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The Importance Of Sangat To A Social Inadequate

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Jan 31, 2011
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Gurfatehji

I have read time and time again how important sangat is, and to be honest I did not really have any time for what I assumed was the social side of sikhi. I don't really get people on the whole, and do my level best to live my own little life as far away from company as I can. For me to have joined a forum and partaken in discussion, is only possible because I would like to think that I can be 'myself' in your company, and I never feel I am judged, corrected- yes, but never judged.

However, in the last few months, I have found the word of god here, that is to say, that this forum is starting to represent the message of truth, not in any individual, but in the completeness of all its members. The path is long and hard, I keep finding myself looking for any help with the journey, be it the validation of a particular path, or the confirmation that another path is not the right one.

I now have to concede that the concept of sangat is an enormous part of sikhi, read any thread, and lone post, and once you have enough sangat to participate, the correct answer seems to shine out.

So my question is, in the real world, in the real sangat, should we accept that individuals are just that, individuals with an individual opinion and feeling, and it takes a number of such individuals to make up a sangat. Surely this means that every person has something to offer the sangat, and in the form of sangat, they are complete, but without the sangat, they are as useful as a sole brick is, in the building of a wall.

On that note, should we attempt self validation through the creator, or validation through sangat, or possibly a combination of the two, but which is the more important, what is the ultimate validation, and how do we find it

Could a man, on a desert island, with just a copy of the SGGS find the truth without sangat, or would he go mad?
 

spnadmin

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Jun 17, 2004
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Last edited:

Ishna

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May 9, 2006
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That depends, can he read Gurbani? lol

but really, good question, I look forward to the responses...
 

spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
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Jun 17, 2004
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That depends, can he read Gurbani? lol

but really, good question, I look forward to the responses...
Why not read in English and just assimilate the controversy over word meanings according to Professor Sahib Singh? Not get overly wound up in that. Controversy in Sikhi has never ceased from the very beginning. A new dawn where Sikhs do not argue may never happen in my lifetime. That means it is important to read, study, discuss, and get closure from a relatively independent position.

One thing I would like to add in relation to feeling socially inadequate. In a small sangat you are more like to find people who are happy to help you on all sorts of levels. In a larger sangat no one is really paying attention, though you may think all eyes are boring in. And you always have your virtual sangat here who will help you as they can.
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
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Jan 31, 2011
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spnadminji,

your not helping by calling me texasstudentlol

just to clarify, socially inadequacy is a label I wear with pride rather than something I wish to lose, I looked at both threads, and yes they answer my questions fully, however I think the path is easier with sangat.

I think to make the task easier he can ready gurbani! I think he would read, and his situation, ie living on a desert island, would hugely affect his interpretation and also what the creator meant to him at that time, and in those circumstances
 

spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
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Jun 17, 2004
14,500
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Texasstudent ji,

There are two threads here that may help you understand that sadhsangat happens at more than one level. Read these and contemplate the variety of perspectives. After that your question may change.

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/questions-and-answers/36112-is-this-a-definition-sadh-sangat.html

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/33115-why-sadh-sangat-why-not-go.html
lol Chemical brain not on top yet. Apologies and wil fix it.

I will also turn on the air conditioner. That might clear things up.
 

Ishna

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May 9, 2006
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Sorry spnadmin ji, I was trying to be funny with my punjabi comment! Because if he was on a desert island with SGGS and it was in Gurmukhi and he couldn't read it hes more likely to use it for kindling!

And I don't think there will ever be a time when Sikhs don't argue, not in your lifetime, not in my lifetime, not in another 300 years. Because we're all human, all individual, and most of us are gifted with an enquiring mind and most of us want to be "right", so we argue our points.

I guess that's why Gurbani says (look Bhagat bhaji, I'm remembering Gurbani!) that those people who know God stay quiet about it because it can't be explained and if you try you regret it (arguments start).
 

BhagatSingh

SPNer
Apr 25, 2006
2,921
1,647
Haha Ishna ji. Thank you for this very pleasant gift.

If I may share something with you and Spnadmin ji and other members who think Sikhs are arguing...

you know... just to help you expand your perception, your perspective,
this is what I would share: Sikhs are not arguing.

That's it.

Now if for some reason you don't see it, then realize that you have the trunk and I have the tail. Come over here and have a good look at the tail.

We will have a party when you come over. :interestedmunda:
 

Kanwaljit.Singh

Writer
SPNer
Jan 29, 2011
1,496
2,169
Vancouver, Canada
I now have to concede that the concept of sangat is an enormous part of sikhi, read any thread, and lone post, and once you have enough sangat to participate, the correct answer seems to shine out.
Truly said. The more closed is a mind, the worse things are. That is why Guru asked us not to go to jungles to meditate alone for years.
 

Annie

SPNer
Jun 12, 2011
114
225
I don't really get people on the whole, and do my level best to live my own little life as far away from company as I can. For me to have joined a forum and partaken in discussion, is only possible because I would like to think that I can be 'myself' in your company, and I never feel I am judged, corrected- yes, but never judged.
I feel the same way, Harry ji. I'm glad you started this thread because it gives me a good place to say "thank you" to everyone here. I have learned a lot in the short time I have been here. I am pleased and a little bit surprised to find people with whom I have so much in common philosophically.

So my question is, in the real world, in the real sangat, should we accept that individuals are just that, individuals with an individual opinion and feeling, and it takes a number of such individuals to make up a sangat. Surely this means that every person has something to offer the sangat, and in the form of sangat, they are complete, but without the sangat, they are as useful as a sole brick is, in the building of a wall.
I think that really depends on the situation. Sometimes it is good to be alone with your thoughts. Sometimes it is helpful to be in a group. And sometimes it takes only one other person to tell you something especially wise, to change your thinking.
 

Harsimran

SPNer
May 18, 2008
4
6
Finland
The (only?) purpose of sangat is to inspire a person to do naam simran. That's why we say in ardaas.. "Se-ee piaare mel, jinnaa miliaa tera naam chit aavai." (unite us with those who inspire us remember your name)

Saadh sangat can be people, but it can also be books, nature, internet forums.. and obviously the best sangat is that of Gurbani...

Guru mere sang sadaa hai naale, simar simar tis sadaa samaale. (Guru is always with me, remembering and remembering I'm forever merged with him)

So yes, the man on the desert island could find the truth with "just" Guru Sahib with him. Probably he'd find it quicker when he wouldn't have anything/anyone else to disturb him there.

Actually, many enlightened Sikhs spent months and even years meditating in solitude (including some of our Guru Sahibaan), but eventually they had to come back to fulfill their worldly duties and follow God's will that way.

Just as a side note.. I once heard a Gursikh say that following Sikh lifestyle without sangat gives more spiritual blessings, because it requires so much more strength and determination compared to when you're having other people around you with the same beliefs and the same rehat.

In the end, I guess it all depends on the person, if someone's born a saint, they'll be doing pretty fine without sangat... whereas low-lifes like me are a sinking stone without it.
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
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Jan 31, 2011
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Harsimranji,

I would like to think that you would learn more, quicker, away from solitude, the Guru's meant for us to be family people, surely, putting what you learn into practice, is a practical way to see how the teachings work. Is it possible without sangat, someone on a desert island would get the wrong message? Or even if they had mastered the whole of the SGGS, would be they be as useful as a freshly graduated medical student.

I avoid people like the plague normally, lack of any social life has made me brutally honest, with very little tact, hardly any diplomacy, bundled with a particularly strange sense of humour, I had always thought it near impossible to be part of anything social. The last time some people came to our house, I faked illness just to go to bed, I just could not grasp the various topics of conversation, but I did have to admire my wife for really showing an interest in holidays, the school run, their new car, etc etc.

The point I would like to make is that here, in this sangat, I have found myself softening, finding tact, finding diplomacy, finding a softer honesty, why? Because every person I have interacted with here, I have found some feelings of respect for, be it on the grounds of niceness, spirituality, knowledge,and that respect has tempered me, if only in this forum.

This forum is amazing because everyone here tries to put forward the best of themselves, not so easy in a face to face situation.

Don't get me wrong, I do like people, but I like PEOPLE, not the shallow and empty personalities whose talk, actions, aspirations and actions seem to be based on the current TV series, or film they are watching, start digging a bit deeper, some do not like it, you are encroaching on a carefully constructed personality, and there are some who do not wish to see who they really are,
 

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