Is this a Definition of Sadh Sangat?

Ishna · #1 (**permalink**) 05-Jul-2011, 17:30 PM

I was reading Chapter 11 of MacAuliffe's Life of Guru Nanak and came upon the following paragraph. Would you say this is a description of the kind of people a Sikh should look for within the sangat?

Quote:

The Guru replied to a man called Kalu who had asked him for a definition of a holy man: 'Recognize him as holy in whom are to be found friend ship, sympathy, pleasure at the welfare of others, and dislike of evil company. In the first place, the intentions of holy men are pure. Secondly, they are pleased on hearing the praises of others. Thirdly, holy men serve the virtuous. Fourthly, they honour those who can impart to them learning and good counsel. Fifthly, as there is a periodical craving for food or intoxicants, so they feel a craving for the Guru's word and for divine knowledge. Sixthly, they love their wives, and renounce other women. Seventhly, they avoid subjects from which quarrels may arise. Eighthly, they serve those who are superior to themselves in intelligence or devotion. Ninthly, even if strong, they are not arrogant, and trample not on others. Tenthly, they abandon the society of the evil, and only associate with the holy.'

You often see Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji talk about the 'company of the holy' and 'the true congregation' and I've often wondered what exactly that was. I think I've found my definition. Hope it helps others with the same query.

Ishna

spnadmin · #2 (**permalink**) 05-Jul-2011, 17:36 PM

This thread may be of use to you on this question. Actually, at some point this thread may need to be merged with the thread linked below. Let's see how discussion unfolds.

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-s...hy-not-go.html

Ishna · #3 (**permalink**) 05-Jul-2011, 17:39 PM

Yes, I did have that thread in mind when contemplating my recent discovery but I had participated in the thread and knew it was closed. Perhaps I should re-read, although I recall it went around in circles for a while in the middle and I don't think I got very far with it. I will have a look-see, thanks.

spnadmin · #4 (**permalink**) 05-Jul-2011, 17:40 PM

I personally like he quote from Macauliffe and would see that as the down to earth way in which I understand the message of Guru Nanak to be given. That is only my view and the question of sangat has been debated to mean other things. My personal impression again, that the idea of sangat described by Macauliffe has eluded many a seeker of sangat, and they become disillusioned.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/questions-and-answers/36112-is-this-a-definition-sadh-sangat.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36112

The thread can be re-opened if new material surfaces. It was closed because it wasn't going anywhere.

Ishna · #5 (**permalink**) 05-Jul-2011, 17:47 PM

I leave the threading to your more than capable weaving techniques admin ji!

I have been one of those disillusioned-type people but find that a mix of all perspectives helps me around it: cyber sangat here where the discussion is intense and enlightening, physical sangat where the learning is not as intense but the experience itself is enlightening, and the personal communion with Waheguru which is also enlightening.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36112

I'm fond of easy-to-understand things such as the MacAuliffe quote, it helps to verify the intuitive knowledge, for me anyway.

Ishna · #6 (**permalink**) 05-Jul-2011, 17:49 PM

HA! See, my post #4, I ask for a definition of Sadh Sangat right there! hahaha!

spnadmin · #7 (**permalink**) 05-Jul-2011, 17:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishna

HA! See, my post #4, I ask for a definition of Sadh Sangat right there! hahaha!

Yes.. and thanks. Sent you a private message about the topic.

hpannu · #8 (**permalink**) 06-Jul-2011, 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishna

I was reading Chapter 11 of MacAuliffe's Life of Guru Nanak and came upon the following paragraph. Would you say this is a description of the kind of people a Sikh should look for within the sangat?

You often see Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji talk about the 'company of the holy' and 'the true congregation' and I've often wondered what exactly that was. I think I've found my definition. Hope it helps others with the same query.

Ishna

Dear Ishna Ji,

Defination of Sadh Sangat as described by MacAuliffe's raises some serious ?s I will not even try to interpret it.
1st we live in Kalyug and there is no perfect person / Sadh Sangat ( that is my own understanding - please forgive me for being blunt ) The defination by MacAuliffe gives the impression of perfect Sadh Sangat (which is not true).
2nd - the reason Sadh Sangat is stressed so much is when we live in a imperfect world, we have to stay clear of the bad vices around ourself and stay close to the good one's. That is like a test we all have to go through.
Some of us make an effort to know the truth and some don't even want to know it. They try to ignore the facts / teachings of Guru Granth Sahib.

And this applies to both Cyber Sangat that you are in currently and when you are physically present amongst Sadh Sangat.

We all are at different spiritual levels. Once you accept that fact if you meet someone who is not at the same level as you. It will not bother you. You will also meet Sangat where there will be plenty to learn from.

Only a VIRLA ( rare ) is a person who is on this path and when you meet one you will know it. He or She will not try to influence you with his understanding of Guru Granth Sahib. He or She will encourage you to follow Guru Granth Sahib ( all the answers are in Guru Granth Sahib ).

ਦਾਸ
ਹਰਜੋਤ ਸਿੰਘ

spnadmin · #9 (**permalink**) 06-Jul-2011, 03:44 AM

hpannu ji

This is the exact reason why people become disillusioned.

Quote:

1st we live in Kalyug and there is no perfect person / Sadh Sangat ( that is my own understanding - please forgive me for being blunt ) The defination by MacAuliffe gives the impression of perfect Sadh Sangat (which is not true)

.

And imho, this is what Guru Nanak was trying to emphasize

Quote:

2nd - the reason Sadh Sangat is stressed so much is when we live in a imperfect world, we have to stay clear of the bad vices around ourself and stay close to the good one's. That is like a test we all have to go through.[

Sensible! Thanks