Harbans ji,
Guru fateh.
Thanks for the response.
This forum is a great place because it allows us to share ideas, interact, even though, at times we disagree. For me, disagreements are part of any learning process, so I welcome them. And, please do not take my disagreements personally.
You write:
It has however never been my contention that just because Hemkunt Sahib matches with the description in Bachittar natak, it automatically gets authenticated as place where Guru ji did penance in his previous birth. All I said was that it can be taken as celebration of great piece of poetry of Bachittar Natak.
From your above statement, one can gather that you believe and have faith in reincarnation and there is such thing as previous birth when our Dasam Pita did penance there.
This is a Hindu concept and belief. Our visionary Gurus acknowledged the fact that Hinduism believed in the belief called reincarnation.
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SGGS, is full of verses that acknowledge this belief but in every verse it is repeated by our visionary Gurus that if one follows the Sikhi path, then this belief of death and rebirth ceases to exist.
If it were something tangibly true and hence would be the part and parcel of nature, then our Gurus would not have said that at the end of every Shabad regarding the
“death” of reincarnation because Ik Ong Kaar
is the Energy that creates nature.
Rather than declaring this as false and meaningless belief which for sure might have created a rebellion against our Gurus because reincarnation is one of the main cornerstones of Hinduism, they used the reverse psychology in my opinion in order to avoid any rebellion because most of the people who embraced this novel school of thought called Sikhi, which is idea based were Hindus. And, hence our Gurus tried to steer them towards SAT by explaining through Gurbani the true meaning of
life.
We know that beliefs require blind faith hence there is lack of logic and reasoning and also, they can not be combated by them either.
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Satnaam, the second word in SGGS, our only Guru, requires no belief but cultivates thinking and reasoning. Truth is a standalone entity. It needs no crutches of belief.
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The first Pauri of Jap ji is the solid proof for all of us to see that.
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One more important thing to notice and it is a fact that our Gurus never talked or praised about themselves or about each other. They only talked and praised The ONE- Ik Ong Kaar. One can verify that in SGGS.
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Keeping the above in my mind, allow me to get back to your post regarding Bachiter Natak.
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We all know the meaning of Natak- which means a play, a fiction, something that is untrue. Something that is a make believe, imaginary.
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Now the question arises why would a Natak be the manifestation of the truth so that Sikh Scholars would go to great lengths to make it the truth by discovering something which is tangible , and hence decide that this is the physical place where our Dasam Pita did Bhagti in his last life? ( I think by penance you mean Bhagti because the meaning of penance is not what is said in Bachiter Natak).
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Penance according to dictionary is:
pen·ance
NOUN:because
- An act of self-mortification or devotion performed voluntarily to show sorrow for a sin or other wrongdoing.
- A sacrament in some Christian churches that includes contrition, confession to a priest, acceptance of punishment, and absolution. Also called reconciliation.
penance - Dictionary definition and pronunciation - Yahoo! Education
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1.Why would these "discoverers" believe in Hindu concept of reincarnation to concoct a place like Hemkunt?
2.Why would they undermine Guru Gobind Singh by deciding that he wrote this about himself hence dwelled into Me-ism, not taking into consideration about the true meaning of Sikhi from our only benchmark- the SGGS?
This I think is the biggest insult to our only Guru- the SGGS and also to our Dasam Pita.
You yourself have said:
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Can it not be taken as a celebration of the work of art of Bachittar Natak?
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Yes it can, but the fact is that Hem Kunt is not taken as a work of art, a fiction. It is not built on some stage where it can be dismantled. It is a real place where thousands of Sikhs throng to every summer, where art is trying to imitate SAT, which is one more non-trait of Sikhi.
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Wikipedia explains Hemkunt like this:
Sri Hemkunt Sahib - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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In the Indian epic and Puranic literature,
Himalayan landscapes are described as the dwelling places of gods and goddesses. Pilgrimage shrines mark the places where the landforms themselves - mountains, rivers, forests, and lakes - are said to have acquired sacred qualities. High above the tree line, in the midst of a natural rock garden of moss, ferns, and flowers, is one such sacred place: a small, blue-green lake fed by water which cascades down from the surrounding mountain walls. Located in the Uttarkhand Himalayas bordering
Tibet and
Nepal, it is accessible for only four months of the year. Between June and October, sun and monsoon rains melt the ice and snow that are its namesake. Then, the steep stone footpath that leads to the lake is crowded with pilgrims and tourists. They journey to the base of the route on foot from neighbouring mountain valleys, or from the plains in buses, cars, and trucks, on scooters and bicycles, even by foot. Then for two days they climb upward. Some walk, some ride mules, and some are carried by porters. Finally, at the top of more than a thousand stone steps, the holy
lake, the
Sri Hemkunt Sahib Gurdwara, and the Sri Lakshman Mandir come into view.<o
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Sikhs believe that this holy place, known as Hemkunt (lake of ice), is the tap asthan (place of meditation and prayer) at which the tenth and final living Guru of the Sikhs
Sri Guru Gobind Singh achieved union with God in his previous incarnation. From there, the Guru was summoned by God to be reborn into the world to teach the people the true path. The temple built on the shore of the lake commemorates his mission. It also shelters the Guru Granth Sahib, the eternal scriptural Guru for the Sikh community. The community is itself recognized as a collective Guru, and pilgrims, as they walk the path toward Hemkunt, share the sacred journey with its members. In this way, all three forms of the Guru - the source of spiritual guidance - are understood to be present at Hemkunt. Sikh pilgrims go there to be inspired to walk the same difficult path that the Guru walked, both in body and in spirit, and to, through the Guru's grace, realize their connection with God in the same place where the Guru realized his. At Hemkunt Sahib, Sikhs feel closer to the Guru and, through the Guru, closer to God.<o
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This 'lake of ice' is also sacred to the hill people who live in the valley below. They tell of the gods Lakshman, Hanuman, Shiva, and Vishnu, the tales of their deeds woven together with images from local landscapes. Long before the Sikhs knew the lake as the Guru's tap asthan, these people knew it as Lokpal, and made annual pilgrimages to its shore. For them, as for Sikhs, the journey continues to be an act of devotion, and the holy lake itself is a place for prayer and worship - a place where wishes can be fulfilled.<o
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You also said:
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All I said was that it can be taken as celebration of All I said was that it can be taken as celebration of great piece of poetry of Bachittar Natak
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1. Harbans ji, how can one celebrate “a great piece of poetry of Bachittar Natak” when it contradicts the True Poetry which is SGGS?
Isn’t this self contradictory?
2. Who has the proof but our Dasam Pita himself that if he wrote Bachitar Natak?
3. So, isn't this all speculation and taking decisions and making judgements on his behalf undermine our Dasam Pita, his vision, sacrifices and his own decision not to add anything of his to SGGS as many of us are trying to play him?
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Regards
Tejwant Singh
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