. He addressed the first part of the question but did not answer the second part "why we are held accountable". Regardless, let us please park this for time being as not to confuse the following observation from your response:

You write: "This is a process of training one’s conscience with godly qualities and godly virtues. This is like creating one’s own God within oneself. In Gurbani It is said: “thithai gharreeai surath math man budh ਤਿਥੈ ਘੜੀਐ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਮਤਿ ਮਨਿ ਬੁਧਿ ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-8) SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH is the conscience and it is to be trained."

This suggests that the God/conscience that we are to train is somehow split into four parts: SURT, MAAT, MAAN, BUDH and we are to train them using divine wisdom. Can you please help me understand how a unitary entity conscience is split into four parts all by itself before we talk about training them with divine wisdom. It raises a number of questions, what is SURT and how does it emerge; what is MAAT and how does it emerge; what is MAAN and how does it emerge; what is BUDH and how does it emerge;

Further down you write:

"It is explained in Gurbani as ਏ ਮਨ ਜੈਸਾ ਸੇਵਹਿ ਤੈਸਾ ਹੋਵਹਿ ਤੇਹੇ ਕਰਮ ਕਮਾਇ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-755) that means one creates one’s own God (conscience) according to the knowledge obtained by anyone"

If I read this carefully this suggests that "MAAN" is now being referred to as God (conscience). It raises the question what happened to SURT, MAAT, and BUDH which were part of conscience in the preceding quote -- are they not relevant any more when we talk about conscience or God in us.

One final question, in your response you rightly said that WE need to grasp divine wisdom to develop our personal God (conscience). Since our capacity to grasp wisdom varies so does our conscience and ability to do good in this world. What do you think who is this mystical "WE" who has to do all this work?

Guru Fetah
S. P.J. Singh Ji, Sat Sri Akal

Your first question is " if God is doing everything than why we are held accountable for our actions".? This is a common belief inculcated in our mind that one gets punishment of one’s deed performed in this world. To bring out of this belief Guru Sahib put one question: ਜਬ ਕਛੁ ਨ ਸੀਓ ਤਬ ਕਿਆ ਕਰਤਾ ਕਵਨ ਕਰਮ ਕਰਿ ਆਇਆ ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-748) Which means that when there was nothing before and for which deeds the first person came in this world? It is simply a Law of Nature. Nobody comes in this world because of previous deeds or KARMAS. Previously people used to have 8 or more than that children and now they are having one or two children only. What does it mean.?

In fact, till the concept of God is not understood properly, then this question shall keep bothering all the times. In this respect, one thing I believe, that everybody agrees that God is within us. Now the God, which is within us, acts in two ways: First form is our conscience or our knowledge or our divine wisdom. The second form of God which is within us is Law of Nature. First form of God which is our wisdom according to this form of God we perform our deeds. The second form of God is the reaction in our body for the deeds performed, that is law of Nature. By this law our body reacts, that is our Hormones in the body effect our inner working of the body. Good deeds create good hormones and bad deed create bad hormones. This is the reward or the punishment. And this is the law of Nature. Supposing we eat junk food this is our action, and it is going to affect our body that is the natural reaction or process. This is act of God which is Law of Nature. We may realise it immediately or after some time. Immediate reaction has taken place in our body. This may be realised within us immediately or it may remain in dormant for some time. This will affect our body and we shall feel its pinch after a long time. That reaction is the punishment. This process is explained in Gurbani as:: ਘਰੀ ਘਰੀ ਕਾ ਲੇਖਾ ਮਾਗੈ ਕਾਇਥੁ ਚੇਤੂ ਨਾਉ ॥1॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥(ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-1104) gharee gharee kaa laekhaa maagai kaaeith chaethoo naao |1| rehaao | It means: The reaction is stored in our conscious or unconscious mind and this will cause some effect on our body sooner or later. This is the law of nature. You may call it that the God within us is recording our deeds. This in fact is the cause of reaction in our body. It tantamounts to get punishment or the reward accordingly. Everything happens inside the body automatically.

Now the second thing about our mind is that everybody believes that all acts are done according to one’s mind that is MAAN. This is why mind is treated as a king in the body. At the same time, Mind is always crazy to do many wrong and bad things and therefore, it is required to be kept under control. This why it is said that don’t go after the mind. ਮਨ ਕੀ ਮਤਿ ਤਿਆਗਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਜਨ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਬੂਝਿ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਈਐ ਰੇ ॥(ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-218) It means do not go after the mind you should understand Hukam that is Law of Nature and while keeping this in view or by understanding and following the law of nature, you will get comforts. It is again said: ਗੁਰ ਕੀ ਮਤਿ ਤੂੰ ਲੇਹਿ ਇਆਨੇ ॥ (ਗ:ਗ:ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ-288) Gurbani clearly advises that don’t go after the mind and get guidance from Gur that is from your wisdom. It means that the mind is to be controlled by one’s wisdom.

The other thing about SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH, Maan, as stated earlier, most of the times crazy to do wrong or bad things and therefore, it is to be controlled and trained to go in right direction by BUDH. At the same time BUDH is to get knowledge from various sources and the knowledge, which is available may not be good knowledge. Many times knowledge which is provided may be misleading and therefore, it is to be analysed. It is necessary to evaluate the knowledge which is being provided and find which is good, reasonable, and logically correct and which is incorrect. This is done by SURT that is your active and awakened mind or wisdom BUDH. After proper examination of the knowledge, it is to be imbibed. This properly tested knowledge is stored in MAAT, and it becomes your nature, SUBHA and YOU act according to the knowledge which is stored in MAAT. Thus, SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH relate to each other. This is all scientific. When the SURT MAAT MAAN BUDH are aligned properly the man becomes SACHIAR. And this is the purpose of Gurbani.

Please make it sure that you must point out your reaction. Do you like it or not? Even if you don’t like it, please say it.
 

ravneet_sb

Writer
SPNer
Nov 5, 2010
864
326
52
Sat Sri Akaal,

There is energy, else GOD, there is unit/root energy, which is source of all creation..it's unit ie.ONE, this.one is in all creation, ie which is generated, operates and will destroy.

There is ONENESS of all creation.

That is Mool Mantra ie root awareness or awareness of initiation.

Sat Naam This is truth in word form.
 
Feb 18, 2023
4
0
Sat Sri Brothers and Sister,
I have one question which has been on my mind for many-many years and for which I am until today unable to find a satisfactory answer. This question can be summarize as "Does God control everything in the Universe?" Allow me to explain myself...

In the Guru Granth Sahib, there appears countless times verses stating to the effect that :- "God is in charge and controls everything in the Universe. That nothing happens which is outside the Will of God. That God is the doer of all. That literally God IS All." These are not exact verses from the Granth Sahib but rather my understanding of verses. I do not think it would be necessary to quote any verses from the Granth Sahib as anyone reading it will bound to find countless verses stating to the effect.

The problem I find is elsewhere the Granth Sahib (and many other holy scriptures) also state that: "Man is responsible for his actions. That Man has free will and can and should decide what is right and wrong."

My dear brothers and sisters, I am confused! To my thinking both statements are contradictory. If God is the controller and doer of all, how can Man have free will? If man has free will, then how can God be said to control and do EVERYTHING? If free will is within the Will of God, how can we say it is FREE?
If free will is an illusion, then why does God punish Man by sending him to hell or reward him by sending him to heaven? What need be there for a heaven or hell if all that man does is according to His Will?

I am utterly confused and puzzled by this enigma! I have searched for an answer in many books and scriptures but the answer eludes me. I have searched through this website and found only ONE thread discussing free will. Kudos to Etinder for his lengthily exposition on free will. While I found his discussion very enlightening on the topic of free will, it still did not resolve my conflict. This is because Etinder choose to discuss free will from the philosophical point of view, leaving God out of the question. What I need is an explanation from Gurbani i.e. a theological or religious point of view.

If there be among you an enlightened one who can solve this mystery for me I shall forever be great full to him or her.

Thank you in advance.

Guru Ki Fateh
Balbinder Singh
Ipoh, Perak
Malay
Sat Sri Brothers and Sister,
I have one question which has been on my mind for many-many years and for which I am until today unable to find a satisfactory answer. This question can be summarize as "Does God control everything in the Universe?" Allow me to explain myself...

In the Guru Granth Sahib, there appears countless times verses stating to the effect that :- "God is in charge and controls everything in the Universe. That nothing happens which is outside the Will of God. That God is the doer of all. That literally God IS All." These are not exact verses from the Granth Sahib but rather my understanding of verses. I do not think it would be necessary to quote any verses from the Granth Sahib as anyone reading it will bound to find countless verses stating to the effect.

The problem I find is elsewhere the Granth Sahib (and many other holy scriptures) also state that: "Man is responsible for his actions. That Man has free will and can and should decide what is right and wrong."

My dear brothers and sisters, I am confused! To my thinking both statements are contradictory. If God is the controller and doer of all, how can Man have free will? If man has free will, then how can God be said to control and do EVERYTHING? If free will is within the Will of God, how can we say it is FREE?
If free will is an illusion, then why does God punish Man by sending him to hell or reward him by sending him to heaven? What need be there for a heaven or hell if all that man does is according to His Will?

I am utterly confused and puzzled by this enigma! I have searched for an answer in many books and scriptures but the answer eludes me. I have searched through this website and found only ONE thread discussing free will. Kudos to Etinder for his lengthily exposition on free will. While I found his discussion very enlightening on the topic of free will, it still did not resolve my conflict. This is because Etinder choose to discuss free will from the philosophical point of view, leaving God out of the question. What I need is an explanation from Gurbani i.e. a theological or religious point of view.

If there be among you an enlightened one who can solve this mystery for me I
Sat Sri Brothers and Sister,
I have one question which has been on my mind for many-many years and for which I am until today unable to find a satisfactory answer. This question can be summarize as "Does God control everything in the Universe?" Allow me to explain myself...

In the Guru Granth Sahib, there appears countless times verses stating to the effect that :- "God is in charge and controls everything in the Universe. That nothing happens which is outside the Will of God. That God is the doer of all. That literally God IS All." These are not exact verses from the Granth Sahib but rather my understanding of verses. I do not think it would be necessary to quote any verses from the Granth Sahib as anyone reading it will bound to find countless verses stating to the effect.

The problem I find is elsewhere the Granth Sahib (and many other holy scriptures) also state that: "Man is responsible for his actions. That Man has free will and can and should decide what is right and wrong."

My dear brothers and sisters, I am confused! To my thinking both statements are contradictory. If God is the controller and doer of all, how can Man have free will? If man has free will, then how can God be said to control and do EVERYTHING? If free will is within the Will of God, how can we say it is FREE?
If free will is an illusion, then why does God punish Man by sending him to hell or reward him by sending him to heaven? What need be there for a heaven or hell if all that man does is according to His Will?

I am utterly confused and puzzled by this enigma! I have searched for an answer in many books and scriptures but the answer eludes me. I have searched through this website and found only ONE thread discussing free will. Kudos to Etinder for his lengthily exposition on free will. While I found his discussion very enlightening on the topic of free will, it still did not resolve my conflict. This is because Etinder choose to discuss free will from the philosophical point of view, leaving God out of the question. What I need is an explanation from Gurbani i.e. a theological or religious point of view.

If there be among you an enlightened one who can solve this mystery for me I shall forever be great full to him or her.

Thank you in advance.

Guru Ki Fateh
Balbinder Singh
Ipoh, Perak
Malaysi
We dont have free will but we have free thinking. Our mann is the negative and our chit our antar atma is our true self consciousness where we need to contemplate naam which is gyan of gurbani. We may think we are doing something but that is Akals hukam as well.
 

ravneet_sb

Writer
SPNer
Nov 5, 2010
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We dont have free will but we have free thinking. Our mann is the negative and our chit our antar atma is our true self consciousness where we need to contemplate naam which is gyan of gurbani. We may think we are doing something but that is Akals hukam as well.
Sat Sri Akaal,

We have free will, but is bound to free thinking but if thoughts are attuned to Gurusbani, we enjoy free will, breaking the bondages of thought. Free will is result of higher E motion, intuitive listening, learning, love for others, compassion for all are attributes of free will support. Else ONE is bound to think.
 

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