Why Are My Animals More Sikh Than Me?

a animal/gods gift to humanity

is not full of ego, want or desire, does not preach or proclaim falsehood, a friend for life and gives love unconditionally - I agree animals are better sikhs - HUMANS have a lot to learn before they can meet the Universal creator, who sustains and provides all life be it big or small, plant or animal - love equally and accept you are here for only a small fraction of time to play in this Circus we call our life!

May god bless you all
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
Randipji

I agree that Reason should have improved on what animals have achieved in the way of consonance, however it has not, it has made things worse, where reason should have made us realise what we are doing to our planet and our bodies, instead reason and intelligence just allows us to cheat the system.

your two points

Animals mate with whoever-I could say this is ensuring the species continues, animals do not live as humans do, also, I am pretty sure there are only a few species that procreate for fun or pleasure

Animals gorge themselves-again this is survival, we live surrounded by fridges full of food, animals have a survival instinct, I am pretty sure they do not gorge beyond what they need, or indeed there would be more fat animals.

I argue that our reason is a two sided sword, it can be used to raise ourselves above animals in the spirit of truth, honesty and sharing, or it can be used to cheat the system, allowing us to act in any way we want, and the use our wisdom to change the effects of consonance.

Look at all the huge amount of money spent on cosmetic surgery, heart bypasses for unhealthy people, diabetic treatment for people who ate too much chocolate, in fact any surgery for ailments that have been caused by lifestyle, that is our way of cheating, of living against consonance and having the resources to change fate, good reason would be to use all these resources for a cure against say cancer, or feed the hungry, or ensure everyone on this planet has the tools and resources to fulfill his or her potential, most animals have this luxury, a lot of humans do not, and the ones that do, fritter it away on the thieves


Ofcourse "Reason" is a two sided sword. Just as it can be used to justify that one should behave as a human, it can be justified to behave like an animals. We have that choice, and we as humans are the only species on this planet that has that choice.

We can kill for pleasure, for survival, for food or whatever, for resources. We have a choice. We have reason.

Animals have no choice. They kill for food. They kill for territory. Some even for pleasure (my cat a good example).

They operate on instinct and pre-programme. We have the ability to overide that instinct and that programme. That is why animals are not good Sikhs. They will never learn to be better, wheras we as humans can, will and do learn to be better.

On page 50 of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji it states:

sireeraag mehlaa 5 ghar 2.

go-il aa-i-aa go-ilee ki-aa tis damf pasaar.
muhlat punnee chalnaa tooN sampal ghar baar.
har gun gaa-o manaa satgur sayv pi-aar.
ki-aa thorh-rhee baat gumaan. rahaa-o.
jaisay rain paraahunay uth chalsahi parbhaat.
ki-aa tooN rataa girsat si-o sabh fulaa kee baagaat.
mayree mayree ki-aa karahi jin dee-aa so parabh lorh.
sarpar uthee chalnaa chhad jaasee lakh karorh.
lakh cha-oraaseeh bharmati-aa dulabh janam paa-i-o-ay.
naanak naam samaal tooN so din nayrhaa aa-i-o-ay.

Siree Raag, Fifth Mehl, Second House:
The herdsman comes to the pasture lands-what good are his ostentatious displays here?
When your allotted time is up, you must go. Take care of your real hearth and home.
O mind, sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord, and serve the True Guru with love.
Why do you take pride in trivial matters? Pause
Like an overnight guest, you shall arise and depart in the morning.
Why are you so attached to your household? It is all like flowers in the garden.
Why do you say, "Mine, mine?" Look to God, who has given it to you.
It is certain that you must arise and depart, and leave behind your hundreds of thousands and millions.
Through 8.4 million incarnations you have wandered, to obtain this rare and precious human life.
O Guru Nanak, remember the Naam, the Name of the Lord; the day of departure is drawing near!
Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji

Human life is precious. More precious than other life on this planet. Value it. Cherish it. Nuture it. It then in turn will be an asset to all other life.
 
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kds1980

SPNer
Kdsji

I am absolutely saying that being fat or being ill for certain reasons is in line with nature, allow me to illustrate this with a personal reflection, I am fat, well, ok a bit chubby, not obese, and I have been ill, actually I should be dead, for years I abused my body with all sorts of bad things, bad food, bad drink, other things, to the point where my arteries clogged up, and I ended up needing lifesaving treatment. I should have died, if I was an animal, I had stepped out of order of things, and my body had reacted as it would, I did not die, (obviously), but I should have

Creation is much more than the personality of me, of my needs, my desires, Creation is an all encompassing sum, I am irrelevant, the concept makes great sense until illness happens to you or someone you love, but each time we unclog someones arteries, we are interfering with consonance, animals do not do this, they accept that actions have consequences, it makes their actions more in tune with consonance than ours, as we have 'get out of jail' cards

As for the chinese, trust me, even those that do not speak english are not as passive or uninformed as you may think, alarm bells can ring in chinese as easily as english, many will know in their hearts something is not right, all dissidents are not just english speaking

Harry ji

You abused your body because you were born in developed nation and you had resources You Had treatment because you could had afford it and your country provide it.What about billions of those people which are born in third world or Africa ,they probably could have been dead if they were in your situation.So can I say all those billions of people on earth which are living in various parts of earth are more like animals or living in console with nature because neither they have neither they could afford modern medicine
 

Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Harry ji

You abused your body because you were born in developed nation and you had resources You Had treatment because you could had afford it and your country provide it.What about billions of those people which are born in third world or Africa ,they probably could have been dead if they were in your situation.So can I say all those billions of people on earth which are living in various parts of earth are more like animals or living in console with nature because neither they have neither they could afford modern medicine

Kdsji

I think that is what I am saying, yes, we waste too much money keeping people like me alive, when we should be spending it on those that have illness thrusted on them through no fault of their own,
 

kds1980

SPNer
Kdsji

I think that is what I am saying, yes, we waste too much money keeping people like me alive, when we should be spending it on those that have illness thrusted on them through no fault of their own,

Harry ji

Your logic is quite funny ,by your logic old people which are ill and of around the age of 70 should not be given treatment as almost all doctors know that because of old age they have to die
 

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
Writer
SPNer
Harry ji

Your logic is quite funny ,by your logic old people which are ill and of around the age of 70 should not be given treatment as almost all doctors know that because of old age they have to die
kds1980 ji is it possible that the Human species has lost control of itself? I don't know if recreational sex is all that common in other life forms. I am not sure of asexual life growth like viruses, bacteria, etc.

In such a scenario since humans sustain the ability to keep producing a child every year for many years, do you believe all the births in say India, China and Africa are based on people planning to have kids or having sex?

I don't want to sound elitist but isn't the thought and consequences of having and raising a child come to people when they are having sex?

Any thoughts!

Sat Sri Akal.
 

Ishna

Writer
SPNer
Animals usually have reasons for doing what they do - they just don't have to think about it.

There is a reason why big fat walrus males fight it out on the beach, not because of krodh, but because that's what walruses do, it is survival of the fittest and is how nature evolves things.

Most animals are choosey about who they mate with - they want to mate with the one who puts on the best show, the one that makes the best nest, the one that fights off all the competitors, to ensure the best genes and the survival of the species. There are other animals (like rodents, for example) who mate with whoever whenever wherever but again, that is because it's how they survive as a species.

Other animals, like eagles and magpies, mate with one partner and stay with them. A family of magpies (mum, dad and juvanile) visits my house every day for food. They've been visiting for the past two years, and the mum has a wonky wing but the dad hasn't gotten rid of her in favour of another bird. Aaawe.

Animals usually do what they do because that's what they do, without the trappings of maya in their minds. That might be the difference - awareness of maya? Are animals trapped in a false reality of maya, or are these dense human intellects in love with false reality the problem?
 

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
Writer
SPNer
Ishna Bahian ji thanks for the post. I have comment on one of the paras in your post as follows,
They've been visiting for the past two years, and the mum has a wonky wing but the dad hasn't gotten rid of her in favour of another bird. Aaawe.
Aaawe Not! May be the dad uses that to rule mom.:interestedmunda:

That might be the difference - awareness of maya? Are animals trapped in a false reality of maya, or are these dense human intellects in love with false reality the problem?
I hope you are talking about the battle versus balance with the so called five thieves. Sometimes knowing is part of the problem. It becomes a re-enforcer one start to unknowingly starts cataloging and counting. Very hard to do but "Let it be" comes to mind.

Great thoughts in your post.

Sat Sri Akal.
 
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Harry Haller

Panga Master
SPNer
Harry ji

Your logic is quite funny ,by your logic old people which are ill and of around the age of 70 should not be given treatment as almost all doctors know that because of old age they have to die

Kdsji,

What I am saying is that smokers should not get free heart treatment, drinkers should not get liver transplants, animals make the most of the resources open to them, whereas if humans have money, they can manipulate consonance to suit themselves, up to a point anyway, animals are not emotional about the circle of life, humans are, animals accept the hukam of creator, humans do not, animals are already pure, everything they do is in consonance, humans have to tame the thieves to get that purity, until we live as one society, one people and not focus on the individuals we will never know what that feels like,

These are not my heartfelt opinions, I have a wife, a stepson, parents, I love them, I would sell everything if one were to be ill, but sometimes I just look at the animal world and see a society that 'works' a lot better than ours, having said that, in sikhi, there are many who have given their lives up for the greater good


Spock Logic The Needs of the Many - YouTube
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
Animals usually have reasons for doing what they do - they just don't have to think about it.

Animals don't have a "reason", because they cannot reason. That is the point. They do things because of instinct not reason.

Sikhi tells us we humans are special because we have "reason". We can either use this reason to behave like animals, or supress animal behaviour with "reason" and act like humans.
 

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
Writer
SPNer
Animals don't have a "reason", because they cannot reason. That is the point. They do things because of instinct not reason.

Sikhi tells us we humans are special because we have "reason". We can either use this reason to behave like animals, or supress animal behaviour with "reason" and act like humans.
Randip Singh ji thanks for your post. I do have a question.

What makes you think ours is the way including the "reason" part as a universal trait in the universe to be exploited?

I believe you are short changing the animals a bit for their wisdom from what I have observed of the animals. Animals do lot of reasonable acts when paid close attention to.

Sat Sri Akal.
 

kds1980

SPNer
Kdsji,

What I am saying is that smokers should not get free heart treatment, drinkers should not get liver transplants, animals make the most of the resources open to them, whereas if humans have money, they can manipulate consonance to suit themselves, up to a point anyway, animals are not emotional about the circle of life, humans are, animals accept the hukam of creator, humans do not, animals are already pure, everything they do is in consonance, humans have to tame the thieves to get that purity, until we live as one society, one people and not focus on the individuals we will never know what that feels like,

These are not my heartfelt opinions, I have a wife, a stepson, parents, I love them, I would sell everything if one were to be ill, but sometimes I just look at the animal world and see a society that 'works' a lot better than ours, having said that, in sikhi, there are many who have given their lives up for the greater good


Spock Logic The Needs of the Many - YouTube

I already replied to Your point that if Humans have money they can manipulate is already explained by me majority of humans on this planet don't have money neither they have any modern medicine for them so they are living in consonance of nature as much.as far your point of denying treatment to smokers is concerned ,then there will be lots of illnesses in world where Medical help should be denied for example you used to eat lot of sugar so now die with Diabetes

Animal society work better because most of animals don't have any emotions
or memories .
Just look at lions they capture pride then they kill the babies in few days Lioness will back in season and they mate with them .Lionesses develop good relations with male lions then in 2 years this cycle is repeated again and again.also in animal world there is no place for weak and death is the only solution for most of problems.In humans this type of society could be created but it will considered as very inhumane evil society
 

kds1980

SPNer
kds1980 ji is it possible that the Human species has lost control of itself? I don't know if recreational sex is all that common in other life forms. I am not sure of asexual life growth like viruses, bacteria, etc.

In such a scenario since humans sustain the ability to keep producing a child every year for many years, do you believe all the births in say India, China and Africa are based on people planning to have kids or having sex?

I don't want to sound elitist but isn't the thought and consequences of having and raising a child come to people when they are having sex?

Any thoughts!

Sat Sri Akal.

Well everyone knows that all births in India or other developing countries are not planned .In India many Hindu's and muslims believe that Children are god's gift so people don't think about having or raising a child.but I don't understand what this has to do with my post?
 

spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
SPNer
Animals don't have a "reason", because they cannot reason. That is the point. They do things because of instinct not reason.

Sikhi tells us we humans are special because we have "reason". We can either use this reason to behave like animals, or supress animal behaviour with "reason" and act like humans.

Not only that! They cannot do simran, read SGGS, earn an honest living, or do seva ka guru or ka sangat. So let's get back on topic.
 

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
Writer
SPNer
Well everyone knows that all births in India or other developing countries are not planned .In India many Hindu's and muslims believe that Children are god's gift so people don't think about having or raising a child.but I don't understand what this has to do with my post?
kds1980 ji you were comparing how life and children are getting diiferent facilities, etc., in the West while so many suffer in India and like.

My comment was a possible correlation as to why. If a country is not a capable of supporting all children born, is it not the duty of the citizens to think about refusing some gifts from God (have fewer children). Just thinking aloud.

Sat Sri Akal.
 

kds1980

SPNer
kds1980 ji you were comparing how life and children are getting diiferent facilities, etc., in the West while so many suffer in India and like.

My comment was a possible correlation as to why. If a country is not a capable of supporting all children born, is it not the duty of the citizens to think about refusing some gifts from God (have fewer children). Just thinking aloud.

Sat Sri Akal.

Ambarsaria ji

The people that capabale of thinking hardly have more than 3 children.India already have birth rate of 2.6 so people are already having less children.As far planning is concerned Human being have been producing children from start of civilization without thinking about planing them so how could illiterate poor people suddenly change this thinking?
 

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
Writer
SPNer
kds1980 ji I totally agree with your post. But the answer also lies in your post,
Ambarsaria ji

The people that capabale of thinking hardly have more than 3 children.India already have birth rate of 2.6 so people are already having less children.As far planning is concerned Human being have been producing children from start of civilization without thinking about planing them so how could illiterate poor people suddenly change this thinking?
How could unfortunate misery suddenly stop?

It is disgusting to see children and others not getting health care, food, nourishment, education but humanity has to address this. Such problems of imbalance develop over decades if not centuries and will take longer to fix themselves too.

Sat Sri Akal.
 

Ishna

Writer
SPNer
Ironically enough our sick pet mouse has been losing a lot of weight and managed to fit through the bars of his cage just now. He climbed onto the rat's cage below, who promptly grabbed him, pulled him into her cage and killed him.

Anyone wanna free rat?

:(
 

Ambarsaria

ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
Writer
SPNer
Ironically enough our sick pet mouse has been losing a lot of weight and managed to fit through the bars of his cage just now. He climbed onto the rat's cage below, who promptly grabbed him, pulled him into her cage and killed him.

Anyone wanna free rat?

:(
Ishna ji sorry about your mouse.

Are you running experiments on forced consonancemundahug? To put such animals near each other while they share evil/not-pleasant looks day and night must be tortturous for some and cause of salivation for others. General test should be to have a collection in cages only if such can also live happily when outside of cages.

Cats and dogs do some time,

catanddog_lg.jpg

Cat_and_Dog_-_the_Best_Friend.jpg


Sat Sri Akal.
 
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