BhagatSingh
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- Apr 24, 2006
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talking about chaos.... here he comes!! :happy:
Promoting JHATKA
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:hey i was expecting an answer from u ppl.:yes::inca:here is my question-
Originally Posted by SAINT SOLDIER
:hey i was expecting an answer from u ppl.:yes::inca:here is my question-Originally Posted by SAINT SOLDIER
u ppl got really good humour.:rofl!!::rofl!!::rofl!!::rofl!!::rofl!!:
the question being raised by me is that what if someone eats halal not intentionally but by mistake is there any process to undergo after that?:yes:
BhagatSingh
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- Apr 24, 2006
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I was going to answer but I thought you were kidding around.:
Originally Posted by SAINT SOLDIER
There is no process. Someone ate it? no biggie!
In fact, in the SGGS there is no instruction about kutha. So looking at it that way, you're good.
But in the Khalsa discipline, it states one cannot eat kutha so if one did, then one shouldn't do it again.
u ppl got really good humour.:rofl!!::rofl!!::rofl!!::rofl!!::rofl!!:
the question being raised by me is that what if someone eats halal not intentionally but by mistake is there any process to undergo after that?:yes:
Same process as vegetarian undergoes when he eats meat I guess. :happy:
PS Your sarcasm is truly breataking :whisling:
Archived_member7
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- Mar 26, 2006
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Ummm..lets invent a process..as i have done ..i mean ..in mumbai ..before i came to know jhatka ..i have relished non veg at muslim joints...as i started reading Sikhi ..i consume only halal..and for repentence ..i promote jhatka ..well..make it a point educate more and more people on jhatka ..well guys wait for the forthcoming attraction..i going to shoot a video myself of jhatka ..have spoken to a butcher ..here who owns a jhatka mutton shop..now guys what do u want me to do ? post it here or home deilver u ..i mean on yor personal ids ..the choice is yors ..!!!!:happy:
Archived_member7
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Archived_member7
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sure kds ji
- Jun 1, 2008
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WOW rajkhalsa ji thats great.:yes:the picture was enought to scare me
but i would like to c the video:yes::happy:
best of luck buddy:star:
but i would like to c the video
:yes::happy:best of luck buddy
:star:
You know veer ji, I read that and wondered what you were saying -- but then I realized you meant jhatka. It is easy to get mixed up if a lot is happening around you in the background. I think mostly all the readers knew what you meant.:yes:
Archived_member7
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- Mar 26, 2006
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you r right ..u know i feel..i have got obsessed with the concept...and i feel i would be relieved the day we get the JHATKA certification..wish me luck veers ..i might be able to shoot a video on saturday ...
Maybe you could start a new business, "Certified Jhatka" :ice:
Archived_member7
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- Mar 26, 2006
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see that could be good ..i might be able to look into it in the future ..but still its not abt my business ..this is about the sentiments of our own brethren..sikh, hindu.. buddhists ...all for whom halal is forbidden the basic reason possibly is compassion...i dont want to sit like a baniya in my shop ..satisfied ..hey i eat and sell jhatka..NO..thats not my goal..my goal..is MY RIGHT ..OUR RIGHT ..WE have a RIGHT TO DEMAND ..
The suffering is precisely why halal is fobidden. In halal the animal must suffer as a continued appeasement of God that harkens back to the sacrifice of the patriarch Abraham.
In the kosher slaughter of animals, the animal must not suffer. The knife must be completely free of nicks of any kind, the man who presides must be certified and trained. The objective of kosher slaughter is purity not suffering. Suffering causes impurity.
In jhatka the animal must not suffer. Guruji advises us that we should endeavor not to cause any part of creation to suffer.
Archived_member7
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bingo..u said it right aad ji..although kosher is also bleeding the animal to death ..and veerji unless the nerve attached to the brain is not cut ..the animal is bound to feel the sensation of pain agony ..so kosher too doesnt serve our purpose ...by the way thanks for yor post on meditation and OM Ksanti ..its good..atleast for me ..some peace for my ears ..its like ..i m speaking to almost everyone abt JHATKA ..wife, colleagues ..and all who consume non veg ...so this is a good thing to unwind..
Hey Sinisterji what do u use ? i mean i stick to Sukha ...hehehehehe...the nihang way ..
Hey Sinisterji what do u use ? i mean i stick to Sukha ...hehehehehe...the nihang way ..
Archived_member7
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- Mar 26, 2006
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well u might be aghast...but Sikhi has many things included ..till the 5th Guru ..Sikhi was more Bhakti oriented ..from the 6th Guru militarisation started ..it was slowly gathering pace ..and the 10TH GURU Maharaj established the KHALSA...this was the Sant Sipahi form of Sikhi...well they couldnt not remain meek and had to be in Bir Ras..i dont know about your reading ..but if you read the History u might understand the reason ...
I totally agree with your point ..we are not a predominantly non vegeterian advocating Panth..how ever there is also a provison for people who consume meat ..
I totally agree with your point ..we are not a predominantly non vegeterian advocating Panth..how ever there is also a provison for people who consume meat ..
Re: Promoting JHATKA?? What total nonsense
What about previous 9 Guru's?
Guru Nanak Eating Meat
Bhai Mani Singh, Gyan Ratnavali, pg. 123
At Kurukshetra, a great centre of Hindu pilgrimage, where a big fair was being held on the occasion of the solar eclipse. A follower of the Guru offered him deer meat to eat. The Guru who had never made any distinction between one kind of food and another and took whatever was offered to him, did not refuse the courtesies of his devotee. And he allowed him to roast it for his food.
A History of the Sikh People by Dr. Gopal Singh, World Sikh University Press, Delhi
It first occurs in Bhai Mani Singh's Gyan Ratnavali (pg. 123) which mentions Nanak having been engaged in debate with a Pandit, called Nanau Chand. The deer-meat was, according to this version, brought to him as an offering by a Prince and his consort, who having been dispossessed of their realm, came to him for a blessing. In the dialogue that followed with the Pandit, he is not only convinced of Nanak's logic, but persuades also the fellow Brahmins, basing his argument on the Veda, the Puranas and even the Quran, saying that even the Hindu gods could be propieated since the earliest times only through yagnas in which meat was invariably served, and that it has been the dharma of the Kashatriya Kings since ages to hunt.
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Guru Angad and Guru Amar Das Eating Meat
The Sikh Religion, Volume II by Max Arthur Macauliffe
One day the Guru had a meat dinner prepared. Amar Das said, "If the Guru is a searcher of hearts, he must know that I am a Vaishnav and do not touch flesh". The Guru (Guru Angad), knowing this, ordered that dal should be served him. Amar Das then reflected, "The Guru knoweth that meat is forbidden me, so he hath ordered that dal be served me instead." Amar Das then rapidly arrived at the conclusion that any disciple, whose practice differed from that of the Guru, must inevitably fail. He therefore told the cook that if the Guru were kind enough to give him meat, he would partake of it. The Guru, on hearing this, knew that superstition was departing from Amar Das's heart, and he handed him his own dish. When Amar Das had partaken of it, he for the first time felt peace of mind, and as he became further absorbed in his attentions and devotion to the Guru, celestial light dawned on his heart. Thus did he break with the strictest tenet of Vaishnavism and become a follower of the Guru. One day the Guru, in order to further remove Amar Das's prejudices, thus began to instruct him: "The meats it is proper to abstain from are these - Other's wealth, other's wives, slander, envy, covetousness and pride. If any one abstaining from meat is proud on the subject and says, 'I never touch meat,' let him consider that the infant sucks nipples of flesh, that the married man takes home with him a vessel of flesh." Guru Angad then repeated and expounded Guru Nanak's sloks on the subject. He also related to Amar Das the story of Duni Chand and his father, giving in the Life of Guru Nanak. "If you think of it," continued the Guru, "there is life in everything, even in fruits and flowers, so say nothing of flesh; but whatever thou eatest, eat remembering God, and it shall be profitable to thee. Whatever cometh to thee without hurting a fellow creature is nectar, and whatever thou recievest by giving pain is poison. To shatter another's hopes, to calumniate others, and to misappropriate their property is worse than to eat meat."
Macauliffe collaborated with the most learned Sikhs of his time when he wrote this over 100 years ago. The exact written source of this account is unknown.
What about previous 9 Guru's?
Guru Nanak Eating Meat
Bhai Mani Singh, Gyan Ratnavali, pg. 123
At Kurukshetra, a great centre of Hindu pilgrimage, where a big fair was being held on the occasion of the solar eclipse. A follower of the Guru offered him deer meat to eat. The Guru who had never made any distinction between one kind of food and another and took whatever was offered to him, did not refuse the courtesies of his devotee. And he allowed him to roast it for his food.
A History of the Sikh People by Dr. Gopal Singh, World Sikh University Press, Delhi
It first occurs in Bhai Mani Singh's Gyan Ratnavali (pg. 123) which mentions Nanak having been engaged in debate with a Pandit, called Nanau Chand. The deer-meat was, according to this version, brought to him as an offering by a Prince and his consort, who having been dispossessed of their realm, came to him for a blessing. In the dialogue that followed with the Pandit, he is not only convinced of Nanak's logic, but persuades also the fellow Brahmins, basing his argument on the Veda, the Puranas and even the Quran, saying that even the Hindu gods could be propieated since the earliest times only through yagnas in which meat was invariably served, and that it has been the dharma of the Kashatriya Kings since ages to hunt.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Guru Angad and Guru Amar Das Eating Meat
The Sikh Religion, Volume II by Max Arthur Macauliffe
One day the Guru had a meat dinner prepared. Amar Das said, "If the Guru is a searcher of hearts, he must know that I am a Vaishnav and do not touch flesh". The Guru (Guru Angad), knowing this, ordered that dal should be served him. Amar Das then reflected, "The Guru knoweth that meat is forbidden me, so he hath ordered that dal be served me instead." Amar Das then rapidly arrived at the conclusion that any disciple, whose practice differed from that of the Guru, must inevitably fail. He therefore told the cook that if the Guru were kind enough to give him meat, he would partake of it. The Guru, on hearing this, knew that superstition was departing from Amar Das's heart, and he handed him his own dish. When Amar Das had partaken of it, he for the first time felt peace of mind, and as he became further absorbed in his attentions and devotion to the Guru, celestial light dawned on his heart. Thus did he break with the strictest tenet of Vaishnavism and become a follower of the Guru. One day the Guru, in order to further remove Amar Das's prejudices, thus began to instruct him: "The meats it is proper to abstain from are these - Other's wealth, other's wives, slander, envy, covetousness and pride. If any one abstaining from meat is proud on the subject and says, 'I never touch meat,' let him consider that the infant sucks nipples of flesh, that the married man takes home with him a vessel of flesh." Guru Angad then repeated and expounded Guru Nanak's sloks on the subject. He also related to Amar Das the story of Duni Chand and his father, giving in the Life of Guru Nanak. "If you think of it," continued the Guru, "there is life in everything, even in fruits and flowers, so say nothing of flesh; but whatever thou eatest, eat remembering God, and it shall be profitable to thee. Whatever cometh to thee without hurting a fellow creature is nectar, and whatever thou recievest by giving pain is poison. To shatter another's hopes, to calumniate others, and to misappropriate their property is worse than to eat meat."
Macauliffe collaborated with the most learned Sikhs of his time when he wrote this over 100 years ago. The exact written source of this account is unknown.
I think the issue is not about suffereing or pain, but about appeasement. The whole idea of Sacrifice is abhorrent to the Sikh, and Halal/Kosher (and even Bali - Hindu sacrifice), is sacrifice/ritual slaughter.
I disagree that Sikhi was more Bhakhti orientated till the 6th Guru. Remember the 2nd Guru established wrestling arenas for his Suikhs to wrestle. Hardly something Bhakta's would do?
Also remeber the Guru's were from a Kshatriya clan (albeit one that jhad lost status), and they were not averse to the ways of the warrior. I am sure all the Guru's from Guru Nanak to the last knew how to defend themselves.
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