Do All Religions Lead To God?

[Tejwant Singh]

Ausdesi ji,

Guru Fateh.

I beg to disagree with your above assertion or/and claim. Jesus, whom the Christians call God and or the Son of God said the following in the Holy Bible:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazrul_islam#cite_note-26 Jesus said, "I am the way, ...no one comes to the Father, but through me." (John.14:6)

One can find more verses in the Bible which also give the message mentioned above.

The Holy Qur’an says similar things or even worse for the non-believers- whom it calls Kafirs.


The Believers are but a single Brotherhood (49:10)
The Qur’an makes it clear that Islam is not about universal brotherhood, but about the brotherhood of believers:

The Believers are but a single Brotherhood (49:10)
​

Not all men are equal under Islam. Slaves and the handicapped are not equal to healthy free men, for example (16:75-76). The Qur’an introduces the “Law of Equality,” which establishes different levels of human value when considering certain matters, such as restitution for murder (2:178).
With regard to Islam, the Qur’an tells Muslims that they are a favored race, while those of other religions are “*******ed transgressors”:

Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are *******ed transgressors. (3:110)
​

As we shall see later, Allah condemns non-Muslims to Hell based merely on their unbelief, while believers are rewarded with the finest earthly comforts in the hereafter, including never-ending food, wine and sex (56:12-40).



In fact, much of the Qur’an is devoted to distinguishing Muslims from non-Muslims and impugning the latter.


I do not know much about Bhagvat Gita and how it shows that all humanity is ONE. Perhaps, you can quote some verses from it which show that.


I know, Sikhism does that.



Tejwant Singh

 

[Satyaban]

JimRinx Ji

Oh, and tell your Generals, Hindus, that 'W' didn't give you 3 Megaton Tech because he Loves You; he did so because he hopes you'll use it one one another!
He is a Racists - a White Supremacists; and if you Nuke yourselves into Oblivion - his type will send in the Robots to rape your Mutated Progeny of whatevers left.

I have no idea what this means or what you are talking about in an otherwise wonderful post. Not quite what I would expect from a Buddhist but what do I know.

Om shanti shanti
Satyaban

 

[AusDesi]

AusDesi ji,

Guru Fateh.

Your write:




What do you mean by" the supreme being"? Can you please elaborate that in lay man's terms?

Thanks.

Tejwant Singh

Certainly sir. Lord Krishna is a human avatar of Lord Vishnu. In most of Mahabharata he acts as a human being. However, When the Bhagvad Gita starts Arjuna basically has a urge not to fight due to all those who will be killed. Many of them will be his relatives.

Lord Krishna reminds him that its his Dharma to fight against opression. Arjuna finally accepts this but he insists that since he might die he wants to see the 'virat rupa' of Lord Krishna. After that, Lord Krishna talks to him in the Virat Rupa. Virat Rupa is the Supreme Being form of God aka the Brahman. Here is an artists image which i also use as my avatar:

Due to this Virat Rupa, The Hare Krishna or ISKON pray to the virat Rupa of krishna. They are monotheists and pray only to Krishna as he is the only god to show his true form in the modern day according to Hindu scriptures.

 

[AusDesi]

Ausdesi ji,

Guru Fateh.

I beg to disagree with your above assertion or/and claim. Jesus, whom the Christians call God and or the Son of God said the following in the Holy Bible:

Jesus said, "I am the way, ...no one comes to the Father, but through me." (John.14:6

I do not know much about Bhagvat Gita and how it shows that all humanity is ONE. Perhaps, you can quote some verses from it which show that.

That is the fundamental difference between Hinduism and Abrahamic religions. No sect of Hinduism says that only their way is right. There are many paths to god. Some Neo-Hindu sects might disagree like ISKON though.

The quote I showed contradicts the John 14:6. Krishna does not say that you can reach Moksha only through worshipping him.

Since you ask about all Humanity is one. Since Bhagvad Gita is a conversation of god and human about attaining Moksha, Lord Krishna answers this differently.

"I am the indwelling-soul, O'Gaudakesha(Arjuna) seated in the hearts of all beings, I am the beginning, the middle, as well as the end of all beings" ch10:V20

"I am the seed of all living beings, O'Arjuna." Ch10:V39

Now as i said Bhgavad Gita is not a commentary. Both those verses says that the Lord if part of all human beings. Since Bhagavd Gita says that every human is equal.

Moreover, Bhagvad Gita also says that only those who hold no enmities towrds other human beings can see the lord:

"He who performs all his actions for me, considers me as his supreme goal, and is totally devoted to me, who is non-attached and free from malice towards all beings, surely comes to me, O'Arjuna" Ch11:V55

"One who is not envious but is a kind friend to all living entities, who does not think himself a proprietor and is free from false ego, who is equal in both happiness and distress, who is tolerant, always satisfied, self-controlled, and engaged in devotional service with determination, his mind and intelligence fixed on Me—such a devotee of Mine is very dear to Me."Ch12:V13-14

I hope I have answered your question.

 

[AusDesi]

AusDesi Ji:
Your opinions are a welcomed new voice to this site.

Thank you Satyaban ji,

Nice to hear your opinions too. In fact, I look forward to learning a bit about Shaivism. Coming from a Sanatan Dharmic family, I had to choose my own path is Hinduism and I chose Krishnaism.

 

[Tejwant Singh]

AusDesi ji,

Guru Fateh.

You mean, now you disagree with Kazi Nazrul Islam whom you have quoted in agreement below regarding the Abrahamic religions?

I like a quote from Kazi Nazrul Islam who was Indian bengali but later moved to Bangladesh.

‘’I can tolerate Hinduism and Muslims but I cannot tolerate the Tikism (Tiki is a tuft of never cut hair kept on the head by certain Hindus to maitain personal Holiness) and beardism. Tiki is not Hinduism. It may be the sign of the pundit. Similarly beards is not Islam, it may be the sign of the pundit. Similarly beard is not Islam, it may be the sign of the mollah
Mullah
. All the hair-pulling have originated from those two tufts of hair. Todays fighting is alos between the Pundit and the Mollah: It is not between the Hindus and the Muslims. No prophet has said, ‘’I have come for Hindus I have come for Muslims I have come for Christians.” They have said, “I have come for the humanity for everyone, like light’’. But the devotees of Krishna says, “Krishna is for Hindus”. The followers of Muhammad (Sm) says, “Muhammad (Sm) is for the Muslims”. The Disciple of Christ is for Christian”.

Tejwant Singh

 

[AusDesi]

AusDesi ji,

Guru Fateh.

You mean, now you disagree with Kazi Nazrul Islam whom you have quoted in agreement below regarding the Abrahamic religions?



Tejwant Singh

Tejwant Ji,

Where did I say Krishna is only for hindus? Even If I did, I apologize.

Ok it took me ages to figure out what you meant. Im guessing you meant that since Jesus said 'One only go to god through him' then Kazi Narul Islam is wrong. Its possible he is wrong.

btw, that quote was in reply to someone who said why do all religions fight not about abrahamic religions.

 

[vsgrewal48895]

Dear All,

Originally all religions were meant to help people to progress on spiritual lines towards god and become a Guru willed (ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ) person but lately all of the religions have become institutionalized and want to control the followers and forgotton spiritual principles as written in their holy scriptures. There is the same light of God inall of us veiled by Houmai-you remove it with humility the Higher Power of Higher Self wil shine. Kabir said in his slokes that same light tells every one what is goo or bad, right or wrong but;

ਕਬੀਰ ਮਨੁ ਜਾਨੈ ਸਭ ਬਾਤ ਜਾਨਤ ਹੀ ਅਉਗਨੁ ਕਰੈ ॥ਕਾਹੇ ਕੀ ਕੁਸਲਾਤ ਹਾਥਿ ਦੀਪੁ ਕੂਏ ਪਰੈ ॥

Kabīr man jānai sabẖ bāṯ jānaṯ hī a¬ugan karai, Kāhė kī kuslāṯ hāth ḏīp kū¬ė parai.

Kabir, the mortal knows every thing, and knowing, he still makes mistakes; what good is a lamp in one’s hand, if he falls in to well? -----Kabir Sloke, 216, AGGS, Page, 1376-4

Cordially,

Virinder

 

[Satyaban]

Namaste AusDesi:
I read the Gita some years ago and took from many things. Krishna told Arjuna and in a sense all of us to do whatever our duty is. Of course Arjuna was a warrior and his duty was to enter into battle. I recall in Krishna's' urgings he said something like go ahead and kill them because "they were already dead" their fate was sealed and destiny. It is also a primer on the different yogas which I think many miss. The Gita is not scripture to us as it is to you.

I am curious about what an "Advaita/Vaishnavite" is. I thought you all's school was dualistic. Is this not so? Am I right in assuming you are not a member of ISKCON? One more question. I know there are what to be 10 incarnations of Lord Vishnu? Have all 10 occurred or are there more to come? The only two I know are Rama and Krishna.

Thanks for hearing all my questions but it may also help other members.

Om shanti shanti Om
Satyaban

 

[spnadmin]

Either Satyaban ji or AusDesi ji

I too am curious whether one can be an adherent of Advaita and a Vaishnavite? It is my understanding that these are distinct branches of sanatan dharma, with a different sense of the nature of the supreme power and philosophical explanation of the divine reality. Please clarify.

 

[Satyaban]

Well speaking for myself I believe in the philosophy of non-dualism,that is reality is composed of one whole principle God with no independent parts. As I have said before "All is Shiva and there is nothing without Shiva". which means there is nothing outside of Shiva and there is nothing without Shiva's essence.

It is my understanding that though largely dualistic devotees of Lord Vishnu range from Madhva's pure dualism to Ramanuja's qualified nondualism. Then there is Vallabha's nearly monistic vision that God and soul are everlastingly distinct.Therefore upon liberation from the cycles of rebirth the soul's destiny is to eternally worship and enjoy Him. Bhakti yoga being the highest path.

That is about all I know and that I accept them as brothers with my arms spread wide. Of course this is knowledge I gained Shaivite sources to include "Dancing With Shiva" by Satguru Sivaya Subramuniyaswami. That is one heck of a name to learn but it is a good little book of 900 plus pages.
Call on me anytime and I will share what little I know or find out for you.

Peace
Satyaban

 

[spnadmin]

Satyaban ji

Thank you and you are very generous to make that offer. I will wait for AusDesi to respond before I respond. I have a different understanding of Advaita. Nondualistic, yest. But other places where we may disagree.

My question however stands -- how can one adhere to Advaita and Vashnaivism at the same time? I think it is a fair question.

 

[AusDesi]

Namaste AusDesi:
I read the Gita some years ago and took from many things. Krishna told Arjuna and in a sense all of us to do whatever our duty is. Of course Arjuna was a warrior and his duty was to enter into battle. I recall in Krishna's' urgings he said something like go ahead and kill them because "they were already dead" their fate was sealed and destiny. It is also a primer on the different yogas which I think many miss. The Gita is not scripture to us as it is to you.

Namaskar Satyaban Ji,

First of all, Let me say I would be an idiot if I expected everyone in the world to accept Bgavad Gita as a scripture. I do not treat Bible or the Quran as scripture. However, I give them the respect that they have alot of knowledge and they could be one of the paths to god as well.

Now, I have looked through chapter 2 and 3 which I thought would have this quote but I cannot find it in my gita at home. Would you mind sending me the verse and the chapter.

Now, Krishna does say that soul is not killed when the body dies and how everyone who is born will die and will be reborn. I guess that could be looked at as urgings to kill in a way but that is just difference of opinion. However, Krishna doesn't say Arjuna will only kill. Ch 2Verse37 says "If killed you will attain heaven or if victorious you will reign with soverignty over earth. So stand up O'Arjuna, resolved to fight"

I am curious about what an "Advaita/Vaishnavite" is.

Problem with the modern day 'ism's and 'ite's is that you have to choose one or the other. Who said you cannot pick things out of both? Well I am not the only one to do so. Shankaracharya uses Bhagvad Gita to justify his theories and Gaudiya Vaishnavism also choose it to justify theirs.

I thought you all's school was dualistic. Is this not so?

I think Advaita and Dvaita are just different views of the same thing.

Am I right in assuming you are not a member of ISKCON?

No I am not. I like the fact they have brought people to worship Krishna BUT i think its much more tailored to convert westerners to Iskon than Hinduism or Vaishnavism.

One more question. I know there are what to be 10 incarnations of Lord Vishnu? Have all 10 occurred or are there more to come? The only two I know are Rama and Krishna.

There are various views but most agree that 9 have come. This is considered to be KaliYuga so Kalki has still to come. Hence, many people claimed themselves to be Kalki.

These are the 10
1. Matsya (the fish)
2. Koorma (the tortoise)
3. Varaha (the boar)
4. Narasimha (the human-lion)
5. Vamana (the dwarf)
6. Parasurama (the angry man, Rama with an axe)
7. Lord Rama (the perfect man, king of Ayodha)
8. Lord Krishna (the divine statesman)
9. Balarama (elder brother of Krishna) - This one is sometimes swapped with Buddha
10. Kalki (the mighty worrior)

Thanks for hearing all my questions but it may also help other members.

Om shanti shanti Om
Satyaban

No worries. Let me just say that Beliefs change as a person gains more knowledge.

Beliefs are quite complex. I have visited and do visit pilgrimages of other sects of hinduism. My devotion doesn't not change. That means I am no longer a Vaishnavite. I don't think so. Infact, i like Krishna more than all other avatars of Vishnu. That means I am a Krishnaite and not a Vaishnavite. If there is such thing as Krishnaite then yes. However, then If i go to Kedarnath does that would mean I am no longer a Krishnaite.

Now, someone might say I am hindu in the modern day definition as i worship all the sects and Hindu is the wrong name for Sanatana Dharma. Yes that might be true but i have 0 belief in Astrology. That would mean I am no longer follwing Sanatan Dharma.

Therefore, I think personally I belive that all sects of Hinduism as well as all other major religions are talking about the same one god. Now, people will try to define the attributes and then fight over which set of attributes is right. Therefore, i believe that Brahman is indefinable in the sense that there are countless ways to define it and we haven't got brains with enough processing to come up with all.

Now I have tried to express my views to make it understandable to all. Its possible that other people's views will not be the same as mine but that is to be expected, we are humans.

OM Shanti Shanti OM

 

[AusDesi]

My question however stands -- how can one adhere to Advaita and Vashnaivism at the same time? I think it is a fair question.

Naryanjot Ji Sat Sri Akal,

Lets be clear I first and foremost adhere to the Bhagvad Gita.

Now, Shankaracharya was the first one to make Advaita popular. He is the biggest teacher in it. He started 4 Mathas of Advaita. link here:Adi Shankara - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He wrote commentary on the Bhagavad Gita. He saw Non-Duality in it. link here: Gita Bhashya - Works of Sankaracharya, Advaita Vedanta and Hindu Sacred Scriptures

Now, Vaishnavism relies on Bhagvad Gita and Bhagvad Purana. They see their beliefs in it.

I am a mere university student with very little knowledge but if two different beliefs are using the same book to their tell their side of the story. I would think that they are talking about the same thing just with a different opinion.

So finally, Yes there are many differences between Avdaita and Vaishnavism but there are commonalities too.

You can call "him" Brahman, Krishna or Vishnu, point is you get to him in the end. To be more accurate, you soul gets there at the end.


Problem is that there are those such as ISKON who will not have it any other way except their own.

 

[spnadmin]

AusDesi ji

Thanks for you reply and I will consider the question further.

 

[AusDesi]

AusDesi ji

Thanks for you reply and I will consider the question further.

Here is a link which shows Adi Shanakarachrya's commentary in summary.

Bhagavad Gita Core Principles - ???? ?? ?????????

Though he believed in Brahman Shankaracharya also wrote songs for hindu gods of all sects
Na thatho, na matha, na bandur na datha,
Na puthro, na puthri , na bruthyo , na bartha,
Na jayaa na Vidhya, na Vruthir mamaiva,
Gathisthwam, Gathisthwam Thwam ekaa Bhavani.

Neither the mother nor the father,
Neither the relation nor the friend,
Neither the son nor the daughter,
Neither the servant nor the husband,
Neither the wife nor the knowledge,
And neither my sole occupation,
Are my refuges that I can depend, Oh, Bhavani,
So you are my refuge and my only refuge, Bhavani.

http://www.sankaracharya.org/bhavani_ashtakam.php


Aaradhayami mani sannibham athma lingam,
Maayapuri hrudaya pankaja sannivishtam,
Sradha nadhi vimala chitha jalabishegai,
Nithyam samadhi kusmaira punarbhavai.
I worship that Linga,
Which is in me as my soul,
Residing in the illusory lotus of my heart,
Getting bathed by the clear water,
Of the river of my devotion,
And worshipped daily by the Lotus,
Of my meditation for avoiding another birth.

http://www.sankaracharya.org/shiva_manasa_pooja.php


Mano budhyahankara chithaa ninaham,
Na cha srothra jihwe na cha graana nethrer,
Na cha vyoma bhoomir na thejo na vayu,
Chidananada Roopa Shivoham, Shivoham.

Neither am I mind, nor intelligence ,
Nor ego, nor thought,
Nor am I ears or the tongue or the nose or the eyes,
Nor am I earth or sky or air or the light,
I am Shiva, I am Shiva, of nature knowledge and bliss

http://www.sankaracharya.org/nirvana_shatkam.php



Angam hare pulaka bhooshanamasrayanthi,
Bhringanga neva mukulabharanam thamalam,
Angikrithakhila vibhuthirapanga leela,
Mangalyadasthu mama mangala devathaya.

To the Hari who wears supreme happiness as Ornament,
The Goddess Lakshmi is attracted,
Like the black bees getting attracted,
To the unopened buds of black Tamala tree,
Let her who is the Goddess of all good things,
Grant me a glance that will bring prosperity.

http://www.sankaracharya.org/kanaka_dhara_stotra.php

 

[vsgrewal48895]

Bhai Gudas in his Vaar 1 and Pauri 33 writes about the response of Guru Nanak on the question, as to which religion is better;

ਪੁਛਨਿ ਗਲ ਈਮਾਨ ਦੀ ਕਾਜੀ ਮੁਲਾਂ ਇਕਠੇ ਹੋਈ ।

ਵਡਾ ਸਾਂਗ ਵਰਤਾਇਆ ਲਖਿ ਨ ਸਕੈ ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕੋਈ ।

ਪੁਛਨਿ ਫੋਲਿ ਕਿਤਾਬ ਨੋ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਵਡਾ ਕਿ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨੋਈ ।

ਬਾਬਾ ਆਖੇ ਹਾਜੀਆ ਸੁਭਿ ਅਮਲਾ ਬਾਝਹੁ ਦੋਨੋ ਰੋਈ ।

ਹਿੰਦੂ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ਦੁਇ ਦਰਗਹ ਔਦਰਿ ਲਹਨਿ ਨ ਢੋਈ ।

ਕਚਾ ਰੰਗੁ ਕੁਸੰਭ ਦਾ ਪਾਣੀ ਧੋਤੈ ਥਿਰੁ ਨ ਰਹੋਈ ।

ਕਰਨਿ ਬਖੀਲੀ ਆਪਿ ਵਿਚਿ ਰਾਮ ਰਹੀਮ ਕੁਥਾਇ ਖਲੋਈ ।

ਰਾਹਿ ਸੈਤਾਨੀ ਦੁਨੀਆ ਗੋਈ ।

Puchan Gal Emaan De Kaji Mullan Ikathay Hoee. Vadda Sang Vartaa-eia Lakh Na Sakai Koee. Puchan Foal Kitab No Hindu Vadda Ke Muslmanoee. Baba Aakhay Haajia Subh Amlaa Vajoh Dono Roee. Hindu Muslaman Douey Dargah Andar Lehan Na Dhoee. Kacha Rang Kusanbh Da PaaNi Dhotai Thir Na Rahoee. Karan Bakheeli Aap Vich Raam Rahim Kuthaey Khloee. Raaeh Saitaani Dunia Goee.

Qazis and Maulvis got together and began discussing religion. A great fantasy has been created and no one could understand its mystery. They asked Baba Nanak to open and search in his book whether Hindu is great or the Muslim. Baba replied to pilgrim Hajjis, that, with out good deeds of morality both will have to weep and wail. Only by being a Hindu or a Muslim one cannot get accepted in the court of the God. As the color of safflower is impermanent and is washed away in water, like wise the colors of religiosity are also temporary. In their exposition followers of both religions denounce Ram and Rahim. The whole world is following the way of Satan.

Virinder

 

[Astroboy]

I worship that Linga,
Which is in me as my soul,

Many ppl think that linga or lingam is male sex organ, but no it isn't.
AusDesi Ji can you throw some light on this matter?

 

[AusDesi]

Many ppl think that linga or lingam is male sex organ, but no it isn't.
AusDesi Ji can you throw some light on this matter?

To be honest I can't. My knowledge does not extend to Shaivism. I know very little only from temples in India and Shivaratri.

All I know is that there are 12 jyotirlingas in India. 1 of which I want to visit. That being the Ujjain Mahakal. Also, there is a maha shivratri and the month of saavan is special for Shiva. There ends my knowledge.

It would be great if our friend Satyaban ji could shed light on the matter.

 

[Satyaban]

Many ppl think that linga or lingam is male sex organ, but no it isn't.
AusDesi Ji can you throw some light on this matter?

namjap ji:

The Shiva lingum so misunderstood. The lingum sure looks like a male organ in a what vulva. It is the image of divinity the first icon of Lord Shiva worshipped as Parasiva "Transcendant Shiva" Siva the Absolute Reality, plus Shiva as creator. Sorry for the white lingam which is much too big and I can't remove it.

Peace
Satyaban