- Jul 14, 2007
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Christianity Is The Bible Misunderstood By Christians?
- Thread starter Astroboy
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
namjap ji
You see, there is a sincerity displayed by Carolineislands; only sincere mind can see and say that. Now guess, what do we see in Sikhism today! I am hinting towards ritualistic practices. If Satguru Nanak Gobind Singh ji see how we Sikhs are practicing Sikhism in that way, they will be appalled too to see That!
namjap ji
You see, there is a sincerity displayed by Carolineislands; only sincere mind can see and say that. Now guess, what do we see in Sikhism today! I am hinting towards ritualistic practices. If Satguru Nanak Gobind Singh ji see how we Sikhs are practicing Sikhism in that way, they will be appalled too to see That!
- Jul 14, 2007
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Pk70 Ji,
Your comments led me to this :
If Guru Nanak Came Back Today
http://www.mrsikhnet.com/mp3player/p...rin%20kaur.mp3
Pk70 Ji,
Your comments led me to this :
If Guru Nanak Came Back Today
http://www.mrsikhnet.com/mp3player/p...rin%20kaur.mp3
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Page 397
ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥
आसा महला ५ ॥
Āsā mehlā 5.
Aasaa, Fifth Mehl:
ਸਾਈ ਅਲਖੁ ਅਪਾਰੁ ਭੋਰੀ ਮਨਿ ਵਸੈ ॥
साई अलखु अपारु भोरी मनि वसै ॥
Sā­ī alakẖ apār bẖorī man vasai.
If the Invisible and Infinite Lord dwells within my mind, even for a moment,
ਦੂਖੁ ਦਰਦੁ ਰੋਗੁ ਮਾਇ ਮੈਡਾ ਹਭੁ ਨਸੈ ॥੧॥
दूखु दरदु रोगु माइ मैडा हभु नसै ॥१॥
Ḏūkẖ ḏaraḏ rog mā­ė maidā habẖ nasai. ||1||
then all my pains, troubles, and diseases vanish. ||1||
ਹਉ ਵੰਞਾ ਕੁਰਬਾਣੁ ਸਾਈ ਆਪਣੇ ॥
हउ वंञा कुरबाणु साई आपणे ॥
Ha­o vañā kurbāṇ sā­ī āpṇė.
I am a sacrifice to my Lord Master.
ਹੋਵੈ ਅਨਦੁ ਘਣਾ ਮਨਿ ਤਨਿ ਜਾਪਣੇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
होवै अनदु घणा मनि तनि जापणे ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Hovai anaḏ gẖaṇā man ṯan jāpṇė. ||1|| rahā­o.
Meditating on Him, a great joy wells up within my mind and body. ||1||Pause||
ਬਿੰਦਕ ਗਾਲ੍ਹ੍ਹਿ ਸੁਣੀ ਸਚੇ ਤਿਸੁ ਧਣੀ ॥
बिंदक गाल्हि सुणी सचे तिसु धणी ॥
Binḏak gāleh suṇī sacẖė ṯis ḏẖaṇī.
I have heard only a little bit of news about the True Lord Master.
ਸੂਖੀ ਹੂੰ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਇ ਮਾਇ ਨ ਕੀਮ ਗਣੀ ॥੨॥
सूखी हूं सुखु पाइ माइ न कीम गणी ॥२॥
Sūkẖī hūʼn sukẖ pā­ė mā­ė na kīm gaṇī. ||2||
I have obtained the peace of all peace, O my mother; I cannot estimate its worth. ||2||
ਨੈਣ ਪਸੰਦੋ ਸੋਇ ਪੇਖਿ ਮੁਸਤਾਕ ਭਈ ॥
नैण पसंदो सोइ पेखि मुसताक भई ॥
Naiṇ pasanḏo so­ė pėkẖ musṯāk bẖa­ī.
He is so beautiful to my eyes; beholding Him, I have been bewitched.
ਮੈ ਨਿਰਗੁਣਿ ਮੇਰੀ ਮਾਇ ਆਪਿ ਲੜਿ ਲਾਇ ਲਈ ॥੩॥
मै निरगुणि मेरी माइ आपि लड़ि लाइ लई ॥३॥
Mai nirguṇ mėrī mā­ė āp laṛ lā­ė la­ī. ||3||
I am worthless, O my mother; He Himself has attached me to the hem of His robe. ||3||
ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਹਭਾ ਹੂੰ ਬਾਹਰਾ ॥
बेद कतेब संसार हभा हूं बाहरा ॥
Bėḏ kaṯėb sansār habẖā hūʼn bāhrā.
He is beyond the world of the Vedas, the Koran and the Bible.
ਨਾਨਕ ਕਾ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹੁ ਦਿਸੈ ਜਾਹਰਾ ॥੪॥੩॥੧੦੫॥
नानक का पातिसाहु दिसै जाहरा ॥४॥३॥१०५॥
Nānak kā pāṯisāhu ḏisai jāhrā. ||4||3||105||
The Supreme King of Nanak is immanent and manifest. ||4||3||105||
I would like to know why the Guru's say this?
Page 397
ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥
आसा महला ५ ॥
Āsā mehlā 5.
Aasaa, Fifth Mehl:
ਸਾਈ ਅਲਖੁ ਅਪਾਰੁ ਭੋਰੀ ਮਨਿ ਵਸੈ ॥
साई अलखु अपारु भोरी मनि वसै ॥
Sā­ī alakẖ apār bẖorī man vasai.
If the Invisible and Infinite Lord dwells within my mind, even for a moment,
ਦੂਖੁ ਦਰਦੁ ਰੋਗੁ ਮਾਇ ਮੈਡਾ ਹਭੁ ਨਸੈ ॥੧॥
दूखु दरदु रोगु माइ मैडा हभु नसै ॥१॥
Ḏūkẖ ḏaraḏ rog mā­ė maidā habẖ nasai. ||1||
then all my pains, troubles, and diseases vanish. ||1||
ਹਉ ਵੰਞਾ ਕੁਰਬਾਣੁ ਸਾਈ ਆਪਣੇ ॥
हउ वंञा कुरबाणु साई आपणे ॥
Ha­o vañā kurbāṇ sā­ī āpṇė.
I am a sacrifice to my Lord Master.
ਹੋਵੈ ਅਨਦੁ ਘਣਾ ਮਨਿ ਤਨਿ ਜਾਪਣੇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
होवै अनदु घणा मनि तनि जापणे ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Hovai anaḏ gẖaṇā man ṯan jāpṇė. ||1|| rahā­o.
Meditating on Him, a great joy wells up within my mind and body. ||1||Pause||
ਬਿੰਦਕ ਗਾਲ੍ਹ੍ਹਿ ਸੁਣੀ ਸਚੇ ਤਿਸੁ ਧਣੀ ॥
बिंदक गाल्हि सुणी सचे तिसु धणी ॥
Binḏak gāleh suṇī sacẖė ṯis ḏẖaṇī.
I have heard only a little bit of news about the True Lord Master.
ਸੂਖੀ ਹੂੰ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਇ ਮਾਇ ਨ ਕੀਮ ਗਣੀ ॥੨॥
सूखी हूं सुखु पाइ माइ न कीम गणी ॥२॥
Sūkẖī hūʼn sukẖ pā­ė mā­ė na kīm gaṇī. ||2||
I have obtained the peace of all peace, O my mother; I cannot estimate its worth. ||2||
ਨੈਣ ਪਸੰਦੋ ਸੋਇ ਪੇਖਿ ਮੁਸਤਾਕ ਭਈ ॥
नैण पसंदो सोइ पेखि मुसताक भई ॥
Naiṇ pasanḏo so­ė pėkẖ musṯāk bẖa­ī.
He is so beautiful to my eyes; beholding Him, I have been bewitched.
ਮੈ ਨਿਰਗੁਣਿ ਮੇਰੀ ਮਾਇ ਆਪਿ ਲੜਿ ਲਾਇ ਲਈ ॥੩॥
मै निरगुणि मेरी माइ आपि लड़ि लाइ लई ॥३॥
Mai nirguṇ mėrī mā­ė āp laṛ lā­ė la­ī. ||3||
I am worthless, O my mother; He Himself has attached me to the hem of His robe. ||3||
ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਹਭਾ ਹੂੰ ਬਾਹਰਾ ॥
बेद कतेब संसार हभा हूं बाहरा ॥
Bėḏ kaṯėb sansār habẖā hūʼn bāhrā.
He is beyond the world of the Vedas, the Koran and the Bible.
ਨਾਨਕ ਕਾ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹੁ ਦਿਸੈ ਜਾਹਰਾ ॥੪॥੩॥੧੦੫॥
नानक का पातिसाहु दिसै जाहरा ॥४॥३॥१०५॥
Nānak kā pāṯisāhu ḏisai jāhrā. ||4||3||105||
The Supreme King of Nanak is immanent and manifest. ||4||3||105||
I would like to know why the Guru's say this?
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Randip ji
To get the full power of this shabad, the last line together with the one before it make Sikhism different from everything else. the view of God different from every other religion.
ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਹਭਾ ਹੂੰ ਬਾਹਰਾ ॥
Bėḏ kaṯėb sansār habẖā hūʼn bāhrā.
He is beyond the world of the Vedas, the Koran and the Bible.
ਨਾਨਕ ਕਾ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹੁ ਦਿਸੈ ਜਾਹਰਾ ॥੪॥੩॥੧੦੫॥
Nānak kā pāṯisāhu ḏisai jāhrā. ||4||3||105||
The Supreme King of Nanak is immanent and manifest. ||4||3||105||
He is beyond all other scriptures, He is immanent and manifest.
He is transcendent, He is immanent.
Or am I getting it wrong?
Randip ji
To get the full power of this shabad, the last line together with the one before it make Sikhism different from everything else. the view of God different from every other religion.
ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਹਭਾ ਹੂੰ ਬਾਹਰਾ ॥
Bėḏ kaṯėb sansār habẖā hūʼn bāhrā.
He is beyond the world of the Vedas, the Koran and the Bible.
ਨਾਨਕ ਕਾ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹੁ ਦਿਸੈ ਜਾਹਰਾ ॥੪॥੩॥੧੦੫॥
Nānak kā pāṯisāhu ḏisai jāhrā. ||4||3||105||
The Supreme King of Nanak is immanent and manifest. ||4||3||105||
He is beyond all other scriptures, He is immanent and manifest.
He is transcendent, He is immanent.
Or am I getting it wrong?
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Well Buddhism spread all the way to Egypt so there is no reason why Jesus would not be aware of the teachings. Some of the phrases Jesus used exactly mimic those of Budhha.
There was a documentry on this very topic (on Channel 4). It is true there is a tomb in Kashmir of a Saint Issa, buried in the Judaic manner and he appeared there shortly after the cruxificition of Christ. He was also known as the Shepherd.
On top of this tomb is buried a Muslim Saint, and outsiders are not allowed to examine it. Would it not be a revelation if this was the burial place of Jesus.
Well Buddhism spread all the way to Egypt so there is no reason why Jesus would not be aware of the teachings. Some of the phrases Jesus used exactly mimic those of Budhha.
There was a documentry on this very topic (on Channel 4). It is true there is a tomb in Kashmir of a Saint Issa, buried in the Judaic manner and he appeared there shortly after the cruxificition of Christ. He was also known as the Shepherd.
On top of this tomb is buried a Muslim Saint, and outsiders are not allowed to examine it. Would it not be a revelation if this was the burial place of Jesus.
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Hi Antonia ji,
I don't think this is swipe at the Koran, Vedas or Bible in the sense God does not lie here, I think you are right. I think what Bani is saying he is beyond ALL scriptures. I think the Guru's would say he is beyond Bani too, in so much God does not live there. I think this line is interesting:
ਸਾਈ ਅਲਖੁ ਅਪਾਰੁ ਭੋਰੀ ਮਨਿ ਵਸੈ ॥
साई अलखु अपारु भोरी मनि वसै ॥
Sā­ī alakẖ apār bẖorī man vasai.
If the Invisible and Infinite Lord dwells within my mind, even for a moment,
We search for God everywhere, but within. Bani and other religious texts give us a pointer, but it is up to us to find God.
Hi Antonia ji,
I don't think this is swipe at the Koran, Vedas or Bible in the sense God does not lie here, I think you are right. I think what Bani is saying he is beyond ALL scriptures. I think the Guru's would say he is beyond Bani too, in so much God does not live there. I think this line is interesting:
ਸਾਈ ਅਲਖੁ ਅਪਾਰੁ ਭੋਰੀ ਮਨਿ ਵਸੈ ॥
साई अलखु अपारु भोरी मनि वसै ॥
Sā­ī alakẖ apār bẖorī man vasai.
If the Invisible and Infinite Lord dwells within my mind, even for a moment,
We search for God everywhere, but within. Bani and other religious texts give us a pointer, but it is up to us to find God.
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Randip ji,
What you have quoted and what you say as your understanding -- that is what makes Sikhi different and uniquely different from other dharmic paths. It goes to the heart of why we were created by Him. We are given a choice. We are not born slaves. We may think so, but have the opportunity to find His freedom within ourselves through His Word. Mukhti.
Randip ji,
What you have quoted and what you say as your understanding -- that is what makes Sikhi different and uniquely different from other dharmic paths. It goes to the heart of why we were created by Him. We are given a choice. We are not born slaves. We may think so, but have the opportunity to find His freedom within ourselves through His Word. Mukhti.
- Jul 14, 2007
- 4,576
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Praise him for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent greatness. Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him with the psaltery and harp. Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs. Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon the high sounding cymbals. Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD.
Psalms 150:2-6
ਵਾਜੇ ਨਾਦ ਅਨੇਕ ਅਸੰਖਾ ਕੇਤੇ ਵਾਵਣਹਾਰੇ ॥
वाजे नाद अनेक असंखा केते वावणहारे ॥
vājė nāḏ anėk asankẖā kėṯė vāvaṇhārė.
The Sound-current of the Naad vibrates there, and countless musicians play on all sorts of instruments there.
Guru Nanak Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
Praise him for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent greatness. Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him with the psaltery and harp. Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs. Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon the high sounding cymbals. Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD.
Psalms 150:2-6
ਵਾਜੇ ਨਾਦ ਅਨੇਕ ਅਸੰਖਾ ਕੇਤੇ ਵਾਵਣਹਾਰੇ ॥
वाजे नाद अनेक असंखा केते वावणहारे ॥
vājė nāḏ anėk asankẖā kėṯė vāvaṇhārė.
The Sound-current of the Naad vibrates there, and countless musicians play on all sorts of instruments there.
Guru Nanak Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
- Jul 14, 2007
- 4,576
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
A Punctured Balloon
"Pleasant words are as an honeycomb, sweet to the soul, and health to the bones".
Proverbs:16:24, King James Version
Have you ever seen a balloon that has been
punctured by a fingernail or object? It only
takes one little hole in the balloon to deflate
it. It may take a while for it to completely
deflate but eventually all the air goes out.
You may try to patch it with something and
it might help for a while but doesn't last.
It is the same with our hearts. When someone
says something negative to us, a sarcastic
remark, a discouraging word, or something
that pulls us down, that is all it takes. It only
takes one discouraging or sarcastic remark to
put the hole in our hearts. But the best friend
to have is the True Guru.
ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਮੀਠਾ ਲਾਗਾ ਗੁਰੁ ਮੀਠੇ ਬਚਨ ਕਢਾਵੈਗੋ ॥
Gurmaṯ har har mīṯẖā lāgā gur mīṯẖė bacẖan kadẖāvaigo.
Following the Guru's Teachings, the Lord seems sweet to them; the Guru inspires them to speak sweet words.
Guru Ram Das - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
A Punctured Balloon
"Pleasant words are as an honeycomb, sweet to the soul, and health to the bones".
Proverbs:16:24, King James Version
Have you ever seen a balloon that has been
punctured by a fingernail or object? It only
takes one little hole in the balloon to deflate
it. It may take a while for it to completely
deflate but eventually all the air goes out.
You may try to patch it with something and
it might help for a while but doesn't last.
It is the same with our hearts. When someone
says something negative to us, a sarcastic
remark, a discouraging word, or something
that pulls us down, that is all it takes. It only
takes one discouraging or sarcastic remark to
put the hole in our hearts. But the best friend
to have is the True Guru.
ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਮੀਠਾ ਲਾਗਾ ਗੁਰੁ ਮੀਠੇ ਬਚਨ ਕਢਾਵੈਗੋ ॥
Gurmaṯ har har mīṯẖā lāgā gur mīṯẖė bacẖan kadẖāvaigo.
Following the Guru's Teachings, the Lord seems sweet to them; the Guru inspires them to speak sweet words.
Guru Ram Das - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
carolineislands
SPNer
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
I think the Guru said what he did about the Lord being above and beyond the Quran/Bible, etc. to remind us that Waheguru is beyond the imaginary boundaries we have drawn around ourselves and others. Anything written by men will always be written by men. But God's name cannot be defined or owned by any group or individual. The love of the Lord is like a big eraser that wipes out all those silly ideas about who is right and wrong. It fills my heart to over over over flow and I believe if we could just focus on His name we could all stand together, Sikh, Muslim, Hindu, Christian, Wiccan, Buddist, Vodouissant... and shout out in one voice:
"O magnify the LORD with me, and let us exalt his name together!!!"'
Psalm 34:3
And until we can do that, we'll continue to live in our little imaginary boxes as Christians, Sikhs, Amritdharis/non Amritdharis, Priests, servants, Popes, Presidents, Cooks, Kings and slaves or whatever. That's why I believe that the intent in the very center, most hidden part of our hearts is more important than anything we wear, say, do, write or THINK we are or are not. That's also why I think it's possible for a dirty begger to be closer to God than the Chair of the most prestigeous school of theology or the international head of any given religion in the world. You just never know what's in someone's heart!
JMHO
I think the Guru said what he did about the Lord being above and beyond the Quran/Bible, etc. to remind us that Waheguru is beyond the imaginary boundaries we have drawn around ourselves and others. Anything written by men will always be written by men. But God's name cannot be defined or owned by any group or individual. The love of the Lord is like a big eraser that wipes out all those silly ideas about who is right and wrong. It fills my heart to over over over flow and I believe if we could just focus on His name we could all stand together, Sikh, Muslim, Hindu, Christian, Wiccan, Buddist, Vodouissant... and shout out in one voice:
"O magnify the LORD with me, and let us exalt his name together!!!"'
Psalm 34:3
And until we can do that, we'll continue to live in our little imaginary boxes as Christians, Sikhs, Amritdharis/non Amritdharis, Priests, servants, Popes, Presidents, Cooks, Kings and slaves or whatever. That's why I believe that the intent in the very center, most hidden part of our hearts is more important than anything we wear, say, do, write or THINK we are or are not. That's also why I think it's possible for a dirty begger to be closer to God than the Chair of the most prestigeous school of theology or the international head of any given religion in the world. You just never know what's in someone's heart!
JMHO
carolineislands
SPNer
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
2Sa 6:14 And David danced before the LORD with all his might!
Bhangra?
(I love bhangra!)
2Sa 6:14 And David danced before the LORD with all his might!
Bhangra?
(I love bhangra!)
- Apr 4, 2007
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
i agree that it is not against any other scriptures... yes, God is beyond all of these scriptures...
but when you say that God is beyond Bani... isn't Bani simply a form of God?
i agree that it is not against any other scriptures... yes, God is beyond all of these scriptures...
but when you say that God is beyond Bani... isn't Bani simply a form of God?
- Apr 4, 2007
- 934
- 29
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
hmm.... not in sikhi anyway.
Gurbani speaks of dancing in two distinct ways. one, the dance of the mind, of the soul, the dance of the bliss of Waheguru. i don't think this is a physical thing... though some sects, like Naamdaris, do dance to kirtan, i find it kind of weird, disrespectful maybe.
aasaa mehalaa 1 ||
Aasaa, First Mehla:
vaajaa math pakhaavaj bhaao ||
Make your intellect your instrument, and love your tambourine;
hoe ana(n)dh sadhaa man chaao ||
thus bliss and lasting pleasure shall be produced in your mind.
eaehaa bhagath eaeho thap thaao ||
This is devotional worship, and this is the practice of penance.
eith ra(n)g naachahu rakh rakh paao ||1||
So dance in this love, and keep the beat with your feet. ||1||
poorae thaal jaanai saalaah ||
Know that the perfect beat is the Praise of the Lord;
hor nachanaa khuseeaa man maah ||1|| rehaao ||
other dances produce only temporary pleasure in the mind. ||1||Pause||
and
thum dhaeiaal saran prathipaalak mo ko dheejai dhaan har ham jaachae ||
You are the Merciful Cherisher of those who seek Your Sanctuary. I beg of You: please grant me Your gift, Lord.
har kae dhaas dhaas ham keejai man nirath karae kar naachae ||3||
Make me the slave of the Lord's slaves, so that my mind might dance in Your Love. ||3||
and
manooaa naachai bhagath dhrirraaeae ||
Channel your dancing mind in devotional worship,
gur kai sabadh manai man milaaeae ||
and through the Word of the Guru's Shabad, merge your mind with the Supreme Mind.
sachaa thaal poorae maaeiaa mohu chukaaeae sabadhae nirath karaavaniaa ||3||
Let your true and perfect tune be the subjugation of your love of Maya, and let yourself dance to the Shabad. ||3||
or, it speaks of the dance of maya, of lust. this i associate with bhangra/hiphop, etc. (yes, i love the music, but i don't think it has much place in sikhi.)
bahu thaal poorae vaajae vajaaeae ||
One may beat upon and play all sorts of instruments,
naa ko sunae n ma(n)n vasaaeae ||
but no one will listen, and no one will enshrine it in the mind.
maaeiaa kaaran pirr ba(n)dhh naachai dhoojai bhaae dhukh paavaniaa ||6||
For the sake of Maya, they set the stage and dance, but they are in love with duality, and they obtain only sorrow. ||6||
or
so jeeviaa jis man vasiaa soe ||
They alone are truly alive, whose minds are filled with the Lord.
naanak avar n jeevai koe ||
O Nanak, no one else is truly alive;
jae jeevai path lathhee jaae ||
those who merely live shall depart in dishonor;
sabh haraam jaethaa kishh khaae ||
everything they eat is impure.
raaj ra(n)g maal ra(n)g || ra(n)g rathaa nachai na(n)g ||
Intoxicated with power and thrilled with wealth, they delight in their pleasures, and dance about shamelessly.
naanak t(h)agiaa mut(h)aa jaae ||
O Nanak, they are deluded and defrauded.
vin naavai path gaeiaa gavaae ||1||
Without the Lord's Name, they lose their honor and depart. ||1||
2Sa 6:14 And David danced before the LORD with all his might!
Bhangra?
(I love bhangra!)
hmm.... not in sikhi anyway.
Gurbani speaks of dancing in two distinct ways. one, the dance of the mind, of the soul, the dance of the bliss of Waheguru. i don't think this is a physical thing... though some sects, like Naamdaris, do dance to kirtan, i find it kind of weird, disrespectful maybe.
aasaa mehalaa 1 ||
Aasaa, First Mehla:
vaajaa math pakhaavaj bhaao ||
Make your intellect your instrument, and love your tambourine;
hoe ana(n)dh sadhaa man chaao ||
thus bliss and lasting pleasure shall be produced in your mind.
eaehaa bhagath eaeho thap thaao ||
This is devotional worship, and this is the practice of penance.
eith ra(n)g naachahu rakh rakh paao ||1||
So dance in this love, and keep the beat with your feet. ||1||
poorae thaal jaanai saalaah ||
Know that the perfect beat is the Praise of the Lord;
hor nachanaa khuseeaa man maah ||1|| rehaao ||
other dances produce only temporary pleasure in the mind. ||1||Pause||
and
thum dhaeiaal saran prathipaalak mo ko dheejai dhaan har ham jaachae ||
You are the Merciful Cherisher of those who seek Your Sanctuary. I beg of You: please grant me Your gift, Lord.
har kae dhaas dhaas ham keejai man nirath karae kar naachae ||3||
Make me the slave of the Lord's slaves, so that my mind might dance in Your Love. ||3||
and
manooaa naachai bhagath dhrirraaeae ||
Channel your dancing mind in devotional worship,
gur kai sabadh manai man milaaeae ||
and through the Word of the Guru's Shabad, merge your mind with the Supreme Mind.
sachaa thaal poorae maaeiaa mohu chukaaeae sabadhae nirath karaavaniaa ||3||
Let your true and perfect tune be the subjugation of your love of Maya, and let yourself dance to the Shabad. ||3||
or, it speaks of the dance of maya, of lust. this i associate with bhangra/hiphop, etc. (yes, i love the music, but i don't think it has much place in sikhi.)
bahu thaal poorae vaajae vajaaeae ||
One may beat upon and play all sorts of instruments,
naa ko sunae n ma(n)n vasaaeae ||
but no one will listen, and no one will enshrine it in the mind.
maaeiaa kaaran pirr ba(n)dhh naachai dhoojai bhaae dhukh paavaniaa ||6||
For the sake of Maya, they set the stage and dance, but they are in love with duality, and they obtain only sorrow. ||6||
or
so jeeviaa jis man vasiaa soe ||
They alone are truly alive, whose minds are filled with the Lord.
naanak avar n jeevai koe ||
O Nanak, no one else is truly alive;
jae jeevai path lathhee jaae ||
those who merely live shall depart in dishonor;
sabh haraam jaethaa kishh khaae ||
everything they eat is impure.
raaj ra(n)g maal ra(n)g || ra(n)g rathaa nachai na(n)g ||
Intoxicated with power and thrilled with wealth, they delight in their pleasures, and dance about shamelessly.
naanak t(h)agiaa mut(h)aa jaae ||
O Nanak, they are deluded and defrauded.
vin naavai path gaeiaa gavaae ||1||
Without the Lord's Name, they lose their honor and depart. ||1||
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
ਸਚਾ ਤਾਲੁ ਪੂਰੇ ਮਾਇਆ ਮੋਹੁ ਚੁਕਾਏ ਸਬਦੇ ਨਿਰਤਿ ਕਰਾਵਣਿਆ ॥੩॥
Sacẖā ṯāl pūrė mā­i­ā moh cẖukā­ė sabḏė niraṯ karāvaṇi­ā. ||3||
Let your true and perfect tune be the subjugation of your love of Maya, and let yourself dance to the Shabad. ||3||
Guru Amar Das - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਗਾਵੈ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਨਾਚੈ ਹਰਿ ਸੇਤੀ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਵਣਿਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Gurmukẖ gāvai gurmukẖ nācẖai har sėṯī cẖiṯ lāvaṇi­ā. ||1|| rahā­o.
The Gurmukhs sing, the Gurmukhs dance, and focus their consciousness on the Lord. ||1||Pause||
Guru Amar Das - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
ਸਚਾ ਤਾਲੁ ਪੂਰੇ ਮਾਇਆ ਮੋਹੁ ਚੁਕਾਏ ਸਬਦੇ ਨਿਰਤਿ ਕਰਾਵਣਿਆ ॥੩॥
Sacẖā ṯāl pūrė mā­i­ā moh cẖukā­ė sabḏė niraṯ karāvaṇi­ā. ||3||
Let your true and perfect tune be the subjugation of your love of Maya, and let yourself dance to the Shabad. ||3||
Guru Amar Das - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਗਾਵੈ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਨਾਚੈ ਹਰਿ ਸੇਤੀ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਵਣਿਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Gurmukẖ gāvai gurmukẖ nācẖai har sėṯī cẖiṯ lāvaṇi­ā. ||1|| rahā­o.
The Gurmukhs sing, the Gurmukhs dance, and focus their consciousness on the Lord. ||1||Pause||
Guru Amar Das - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Humbly I have to disagree with you Randip Singh ji
That is not what Guru ji says in this Shabad. Guru ji is expressing the infinity of GOD and indicating that GOD described in those scriptures fall short of satisfactory explanation since GOD is beyond description.
Now next point as you say it is also beyond Gurbani, not exactly. You have the right to have your opinion; however, Gurbani says totally different than what you have said in the above post. How? In Gurbani (JAPJI) Guru ji tries to give fundamental qualities of GOD; however, Guru ji again accepts that HE is inexpressible unlike other scriptures. Gurbani also reveals that HE can be found within. That qualifies Gurbani far better in expressing about GOD than other claims. Bani Nirankar Hai, is pretty good waak in this context. It doesn’t mean Gurbani is God but for sure it states that Gurbani is all about HIM so HE is not beyond Gurbani.
Humbly I have to disagree with you Randip Singh ji
That is not what Guru ji says in this Shabad. Guru ji is expressing the infinity of GOD and indicating that GOD described in those scriptures fall short of satisfactory explanation since GOD is beyond description.
Now next point as you say it is also beyond Gurbani, not exactly. You have the right to have your opinion; however, Gurbani says totally different than what you have said in the above post. How? In Gurbani (JAPJI) Guru ji tries to give fundamental qualities of GOD; however, Guru ji again accepts that HE is inexpressible unlike other scriptures. Gurbani also reveals that HE can be found within. That qualifies Gurbani far better in expressing about GOD than other claims. Bani Nirankar Hai, is pretty good waak in this context. It doesn’t mean Gurbani is God but for sure it states that Gurbani is all about HIM so HE is not beyond Gurbani.
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
ਤੁਧੁ ਧਿਆਇਨ੍ਹ੍ਹਿ ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬਾ ਸਣੁ ਖੜੇ ॥
तुधु धिआइन्हि बेद कतेबा सणु खड़े ॥
The followers of the Vedas, the Bible and the Koran, standing at Your Door, meditate on You.
Guru Arjan Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
ਤੁਧੁ ਧਿਆਇਨ੍ਹ੍ਹਿ ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬਾ ਸਣੁ ਖੜੇ ॥
तुधु धिआइन्हि बेद कतेबा सणु खड़े ॥
The followers of the Vedas, the Bible and the Koran, standing at Your Door, meditate on You.
Guru Arjan Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
And let him that is athirst come, and whosoever will,
let him take the Water of Life freely.
Revelation 22:7
ਪਤਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਾਵਹਿ ਘਰਿ ਸਿਧਾਵਹਿ ਝੋਲਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਪੀ ਰਸੋ ॥
पति नामु पावहि घरि सिधावहि झोलि अम्रित पी रसो ॥
Paṯ nām pāvahi gẖar siḏẖāveh jẖol amriṯ pī raso.
Through the Naam, you shall obtain honor, and come home. Eagerly drink in the Ambrosial Amrit.
Guru Nanak Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
And let him that is athirst come, and whosoever will,
let him take the Water of Life freely.
Revelation 22:7
ਪਤਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਾਵਹਿ ਘਰਿ ਸਿਧਾਵਹਿ ਝੋਲਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਪੀ ਰਸੋ ॥
पति नामु पावहि घरि सिधावहि झोलि अम्रित पी रसो ॥
Paṯ nām pāvahi gẖar siḏẖāveh jẖol amriṯ pī raso.
Through the Naam, you shall obtain honor, and come home. Eagerly drink in the Ambrosial Amrit.
Guru Nanak Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
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Re: Is the Bible Misunderstood by Christians ?
Pss.11 [1]
In the LORD put I my trust: How say ye to my soul, Flee as a bird to your mountain?
ਮਾਣੁ ਨਿਮਾਣੇ ਤੂੰ ਧਣੀ ਤੇਰਾ ਭਰਵਾਸਾ ॥
Māṇ nimāṇė ṯūʼn ḏẖaṇī ṯėrā bẖarvāsā.
You are the honor of the dishonored. O Master, in You I place my trust.
Guru Arjan Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
Pss.11 [1]
In the LORD put I my trust: How say ye to my soul, Flee as a bird to your mountain?
ਮਾਣੁ ਨਿਮਾਣੇ ਤੂੰ ਧਣੀ ਤੇਰਾ ਭਰਵਾਸਾ ॥
Māṇ nimāṇė ṯūʼn ḏẖaṇī ṯėrā bẖarvāsā.
You are the honor of the dishonored. O Master, in You I place my trust.
Guru Arjan Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
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