Spiritual Daily Amrit Vela Blog - Difficulties, Joys, Methods Of This Practical Journey To Self Discovery

[chazSingh]

Chazji,

its up to you, but if you feel debate should be left to the forum rather than your blog, then just open a thread with whatever the issue is, so that your blog may be left for personal experiences , just a thought

Blog became too much about me...

And a thread becomes about just opinions...even though I request people talk of their experiences joys and difficulties lol

Its like asking people...hey let's share our experiences of playing football....but someone keeps posting...but I believe cricket is better lol

Still .. open is better whichever way the thread evolves .

Have a good weekend dude

 

[Navdeep88]

You are still concerned with the inner state of others. Rather be concerned with only your own inner state.

Who are you?

I am a person writing on a forum (goal:affiliation), not a personal journal (goal: private self reflection). An Inner state is Worthless if it doesn't help anyone else.

Who am I? A changing person, not the same as yesterday. It's not my GOAL to know completely who I am (because it's not possible). It is however, important for my person that my incomplete Inner self and my Complete Outer self (good health, no disabilities) to know that I am Not stagnant. There is struggle, there is challenge, there is the possibility to learn. That's more important than parroting a belief that might not have substance.

 

[Navdeep88]

I really don;t know my destination...if i knew that i would already be there

Navdeep, SGGS Ji describes something quite unique...an 'IK' a creative energy, power, sound current, something infused within what was created...and therefore infused within me, and you also...

I just have this thirst within, to find out more...it started with a lot of reading of SGGS Ji, books written by others...discussion with people...the thirst just kind of grew...sometimes unbearable...

using some methods i believe are described in SGGS Ji...i tried to be pragmatic so to speak...tried things and tried to evaluate the results...

I guess that something 'within' knew i was intrigued...and in some ways made it known to me...
no idea about destinations...some things are out of my control...and out of anything i could imagine or comprehend

hope that helps

Chaz,

Thank you for the courteous reply.

But it doesn't help. I have an issue with someone saying, if there was a gauge/destination I would already be there. Doesn't that bother you?

1) You have no where to progress
2) You judge your own performance

Also, how is a thirst unbearable? Sounds overly emotional. Did this result in physical pain?

In my opinion, there are lots of people in the world who have actual unbearable thirst. As a Sikh, is it more important to aid people (I'm not perfect, but it's important to try) or to talk from your well fed stance (mine and yours) about things that are not concrete.

 

[BhagatSingh]

I am a person writing on a forum (goal:affiliation), not a personal journal (goal: private self reflection). An Inner state is Worthless if it doesn't help anyone else.

Who am I? A changing person, not the same as yesterday. It's not my GOAL to know completely who I am (because it's not possible). It is however, important for my person that my incomplete Inner self and my Complete Outer self (good health, no disabilities) to know that I am Not stagnant. There is struggle, there is challenge, there is the possibility to learn. That's more important than parroting a belief that might not have substance.

That's better. Your post indicates an inward turn.

You made some good observations that will nurture growth -

Observation 1 - A changing person, not the same as yesterday.

It is powerful to recognize this... not even day-by-day but moment-by-moment, due to the fact that we are constantly in flux, transient. Thoughts and feelings arise and disappear in a moments.

So ramping up this type of observation and watching the person in constant change is of great value, as it provides insights into the person's struggles, challenges and maximizes learning.

Which leads us to -

Observation 2 - There is struggle, there is challenge, there is the possibility to learn.

This is true of any path. And thus observation of oneself, can provide leverage in whatever path you are on, it can provide leverage with regards to challenges and learning experiences.

Question -
1. What are you goals regarding your struggles, challenges and the things you want to learn?



Some assumptions you are making that may make you stagnant -

Assumption 1 - An Inner state is Worthless if it doesn't help anyone else.

Is that so?

I think not.

When you dance in the rain and splash around in the puddles - that experience is worth a lot regardless of whether it helped anyone.

When you go hike up a mountain, reach the top, smell that fresh air, wipe that sweat off your face and gaze down at the beautiful valley - that experience is worth a lot regardless of whether it helped anyone.


Also -
While it is good to help people, when you judge your worth SOLELY by how much you have helped someone then that is an unhealthy state to be in.

Question-
2. What inner states have you found in life that were worth it?


Assumption 2 - It's not possible to know who you are fully.

Is it really impossible?

I take that you are not parroting a belief here and have actually tried this yourself.

So two questions -
3. By which method(s) did you explore yourself?
4. What did you find out by employing them?

 

[Navdeep88]

That's better. Your post indicates an inward turn.

You made some good observations that will nurture growth

Observation 1 - A changing person, not the same as yesterday.

It is powerful to recognize this... not even day-by-day but moment-by-moment, due to the fact that we are constantly in flux, transient. Thoughts and feelings arise and disappear in a moments.

So ramping up this type of observation and watching the person in constant change is of great value, as it provides insights into the person's struggles, challenges and maximizes learning.

Which leads us to -

Observation 2 - There is struggle, there is challenge, there is the possibility to learn.

This is true of any path. And thus observation of oneself, can provide leverage in whatever path you are on, it can provide leverage with regards to challenges and learning experiences.

Question -
1. What are you goals regarding your struggles, challenges and the things you want to learn?



Some assumptions you are making that may make you stagnant -

Assumption 1 - An Inner state is Worthless if it doesn't help anyone else.

Is that so?

I think not.

When you dance in the rain and splash around in the puddles - that experience is worth a lot regardless of whether it helped anyone.

When you go hike up a mountain, reach the top, smell that fresh air, wipe that sweat off your face and gaze down at the beautiful valley - that experience is worth a lot regardless of whether it helped anyone.


Also -
While it is good to help people, when you judge your worth SOLELY by how much you have helped someone then that is an unhealthy state to be in.

Question-
2. What inner states have you found in life that were worth it?


Assumption 2 - It's not possible to know who you are fully.

Is it really impossible?

I take that you are not parroting a belief here and have actually tried this yourself.

So two questions -
3. By which method(s) did you explore yourself?
4. What did you find out by employing them?

Hmm, I thought You Criticized me for being overly concerned with others, yet you've made this entire reply about me. Lol

My growth is not at question here (I'm not above it but it's not my reason for participating). I'm concerned about the Perspective of the adherence of the "Spiritualists".

"While it is good to help people, when you judge your worth SOLELY by how much you have helped someone then that is an unhealthy state to be in." I Never claimed this was the end all. However Life is not a big Vacation. There is reward in being productive and helping others.

A reversal of your statement: While it is good to have a level of personal spirituality, when you judge your worth SOLELY by how self-proclaiming 'Spiritual' you are, that is an UNHEALTHY State to be in.

To answer your question about inner growth: It's more important to EXPERIENCE the moment in nature, then document/talk endlessly. Experience it's beauty, then move on. And be open to experiencing the variety of experiences life can offer (splendid or not).
Talking about it, talking about it, talking about it doesn't extend it or re-create it but robs the possibility of future.

 

[chazSingh]

Hmm, I thought You Criticized me for being overly concerned with others, yet you've made this entire reply about me. Lol

My growth is not at question here (I'm not above it but it's not my reason for participating). I'm concerned about the Perspective of the adherence of the "Spiritualists".

"While it is good to help people, when you judge your worth SOLELY by how much you have helped someone then that is an unhealthy state to be in." I Never claimed this was the end all. However Life is not a big Vacation. There is reward in being productive and helping others.

A reversal of your statement: While it is good to have a level of personal spirituality, when you judge your worth SOLELY by how self-proclaiming 'Spiritual' you are, that is an UNHEALTHY State to be in.

To answer your question about inner growth: It's more important to EXPERIENCE the moment in nature, then document/talk endlessly. Experience it's beauty, then move on. And be open to experiencing the variety of experiences life can offer (splendid or not).
Talking about it, talking about it, talking about it doesn't extend it or re-create it but robs the possibility of future.

Hi navdeep. Please read the first post on this forum.

And please try to post something related to that.
Just because we are talking about spirituality here and out experiences doesn't mean we don't have a life where we live and help others lol

Lets please try and keep it to what I requested on the first post. If you want to discuss something slightly different it's easier to open another thread.

Thanks

 

[Original]

Navdeep Ji

With age comes maturity and with maturity comes wisdom [This is not to be construed discriminative but proverbial]. And, the becoming and learning of the spiritual is the accumulation of experiences, both good n bad, particularly those that has a big question mark along side it [meaning why, ?], and is beyond the calculation of human intellect. This, then is an invitation to the spiritual segment of the human you, separating you as it were, from the other three, namely, physical, mental and emotional. For example, take a tree, which in time produces a bud that blossoms into a flower and finally a fruit. It is said that the true "nature" [purpose] of the tree is the fruit, albeit, supplanted by the flower and the bud that precedes it as a mean to an ultimate end. Similarly, spiritual Sikhism is to that end to tease out if you like, the "fruit" [spiritual] you from the physical, emotional and the mental you.

Page 12 of SGGSJ confirms the same, beautifully:

ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥ ਭਈ ਪਰਾਪਤਿ ਮਾਨੁਖ ਦੇਹੁਰੀਆ ॥ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਮਿਲਣ ਕੀ ਇਹ ਤੇਰੀ ਬਰੀਆ ॥ ਅਵਰਿ ਕਾਜ ਤੇਰੈ ਕਿਤੈ ਨ ਕਾਮ ॥ ਮਿਲੁ ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਭਜੁ ਕੇਵਲ ਨਾਮ ॥੧॥ ਸਰੰਜਾਮਿ ਲਾਗੁ ਭਵਜਲ ਤਰਨ ਕੈ ॥ ਜਨਮੁ ਬ੍ਰਿਥਾ ਜਾਤ ਰੰਗਿ ਮਾਇਆ ਕੈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ ਜਪੁ ਤਪੁ ਸੰਜਮੁ ਧਰਮੁ ਨ ਕਮਾਇਆ ॥ ਸੇਵਾ ਸਾਧ ਨ ਜਾਨਿਆ ਹਰਿ ਰਾਇਆ ॥ ਕਹੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਹਮ ਨੀਚ ਕਰੰਮਾ ॥ ਸਰਣਿ ਪਰੇ ਕੀ ਰਾਖਹੁ ਸਰਮਾ ॥੨॥੪॥{ਪੰਨਾ 12}

Translation [bold]: time to meet the spiritual you.

Note in gest for onlookers: Bhagat Singh's post #144 is beautifully drafted for the contemplative mind and is worth chewing.

Enjoy the day !

 

[japjisahib04]

ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥ ਭਈ ਪਰਾਪਤਿ ਮਾਨੁਖ ਦੇਹੁਰੀਆ ॥ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਮਿਲਣ ਕੀ ਇਹ ਤੇਰੀ ਬਰੀਆ ॥ ਅਵਰਿ ਕਾਜ ਤੇਰੈ ਕਿਤੈ ਨ ਕਾਮ ॥ ਮਿਲੁ ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਭਜੁ ਕੇਵਲ ਨਾਮ ॥੧॥ ਸਰੰਜਾਮਿ ਲਾਗੁ ਭਵਜਲ ਤਰਨ ਕੈ ॥ ਜਨਮੁ ਬ੍ਰਿਥਾ ਜਾਤ ਰੰਗਿ ਮਾਇਆ ਕੈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ ਜਪੁ ਤਪੁ ਸੰਜਮੁ ਧਰਮੁ ਨ ਕਮਾਇਆ ॥ ਸੇਵਾ ਸਾਧ ਨ ਜਾਨਿਆ ਹਰਿ ਰਾਇਆ ॥ ਕਹੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਹਮ ਨੀਚ ਕਰੰਮਾ ॥ ਸਰਣਿ ਪਰੇ ਕੀ ਰਾਖਹੁ ਸਰਮਾ ॥੨॥੪॥{ਪੰਨਾ 12}

Translation [bold]: time to meet the spiritual you.

The problem in understanding comes when we link ਮਾਨੁਖ ਦੇਹੁਰੀਆ ॥ with our biological (physical) body. Obtaining physical body is not a blessing as millions and millions live like an insect and suffer. It is who is able to remove the veil of illusion between us and the divine within us and obtain the robe of durlabh manukh and establish his entity. Akal Purkh had special mission in evolving human beings from animal kingdom. The mission was to create a human who should be NirBhau, Nirveir, happy, content, full of love for fellow beings and always ready to serve them with humility. Guru Nanak was the first religious man who understood this wish of Akal Purakh. Mission of gurbani is how to be sachiar and practical. Throughout gurbani it is refered as durlabh manukh dey. Gurmat spirituality is different than sitting in trance and mumbling but innovative and helping humanity and i.e. surrender to His hukam i.e. guru sahib advised Yogies to come down from mountain and help the people

 

[chazSingh]

H

The problem in understanding comes when we link ਮਾਨੁਖ ਦੇਹੁਰੀਆ ॥ with our biological (physical) body. Obtaining physical body is not a blessing as millions and millions live like an insect and suffer. It is who is able to remove the veil of illusion between us and the divine within us and obtain the robe of durlabh manukh and establish his entity. Akal Purkh had special mission in evolving human beings from animal kingdom. The mission was to create a human who should be NirBhau, Nirveir, happy, content, full of love for fellow beings and always ready to serve them with humility. Guru Nanak was the first religious man who understood this wish of Akal Purakh. Mission of gurbani is how to be sachiar and practical. Throughout gurbani it is refered as durlabh manukh dey. Gurmat spirituality is different than sitting in trance and mumbling but innovative and helping humanity and i.e. surrender to His hukam i.e. guru sahib advised Yogies to come down from mountain and help the people

Thanks for sharing ji

How is your ever increasing connection with waheguru helping you serve others better...

I''s that knowing that waheguru is within you and therefore in others also...helping you serve and live better. ..

Any difficulties? Joys...?

 

[Navdeep88]

A Blog for all that do regular Amrit Vela Nitnem, Simran etc.

Whilst i try to do Amrit Vela every day, some days lifes events come in the way, or the mind brings forth it's excuses and i fall prey and follow.

It would be nice to share this journey with others that wish to try, or are already doing Amrit Vela ... to uplift each other, to inspire each other etc etc. in a practical sense...

no rights, no wrongs ... to learn through actual experience ...to allow our consciousness to grow through continued contemplation, taking practical steps, re-evaluation when hurdles appear - whilst constantly seeking guidance from our outer and inner guru (One), and each other

God Bless All

I'm not drinking the lemonade. This description seems overly positive, when in actuality there is a daily struggle. Your brain wants to sleep but you shouldn't. You gut wants to overeat but you stop yourself.

In every instance there is Control.

*My replies are not off subject, considering taunting remarks to other people about samosas and being 'nuts' is acceptable. Just because it doesn't Repeat your stance or that of others, and that makes you UNCOMFORTABLE, doesn't make it Irrelevant.

 

[Navdeep88]

H


Thanks for sharing ji

How is your ever increasing connection with waheguru helping you serve others better...

I''s that knowing that waheguru is within you and therefore in others also...helping you serve and live better. ..

Any difficulties? Joys...?

My 'ever increasing connection'? How is that possible to know? Is God a plug in machine, where as long as your plugged in you 100% know the workings of it? What if your adaptor is wrong (what if your a mac, not a pc, and you get rejected).

 

[chazSingh]

I'm not drinking the lemonade. This description seems overly positive, when in actuality there is a daily struggle. Your brain wants to sleep but you shouldn't. You gut wants to overeat but you stop yourself.

In every instance there is Control.

*My replies are not off subject, considering taunting remarks to other people about samosas and being 'nuts' is acceptable. Just because it doesn't Repeat your stance or that of others, and that makes you UNCOMFORTABLE, doesn't make it Irrelevant.

Definitely don't feel uncomfortable with your comments

The description talks of difficulties lol so please talk of your daily struggles...share..if you want to...that's what the thread is for

The description says for those that are making that effort to connect..what their difficulties and joys are... let's actually do that

 

[chazSingh]

I

My 'ever increasing connection'? How is that possible to know? Is God a plug in machine, where as long as your plugged in you 100% know the workings of it? What if your adaptor is wrong (what if your a mac, not a pc, and you get rejected).

How is It possible to know?
How do you know if you like a sweet
How do you know what fear is when you first experience it?
Or hunger
Or love?

Share your experienced on here...try some of the things said in sggs ji

How do I know...I just do? Love
...it's coooool lol


Keep sharing. ..it's a daily struggle but we can inspire each other

God bless

 

[Navdeep88]

I


How is It possible to know?
How do you know if you like a sweet
How do you know what fear is when you first experience it?
Or hunger
Or love?

Share your experienced on here...try some of the things said in sggs ji

How do I know...I just do? Love
...it's coooool lol


Keep sharing. ..it's a daily struggle but we can inspire each other

God bless

Oooo... more koolaid.

Actually, I would consider any sort of Spirituality a PRIVATE matter, where I am a lesser part of the equation. The biggest part of the equation is the situations that I encounter in Life(the time gifted to me) and how I use my beautiful Brain(also, god--given) to comprehend, analyze and come up with a solution/action that will help myself and my fellow man. God expects this purity in Action, not just intention.

I will not be sharing because
1) I have limited time
2) I don't agree with the reasoning or flow here.

I don't want to end up describing ever thing as an adjective.. Whether it's "coooool" or whatever else. Sounds awful.

 

[chazSingh]

Actually, I would consider any sort of Spirituality a PRIVATE matter, where I am a lesser part of the equation. The biggest part of the equation is the situations that I encounter in Life(the time gifted to me) and how I use my beautiful Brain(also, god--given) to comprehend, analyze and come up with a solution/action that will help myself and my fellow man. God expects this purity in Action, not just intention.

Well done...you.ve just described pretty much everyone here...

I will not be sharing because
1) I have limited time
2) I don't agree with the reasoning or flow here.

You.ve probably been the fastest poster on this forum for a long time.

I don't want to end up describing ever thing as an adjective.. Whether it's "coooool" or whatever else. Sounds awful.

Describe the love for you parents...or kids or whatever. .

It's pretty hard isn't it? Do mere words do that love justice?

Good luck with life and everything navdeep

 

[Navdeep88]

'Well done...you.ve just described pretty much everyone here...' No I haven't. You're actively encouraging people to publicize it.

'You.ve probably been the fastest poster on this forum for a long time.' I havent Been on this forum in a long time. Thread and forum are different things

'No one is making you post on here...if you don't agree with it..then don't post.. especially if you don't have much time..' I'm posting here because I DON'T agree and I will post where I want because I CAN. You don't get to direct what I should or shouldn't be sharing, especially if it for disagrees with your views.

'Describe the love for you parents...or kids or whatever. .' No. I don't know you, I've never seen you nor you me. Why would I publicly talk about my Obvious love for my parents (which is useless if Not acted upon).

'It's pretty hard isn't it? Do mere words do that love justice?' NOPE, I assume most parents love their children similarly and vice versa.

'Good luck with life and everything navdeep' Already living it, don't need "luck".

 

[BhagatSingh]

Hmm, I thought You Criticized me for being overly concerned with others, yet you've made this entire reply about me. Lol

It wasn't but I am glad it made you feel special.

My growth is not at question here

Oh. Why did you bring it up then?

Your words, not mine -> It is however, important for my person that my incomplete Inner self and my Complete Outer self (good health, no disabilities) to know that I am Not stagnant. There is struggle, there is challenge, there is the possibility to learn. That's more important than parroting a belief that might not have substance.

I'm concerned about the Perspective of the adherence of the "Spiritualists".

<insert criticism about you being overly concerned with others>

There is reward in being productive and helping others.

And what is that reward?

While it is good to have a level of personal spirituality, when you judge your worth SOLELY by how self-proclaiming 'Spiritual' you are, that is an UNHEALTHY State to be in.

Hey! You simply parroting what I said or do you actually understand why that's the case?

To answer your question about inner growth: It's more important to EXPERIENCE the moment in nature, then document/talk endlessly. Experience it's beauty, then move on.

But that didn't help anyone so it was worthless, am I right?

To answer your question about inner growth

There were other questions that I would like you to respond to as well.

"
Assumption 2 - It's not possible to know who you are fully.

Is it really impossible?

I take that you are not parroting a belief here and have actually tried this yourself.

So two questions -
3. By which method(s) did you explore yourself?
4. What did you find out by employing them?
"

Talking about it, talking about it, talking about it doesn't extend it or re-create it but robs the possibility of future.

What else do you want people to do on a forum? Shoot snot rockets out of their nose?

 

[chazSingh]

'Well done...you.ve just described pretty much everyone here...' No I haven't. You're actively encouraging people to publicize it.

'You.ve probably been the fastest poster on this forum for a long time.' I havent Been on this forum in a long time. Thread and forum are different things

'No one is making you post on here...if you don't agree with it..then don't post.. especially if you don't have much time..' I'm posting here because I DON'T agree and I will post where I want because I CAN. You don't get to direct what I should or shouldn't be sharing, especially if it for disagrees with your views.

'Describe the love for you parents...or kids or whatever. .' No. I don't know you, I've never seen you nor you me. Why would I publicly talk about my Obvious love for my parents (which is useless if Not acted upon).

'It's pretty hard isn't it? Do mere words do that love justice?' NOPE, I assume most parents love their children similarly and vice versa.

'Good luck with life and everything navdeep' Already living it, don't need "luck".

I.m not asking you to describe your love here lol.... I. M asking you just to do it.. and then see if mere words do it justice..

 

[chazSingh]

It wasn't but I am glad it made you feel special.



Oh. Why did you bring it up then?

Your words, not mine -> It is however, important for my person that my incomplete Inner self and my Complete Outer self (good health, no disabilities) to know that I am Not stagnant. There is struggle, there is challenge, there is the possibility to learn. That's more important than parroting a belief that might not have substance.


<insert criticism about you being overly concerned with others>


And what is that reward?



Hey! You simply parroting what I said or do you actually understand why that's the case?


But that didn't help anyone so it was worthless, am I right?



There were other questions that I would like you to respond to as well.

"
Assumption 2 - It's not possible to know who you are fully.

Is it really impossible?

I take that you are not parroting a belief here and have actually tried this yourself.

So two questions -
3. By which method(s) did you explore yourself?
4. What did you find out by employing them?
"



What else do you want people to do on a forum? Shoot snot rockets out of their nose?

Your writing style is pretty cool my friend..

Keep the posts coming...

 

[Original]

Japjisahib Ji - SSA

The problem

Huh..what problem ? Gurbani is "active" and positive, not "restrictive" and negative. The very word "gur"- "bani" is the solution, the light of life for a SIKH and not a problem and never will be a problem.

The problem in understanding comes when we link ਮਾਨੁਖ ਦੇਹੁਰੀਆ ॥ with our biological (physical) body.

..Guru Arjun Ji is pretyy clear when he says, " hey human [ਮਾਨੁਖ] thou art creation of God [
ਦੇਹੁਰੀਆ] and your purpose for being created a human is to meet your creator. Where is the problem in that ? I think you're complicating what is basically a simple statement of fact from within a theological perspective.

Obtaining physical body is not a blessing

..I'm sorry to hear that ! Have a read of the opening passage of Asa Di Vaar and see what Gur Nanak is saying...

Obtaining physical body is not a blessing as millions and millions live like an insect and suffer.

..this is the world of duality, you cannot have one without the other. Of course, there is suffering [dukh] and comfort [sukh], this is the huiman condition. Doctrinal Sikhism seeks to address the very same and offers by way of relief, a spiritual journey - nam simran [open to wider interpretation].

Akal Purkh

..AP is nirgun, has no agenda at all, everything is as a result of AP the attributiveless ! No mission - no nothing, AP just is, an existence.

Akal Purkh had special mission in evolving human beings from animal kingdom.

.. "reincarnation" - !

The mission was to create a human who should be NirBhau, Nirveir

..in that case AP failed because all humans are intrinsically fearful and conflictive !

happy, content, full of love for fellow beings and always ready to serve them with humility.

..in this case AP succeeded to a degree, that is, altruistic and cooperative !

Guru Nanak was the first religious man who understood this wish of Akal Purakh.

..stick to selling sand to the Arabs or else, you'll be held responsible for starting WW3 !

Mission of gurbani is how to be sachiar and practical.

..yes, I agree ! Sachiar as an ideal is to theoretically populate on the proviso that one remains within and on the path of HUKAM.

Throughout gurbani it is refered as durlabh manukh dey.

....yes ! indeed, its a rare opportunity to be born human....gurbani is saying take advantage and meet the Govind within you !

Gurmat spirituality is different

..please share !

sitting in trance and mumbling

,,Japjisahib Ji, you're both learned and a senior member of SPN, pls show respect to "nam simran". I must remind you of the right to respect and dignity of others in a democratic society. I'll request Admin Singh Ji to throw the rule book at you, for reference sake. Sikhs "do not" look down upon anyone, but rather, accommodate and understand everyone. Their mission is to strive for unity in diversity. Use of derogatory or profane language is contrary to Sikh belief n value, kindly show respect when visiting SIKH site, thank you !

Let us start from today to become "sachiar and practical" as per your observation above !

surrender to His hukam

..which is love ! Love not war - let's see, shall we ! You will hereinafter, accept the meditators, gladiators, agitators and dictators on account them being humans wannabe SIKHS and allow them safe passage without fear or favour.

guru sahib advised Yogies to come down from mountain and help the people

...and you're sending them [meditators] back up because you don't want them here, ha !

Goodnight n Godbless