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Sikhi After Life

Jan 26, 2012
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Not believing in some form of reincarnation, transmigration of the soul and the ultimate aim of tearing down that false wall of illusion between us and our creator (the merging) is hardly mainline Sikhi!
 

Ishna

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Do Akasha and Lucky ji believe that anything recognisable as you individually will live on after death? Will you still retain your separate selves?

The characters which live in my dreams are gone when I wake up because they were never really there to begin with. To say they continue on living in me is what I'm struggling to understand... what happens in my imagination is not real.

I will die, it is hukam, and I accept that. Energy doesn't disappear, it just changes. The electricity in my lamp is not unique to the electricity powering Akasha Ji's laptop, even though the lamp and the laptop are different things. When I turn off the lamp there is no shadow of my lamp which permeates the electricity network. I guess that's where my head's at at the momet.

I haven't really seen anything in Gurbani to suggest there is some personal part of us that continues after death, either. But I'm no scholar.

Also, I think it's important not to over-think this sort of thing, when we don't actually know what will happen. We can only rely on Gurbani and our good actions here and now.
 

Tejwant Singh

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Not believing in some form of reincarnation, transmigration of the soul and the ultimate aim of tearing down that false wall of illusion between us and our creator (the merging) is hardly mainline Sikhi!

dalsingh1zero1ji,

Guru Fateh.

Would you be kind enough to elaborate that and also what is mainline Sikhi and what is not? And how does one differentiate between the two?

For the above, you may use full shabads from the SGGS, our only Guru, with your own understanding. It is important to know what the message means to your personally.

Thanks & regards

Tejwant Singh
 

Harkiran Kaur

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Jul 20, 2012
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Do Akasha and Lucky ji believe that anything recognisable as you individually will live on after death? Will you still retain your separate selves?

The characters which live in my dreams are gone when I wake up because they were never really there to begin with. To say they continue on living in me is what I'm struggling to understand... what happens in my imagination is not real.

Ishna Ji,

How is a dream not real? Because you can't touch it? It DID exist... in your thoughts... that creation DID exist. It was not physical... but it was real.

As for the characters in the dream, they were never individuals to begin with!!! That's the point I am trying to get across...

There is no death because when you 'wake up' you will realize that you and me and everyone else were really the same ONE. We are all dream characters being played by the same ONE creator. So it's inconsequential what we are as individuals... Your consciousness however will NOT cease to exist. You will remember being you, and me, and everyone else.

Remember Gurbani stresses that there is ONLY ONE.

It's the hardest concept to grasp.... and is why ego is so hard to let go of... people want to try to hold on to individuality when separateness is only an illusion. Even in your post above, you specifically mention individuality and if something of the individual exists beyond death... to me it's inconsequential - there is only ONE of us here. There only ever was one of us here.

Just like the characters I dream never died when I woke, because they were me all along... all of them. They never actually had individuality to begin with - so there was nobody to actually die.... the illusion was being immersed in the dream. The characters within the dream were characters I was playing... When I wake up I don't mourn because I woke up from the dream. There was nothing to mourn because they never existed as separate entities to begin with. And they did not die... they still exist within me, as a part of me...

So the question of living on past physical death is inconsequential to me... the act of physical death is only the physical body. Things won't go black... it's not the end. It's more like an actor removing a costume...

again... this is just how I see things...
 
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Ishna

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I think this might be my last post on this subject for now because I think we're both trying to explain the taste of an apple to each other and insisting the other person isn't eating an apple because we describe the taste slightly different to each other.

There is no death because when you 'wake up' you will realize that you and me and everyone else were really the same ONE.

But there is no 'I' to wake up. There is only Akaal Purakh. My dream characters don't wake up. I am a dream character. You area dream character.

There is only ONE as you would say and it's not you or me but IT. It is the power grid, you and I are tiny little lamps.
 

Harkiran Kaur

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I think this might be my last post on this subject for now because I think we're both trying to explain the taste of an apple to each other and insisting the other person isn't eating an apple because we describe the taste slightly different to each other.



But there is no 'I' to wake up. There is only Akaal Purakh. My dream characters don't wake up. I am a dream character. You area dream character.

There is only ONE as you would say and it's not you or me but IT. It is the power grid, you and I are tiny little lamps.

Hmmm I don't know if I can explain any other way... :( When you dream you are conscious in the role of that character that you are in the dream.

Or as an actor, you play the part of a character consciously. But lets say the actor has forgotten that he's actually in a play. When he takes the costume off, he doesn't forget being the character...the character didn't die because the character really didn't exist as a separate entity. And the idea of the character being an individual is inconsequential. The consciousness inhabiting the character WAS the ONE all along... IS the creator...

You are still thinking in terms of separateness. You are thinking your consciousness is a separate little entity from everything else. You are thinking the consciousness of the creator is just some background power that somehow animates us. The point is, we are not separate... we never were... I remember quoting Gurbani where it says one who recognizes that "HE IS ME" is satisfied... this whole part talks about giving up the illusion of separateness and ego... (page 60) To me it says by being self willed... and thinking in individual terms we can not understand and can never be satisfied because we are concerned about the individual. But when you realize there was no individual to begin with... when you surrender ego and individuality and separateness, then you realize that HE IS ME... it says when you realize your OWN SELF... then what else is there? That is the truth... (again all my understanding of it)

ਮਨ ਰੇ ਕਿਉ ਛੂਟਹਿ ਬਿਨੁ ਪਿਆਰ ॥ मन रे किउ छूटहि बिनु पिआर ॥ Man re ki▫o cẖẖūtėh bin pi▫ār. O mind, how can you be saved without love?
ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਅੰਤਰਿ ਰਵਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਬਖਸੇ ਭਗਤਿ ਭੰਡਾਰ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ गुरमुखि अंतरि रवि रहिआ बखसे भगति भंडार ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ Gurmukẖ anṯar rav rahi▫ā bakẖse bẖagaṯ bẖandār. ||1|| rahā▫o. God permeates the inner beings of the Gurmukhs. They are blessed with the treasure of devotion. ||1||Pause||
ਰੇ ਮਨ ਐਸੀ ਹਰਿ ਸਿਉ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਜੈਸੀ ਮਛੁਲੀ ਨੀਰ ॥ रे मन ऐसी हरि सिउ प्रीति करि जैसी मछुली नीर ॥ Re man aisī har si▫o parīṯ kar jaisī macẖẖulī nīr. O mind, love the Lord, as the fish loves the water.
ਜਿਉ ਅਧਿਕਉ ਤਿਉ ਸੁਖੁ ਘਣੋ ਮਨਿ ਤਨਿ ਸਾਂਤਿ ਸਰੀਰ ॥ जिउ अधिकउ तिउ सुखु घणो मनि तनि सांति सरीर ॥ Ji▫o aḏẖika▫o ṯi▫o sukẖ gẖaṇo man ṯan sāʼnṯ sarīr. The more the water, the more the happiness, and the greater the peace of mind and body.
ਬਿਨੁ ਜਲ ਘੜੀ ਨ ਜੀਵਈ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਜਾਣੈ ਅਭ ਪੀਰ ॥੨॥ बिनु जल घड़ी न जीवई प्रभु जाणै अभ पीर ॥२॥ Bin jal gẖaṛī na jīv▫ī parabẖ jāṇai abẖ pīr. ||2|| Without water, she cannot live, even for an instant. God knows the suffering of her mind. ||2||
ਰੇ ਮਨ ਐਸੀ ਹਰਿ ਸਿਉ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਜੈਸੀ ਚਾਤ੍ਰਿਕ ਮੇਹ ॥ रे मन ऐसी हरि सिउ प्रीति करि जैसी चात्रिक मेह ॥ Re man aisī har si▫o parīṯ kar jaisī cẖāṯrik meh. O mind, love the Lord, as the song-bird loves the rain.
ਸਰ ਭਰਿ ਥਲ ਹਰੀਆਵਲੇ ਇਕ ਬੂੰਦ ਨ ਪਵਈ ਕੇਹ ॥ सर भरि थल हरीआवले इक बूंद न पवई केह ॥ Sar bẖar thal harī▫āvle ik būnḏ na pav▫ī keh. The pools are overflowing with water, and the land is luxuriantly green, but what are they to her, if that single drop of rain does not fall into her mouth?
ਕਰਮਿ ਮਿਲੈ ਸੋ ਪਾਈਐ ਕਿਰਤੁ ਪਇਆ ਸਿਰਿ ਦੇਹ ॥੩॥ करमि मिलै सो पाईऐ किरतु पइआ सिरि देह ॥३॥ Karam milai so pā▫ī▫ai kiraṯ pa▫i▫ā sir ḏeh. ||3|| By His Grace, she receives it; otherwise, because of her past actions, she gives her head. ||3||
ਰੇ ਮਨ ਐਸੀ ਹਰਿ ਸਿਉ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਜੈਸੀ ਜਲ ਦੁਧ ਹੋਇ ॥ रे मन ऐसी हरि सिउ प्रीति करि जैसी जल दुध होइ ॥ Re man aisī har si▫o parīṯ kar jaisī jal ḏuḏẖ ho▫e. O mind, love the Lord, as the water loves the milk.
ਆਵਟਣੁ ਆਪੇ ਖਵੈ ਦੁਧ ਕਉ ਖਪਣਿ ਨ ਦੇਇ ॥ आवटणु आपे खवै दुध कउ खपणि न देइ ॥ Āvtaṇ āpe kẖavai ḏuḏẖ ka▫o kẖapaṇ na ḏe▫e. The water, added to the milk, itself bears the heat, and prevents the milk from burning.
ਆਪੇ ਮੇਲਿ ਵਿਛੁੰਨਿਆ ਸਚਿ ਵਡਿਆਈ ਦੇਇ ॥੪॥ आपे मेलि विछुंनिआ सचि वडिआई देइ ॥४॥ Āpe mel vicẖẖunni▫ā sacẖ vadi▫ā▫ī ḏe▫e. ||4|| God unites the separated ones with Himself again, and blesses them with true greatness. ||4||
ਰੇ ਮਨ ਐਸੀ ਹਰਿ ਸਿਉ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਜੈਸੀ ਚਕਵੀ ਸੂਰ ॥ रे मन ऐसी हरि सिउ प्रीति करि जैसी चकवी सूर ॥ Re man aisī har si▫o parīṯ kar jaisī cẖakvī sūr. O mind, love the Lord, as the chakvee duck loves the sun.
ਖਿਨੁ ਪਲੁ ਨੀਦ ਨ ਸੋਵਈ ਜਾਣੈ ਦੂਰਿ ਹਜੂਰਿ ॥ खिनु पलु नीद न सोवई जाणै दूरि हजूरि ॥ Kẖin pal nīḏ na sov▫ī jāṇai ḏūr hajūr. She does not sleep, for an instant or a moment; the sun is so far away, but she thinks that it is near.
ਮਨਮੁਖਿ ਸੋਝੀ ਨਾ ਪਵੈ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਸਦਾ ਹਜੂਰਿ ॥੫॥ मनमुखि सोझी ना पवै गुरमुखि सदा हजूरि ॥५॥ Manmukẖ sojẖī nā pavai gurmukẖ saḏā hajūr. ||5|| Understanding does not come to the self-willed manmukh. But to the Gurmukh, the Lord is always close. ||5||
ਮਨਮੁਖਿ ਗਣਤ ਗਣਾਵਣੀ ਕਰਤਾ ਕਰੇ ਸੁ ਹੋਇ ॥ मनमुखि गणत गणावणी करता करे सु होइ ॥ Manmukẖ gaṇaṯ gaṇāvaṇī karṯā kare so ho▫e. The self-willed manmukhs make their calculations and plans, but only the actions of the Creator come to pass.
ਤਾ ਕੀ ਕੀਮਤਿ ਨਾ ਪਵੈ ਜੇ ਲੋਚੈ ਸਭੁ ਕੋਇ ॥ ता की कीमति ना पवै जे लोचै सभु कोइ ॥ Ŧā kī kīmaṯ nā pavai je locẖai sabẖ ko▫e. His Value cannot be estimated, even though everyone may wish to do so.
ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਹੋਇ ਤ ਪਾਈਐ ਸਚਿ ਮਿਲੈ ਸੁਖੁ ਹੋਇ ॥੬॥ गुरमति होइ त पाईऐ सचि मिलै सुखु होइ ॥६॥ Gurmaṯ ho▫e ṯa pā▫ī▫ai sacẖ milai sukẖ ho▫e. ||6|| Through the Guru's Teachings, it is revealed. Meeting with the True One, peace is found. ||6||
ਸਚਾ ਨੇਹੁ ਨ ਤੁਟਈ ਜੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਭੇਟੈ ਸੋਇ ॥ सचा नेहु न तुटई जे सतिगुरु भेटै सोइ ॥ Sacẖā nehu na ṯut▫ī je saṯgur bẖetai so▫e. True love shall not be broken, if the True Guru is met.
ਗਿਆਨ ਪਦਾਰਥੁ ਪਾਈਐ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣ ਸੋਝੀ ਹੋਇ ॥ गिआन पदारथु पाईऐ त्रिभवण सोझी होइ ॥ Gi▫ān paḏārath pā▫ī▫ai ṯaribẖavaṇ sojẖī ho▫e. Obtaining the wealth of spiritual wisdom, the understanding of the three worlds is acquired.
ਨਿਰਮਲੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਨ ਵੀਸਰੈ ਜੇ ਗੁਣ ਕਾ ਗਾਹਕੁ ਹੋਇ ॥੭॥ निरमलु नामु न वीसरै जे गुण का गाहकु होइ ॥७॥ Nirmal nām na vīsrai je guṇ kā gāhak ho▫e. ||7|| So become a customer of merit, and do not forget the Immaculate Naam, the Name of the Lord. ||7||
ਖੇਲਿ ਗਏ ਸੇ ਪੰਖਣੂੰ ਜੋ ਚੁਗਦੇ ਸਰ ਤਲਿ ॥ खेलि गए से पंखणूं जो चुगदे सर तलि ॥ Kẖel ga▫e se paʼnkẖ▫ṇūʼn jo cẖugḏe sar ṯal. Those birds which peck at the shore of the pool have played and have departed.
ਘੜੀ ਕਿ ਮੁਹਤਿ ਕਿ ਚਲਣਾ ਖੇਲਣੁ ਅਜੁ ਕਿ ਕਲਿ ॥ घड़ी कि मुहति कि चलणा खेलणु अजु कि कलि ॥ Gẖaṛī kė muhaṯ kė cẖalṇā kẖelaṇ aj kė kal. In a moment, in an instant, we too must depart. Our play is only for today or tomorrow.
ਜਿਸੁ ਤੂੰ ਮੇਲਹਿ ਸੋ ਮਿਲੈ ਜਾਇ ਸਚਾ ਪਿੜੁ ਮਲਿ ॥੮॥ जिसु तूं मेलहि सो मिलै जाइ सचा पिड़ु मलि ॥८॥ Jis ṯūʼn melėh so milai jā▫e sacẖā piṛ mal. ||8|| But those whom You unite, Lord, are united with You; they obtain a seat in the Arena of Truth. ||8||
ਬਿਨੁ ਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਨ ਊਪਜੈ ਹਉਮੈ ਮੈਲੁ ਨ ਜਾਇ ॥ बिनु गुर प्रीति न ऊपजै हउमै मैलु न जाइ ॥ Bin gur parīṯ na ūpjai ha▫umai mail na jā▫e. Without the Guru, love does not well up, and the filth of egotism does not depart.
ਸੋਹੰ ਆਪੁ ਪਛਾਣੀਐ ਸਬਦਿ ਭੇਦਿ ਪਤੀਆਇ ॥ सोहं आपु पछाणीऐ सबदि भेदि पतीआइ ॥ Sohaʼn āp pacẖẖāṇī▫ai sabaḏ bẖeḏ paṯī▫ā▫e. One who recognizes within himself that, "He is me", and who is pierced through by the Shabad, is satisfied.
ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਆਪੁ ਪਛਾਣੀਐ ਅਵਰ ਕਿ ਕਰੇ ਕਰਾਇ ॥੯॥ गुरमुखि आपु पछाणीऐ अवर कि करे कराइ ॥९॥ Gurmukẖ āp pacẖẖāṇī▫ai avar kė kare karā▫e. ||9|| When one becomes Gurmukh and realizes his own self, what more is there left to do or have done? ||9||
ਮਿਲਿਆ ਕਾ ਕਿਆ ਮੇਲੀਐ ਸਬਦਿ ਮਿਲੇ ਪਤੀਆਇ ॥ मिलिआ का किआ मेलीऐ सबदि मिले पतीआइ ॥ Mili▫ā kā ki▫ā melī▫ai sabaḏ mile paṯī▫ā▫e. Why speak of union to those who are already united with the Lord? Receiving the Shabad, they are satisfied.
ਮਨਮੁਖਿ ਸੋਝੀ ਨਾ ਪਵੈ ਵੀਛੁੜਿ ਚੋਟਾ ਖਾਇ ॥ मनमुखि सोझी ना पवै वीछुड़ि चोटा खाइ ॥ Manmukẖ sojẖī nā pavai vīcẖẖuṛ cẖotā kẖā▫e. The self-willed manmukhs do not understand; separated from Him, they endure beatings.
ਨਾਨਕ ਦਰੁ ਘਰੁ ਏਕੁ ਹੈ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਦੂਜੀ ਜਾਇ ॥੧੦॥੧੧॥ नानक दरु घरु एकु है अवरु न दूजी जाइ ॥१०॥११॥ Nānak ḏar gẖar ek hai avar na ḏūjī jā▫e. ||10||11|| O Nanak, there is only the one door to His Home; there is no other place at all. ||10||11||
 

Ishna

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Akasha ji, you think I'm stuck in duality and I think you are too, but I think it's just because we don't understand each other. I won't start an analysis of what you think because I don't actually know what you think because I'm not in your head (and likewise).

One is talking about cooking in terms of ingredients and flavour, the other in terms of chemical reactions and science. They're talking about the same thing (cooking the freakin' meal) but using different terms and one can't understand the terms of the other.

I've done my dash now, good luck to the rest of you :peacesignkaur:
 

Luckysingh

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But there is no 'I' to wake up. There is only Akaal Purakh
It is ONLY you that experiences the dream and wakes from it.
My dream characters don't wake up. I am a dream character. You are a dream character.
You may be the dream character, but only YOU are having that dream with others playing their roles. The others are not dreaming the same dream and scenario. You are in control as it stops when you wake up.

I know this is a little tricky, but you will either get it or you won't !
 
Nov 14, 2008
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There is no death because when you 'wake up' you will realize that you and me and everyone else were really the same ONE.
But there is no 'I' to wake up.


respected sister ji ,


"I" is ALWAYS THERE until "I" WAKES UP , wake up of I (Our soul) is very much required .in shabad below I is soul bride .

ਸੂਹੀ ਮਹਲਾ

Soohee, Fifth Mehl


<table cellspacing="5"><tbody><tr></tr><tr> <td> ਏਕਾ ਸੇਜ ਵਿਛੀ ਧਨ ਕੰਤਾ
एका सेज विछी धन कंता ॥
Ėkā sej vicẖẖī ḏẖan kanṯā.
One bed is spread out for the bride and her Husband Lord.
</td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#BABAC7"><td> ਧਨ ਸੂਤੀ ਪਿਰੁ ਸਦ ਜਾਗੰਤਾ
धन सूती पिरु सद जागंता ॥
Ḏẖan sūṯī pir saḏ jāganṯā.
The bride is asleep, while her Husband Lord is always awake.
</td></tr> <tr><td> ਪੀਓ ਮਦਰੋ ਧਨ ਮਤਵੰਤਾ
पीओ मदरो धन मतवंता ॥
Pī▫o maḏro ḏẖan maṯvanṯā.
The bride is intoxicated, as if she has drunk wine.
</td></tr> <tr><td> ਧਨ ਜਾਗੈ ਜੇ ਪਿਰੁ ਬੋਲੰਤਾ ॥੨॥
धन जागै जे पिरु बोलंता ॥२॥
Ḏẖan jāgai je pir bolanṯā. ||2||
The soul-bride only awakens when her Husband Lord calls to her. ||2||
</td></tr></tbody></table>
 
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Ishna

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respected sister ji ,


"I" is ALWAYS THERE until "I" WAKES UP , wake up of I (Our soul) is very much required .in shabad below I is soul bride .

ਸੂਹੀ ਮਹਲਾ
Soohee, Fifth Mehl

<TABLE cellSpacing=5><TBODY><TR></TR><TR><TD>ਏਕਾ ਸੇਜ ਵਿਛੀ ਧਨ ਕੰਤਾ
एका सेज विछी धन कंता ॥
Ėkā sej vicẖẖī ḏẖan kanṯā.
One bed is spread out for the bride and her Husband Lord.


</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#babac7><TD>ਧਨ ਸੂਤੀ ਪਿਰੁ ਸਦ ਜਾਗੰਤਾ
धन सूती पिरु सद जागंता ॥
Ḏẖan sūṯī pir saḏ jāganṯā.
The bride is asleep, while her Husband Lord is always awake.


</TD></TR><TR><TD>ਪੀਓ ਮਦਰੋ ਧਨ ਮਤਵੰਤਾ
पीओ मदरो धन मतवंता ॥
Pī▫o maḏro ḏẖan maṯvanṯā.
The bride is intoxicated, as if she has drunk wine.


</TD></TR><TR><TD>ਧਨ ਜਾਗੈ ਜੇ ਪਿਰੁ ਬੋਲੰਤਾ ॥੨॥
धन जागै जे पिरु बोलंता ॥२॥
Ḏẖan jāgai je pir bolanṯā. ||2||
The soul-bride only awakens when her Husband Lord calls to her. ||2||


</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Dear Veer ji

My understanding of this shabad (full shabad from ang 737 is here for reference: http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=737&L=19&id=31662 ) is that the awakening is of our awareness, here and now. In egotism we are asleep, unaware of Truth, the soul bride is drunk on the wine of Maya. Gurprasad we are awakened and can only see Truth all around, as per the end of the shabad:

ਜਹ ਦੇਖਾ ਤਹ ਪਿਰੁ ਹੈ ਭਾਈ
Jah ḏekẖā ṯah pir hai bẖā▫ī.
Wherever I look, I see my Husband Lord there, O Siblings of Destiny.
ਖੋਲ੍ਹ੍ਹਿਓ ਕਪਾਟੁ ਤਾ ਮਨੁ ਠਹਰਾਈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ਦੂਜਾ ॥੫॥
Kẖolĥi▫o kapāt ṯā man ṯẖahrā▫ī. ||1|| rahā▫o ḏūjā. ||5||
When the door is opened, then the mind is restrained. ||1||Second Pause||5||

Personally I don't see this shabad as speaking of the afterlife but about this current life.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Nov 14, 2008
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My understanding of this shabad is that the awakening is of our awareness, here and now.
GREAT !!Sister ji , m also saying same (Jeevan mukt ) .

In egotism we are asleep, unaware of Truth, the soul bride is drunk on the wine of Maya. Gurprasad we are awakened and can only see Truth all around, as per the end of the shabad:
nothing to disagree !!


ਜਹ ਦੇਖਾ ਤਹ ਪਿਰੁ ਹੈ ਭਾਈ
Jah ḏekẖā ṯah pir hai bẖā▫ī.
Wherever I look, I see my Husband Lord there, O Siblings of Destiny.
ਖੋਲ੍ਹ੍ਹਿਓ ਕਪਾਟੁ ਤਾ ਮਨੁ ਠਹਰਾਈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ਦੂਜਾ ॥੫॥
Kẖolĥi▫o kapāt ṯā man ṯẖahrā▫ī. ||1|| rahā▫o ḏūjā. ||5||
When the door is opened, then the mind is restrained. ||1||Second Pause||5||
ya,its situation after I/Soul wakes up (I and YOU became ONE ,UNION)and its same as Akasha ji quoted
ਸੋਹੰ ਆਪੁ ਪਛਾਣੀਐ ਸਬਦਿ ਭੇਦਿ ਪਤੀਆਇ ॥ सोहं आपु पछाणीऐ सबदि भेदि पतीआइ ॥ Sohaʼn āp pacẖẖāṇī▫ai sabaḏ bẖeḏ paṯī▫ā▫e. One who recognizes within himself that, "He is me", and who is pierced through by the Shabad, is satisfied.
ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਆਪੁ ਪਛਾਣੀਐ ਅਵਰ ਕਿ ਕਰੇ ਕਰਾਇ ॥੯॥ गुरमुखि आपु पछाणीऐ अवर कि करे कराइ ॥९॥ Gurmukẖ āp pacẖẖāṇī▫ai avar kė kare karā▫e. ||9|| When one becomes Gurmukh and realizes his own self, what more is there left to do or have done? ||9||
upto here there is no disagreement between us .

Personally I don't see this shabad as speaking of the afterlife but about this current life.
ok , lets assume as it is highly probable that I/Soul do not wake up from maya / illusion , I remained I(Separated from YOU) .if one dies in such situation(Separated) then what will happen to I ? THE END ?
 
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Ishna

Writer
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May 9, 2006
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Dear Veerji

This shabad from ang 46 say that even when we're separate, we're atually not. http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=46&L=18&id=1897

<TABLE width="84%"><TBODY><TR><TD>ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ ਮਹਲਾ
Sirīrāg mėhlā 5.
Siree Raag, Fifth Mehl:
ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਲਗੀ ਤਿਸੁ ਸਚ ਸਿਉ ਮਰੈ ਆਵੈ ਜਾਇ
Parīṯ lagī ṯis sacẖ si▫o marai na āvai jā▫e.
I have fallen in love with the True Lord. He does not die, He does not come and go.
ਨਾ ਵੇਛੋੜਿਆ ਵਿਛੁੜੈ ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਸਮਾਇ
Nā vecẖẖoṛi▫ā vicẖẖuṛai sabẖ mėh rahi▫ā samā▫e.
In separation, He is not separated from us; He is pervading and permeating amongst all.
ਦੀਨ ਦਰਦ ਦੁਖ ਭੰਜਨਾ ਸੇਵਕ ਕੈ ਸਤ ਭਾਇ
Ḏīn ḏaraḏ ḏukẖ bẖanjnā sevak kai saṯ bẖā▫e.
He is the Destroyer of the pain and suffering of the meek. He bears True Love for His servants.
ਅਚਰਜ ਰੂਪੁ ਨਿਰੰਜਨੋ ਗੁਰਿ ਮੇਲਾਇਆ ਮਾਇ ॥੧॥
Acẖraj rūp niranjano gur melā▫i▫ā mā▫e. ||1||
Wondrous is the Form of the Immaculate One. Through the Guru, I have met Him, O my mother! ||1||
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
 

Harkiran Kaur

Leader

Writer
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Jul 20, 2012
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Dear Veerji

This shabad from ang 46 say that even when we're separate, we're atually not. http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=46&L=18&id=1897

<TABLE width="84%"><TBODY><TR><TD>ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਲਗੀ ਤਿਸੁ ਸਚ ਸਿਉ ਮਰੈ ਆਵੈ ਜਾਇ
Parīṯ lagī ṯis sacẖ si▫o marai na āvai jā▫e.
I have fallen in love with the True Lord. He does not die, He does not come and go.
ਨਾ ਵੇਛੋੜਿਆ ਵਿਛੁੜੈ ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਸਮਾਇ
Nā vecẖẖoṛi▫ā vicẖẖuṛai sabẖ mėh rahi▫ā samā▫e.
In separation, He is not separated from us; He is pervading and permeating amongst all.

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


SSA,

EXACTLY!!!!!! Separation IS the illusion!!! There IS ONLY ONE!!!

Ishna Ji, Akasha Ji etc. are inconsequential...

The 'I AM' - the experiencer - that exists within all of us... the part of you (and me and everyone) that 'experiences'... IS THE ONE.

Recognize that 'HE IS ME'
Realize your 'OWN SELF'
Remember 'There is only ONE' and he is 'NOT separated from us' even though we think we are separate we are not.
Awaken to WHO you really are!

Shed ego... and give up separateness.... surrender the idea of individuality all together... the only way to come out and say it directly... YOU ARE the ONE (and so am I, and so is Lucky Ji, and Harmanpreet Ji, etc.)

The ONE does not die. The 'experiencer' does not die. Though the physical body of Ishna Ji will one day be shed, the DOER and experiencer inside that physical body will one day awaken and remember that Ishna Ji was only a character to be played in a transient dream, as were all the other characters. Death is therefore inconsequential - it doesn't matter - because Ishna Ji as a separate entity is only an illusion... just as my dream characters were never really separate entities to begin with, there is nothing to die...

I know that only Lucky Ji so far actually gets what I am trying to explain. It's so simple, yet so hard for people to wrap their heads around, because even though we may know the concept of ONEness we always have to think of things in the terms of being separate. That's the challenge of this lifetime... the hardest thing to give up is your identity... you identify automatically as a separate being... you MUST lay down this identity to see the truth... you must surrender your ego and self-willed thinking... you HAVE to think in the concept that we are all ONE - there was never WE to begin with...'we' are just the characters the creator is playing. The 'experiencer' who is looking through your eyes, hearing through your ears, thinking, feeling, doing... the experiencer IS and was all along the ONE. You just forgot who you are.

This philosophy is deep and difficult to understand... but interpreting Gurbani in this way just makes so much sense... more sense than to try to cryptically apply it to just nature and science. I read gurbani and it jumps out at me... lay down the ME and YOU and SHE and HE... and remember only my true identity.

again... people who view things in terms of only science and nature will interpret these things differently... but for me, trying to do it that way is very abstract and you end up trying to 'make things fit'.

In fact, I held these beliefs before I came to Sikhi anyway... It was when I read Gurbani and realized it totally was saying what I already believed, I was in Awe.

Of course people are at different stages of spiritual development and people will interpret things differently... so lets not name call or argue anymore.

This site may expain it better than I tried to.... Ishna Ji, you might grasp what Lucky Ji and I are trying to say by reading this article:
http://divinecosmos.com/start-here/larrys-corner/larry-articles/535-there-is-only-one-of-us-here

Fateh,

Akasha
 

Kamala

Banned
May 26, 2011
389
147
Canada.
To be honest, I know if you are a really virtuous Sikh, you may recieve a spot in sach khand and "merge" with Sri Vaheguru. Or if you are not as virtuous you will keep getting reincarnated till you become so. Everyone has to go to Narakh for their paaps for a while, and after that you get to go to Swarg (not sach khand) for as much virtues you've done.

I have been told that when you go to Narakh, the yam dhuuts would constantly give you pain for your virtues, but they can never snatch the virtue of praying to Sri Vaheguru.

This is one reason why it is essential to pray to Sri Vaheguru for forgiveness. Saying sorry after you have done wrong is meaningless, pray to Sri Vaheguru and watch your prayers go to sach khand.
 

Kamala

Banned
May 26, 2011
389
147
Canada.
Sat Sri Akal
Well, I don't think they are called Narakh or Swarg specifically, they are named after different kinds of hells, like rasthal (different patalas) for example.

<table cellspacing="5"><tbody><tr><td> ਤੀਰਥ ਬਰਤ ਨੇਮ ਕੀਏ ਤੇ ਸਭੈ ਰਸਾਤਲਿ ਜਾਂਹਿ ॥੨੩੩॥
तीरथ बरत नेम कीए ते सभै रसातलि जांहि ॥२३३॥
Ŧirath baraṯ nem kī▫e ṯe sabẖai rasāṯal jāʼnhi. ||233||
no matter what pilgrimages, fasts and rituals they follow, they will all go to hell. ||233||
</td></tr></tbody></table>
 

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