The Doctrine: Manmukh And Gurmukh

Discussion in 'Hard Talk' started by Original, Mar 12, 2018.

  1. Original

    Original Writer SPNer

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    Veer Ambarsaria Ji - A very good morning [06:45 UK]

    First n foremost - wonderful to hear from you - hope all is well.
    Of late, I've been thinking 'where have all the "SPN's olds n gold's" disappeared to ? and then, you show up' - thank god !!!

    Back to topic
    -

    From an ideological perspective manmukh and gurmukh are conceptual tools, forged specifically to hammer home the message of the Guru. The message is to liberate oneself from the wheel of 84 [birth, growth, decay, death n rebirth] and enjoy eternal bliss for that is the "real" home of the soul [sachkhand]. Only by turning towards the Guru's way of life [gurmukh] can one swim across the ocean of life. Theoretical reasoning applied here is inductive, that is, wood floats on water and if metal was attached to wood it too will float across [metaphor: wood for Guru and metal for manmukh]. In other words, transformation of manmukh to gurmukh is essential, but not exclusive to experience the "ultimate reality". The ultimate reality is beyond time n space, requiring therefore a non-physical means of transportation, which is "GURU".

    Sikhi spiritual is sweet, only if you now how to peel.

    More another time -
     
  2. Ambarsaria

    Ambarsaria ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār Writer SPNer

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    Gurmukh Original ji, good morning to you too.

    I have observed many great qualities of your intellect and disposition in your posts. SGGS gives us some hints as to how to identify a Gurmukh or what makes a Gurmukh.

    It is quite common among Sikhs to address each other as "Gurmukho"! For example, "Gurmukho ki haal chaal hai/Respecteful one how have you been?". I have also observed that at such times there are very common reactions from people in the form of "Pride -Joy". The important thing is that for an improving Gurmukh, the joy will encourage and stimulate the person to seek and assimilate other Gurmukh qualities and put these in practice. The undeserving Gurmukh perhaps will take pride and get stuck at "Pride" with stunted future growth towards being Gurmukh of greater qualities.

    As far as 8400000 "joons" are concerned, I understand that SGGS guides us to see and find bliss as we are. SGGS does not threaten or carries a big stick that if you don't do this that you will become a snake or something else if you don't do. The issue for me is if we have found blissful life and eternal peace in ourselves as that is what guides us to be a Gurmukh at one with all creation. I conjecture that there are Gurmukh lions, elephants, skunks and rats too. We just cannot see it that way as "it takes one to know one".

    Gurmukh Original ji and other spners, "salvation or finding bliss" is big business and a money maker for the guides, the babeys, the preachers, the sants and many others in almost all sects and religions in the world. Beware; SGGS guides you for free if you invest a bit of time and do self-study. Original ji your analogy about wood-iron floating is good one. But the wood better not be indicative of a Baba or someone similar that you are paying monies to or doing services for to find salvation. Those who do that have simply not understood much of SGGS or our Guruji's teachings and have asked for a miracle pill of salvation. From what I know no such pill exists and SGGS does not identify one either from what I have understood of SGGS.

    Sat Sri Akal.
     
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  3. Aman Singh

    Aman Singh Admin SPNer

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    Welcome back @Ambarsaria Ji :mundahug:
     
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  4. Original

    Original Writer SPNer

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    Sir

    Thank you for the honorific title, Gurmukh.

    Am I by definition a Gurmukh [GM] ? I'm afraid I'm not. I may qualify as a GM by virtue of all that I do and believe, but in truth, I'm far from it. That's because GM n MM [Manmukh] are conceptual tools forged to advance an "idea". An idea that is Sikh where conceptual tools are employed as a guide in directing the application of intellectual activities to contemporary social and personal problems. It is the pursuit of a perfect being [GM] in an imperfect human [MM]. Thus, a life philosophy based on the teachings of the Guru to liberate the spirit through self-discipline. I'm yet to reach that state of being.

    Nature has placed humankind under the governance of two sovereign masters, pain n pleasure. These two imposters dictate their everyday lives. On the one hand is the moral compass [right n wrong], and on the other, the chain of cause n effect. They are forever caught bang in the middle, utterly helpless and powerless before the will of nature [human condition]. GM is a way out and like you've said "it takes one to know one". How true, but that statement stands true following "experience". That is to say, we can discuss GM-MM till the cows come home, but the experience factor GM can only be had after anointment. Only a Gurmukh can tell you what a Gurmukh "is", all else will be a perceived view.

    Always a pleasure conversing and most recent, if I may; me n wife were in your neck of the woods [Amritsar] and what a sojourn ? as if heaven had descended, enveloping Harminder Sahib completely. Beautiful moments at the grace of Waheguru in your nagri.

    Good day
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2018
  5. Dr.Alta

    Dr.Alta SPNer

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    I have the qualities of Sahaj and Sach Santokhee, I am a follower of the truth(notice the small 't' or as I like to call it aletheia, Greek for unconcealedness);I'm relatively detached in the midst of Maya, I am Jeevan Mukat. I'm (maybe not completely)free of the false ego-sense (Haume) that is filth (of Haume or egotism) does not come and stick to me. pain and pleasure do not afflict me. though I lack Sukh for the most part the descriptions of a Gurmukh describe me.
    I certainty don't think they are impossible to achieve. I hope to someday meet another like me, to discus the problem of being satisfied.
     
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  6. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller

    Panga Master

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    yeah, I think you possibly need to work on the ego a bit more
     
  7. Dr.Alta

    Dr.Alta SPNer

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    I have decided I'm a Sanmukh.
     

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