Gyani ji,
I consider the opportunity to hear and discuss these things rare. I therefore would like to be as direct as possible.
Confused ji wrote:
My impression is different. I read the message as an attempt to highlight two extreme practices, making a statement about the intentions of those who cut their hair which they do not have, and trying to make a case for keeping hair.
Quote: I would like to add that I haven't come across anyone who cuts hair and thinks they are superior to amritdhari sikh.
And the truth is:
A Sikh who cuts hair does so motivated by attachment and by conceit. A Sikh who maintains hair thinking that it serves some spiritual purpose is motivated by attachment, by conceit and also wrong understanding.
IS That the Real "TRUTH" or simply a Made up statement ?? ( as I am accused of making statements Jios ??) How does one JUDGE a "truth" from a "made up statement"
It is a general statement not pointing to particular incidents, but universal truths.
A Sikh who decides to cut his long hair will not have any spiritual reasons for doing so (if there are some unusual exceptions, we should not consider it). It is clear then that he does it with attachment and if connected with some image, there must also be conceit.
A Sikh who maintains hair due to spiritual reasons has wrong understanding, since hair as you have said also, has nothing to do with the ability to develop goodness or wisdom. When there is wrong understanding, there must also be attachment associated with it. But also the very idea of long hair invariable becomes the object of sense attachment especially when there is the kind of wrong understanding. And in thinking that “I have long (or short) hair”, this is clearly an expression of conceit.
Do you disagree with this? If so, what is the reason?
...intentions which they DO NOT HAVE ?? How does one KNOW whats in every ones hearts ??..is there a Truth Meter ...and a "made up statement false intentions meter ??
You had written in your original message:
“Just because a CUT hair person thinks hes BETTER simply due to his short hair”
This I took as projecting a situation not likely to ever happen. If there are rare cases that a Sikh decides to cut his hair thinking that he will be a “better” person in doing so, it must be very rare. But certainly this can’t be taken to represent all those other people who do so simply out of attachment and conceit, can it? On the other hand, Sikhs who keep hair as a religious symbol and who convince themselves by making the association with particular moral qualities, this is very common is it not? Even if they do not in their minds, form an idea regarding why hair must be kept, do they not however feel that in cutting their hair they would be doing wrong?
Do my statements appear to be made up, if so, in what way?
The ONE and ONLY unalterable TRUTH is GURBANI..all others simply state their own OPINIONS....you, me. every poster here...no one has the monopoly on "truth/facts".
And according to your criterion, what you state above is just opinion. Doesn't sound right, does it?
One of us may be right and the other wrong or both are wrong depending on the topic of discussion. Indeed we may both be wrong about everything; however this would be due to conditions and can’t be helped. But to presume that what we say is only opinion, makes pointless any discussion of this sort, I’d think.
Would it not be that you have some level of understanding with regard to the truth that there is some validity in your stating that the Gurbani contains the Truth? Why then suggest that we come in thinking that what we say is only opinion? Why not discuss what is said in order to determine whether or not it is in line with the Truth?
I ma 60+ and have been dealing with Sikhs, of all shades sizes, leabnings and all for past decades..locally face to face, internationally abroad face to face and via the Internet ...and thats why my Gmail accounts ( are all FULL to capacity)..and i have first hand accounts of sikhs cutting hair, facing all sorts of problems, etc etc and sikhs who keep full banna ..instant amrtidharees who think they have the world at their feet the moment they step out of Amrit sanskaar Ceremony..etc etc...so i do have a little first hand knowledge of "INTENTIONS"....
What you describe appears as a case simply of attachment and conceit and is what I had pointed out. But in your original post you had said:
“Just because a CUT hair person thinks hes BETTER simply due to his short hair”
As I said, it appears very unusual this particular line of thought. It may be that this had in fact nothing to do with spiritual aims, but why then compare this with the person who keeps his hair whose reasons include spiritual ones?
but i still cannot judge anybody because thats not my job. I have many sikhs among my closest associates who dont keep hair and claim sikhi is INSIDE...and that they are MUCH BETTER than some Full banna amritdharees who cna be seen in discos.bars at weekends..and I agree..it could be..
It is good to hear that you keep friendship with Sikhs regardless of whether they keep or cut their hair.
but that could also be that the Full banna guy is much more easily RECOGNISABLE even from across the road..than a cut hair shaved 'sikh" who has sikhi inside and also a jug of beer in his belly..and a lady of the night on his shoulder...no one..not even me..can see INSIDE either...whether its really "SIKHEE" inside or just SICKEE". we come to SPN to LEARN...UN-LEARN...RE-LEARN...24/7..no one is perfect...long har, short hair...balding...lasered..coloured..plucked...what ever.. SHUBH Amallan bajoh DOVEH ROOVEE...
It is to be expected that everyone, both young and old, is full of attachment. Going to discos and bars is what young people like to do and if not this, they'd be attached to something else. Not going to discos and drinking does not therefore prove that there is no attachment; indeed there may be attachment to *not doing* these things. So why take the concept of amritdhari so seriously? There appears to be so much unnecessary suppression and guilt involved in the whole thing.
If attachment to sense objects is wrong, point out to the nature of attachment. In highlighting certain aspects and the idea that in being able to avoid these one is on the right track, this easily becomes yet another object of attachment, which means that in the end it serves no purpose at all. Besides which is worse, a person who drinks but knows that it is not good, or someone who does not drink, but not aware of his attachments?
and then god will tell you himself from within whether you should cut your hair or not or keep your nails, whether you should wear nike or adidas 
