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Islam Dawah Man And Basics Of Sikhi [Video]

Nov 14, 2008
283
414
The Sikh did say that and i'm not going to subject myself to torture by attempting to watch that in order to pinpoint the exact moment he made a mention of that. You may rewatch if you want. I'd rather waste my time on youtube by watching funny cat videos.


I proclaim the cuteness and nonchalant attitude of cats to be miracles of the highest order!
if you can't, then kindly stop lying on public forum :happykudi:.
 

choochoochan

SPNer
Nov 4, 2013
75
30
Actually, i've come across what the Sardarji said and it's kind of insulting to Muslims in general. Actually, it's insulting God. He equates the Quranic challenge for all of Mankind and Jinn to try to compose a line in the poetic styling of the Quran, silly. A silly challenge. RIGHT.

Why don't Sikhs sit down, and read the Quran like the Gurus? No one is performing dawah on you, but just read the Quran to know what is in it. Guru Nanak did, why can't you? And if you criticise the Quran, or Islam, are you saying Guru Nanak was "wrong" for calling the Prophet's religion "sweet"?

Anyway, back to Lil Bub.
 
Nov 14, 2008
283
414
<hr style="color:; background-color:" size="1">
Actually, i've come across what the Sardarji said and it's kind of insulting to Muslims in general. Actually, it's insulting God.
hi Choochoochan ji ,

nowhere he (Mr Singh) said nonSikhs/Muslims will burn/rot in Hell eternally infact he repeated several times that its the connection with divine which is important rather than religious labels, we can call HIM Ram ,Allah or whatever we want and this is what Sikhi teaches us ,tell me how its insult of Muslims ?

on contrary just look at the view of Dawahman towards non muslims/Sikhs
"
This is why we're out here, because I know the reality and I don't mean disrespect but come on you already know what my beliefs are, don't you? That if you're not a Muslim after you heard the message of Islam, you're going to burn in the hellfire, not you in particular but anyone
"

He equates the Quranic challenge for all of Mankind and Jinn to try to compose a line in the poetic styling of the Quran, silly. A silly challenge. RIGHT
sorry m unable to get what you wanna say ,kindly explain .

Why don't Sikhs sit down, and read the Quran like the Gurus? No one is performing dawah on you, but just read the Quran to know what is in it. Guru Nanak did, why can't you? And if you criticise the Quran, or Islam, are you saying Guru Nanak was "wrong" for calling the Prophet's religion "sweet"?
why you assumed Sikhs don't read quran ? Sikhs are encouraged to read scriptures of various faiths , you know there were 52 poets/scholars in the darbar of Guru Gobind singh sahib ji whose work was to study/ translate religious text into different languages . In Guru Darbar Quran was translated into Gurmukhi and Geeta /Puranas/Vedas were translated into persian .

very first thing we(Sikhs) are told is to respect others Faith .
 

choochoochan

SPNer
Nov 4, 2013
75
30
<hr style="color:; background-color:" size="1"> hi Choochoochan ji ,

nowhere he (Mr Singh) said nonSikhs/Muslims will burn/rot in Hell eternally infact he repeated several times that its the connection with divine which is important rather than religious labels, we can call HIM Ram ,Allah or whatever we want and this is what Sikhi teaches us ,tell me how its insult of Muslims ?

on contrary just look at the view of Dawahman towards non muslims/Sikhs
"
This is why we're out here, because I know the reality and I don't mean disrespect but come on you already know what my beliefs are, don't you? That if you're not a Muslim after you heard the message of Islam, you're going to burn in the hellfire, not you in particular but anyone
"

sorry m unable to get what you wanna say ,kindly explain .

why you assumed Sikhs don't read quran ? Sikhs are encouraged to read scriptures of various faiths , you know there were 52 poets/scholars in the darbar of Guru Gobind singh sahib ji whose work was to study/ translate religious text into different languages . In Guru Darbar Quran was translated into Gurmukhi and Geeta /Puranas/Vedas were translated into persian .

very first thing we(Sikhs) are told is to respect others Faith .
The fact that you dunno the Quranic challenge leads me to believe that you've never read the Quran. The fact that the Sardarji didn't know of it and referred to as a silly challenge leads me to believe that (A) he's never read the Quran, and (B) he doesn't respect Islam.

The challenge is in the Quran and is something posed to anyone who doubted the authenticity of the Quran by God. I don't want to be accused of proselytizing, but the following are the verses relating to this challenge:-

“Say: ‘If all mankind and the jinn would come together to produce the like of this Quran, they could not produce its like even though they exerted all their strength in aiding one another.’” (Quran 17:88)

“Or do they say that he has invented it? Say (to them), ‘Bring ten invented chapters like it, and call (for help) on whomever you can besides God, if you are truthful.” (Quran 11:13)

“And if you all are in doubt about what I have revealed to My servant, bring a single chapter like it, and call your witnesses besides God if you are truthful.” (Quran 2:23)

What did Dawah Man say? I am not defending him. He's an idiot.

But since you say that the Sardarji was respectful to other faiths as ordained by Sikhism, please explain to me WHY he said the Quranic challenge is "silly". It shows that he has no respect and never read the Quran. Enough said.
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
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SPNer
Jul 4, 2004
7,676
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KUALA LUMPUR MALAYSIA
IF it is so fantastic that it cant be written by human hands..then it shouldnt use paper..ink..human language..it should mysteriously hover in mid air or turn into words on stone written by lightning and fire (like Moses getting the Ten Commandments in the movie)..and be like a hologram whatever..in the SKY 24/7...NO HUMAN could burn it..deface it..desecrate it..tear it....in any way..then may be..just maybe..I will beleive the dawah man...OTHERWISE..it simply meets HUMAN STANDARDS...nothing more or less:soccersingh:.
 

choochoochan

SPNer
Nov 4, 2013
75
30
IF it is so fantastic that it cant be written by human hands..then it shouldnt use paper..ink..human language..it should mysteriously hover in mid air or turn into words on stone written by lightning and fire (like Moses getting the Ten Commandments in the movie)..and be like a hologram whatever..in the SKY 24/7...NO HUMAN could burn it..deface it..desecrate it..tear it....in any way..then may be..just maybe..I will beleive the dawah man...OTHERWISE..it simply meets HUMAN STANDARDS...nothing more or less:soccersingh:.
The verses, as Muslims believe were read out aloud to Muhammad by Gabriel. Muhammad was then commanded to recite them to the people. They were then recorded onto paper, or whatever surface which was capable of being written by those who heard Muhammad. The challenge in the Quran is to produce such verses, as in come up with them, not to pen them down.

Anyway, the point is, you don't have to believe the Dawah Man or any other Muslim. What you should not do is, to refer to this Quranic challenge as "silly". It's as simple as saying God is silly for having given such a challenge, which is insulting. You can simply say. Oh alright. Hey, i don't believe in that. By calling it "silly" is not something i would deem as being respectful to Muslims and their belief.
 
Jul 1, 2012
35
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whatever but when ever i see people of islamic faith trying to put superiority over others by telling that quaran has this challange or that challange or islam is the real deen n all others are man made or quaran is the final word of god with authentication n bla bla bla....i really feel pitty on them. i have many muslim friends n except one or two of them almost all have this problem that one day or other they will try to put their faith above urs. .. the problem with the people of other faiths is that they never try to fully read and understand their own religions where as most (not all) of muslims read their scriptures not with the intention of getting close to god but with the intention of making arguments/ dawaahs to others. that's why we can see internet full of sites like dawaah to sikhs, islam only true religion, prophet mohammed only true prophet n all others are false....n...so on.....list is just unending... As per me i consider such people spiritually blind...
when i read gurbani i get a feeling n nature of not talking un-necessary, not indulging in slandering n likewise.... but i can see what the effect of reading quran has on its readers (sorry this is harsh statement but true).

n dere is one saying that to counter one's arguments you have to come to his level of mentality (but in this case i have to come to lower level). so am coming dudes....

1. quran is last n final word of god: all of us know prophet jee never have a direct contact with god n all the quran was revealed to him by an angel (i.e. a 2nd person or a middle man). so when you have a middle man in communication there is ever chance of its being wrong n further more when god has to do such a important job of providing mankind a final n last word of his....why he'll bank on a middle man/ angel....why not he himself communicated with prophet jee?? now come to guru granth sahib jee n gurus. guru granth sahib jee never clams to be last n final word of god coz. only fools can boast soo as by telling this you are directly telling that this is the final limit of god or u've found the limit of the limitless god. on many occasions it is written in guru granth sahib jee that the baani (shabad) is directly from god (no angels/ middle man).

2. when quaranic revelations came to prophet jee he used to suffer from fits i.e. he was not aware of what he used to speak from his mouth during that particular time. where as when shabad/ baani used to come from god my beloved guru nanak used to ask bhai mardana jee....mardanna play the beautiful tune from ur rabaab...baani is coming..... d difference is clear n i do'nt think i need to explain more...

3. most of muslims say quaran is real n final word of god coz. everyone can easily remember whole of it which one can not do wid other scriptures..... i say you can also remember the abcd booklet of nursery class kids but can not even remember one single chapter of my internal medicine book....

4. islam is true deen thts why it is fastest growing religion in world: well buddies i think quality should matter more than quantity. this is very common term used by muslims to woo the people of other faiths. on one such instance my friend from kashmir also told me the same n i just asked him can he kindly provide me the significance of this line that islam is fastest growing religion of world with bla bla bla conversions a day/year. he told i can not... n... i replied this is the natural intention (fidratt) of humans to get wooed towards wrong. most of us get easily wooed towards wrong but run away from good n truth. like wise if islam is really a great religion (which i think it is) n so many people are converting to it from other faiths (which according to most of islamist are false faiths) than there must be exciting good results also. my friend questioned me what type of results??? n i told when soo many people from wrong faith comes to a good faith all over the world than there must me increase in love, goodness and prosperity as a whole on earth but the results are surprisingly opposite with increase in hatred, violence, wrongful deeds n so on....n my muslim friend was just tightlipped n struck... i told him that sikhs never ask others for conversion n even do'nt bother about their less numbers coz. only few have courage to walk on the true path...

5. quran has d challenge that no one can produce this or that chapter or verse: according to my thinking n mentality if a 10th class child will come to me n challenge me that i can not write an essay/ poem as he has written... my response will be simple.....dear kid you are right....i can not write an essay/ poem the way you have written it coz. thats what is ur caliber/ standard. i have my own caliber/ standard n the challenge you are providing is not worth for me now....may be i would have accepted it n produced an essay/ poem/verse if you had come to me when i was in 10th standrd....those who make challenges are in reallity doubtfull of their own worth that after reading it will people accept it??? where as truth never put challenges coz. wether you challenge or not, wether one accepts or not.....truth will remain truth.

6. once i was reading english version of quran n i was surprised to read that 1st 100 lines/verses are totally hell bent on Christians n jews. more over an interesting point to note is that there is always reference of we (angels) instead of i (had really god dictated it). n i asked one of the muslims why quran has soo strong wordings against jews...he told me that they had a hand in killing Jesus (who according to quran was never dead n is resting in paradise n will again land on earth just prior to day of judgement). i thought that if some jews killed jeseus n now all of them are now bound to go to hell coz. of this......what if sikhism also goes in this way.......i mean....if afgans, turks n mughals did such horrible things does it mean that all the muslims in future will also go to hell???


n there are loads of queries n rebuttals for islam but after writing only this much my head is really aching as if i am in some fish market.........all such low level of queries/talks /challenges are not at par with spiritual standard of real sikhs....(in in process of writing this comment i am feeling that i've lowered my standard). but it is sometimes (not always n routinely) necessary. gurfatehh...
 
Apr 12, 2007
351
262
I think the biggest problem with other religions especially the Abrahamic religions is this; they all want to prove that they are better then other religions and everything else out there. Where as Sikhism does not and this does not seem to make sense to them, they have in there own warped sense and minds and understandings got other religions down as a form of competition, that Sikhism does not conform to. It is there own misunderstanding on god that needs upgrading really! No one else's problem just they are not understanding god correctly! Another question I would like to ask other religions is this; after the creation of there religions and messages why have there religions not created people enlightened to the same depths of spiritual understanding that was created at the start of them; is their something wrong in there messages? In Sikhism after Guru Nanak there was a creation of 10 other guru's with the same level of spirituality as the man that started the religion so what have the other religions learned? As after the guidance the Guru's gave the only point left is self realisation=(Soul). I can not say that there is a higher par of religions but when the message is to better yourself then on what point have these other religions tried to improve themselves? Sikhism has died, fed, helped other people of other religions when needed as we see everyone as Sikh's no one is better! Other religions cause these differences and promote they are better by making others look bad, how? When really it makes your own understanding and religion look bad nothing else, as you are following your message which if based on morals, shows the approach you are following.

The entire Guru Granth Sahib ji is based on Ek Onkar from there on many words are used to describe the true essence of god. So the entire Guru Granth Sahib ji is based on many rhetorical devises just as the bible is based on many attributes of god and so is the Quran! So to say if something is better or worse on a rhetorical device would be a challenge that all religions have passed and are on par with each other! As they are all just forming many different descriptions on the creator on many different levels to get to the same meaning that there is only one god; we are all the same=learning-sikhs!

In rhetoric, a rhetorical device or resource of language is a technique that an author or speaker uses to convey to the listener or reader a meaning with the goal of persuading him or her towards considering a topic from a different perspective, using sentences designed to encourage or provoke a rational argument from an emotional display of a given perspective or action. Note that although rhetorical devices may be used to evoke an emotional response in the audience, this is not their primary purpose.
 

NavKaur

SPNer
Jun 18, 2014
10
20
The Singhji, Jagraj Singh actually cleared his point on another Sikhi forum, he was on the spot, he was just standing around when Dawahman approached him, I think he did well with what he had. He does acknowledge he was with mistake.
 

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Shabad Vichaar by SPN'ers

The shabd under discussion in this article is composed by Guru Teg Bahadur ji and is contained on Page 633 of the SGGS. The complete shabd is as follows:

ਸੋਰਿਠ ਮਹਲਾ ੯॥...​

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