Spiritual Daily Amrit Vela Blog - Difficulties, Joys, Methods Of This Practical Journey To Self Discovery

[japjisahib04]

Bhagat Singh Jee

Please simply answer 'have you ever seen any animal or insect contemplating on sabd'. Upon your answer I will take you back to rahao pankti and then we will be able to easily interact and will show you the difference between mumbling and contemplation

 

[Original]

When a person sits and recites words that are not understood, at a speed by which comprehension is impossible, and even tries to beat the record for the time taken to recite, what else could it be other than mumbling, I must remind YOU of the right to respect and dignity of others, there is nothing derogatory or profane about describing this as mumbling, it is simple fact, if you are trying to recite something as quick as possible, then it is mumbling, try and remember that your mission works both ways, not just your way, or should I start seeking legal address for freedom of speech before you start censoring everything you do not agree with?

regards

H.....you missed the operative word, NAM SIMRAN, to which I referred and requested Japjisahib Ji to show respect n understanding. Nam Simran by definition is what we're given at the time of initiation - WAHEGURU. This is a speaking tongue and not a mumbling tongue. It is an intelligible speech. To call it mumbling is clearly irreverence by virtue of the term employed to a genre that is holy n sacred.

As for legal rationality [reference sake only], but otherwise, we're all a one big family, learning from one another.

Article 18...[Universal Declaration of Human Rights]

Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.

Article 1.

All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

As citizens of the state, in a democratic society we are reminded of our obligations, particularly, of respect n dignity for one another.

Thank you -

 

[Tejwant Singh]

QUOTE="Original, post: 208098, member: 14400"]H.....you missed the operative word, NAM SIMRAN, to which I referred and requested Japjisahib Ji to show respect n understanding. Nam Simran by definition is what we're given at the time of initiation - WAHEGURU.

What is initiation? What kind of ritual is that in Sikhi? Please elaborate.

This is a speaking tongue and not a mumbling tongue. It is an intelligible speech. To call it mumbling is clearly irreverence by virtue of the term employed to a genre that is holy n sacred.

There is no such thing in Sikhi. Christians are known to speak in tongues. Are you trying to say that Sikhs do the same as the Christians?

Please provide examples from SGGS, our only Guru for the above or is it your personal kind of "Sikhi" with the colours of Hindutva and Abrahamic faiths which you fill your posts with?Pretending to be a Sikh may be a good ego booster for some.

As for legal rationality [reference sake only], but otherwise, we're all a one big family, learning from one another.

Article 18...[Universal Declaration of Human Rights]

Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.

Article 1.

All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

As citizens of the state, in a democratic society we are reminded of our obligations, particularly, of respect n dignity for one another.

Universal Declaration of Human Rights came late to the party because Sikhi is based on this which happened 500 some years ago. I thought you knew that.

Learning through Piri and practicing those lessons through Miri is the best Spiritual journey for me, not mumbling as many claim here.

 

[Navdeep88]

Schooling adult children who can't behave themselves.

Infanticizing Adults that disagree with you through a SUPERB use of Passive aggression and repetition of nonsense questions is more like it.

 

[Navdeep88]

BhagatSingh:'It wasn't but I am glad it made you feel special. '

Read your post again and see how often you use the word 'You' versus using 'I', but once. No, my specialnesss has nothing to do with you, but I'm glad you think that (passive aggression returned).

'Oh. Why did you bring it up then?'

Because I Can. Always remember that, I can.

'There were other questions that I would like you to respond to as well.
Assumption 2 - It's not possible to know who you are fully.
Is it really impossible?
I take that you are not parroting a belief here and have actually tried this yourself.
So two questions -
3. By which method(s) did you explore yourself?
4. What did you find out by employing them?'

How about No? How about I find these bizarre Simple questions a sneaky and underhanded attempt to infanticize/convert me to a lemming of your camp.

'What else do you want people to do on a forum? Shoot snot rockets out of their nose?'

That would be entertaining and more genuine/truthful than a lot else happening.

SO, IN YOUR SIGNATURE FASHION OF REPITITION AND ATTEMPTING TO SIMPLIFY THINGS, let me leave you with this: I disagree with the perspective you begin with, so I will not be answering any questions, on any level, that may satisfy criteria to be "one of you". Second, I am an independent being and I OWN my perspective and will express it without Censorship.

 

[Navdeep88]

Your writing style is pretty cool my friend..

Keep the posts coming...

Ohh, buttering people up. Classic move to convert/retain someone.

 

[Original]

 

[Luckysingh]

Beautiful Wondrous Wa-he-guroo

........'have you ever seen any animal or insect contemplating on sabd'. ....

It is not seen, but Yes, it is heard and you can feel it. The beauty is when you become selfless and connect with it. Quite recently, most mornings, I've been having the company of two local eagles, which I sometimes connect to!....awesome!!

 

[chazSingh]

Ohh, buttering people up. Classic move to convert/retain someone.

Convert or retain?

this is funny stuff....it really is lol

 

[chazSingh]

Beautiful Wondrous Wa-he-guroo



It is not seen, but Yes, it is heard and you can feel it. The beauty is when you become selfless and connect with it. Quite recently, most mornings, I've been having the company of two local eagles, which I sometimes connect to!....awesome!!

My Cat seems to be loving my early morning Simran....usually very active, jumpy...can;t wait to get out...now sits through the Simran.

If it feels anything that i do...i can see why

 

[chazSingh]

The pull inwards - the current that takes us within...

Very powerful last night...mind eventually absorbed in the sound of Waheguru and Satnaam flowing through it. but the initial struggle was difficult

the mind is so easily distracted...random thoughts of life kept flashing by...the new promotion i've just had, all the additional traveling to other countries...how it will affect me...the car that keeps playing up...the business opportunity my friend wants me to take an interest in...why i haven't been doing my martial arts training recently...
Does the mind never give in - just goes on and on...

all i could so was surrender to them, just gently watched the thoughts flash by...and then asking Waheguru to help me past them...in this moment perseverance was the key

When you feel the current, you just surrender, and let it take you. Its beautiful, energizing, revealing...

Waheguru .... Waheguru .... Waheguru....they think i parrot...that i hold no love for you...that my heart isn't calling out for you...That I and others are here as some form of business, to recruit...

waheguru waheguru waheguru

 

[chazSingh]

Chaz,

Also, how is a thirst unbearable? Sounds overly emotional. Did this result in physical pain?

Navdeep Ji.....it doesn't result in physical pain....but often i feel like this beautiful shabad written by Sri Guru Arjan Dev Ji.

In your reading of Gurbani, i'm sure you would have read such shabads, so i'm surprised you make the above statement.

after reading it, please ask your Guru if was He was being Overly emotional, and if it resulted in physical pain...please do this

My mind longs for the Blessed Vision of the Guru's Darshan.
It cries out like the thirsty song-bird.
My thirst is not quenched, and I can find no peace, without the Blessed Vision of the Beloved Saint.
I am a sacrifice, my soul is a sacrifice, to the Blessed Vision of the Beloved Saint Guru. ||1||Pause||
Your Face is so Beautiful, and the Sound of Your Words imparts intuitive wisdom.
It is so long since this rainbird has had even a glimpse of water.
Blessed is that land where You dwell, O my Friend and Intimate Divine Guru
I am a sacrifice, I am forever a sacrifice, to my Friend and Intimate Divine Guru.
When I could not be with You for just one moment, the Dark Age of Kali Yuga dawned for me.
When will I meet You, O my Beloved Lord?
I cannot endure the night, and sleep does not come, without the Sight of the Beloved Guru's Court.
I am a sacrifice, my soul is a sacrifice, to that True Court of the Beloved Guru
By good fortune, I have met the Saint Guru.
SikhiToTheMAX - Enabling Gurmat Knowledge

The shabad ends in so much positivity, so much delight at What Guru Ji discovered within himself...at what Guru Ji is inspired to help others Discover.

After you read the end, Ask your Guru, please Ask your Guru if he is selling a business, if he is recruiting for His own benefit...or just talking utter garbage about the possibility of experiencing waheguru whilst yet alive in the physical body

I have found the Immortal Lord within the home of my own self.
I will now serve You forever, and I shall never be separated from You, even for an instant. Servant Nanak is Your slave, O Beloved Master.
I am a sacrifice, my soul is a sacrifice; servant Nanak is Your slave, Lord.

In my opinion, there are lots of people in the world who have actual unbearable thirst. As a Sikh, is it more important to aid people (I'm not perfect, but it's important to try) or to talk from your well fed stance (mine and yours) about things that are not concrete.

of course it's important to help...please stop this assumption that people who thirst for experience of Waheguru...stop serving humanity...and stop living...

When Guru Ji says:
will now serve You forever, and I shall never be separated from You, even for an instant. Servant Nanak is Your slave, O Beloved Master.
I am a sacrifice, my soul is a sacrifice; servant Nanak is Your slave, Lord.

This includes Serving Humanity.

 

[Luckysingh]

Well done Chaz, ..keep it up bro

Everything will slowly start to become more clear as that veil of maya begins to lift. You want to use the MIND for what it was really intended for. One only comes to know this as the veil begins to lift and the 5 tat maya gets apparent for what it really is.
Btw, have a read of the 5 elements post on page 9. This was inspired by one of Bhagat's statements, and when I began to write it, I was realising so much more that it was making even more sense. I'm sure you will be able to add and inspire it even further.

ps. I'm not joking about the eagles

 

[chazSingh]

you do not seem to have much respect for this thread with your questions which are utterly pointless, do you think if you just keep regurgitating the same again and again, I am going to give in and throw my hands up?

I am not a moderator anymore, but if I were, I would be asking to get back to the thread, I know you are eager to show your camp how masterful and intelligent you are, but don't you think this conversation should be in private, or at least on another thread? that way you can keep an audience!

If I had time I would look for a comment that you had made and then constantly ask if you were referring to me, see that is not debate, its what children do in the playground, if you wish to debate then debate properly, not like a child

Harry Ji,

I thank you for trying to keep the thread in tact, and going in some direction...much appreciated.

The parroting thing comes up a lot, because we see people appear to do this all the time...
in the Gurdwara on Saturday...two people at the front, remained through the whole reading of Sukhmani, with their eyes closed...and i could see they were repeating waheguru gently with their mouth.

if i set up a webcam of me doing Simran in the early hours...i appear to be doing the same...

This is not aimed at you,

but who is parroting, and who isn't? do we know...i cannot differentiate, because i cannot see what's happening within them...in their minds...in their hearts..

in a similar way...in my early life i used to get awards for my reading skills...i could sit in class, and read really well...but truth be told, i had a poor attention span...i wasn;t taking in what i read, the story...or anything...it was mumbling or words...but onlookers thought otherwise..

on the other hand...my wife is a good reader of novels and books...she says when she reads she is in the zone, creating worlds, images, feeling and emotions in her mind...

Her experience and my experience were completely different...

In a Similar way...Some do Mumble, and parrot gurbani in their supposed Simran...but it's not Simran...

Simran is Simran, when so many more components are at play....the mind, the heart....Love...it becomes a completely different thing altogether

In that way...i wouldn;t want my wifes reading to be compared to mine...she would find it strange if people kept telling her she is merely mumbling...

Good Builders, bad builders
Trusty plumbers and the other sort
parroting, and words spoken with love, thirst, passion - I'm really not parroting, when i tell my mum i love her...

Worst thing in the world is painting everything and everyone with the same brush

 

[Harry Haller]

Chazji

I will be absolutely frank about my opinion on this, I have no problem with anyone doing what they wish, as you say, some mumble, some parrot, some trip the light fantastic, some bond with god, my only issue is that it is a highly personal experience that cannot be taught, or shown to another, yet, when I read these experiences are open to everyone, I know that is not true, because they are not open to me. It is a bit like me going on and on about say having sex with women dressed up as nuns, as wonderful and as magical as the experience may be for me, it does not folllow that all men wish to have sex with women dressed up as nuns.

Your last post, good post, very nice, and when you speak of your experiences, I absolutely believe you, they make good reading, its when we get to the bit about how these experiences can be had by anyone, and here are some techniques to help, I went to a catholic school, and I was beaten quite badly by the nuns when I misbehaved, so, I misbehaved a lot, just one of the things that formed my character, you cannot buy that experience, I cannot teach this experience, the truth is, your meditation and journey to self discovery is indeed that, a self discovery, it applies to you and you alone.

now come here and bend over whilst I spank you with this ruler

 

[chazSingh]

Chazji

I will be absolutely frank about my opinion on this, I have no problem with anyone doing what they wish, as you say, some mumble, some parrot, some trip the light fantastic, some bond with god, my only issue is that it is a highly personal experience that cannot be taught, or shown to another, yet, when I read these experiences are open to everyone, I know that is not true, because they are not open to me. It is a bit like me going on and on about say having sex with women dressed up as nuns, as wonderful and as magical as the experience may be for me, it does not folllow that all men wish to have sex with women dressed up as nuns.

Your last post, good post, very nice, and when you speak of your experiences, I absolutely believe you, they make good reading, its when we get to the bit about how these experiences can be had by anyone, and here are some techniques to help, I went to a catholic school, and I was beaten quite badly by the nuns when I misbehaved, so, I misbehaved a lot, just one of the things that formed my character, you cannot buy that experience, I cannot teach this experience, the truth is, your meditation and journey to self discovery is indeed that, a self discovery, it applies to you and you alone.

now come here and bend over whilst I spank you with this ruler

but i wouldn't go on a forum about having sex with women dressed as nuns, and tell everyone they are barmy...or that their sex could not possibly have been enjoyable

Hey, my past hasn't been all good...drugs, drinking, fighting, treating women badly, stealing all played it's part..at some stage or another...and i'm far from perfect now...not saying i've been through same as you...but had my own bit of stuff that defined me also...

i've been doing a lot of squats lately harry ji...the buttocks are firm...i'd bring a few rulers if i was you...

 

[Harry Haller]

but i wouldn't go on a forum about having sex with women dressed as nuns, and tell everyone they are barmy...or that their sex could not possibly have been enjoyable

try it, I'll mail you the forum web address!

 

[Navdeep88]

Beautiful Wondrous Wa-he-guroo



It is not seen, but Yes, it is heard and you can feel it. The beauty is when you become selfless and connect with it. Quite recently, most mornings, I've been having the company of two local eagles, which I sometimes connect to!....awesome!!

Why have you been selfish before?

What do the Eagles say? Do they communicate to you that they're a species going extinct and they're worried about the aunt/uncle/parent or baby eagle they haven't seen in a while? And they're concerned about this trend?

 

[Navdeep88]

Waheguru .... Waheguru .... Waheguru....they think i parrot...that i hold no love for you...that my heart isn't calling out for you...That I and others are here as some form of business, to recruit...

LOL. In the Middle of your meditation, AMIDST Your 'Wahegurus', you think of Us! After you claim to have Surpassed thoughts and duality, You actively Defend yourself using a narrative and reduce God to a distant 'you'.

Is God ignorant? Do you have to update him of every happening of your Life? Is he a Plug-in that you have to update because God is INCAPABLE of understanding human life?

 

[Harry Haller]

LOL. In the Middle of your meditation, AMIDST Your 'Wahegurus', you think of Us! After you claim to have Surpassed thoughts and duality, You actively Defend yourself using a narrative and reduce God to a distant 'you'.

Is God ignorant? Do you have to update him of every happening of your Life? Is he a Plug-in that you have to update because God is INCAPABLE of understanding human life?

as much as I am heartily enjoying your posts sis, many people talk to god, many people see god as their best friend, as a parent figure, or even as a lover, who are we who are utterly alone to argue..