Dasam Granth And Its History
- Thread starter kds1980
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International Akaali
SPNer
why do you have to hide behind so many different aliases?
why can't i learn about my faith in my mother tongue? why must i read everything in punjabi? do you think Guru Nanak Dev ji tried to speak in punjabi to the arabs in Mecca? or in Tibet? or do you believe in sakhis?
you speak english very well, you obviously feel you're very intelligent and have great understanding of gurbani. why can't you explain it to those of us with lesser intellect and understanding? wait, let me guess, you don't have time.
i have tried to address each of your points that i felt comfortable addressing. i don't usually answer questions i do not know the answer to. i think that is fair.
so if you'd like to teach us poor stupid western sikhs anything, please attempt to do so using english. or if you want to be a punjabi elitist snob, write us off as unable to understand.
btw, are you the same person who said that western sikhs are incapable of understanding gurbani? i can't remember.
they're not similar posts, they're identical. even to the point of refusing to explain because you "don't have time to explain" or "you can't understand punjabi so there's no point".
you need multiple IDs because you're trying to make it look like other sikhs agree with you, when you're clearly in a tiny minority.
fateh!
quick question for khalsa fauj/akali...
which gurdwara do you attend which goes directly against akal takht and teaches this heresy? i'd like to be sure to stay away from it.
First of all i would like to say i am born in canada and english is my first language i learned in school. On the side i was grown up speaking punjabi in my family. I was not taught in school how to read and write or speak punjabi. Rather i took the intiative to read write and speak punjabi because the fact sahib shri guru granth sahib is written in gurmukhi script. My guru gave me gur shabad in roop of gurmukhi and it is my duty to take the duty of learning the "tounge" of my guru.
For you to accuse me of saying western sikhs are not capable of understanding gurbani is absurd as i am a western sikh myself.
The questions I am going to pose for you are going to be pointless to post because you are just going to ignore them. So what is the point? I do not think i am intelligent or anything like that but how much intelligence does it take to figure out guru gobind singhs character is being tarnisherd by this so called "dasam granth".
If you have pyaar in your heart for your guru then you will stand up against those who call this bani of guru sahib.
Shereb ji, if you do not know one word of punjabi i strongly suggest you start learning... this means no offence or anything. As jasleen keeps refering to akal takht maryada please refer to that for what is akal takht maryada is saying regarding learning gurmukhi.
You can say you don't know anything know but ask yourself how much intitive you have taken to learn gurmukhi and if yes then good and if not set goals for yourself.
Jasleen if you want translations pleask ask. There are a bunch already on the internet i can give you links too. in english
fateh
The Khalsa Fauj
SPNer
- Dec 1, 2006
- 315
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Waheguru. Why is he being labeled Khalsa Fauj? Like that is jusy dumb. I am not International Akali, he is. I am the Khalsa Fauj. What a scene this is.
Gurudwara name is Dixie in Toronto. There are lots of anti-dasam granth Sikhs in Toronto. Thanks to awakening which Waheguru has caused through parchar and hard work.
We don't have control over Dixie Gurudwara but we hold meetings and stuff in rooms there as it is the biggest Gurudwara in North America I think.
International Akali comes there to learn Gurmat. International Akali's name is Randeep Singh while my name is Harmanjit Singh. If someone still has doubts and wants proof, msn is the best friend. We are not the same people. Why does everyone who oppose dasam granth get labeled "khalsa fauj"? Come on guys. Wake up, realize the facts. There are 13 organizations presently in Punjab which are against Dasam Granth. Biggest ones are Dasam Granth Vichar Manch International and Gurmat Missionary College Delhi.
Reason why International Akali has little time is because he goes to University and I don't have much time because I am working on some projects and go to work. Two days off aren't much. I was off today and just came back from playing hockey.
I only use 1 identity on each website and it is always The Khalsa Fauj. There is no shame but greatness in admitting truth that dasam granth is anti-Gurmat.
Gurudwara name is Dixie in Toronto. There are lots of anti-dasam granth Sikhs in Toronto. Thanks to awakening which Waheguru has caused through parchar and hard work.
We don't have control over Dixie Gurudwara but we hold meetings and stuff in rooms there as it is the biggest Gurudwara in North America I think.
International Akali comes there to learn Gurmat. International Akali's name is Randeep Singh while my name is Harmanjit Singh. If someone still has doubts and wants proof, msn is the best friend. We are not the same people. Why does everyone who oppose dasam granth get labeled "khalsa fauj"? Come on guys. Wake up, realize the facts. There are 13 organizations presently in Punjab which are against Dasam Granth. Biggest ones are Dasam Granth Vichar Manch International and Gurmat Missionary College Delhi.
Reason why International Akali has little time is because he goes to University and I don't have much time because I am working on some projects and go to work. Two days off aren't much. I was off today and just came back from playing hockey.
I only use 1 identity on each website and it is always The Khalsa Fauj. There is no shame but greatness in admitting truth that dasam granth is anti-Gurmat.
What are the views of anti dasam granth on following sawaiya
SWAYYA
ਜਾਗਤਿ ਜੋਤ ਜਪੈ ਨਿਸ ਬਾਸੁਰ ਏਕ ਬਿਨਾ ਮਨ ਨੈਕ ਨ ਆਨੈ ॥ ਪੂਰਨ ਪ੍ਰੇਮ ਪ੍ਰਤੀਤ ਸਜੈ ਬ੍ਰਤ ਗੋਰ ਮੜੀ ਮਟ ਭੂਲ ਨ ਮਾਨੈ ॥
जागति जोत जपै निस बासुर एक बिना मन नैक न आनै ॥ पूरन प्रेम प्रतीत सजै ब्रत गोर मड़ी मट भूल न मानै ॥
He is the true Khalsa (Sikh), who remembers the ever-awakened Light throughout night and day and does not bring anyone else in the mind; he practices his vow with whole heated affection and does not believe in even by oversight, the graves, Hindu monuments and monasteries;
ਤੀਰਥ ਦਾਨ ਦਇਆ ਤਪ ਸੰਜਮ ਏਕ ਬਿਨਾ ਨਹ ਏਕ ਪਛਾਨੈ ॥ ਪੂਰਨ ਜੋਤ ਜਗੈ ਘਟ ਮੈ ਤਬ ਖਾਲਸ ਤਾਹਿ ਨਖਾਲਸ ਜਾਨੈ ॥੧॥
तीरथ दान दइआ तप संजम एक बिना नह एक पछानै ॥ पूरन जोत जगै घट मै तब खालस ताहि नखालस जानै ॥१॥
He does not recognize anyone else except One Lord, not even the bestowal of charities, performance of merciful acts, austerities and restraint on pilgrim-stations; the perfect light of the Lord illuminates his heart, then consider him as the immaculate Khalsa.1.
SWAYYA
ਜਾਗਤਿ ਜੋਤ ਜਪੈ ਨਿਸ ਬਾਸੁਰ ਏਕ ਬਿਨਾ ਮਨ ਨੈਕ ਨ ਆਨੈ ॥ ਪੂਰਨ ਪ੍ਰੇਮ ਪ੍ਰਤੀਤ ਸਜੈ ਬ੍ਰਤ ਗੋਰ ਮੜੀ ਮਟ ਭੂਲ ਨ ਮਾਨੈ ॥
जागति जोत जपै निस बासुर एक बिना मन नैक न आनै ॥ पूरन प्रेम प्रतीत सजै ब्रत गोर मड़ी मट भूल न मानै ॥
He is the true Khalsa (Sikh), who remembers the ever-awakened Light throughout night and day and does not bring anyone else in the mind; he practices his vow with whole heated affection and does not believe in even by oversight, the graves, Hindu monuments and monasteries;
ਤੀਰਥ ਦਾਨ ਦਇਆ ਤਪ ਸੰਜਮ ਏਕ ਬਿਨਾ ਨਹ ਏਕ ਪਛਾਨੈ ॥ ਪੂਰਨ ਜੋਤ ਜਗੈ ਘਟ ਮੈ ਤਬ ਖਾਲਸ ਤਾਹਿ ਨਖਾਲਸ ਜਾਨੈ ॥੧॥
तीरथ दान दइआ तप संजम एक बिना नह एक पछानै ॥ पूरन जोत जगै घट मै तब खालस ताहि नखालस जानै ॥१॥
He does not recognize anyone else except One Lord, not even the bestowal of charities, performance of merciful acts, austerities and restraint on pilgrim-stations; the perfect light of the Lord illuminates his heart, then consider him as the immaculate Khalsa.1.
- Apr 4, 2007
- 934
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The Khalsa Fauj
SPNer
- Dec 1, 2006
- 315
- 186
We are only brainwashed by Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Is that a bad thing? If yes, please tell me how.
- Apr 4, 2007
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i was referring to the heretic kala afghana.
i try to stay away from tankhaiya myself.
i talked to some friends from Dixie Gurdwara... they told me all about your "group" (all 5-10 of you :rofl!!
Jasleen Kaur ji,i was referring to the heretic kala afghana.
i try to stay away from tankhaiya myself.
i talked to some friends from Dixie Gurdwara... they told me all about your "group" (all 5-10 of you :rofl!!
Have you ever been to Waco, Texas?
My dad was born there in the 50-60s.
Had to ask.
- Apr 4, 2007
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Jasleen Kaur ji,
Have you ever been to Waco, Texas?
My dad was born there in the 50-60s.
Had to ask.
lol... nope, but i see the sign all the time.
International Akaali
SPNer
Singh Sabha International Canada - Articles
one article please read some translations. I don't associate myself with any kind of group but only group of guru.
Guru granth sahib ji is supreme, i am sorry if i am trying to be a sikh of guru granth sahib. Is this what you want me to say?
Lets not get personal and stay on topic.
Fateh
one article please read some translations. I don't associate myself with any kind of group but only group of guru.
Guru granth sahib ji is supreme, i am sorry if i am trying to be a sikh of guru granth sahib. Is this what you want me to say?
Lets not get personal and stay on topic.
Fateh
- Apr 4, 2007
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thank you, it's an entertain read, but i'm not interested in propaganda. singh sabha international canada is a known anti-dasam granth propaganda machine run by the heretic Ghagga.
lest there be any confusion (and i'm sure the name is intended to bring about confusion) it is not affiliated with the better known Singh Sabha movement in India or with the Singh Sabha gurdwaras in the US. Ghagga's "singh sabha" has been denounced and ghagga and kala afghana are banned from the premises of most US and Canadian Gurdwaras. not to mention the fact that they are too cowardly to even enter India, even after being summoned by akal takht.
check the websites they link to:
kala afghana
fateh publications (Ghagga's site)
spokesman (publisher of this magazine is excommunicated from the panth, another kala afghana supporter)
the sikh buletin (reading the editorial on the first page shows that they're clearly in the kala afghana/ghagga camp)
though i do thank you for the link. the articles are fascinating, if a bit shocking. i didn't realize you guys are also against Giani Sant Maskeen ji, Harbajan Singh Yogi, Bhai Randir Singh ji, 3HO, AKJ, and Nanaksar. i never realized that using a mala to aid in recitation of mantras/banis/naam simran was "idol worship" before i read this site.
it was interesting to learn that Guru Nanak Dev ji never entered the river Beas. i'm still going through the articles to see what other fascinating propaganda they're distributing.
fateh!
The Khalsa Fauj
SPNer
- Dec 1, 2006
- 315
- 186
We don't have 5-10 people. We got lots more than that. 5-10 are the main guys. Hahahaha! Singhsabhacanada.com is a wicked site. It exposes fakes and promotes Guru Granth Sahib Ji. I don't know about Ghagga not being allowed on stages because Ghagga recently gave a speech on stage controlled by Gyani Joginder Singh Vedanti who is Jathaydar Akaal Takht. If you don't believe me, ask newspapers from Punjab.
drkhalsa
SPNer
- Sep 16, 2004
- 1,308
- 54
Dear
International Akali's ( Randeep Singh)
Khalsa Fauj(Harmanjit Singh.)
Thanks for your efforts online and offline as well.
I appreciate the work you are doing ( Although I know little ..)
from what I have understood that your observations and understanding tell you that Dasam Granth is Anti Gurmat .
You might also know that this views of yours are held by Minority in Sikh Population and there are many others who believe otherwise and you have every right to believe that you and your friends are right or may be blessed with your right Thinking .
In my observation everybody on the spirtual journey is blessed with the different understand as the journey goes on and things become more clear as the God want it to be .
So my request is just that you may be having better understanding of the gurmat but there should be no reason for any body to believe that their version is superior I dont think its going to help anybody and I saying this for both Anti Dasam Granth and Pro Dasam Granth .
The best we could do is let the others know what your veiw point is and I thinki you have done a good job there .
Thanks
Jatinder Singh
International Akali's ( Randeep Singh)
Khalsa Fauj(Harmanjit Singh.)
Thanks for your efforts online and offline as well.
I appreciate the work you are doing ( Although I know little ..)
from what I have understood that your observations and understanding tell you that Dasam Granth is Anti Gurmat .
You might also know that this views of yours are held by Minority in Sikh Population and there are many others who believe otherwise and you have every right to believe that you and your friends are right or may be blessed with your right Thinking .
In my observation everybody on the spirtual journey is blessed with the different understand as the journey goes on and things become more clear as the God want it to be .
So my request is just that you may be having better understanding of the gurmat but there should be no reason for any body to believe that their version is superior I dont think its going to help anybody and I saying this for both Anti Dasam Granth and Pro Dasam Granth .
The best we could do is let the others know what your veiw point is and I thinki you have done a good job there .
Thanks
Jatinder Singh
- Jul 14, 2007
- 4,576
- 1,609
Would anyone care to review and comment what this guy's saying ?
Is he anti-dasam granth ?
YouTube - Sri Dasam Granth Sahib Ji Seminar - Prof Devinder Singh
Is he anti-dasam granth ?
YouTube - Sri Dasam Granth Sahib Ji Seminar - Prof Devinder Singh
International Akaali
SPNer
thank you, it's an entertain read, but i'm not interested in propaganda. singh sabha international canada is a known anti-dasam granth propaganda machine run by the heretic Ghagga.
lest there be any confusion (and i'm sure the name is intended to bring about confusion) it is not affiliated with the better known Singh Sabha movement in India or with the Singh Sabha gurdwaras in the US. Ghagga's "singh sabha" has been denounced and ghagga and kala afghana are banned from the premises of most US and Canadian Gurdwaras. not to mention the fact that they are too cowardly to even enter India, even after being summoned by akal takht.
check the websites they link to:
kala afghana
fateh publications (Ghagga's site)
spokesman (publisher of this magazine is excommunicated from the panth, another kala afghana supporter)
the sikh buletin (reading the editorial on the first page shows that they're clearly in the kala afghana/ghagga camp)
though i do thank you for the link. the articles are fascinating, if a bit shocking. i didn't realize you guys are also against Giani Sant Maskeen ji, Harbajan Singh Yogi, Bhai Randir Singh ji, 3HO, AKJ, and Nanaksar. i never realized that using a mala to aid in recitation of mantras/banis/naam simran was "idol worship" before i read this site.
i'm still going through the articles to see what other fascinating propaganda they're distributing.
fateh!
Jasleen kaur,
How can you find such writings such as dasam granth as entertaining? Those articles dont give you any sort of hurt when you read that this is in the name of guru gobind singh. Why are you talking about political stuff we are talking about dasam granth here the topic is not Prof. Inder Singh Ghaagga and not Gurbuksh Singh Kala Afghana. Its not like you have ever read eithers works so how can you even be constructive in there writings.
Follow only Guru granth sahib ji and not some so called sants. Please refer to guru granth sahib ji:
Please refer to gurshabad for the following for the views of guru sahib on mala.
Matai Tilak Haat Mala bana
Logan Raam Khilona Jana
Page 1148
Translation:
You have tilak on your head, your holding a mala in your hand.
People have considred your raam as a game.
Simple translation.
This incorporates with us sikhs too we see sadhs and so called sants wearing malas over there hands when guru sahib is clear on what he thinks of mala. We have even given guru sahib a mala in various pictures that have been dipicting his image. Which is Contry to in gur shabad.
- Apr 4, 2007
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Jasleen kaur,
it's not dasam granth that's so entertaining, it's the way the article are written. they sound like brainwashed babbling.
i do, thanks.
so because guru criticizes a hypocritical brahman and mentions the word mala, then no sikh should ever use one?
can you post the complete shabad? i can't seem to find it on the page you mentioned.
i can find a shabad to prove or disprove anything. read the WHOLE shabad for meaning, not just one line. understand the context, the history, don't base your religion on a line here and a line there.
you guys take everything so literally. next thing you know you'll be trying to erase the word raam and bhagat bani from SGGS for being "pro hindu".
the funny thing is... i haven't done enough personal research and study to say whether i believe the WHOLE thing is bani of the 10th master. though i respect the opinions of the historians and scholars who have...
but i cannot sit here while people insult amrit banis, Guru Gobind Singh ji, Akal Takht, and Amrit Sanchar itself. so i guess i'll learn more and more in order to show that this kala afghana cult is simply wrong.
ok guys, it's been educational, but i guess it's probably a pointless discussion to have with kala afghana follwers, so i think i'll stop discussing dasam granth and concentrate on improving my life.
(bowing out gracefully)
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The Khalsa Fauj
SPNer
- Dec 1, 2006
- 315
- 186
There are no kala afgana followers here. This is your misconception. Also, Bhagat Bani is not pro Hindu at all. You have been fed this information to spread propaganda against GurSikhs who oppose dasam granth. Bhagat Bani rejects Hinduvaad and promotes Gurmat. Who told you that bhagat bani is pro Hindu? This is a blatant lie and I know this comment came from someone else and not you. I also know who this comment came from but I won't mention name here. Ram means rammeyaa meaning prevading in all. Not some Ram Chandar who had issues with Ravan.
It is not only using one line, but also interpreting the line which is important. Some people make aarths into anarths and make it seem as if Gurbani contradicts. Some fools even place a question mark on mool mantar with their interpretations. Interpretations of Gurbani have to be based on Gurmat and so that it doesn't contradict mool mantar. E.g. If mool mantar says God has no shape then there should be no translations saying God has conch, etc. etc.
It is not only using one line, but also interpreting the line which is important. Some people make aarths into anarths and make it seem as if Gurbani contradicts. Some fools even place a question mark on mool mantar with their interpretations. Interpretations of Gurbani have to be based on Gurmat and so that it doesn't contradict mool mantar. E.g. If mool mantar says God has no shape then there should be no translations saying God has conch, etc. etc.
The thread is meant to enhance the knowledge about Dasam Granth.Personally speaking I would have great respect for this.But the problem is that there is no site from where one can download it and read it with english translation. Anyone can advise.It should not only be in gurmukhi but should have english translation as well.
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