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Why Can't Sikhs Excommunicate Patit Sikhs?

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palaingtha

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Aug 28, 2012
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In Sikhism the most important of the five Kakkars is "one will never cut,trim or remove hairs of his body".And any Sikh guilty of this part of ethic is a PATIT, i.e. a fallen one. Nowadays Sikhs especially in Punjab villages are cutting off or have already shorn their hairs of head. In Punjab it is due lack of SIKHI PRACHAR. When a Sikh attains prosperity in life he sheds his hairs of his head sending Sikh ethics to the winds. Guru Gobind Singh Ji has strictly prohibited Sikhs to have any contact with a Patit Sikh.
When we retain relations with a Patjt Sikh we should ask ourselves "Are we obeying Guru's Hukam"?
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

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1. How could they be "fallen"when they DID NOT "stand up" in the First place ?? One cannot FALL sitting down....its impossible.

2. IF somebody Falls..its his/her business. we can help him to stand up..or NOT...but we shouldnt stand by and "berate him..call him names..scold him..look down on him..scorn him...it shows our own HAUMAII..Holier than Thou attitude...which really hurts US more than them...

3. A person can be born a sikh...( in a Sikh Family)..and IF he doenst appreciate this and get better...into a KHALSA..thats his CHOICE....EVERY CHILD gets to go to School..BUT only a few EXCEL...we dont berate the failures, the drop outs..the slow learners..those who refuse to become PHd.s...we ENCOURAGE..YES..we MOTIVATE..YES..we LOVE...YES...we BEFRIEND..YES..we do parchaar...YES...But we DONT CONDEMN..NO.

4. The enxt time a BABA like Dhadriwallah comes to UK/Canada etc..SEND HIM PACKING...tell him to try parchaar in PUNJAB...only when the whole PUJAB is KHALSA should they come out of Punjab.. PARCHAAR BEGINS AT HOME...not in UK/Toronto or Vancouver...in Patiala, Amrtisar, Ludhiana..12,000 Villages not WEST...
 

Randip Singh

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In Sikhism the most important of the five Kakkars is "one will never cut,trim or remove hairs of his body".And any Sikh guilty of this part of ethic is a PATIT, i.e. a fallen one. Nowadays Sikhs especially in Punjab villages are cutting off or have already shorn their hairs of head. In Punjab it is due lack of SIKHI PRACHAR. When a Sikh attains prosperity in life he sheds his hairs of his head sending Sikh ethics to the winds. Guru Gobind Singh Ji has strictly prohibited Sikhs to have any contact with a Patit Sikh.
When we retain relations with a Patjt Sikh we should ask ourselves "Are we obeying Guru's Hukam"?
There are what is known as Sehajdhari Sikhs or slow adopters. There is no compulsion or Sikhs to take Amrit and never should be. Neither should their be anomisity against thos who have not. By doing such this we'll just create a type of Sikh "Brahmin".
 

Searching

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Aug 8, 2011
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Why have I never heard anyone say that why don't we excommunicate Sikhs who wear Jockey instead of Kachera?
Or lets excommunicate Sikhs who do not keep Kangha?

It is sad that many among our youth have decided to get rid of our religious identity but still we can't "enforce" it on them.
If anything at all, we need to bring them back to the Sikh values by active prachar or some other means not excommunicate them.
 

Luckysingh

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This means that I am a patit sikh because my hair has been cut.
Therfore I am already a fallen sikh, even though I never stood up as one!!

We are ALL rising all the time to be able to stand as sikhs.
Why don't we just call all the sikhs with cut hair as outcasts or better still call them hindus! - Because we are just living in the same brahmin caste manner.

I'm sorry to say this but this is One Stupid argument for a thread.
Complete waste of time!
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

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This means that I am a patit sikh because my hair has been cut.
Therfore I am already a fallen sikh, even though I never stood up as one!!

We are ALL rising all the time to be able to stand as sikhs.
Why don't we just call all the sikhs with cut hair as outcasts or better still call them hindus! - Because we are just living in the same brahmin caste manner.

I'm sorry to say this but this is One Stupid argument for a thread.
Complete waste of time!

EXACTLY Lucky Singh ji..

But then we cannot "STOP" sikhs excommunicating other "sikhs"...we cant stop sikhs cutting hair..keeping hair...marrying one ..keeping another as spare...we cant stop sikhs form reading the sggs...at home..in their bedroom..in their library..in the Public Library..on the bus..in the hotel room... ( Satikaar) we cant stop other "sikhs" who dont want to read sggs but just have darshan/matha tek to it as a closed book..(SHARDHA)...

BUT we can..start threads..we can argue...but forget thats whats not required..whats REQUIRED is LIVING GURBANI....becoming GURBANI SIKHS...GURMUKHS that can Face the GURU with Honour..... I may be WRONG..But I am not sure I can FACE my GURU with Honour after I slapped a "sikh" for not washing his hands before he touched a GUTKA...or scolding a Sikh for not covering his head in Langgar hall..etc etc.....I would ADVISE.....I would LOVE...explain...persuade...and LEAVE it at THAT.
 

palaingtha

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Aug 28, 2012
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1. How could they be "fallen"when they DID NOT "stand up" in the First place ?? One cannot FALL sitting down....its impossible.

2. IF somebody Falls..its his/her business. we can help him to stand up..or NOT...but we shouldnt stand by and "berate him..call him names..scold him..look down on him..scorn him...it shows our own HAUMAII..Holier than Thou attitude...which really hurts US more than them...

3. A person can be born a sikh...( in a Sikh Family)..and IF he doenst appreciate this and get better...into a KHALSA..thats his CHOICE....EVERY CHILD gets to go to School..BUT only a few EXCEL...we dont berate the failures, the drop outs..the slow learners..those who refuse to become PHd.s...we ENCOURAGE..YES..we MOTIVATE..YES..we LOVE...YES...we BEFRIEND..YES..we do parchaar...YES...But we DONT CONDEMN..NO.

4. The enxt time a BABA like Dhadriwallah comes to UK/Canada etc..SEND HIM PACKING...tell him to try parchaar in PUNJAB...only when the whole PUJAB is KHALSA should they come out of Punjab.. PARCHAAR BEGINS AT HOME...not in UK/Toronto or Vancouver...in Patiala, Amrtisar, Ludhiana..12,000 Villages not WEST...
My reply is addressed to Giani Jarnail Singh Ji and those who have shown appreciation of above post.

A person was born in a Sikh family and his parents brought him up as a Sikh. Now when this Sikh cuts his hair and becomes a "SIRGUM", i.e.(Keshdhari ho ke kesh kata dewai viz. a Sikh with hair intact cuts his hair) That person is Patit as per SRM. SRM requires of all the Sikhs to excommunicate a Patit.
Any Sikh who retains any communications is declared to be "TANKHIA"
Now it is up to you to go by SRM or become a Tankhaia by your MANMAT stance.
Otherwise also if a person belonging to an institution has to obey that institution's code of ethics of his profession or his society. When he infringes this ethics/rule of conduct he is removed from the institution or society.
Instead of giving irrelevant replies I expect to learn from you where I am wrong in my reply hereof.
 

palaingtha

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Aug 28, 2012
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"Why can't Sikhs excommunicate [...] Sikhs?"
If you acknowledge that they are also Sikhs, why would you want to excommunicate them? That makes no sense.
My reply:-

I am not advocating to excommunicate people who cut their hairs at large. I am only pointing that when a Sikh with hair at one time cuts his hair SRM requires of all Sikhs not to have any communication with such person who is declared as Patit.

I have read a story when I was in third standard.

A junglee dog was trapped in a trap set up be a hunter in a jungle. The dog tried to free itself and while doing so it cut it's tail in the process. All other dogs laughed at it. At this it told the other dogs that it was very convenient with this stub of a tail. And further advised them to cutoff their lengthy tails.

Don't you think a Patit Sikh will want other Sikhs go his way. That will be against the Sikh interests.
 

palaingtha

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Aug 28, 2012
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"Why can't Sikhs excommunicate [...] Sikhs?"
If you acknowledge that they are also Sikhs, why would you want to excommunicate them? That makes no sense.
My reply:-
A person born and brought as a Sikh in a Sikh family was a Sikh before he cuts his hair. SRM requires such person to be excommunicated. I am not talking about any person, but about a person who was a Sikh and became Patit.
 

palaingtha

SPNer
Aug 28, 2012
270
295
89
Why have I never heard anyone say that why don't we excommunicate Sikhs who wear Jockey instead of Kachera?
Or lets excommunicate Sikhs who do not keep Kangha?

It is sad that many among our youth have decided to get rid of our religious identity but still we can't "enforce" it on them.
If anything at all, we need to bring them back to the Sikh values by active prachar or some other means not excommunicate them.

My reply:-

The SRM was prepared after much deliberations by learned Sikh from across the entire world. It was drafted in accordance of Sikh tenets/Guru Gobind Singh Ji's aspiration about his Sikh.
Do you think your views are more precious than the draftees of SRM? No my dear. We have to go by SRM.
 
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