General - God The Water (BoSKD 3) | Page 2 | Sikh Philosophy Network
  • Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
    Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
    Sign up Log in

General God The Water (BoSKD 3)

Aug 29, 2010
1,514
1,116
68
Hundreds of times 'RAM' word is used in Gurbani. It's not necessary that it's for 'the king' Ram-Chandra. "RAM" is meant to someone who is merged in The Almighty "Ramya Hoya" / Merged in Almighty. So Kabir Ji obviously would not worship a body so his attention is towards the Almighty & all those who are merged in the Almighty/Akal Roopi Jeevs
The word RAAM or RAAMu alone in Gurbaanee is the reference for HARi/Prabh/EKANKAAR only.

Wherever in Gurbaneee ,the word RAAM found as reference for King Ram Chandra is only along with other names of that era like Ravan,Sita or Luxman.Such application of the word Ram makes clear about its reference.

Prakash.s.bagga
 

Luckysingh

Writer
SPNer
Dec 4, 2011
1,633
2,750
Vancouver
Yes my focus is on this word <HARi.HARi> only and I relish this a lot.
And I wish to do so till my last breath.

Prakash.S.Bagga
Does this mean that the mantar -hari hari- supersedes any other gurmantar?
OR do you mean that we can choose whatever mantar we wish to ?

Is not the 'waheguru' gurmantar more applicable for us and it can help evoke more love to all of the gurbani ?
 
Aug 29, 2010
1,514
1,116
68
Does this mean that the mantar -hari hari- supersedes any other gurmantar?
OR do you mean that we can choose whatever mantar we wish to ?

Is not the 'waheguru' gurmantar more applicable for us and it can help evoke more love to all of the gurbani ?
In fact one can learn from Gurbanee that there are following reference for
mantra
as

1..Gur Mantra
2..Beej Mantra
3.Mool Mantra
4.Naam Mantra

Now the question is are these mantras different?
The answer is "NO"
All these mantra refer to the same single word as mantra and that is
<Hari.HARi> according to Gurbanee.

The word WAHi GuROO is the WORD OF GuR(Gur joti).Bhai Gurdas is also saying so in one of his Vaars and it is the consideration of Bhai Gurdas ji
to refer the word WAHi GuROO as Gur Mantra. This is not mentiones so anywhere in Gurbanee.

My understanding is that WAHi GuROO is a word that should be very helpful in evoking love for RAAM NAAMu/HARi NAAMu as envisaged in
Gurbanee.

I would say one should try to understand the real message of GuRu
in context of gurmantra from Gurbanee.

From Gurbanee one can learn that as amongest vast vegitation the CHANDAN VEGITATION is the best ,similarly amongest many and infinite Names the one <HARi .HARi> is the best.

Thus Gurbanee provides one with infinite choice along with THE BEST.
Now the choice is for your consideration.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Luckysingh

Writer
SPNer
Dec 4, 2011
1,633
2,750
Vancouver
During amrit ceremony are we not told to jap 'waheguru' or have I been mistaken!!

As per Bhai Gurdas ji, I personally think that 'waheguru' gurmantar is more appropriate.

1..Gur Mantra
2..Beej Mantra
3.Mool Mantra
4.Naam Mantra
I'm not sure that we can place gurmantra on par with mool mantra for example.
The different mentions in gurbani are for different references and purposes.
 
Aug 29, 2010
1,514
1,116
68
During amrit ceremony are we not told to jap 'waheguru' or have I been mistaken!!

As per Bhai Gurdas ji, I personally think that 'waheguru' gurmantar is more appropriate.



I'm not sure that we can place gurmantra on par with mool mantra for example.
The different mentions in gurbani are for different references and purposes.
As per my understanding during Khande ki Pahul ceremony one is given THE WORD "WAHi GuROO" for doing Jap.And this is correct as per Gurnbanee also.

Well I am not sure about for different mantras in Gurbanee as being for different purposes.
I hope you can elaborate this for my reference and understanding.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Luckysingh

Writer
SPNer
Dec 4, 2011
1,633
2,750
Vancouver
OK, to keep it simple-
The Gurmantar is what you focus on when practicing naam simran.
Whereas the mool mantar is not normally used for this simran and meditation.

This does not mean that you can't use any for another task. It doesn't advise anywhere not to use any mantar at all, but it does advise to use certain ones such as 'waheguru' for nam jap.

The mool mantar is often used prior to or in between or after nitnem by many of us.
Some prefer to do path with a gutka only, even if they do have the paath memorised.- These people normally recite the mool mantar if they feel the need or urge to do paath during the day and they don't have a gutka to hand.They could be at work, or having lunch for example and feel like some paath.
 
Aug 29, 2010
1,514
1,116
68
OK, to keep it simple-
The Gurmantar is what you focus on when practicing naam simran.
Whereas the mool mantar is not normally used for this simran and meditation.

This does not mean that you can't use any for another task. It doesn't advise anywhere not to use any mantar at all, but it does advise to use certain ones such as 'waheguru' for nam jap.

The mool mantar is often used prior to or in between or after nitnem by many of us.
Some prefer to do path with a gutka only, even if they do have the paath memorised.- These people normally recite the mool mantar if they feel the need or urge to do paath during the day and they don't have a gutka to hand.They could be at work, or having lunch for example and feel like some paath.
What is generally considered as Mool Mantra ,the same is not being refered as Mool Mantra in Gurbanee.
There are certain views presented by our so called Mahapurash/Preachers
to be followed but my understanding is that one should try to listen and follow what GuRu is telling in Gurbanee that is the real Gurmati.

One is required to start moving on the path of HARi no matter how one starts his journey.However it is important to ride a correct vehicle for
the correct destination.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,641
As per my understanding during Khande ki Pahul ceremony one is given THE WORD "WAHi GuROO" for doing Jap.And this is correct as per Gurnbanee also.

Well I am not sure about for different mantras in Gurbanee as being for different purposes.
I hope you can elaborate this for my reference and understanding.

Prakash.S.Bagga
From my experience of doing amrit vela naam simran, i cannot tell if different mantras have any different effects. Sometimes i use 'waheguru' sometimes 'satnaam' sometimes the mool manter. all of them help in settling my mind and getting me into a deep meditative state.

Once in deep meditative state i stop the mantra and just sit in silence...sort of explorong my consciousness visually and listening to any sounds/shabad within.

I guess it is easier to focus on Satnaam or Waheguru and if my mind is wondering excessively, using sat or Wahe when breathing in, and naam or guru when breathing out seems to really help.

One thing for sure is if i'm not feeling the push, love, thirst during naam simran then i tend to have a poor Simran session...so i guess the the Love and thirst for god/guru is a pre-requisite :)
 

Luckysingh

Writer
SPNer
Dec 4, 2011
1,633
2,750
Vancouver
My meditation is voluntary work, or smiling at someone on the street, or doing something constructive for the environment. Only when engaging with creation, and doing something positive for creation, do I feel I am meditating and following my Guru's instructions
I would call that 'contemplating' more than meditating by definition.

Once you become better practiced at simran, using the recommeneded ''waheguru'' gurmantar.
Then whilst engaging in creation and doing your tasks, the waheguru mantra continues to vibrate and sound from every part of your body.
A litttle like when a song is playing in the back of your mind all day except this ''waheguru'' plays all over your body and all around you as well.
You begin to feel it in the walls, the ground, the trees..etc..etc.
 

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,641
My meditation is voluntary work, or smiling at someone on the street, or doing something constructive for the environment. Only when engaging with creation, and doing something positive for creation, do I feel I am meditating and following my Guru's instructions
Satnaam Ji,

everything you say is correct...engaging with creation with love is engaging with god also...these things plant the seeds and help us become more humble beings, fighting our ego and helping us love others.

But in this Human body we have all the tools to go beyond the mind and raise our consciousness to levels that will really truely change us in our deepest core.

Guru Nanak Dev ji in Japji Sahib gave/described to us a way/method to connect with god and evoke his love in the following verse:

faer k agai rakheeai jith dhisai dharabaar ||
So what offering can we place before Him, by which we might see the Darbaar of His Court?

muha k bolan boleeai jith sun dhharae piaar ||
What words can we speak to evoke His Love?

a(n)mrith vaelaa sach naao vaddiaaee veechaar ||
In the Amrit Vaylaa, the ambrosial hours before dawn, chant the True Name, and contemplate His Glorious Greatness.

karamee aavai kaparraa nadharee mokh dhuaar ||
By the karma of past actions, the robe of this physical body is obtained. By His Grace, the Gate of Liberation is found

It is so clear yet for so many years i failed to realise it's significance. I thank guru ji for motivating me to start amrit vela Simran...i pray we all do this daily :)

Once you start....i dont think you'll ever turn back :)
 

namjiwankaur

SPNer
Nov 14, 2010
557
433
USA
_/|\_ Sat Nam

Discovering all this in Sikhi has led me to digging into power of simran/zikr/vibrating-with-the-word. And it is showing up everywhere, thanks to God/dess!

What is awesome about Sikhi is how it sheds all the extras and just gets down to the basics of realizing the Supreme in this life. It doesn't distract us with metaphors and stories and history. Guru Granth Sahib gets to the point and repeats it again and again...almost like a teaching on simran and meditation on the Sound & Light of the One.

And once we get there, all the sages, saints and prophets tell us that it opens our hearts to receive an Ocean of Love and Beauty.

I bow to that One which is everywhere. You and I are that Ocean once we connect soul to soul. And the only way to connect to that soul is to call out to the Divine Be-ing with every cell of our being.

Nam Jiwan:tablakudi:

Guru Nanak Dev ji in Japji Sahib gave/described to us a way/method to connect with god and evoke his love in the following verse:

faer k agai rakheeai jith dhisai dharabaar ||
So what offering can we place before Him, by which we might see the Darbaar of His Court?

muha k bolan boleeai jith sun dhharae piaar ||
What words can we speak to evoke His Love?

a(n)mrith vaelaa sach naao vaddiaaee veechaar ||
In the Amrit Vaylaa, the ambrosial hours before dawn, chant the True Name, and contemplate His Glorious Greatness.

karamee aavai kaparraa nadharee mokh dhuaar ||
By the karma of past actions, the robe of this physical body is obtained. By His Grace, the Gate of Liberation is found
 
Last edited:

chazSingh

Writer
SPNer
Feb 20, 2012
1,644
1,641
_/|\_ Sat Nam

Discovering all this in Sikhi has led me to digging into power of simran/zikr/vibrating-with-the-word. And it is showing up everywhere, thanks to God/dess!

What is awesome about Sikhi is how it sheds all the extras and just gets down to the basics of realizing the Supreme in this life. It doesn't distract us with metaphors and stories and history. Guru Granth Sahib gets to the point and repeats it again and again...almost like a teaching on simran and meditation on the Sound & Light of the One.

And once we get there, all the sages, saints and prophets tell us that it opens our hearts to receive an Ocean of Love and Beauty.

I bow to that One which is everywhere. You and I are that Ocean once we connect soul to soul. And the only way to connect to that soul is to call out to the Divine Name with every cell of our being.

Nam Jiwan:tablakudi:
It's amazing just how simple it all is :)

People say gurbani is full of metaphors...once i used to agree...and then through experience i realised it was giving full on descriptions of the spiritual path....everyone can realise this with the effort of doing Simran.

Some say gurbani just keeps on 'repeating' the same things...i'm not surprised it does, because it's dealing with our stubborn minds which wants to complicate things :)

I love the following verse in Japji:

chupai chup n hovee jae laae rehaa liv thaar ||
By remaining silent, inner silence is not obtained, even by remaining lovingly absorbed deep within.

If we remain silent, through mediation or whatever, and yet there is still no inner silence....what else is resounding within...i want to know...i want to explore this inner shabad and see where it takes me :)

God bless you on your journey.
 
Aug 29, 2010
1,514
1,116
68
There is a common old saying in India as

Karat Karat Abheeyas Jad Mati Hoat Sujaan.......................................

This is a very simple effect of anything being repeated.There is always a purpose for such repeatition and Gurbaanee messages are very articulate in this effect.

One should therefore keep on focusing on THE WORD OF GuR no one knows when and how the vibrating effect of the WORd OF GuR may bring a tremendous chane in ones
overall thought process to see and realise THE ONE all pervadind over.

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Luckysingh

Writer
SPNer
Dec 4, 2011
1,633
2,750
Vancouver
It is ALL repeat, repeat and repeat.
Repeat your nitnem every day, repeat amrit vela, repeat the name of 'waheguru' uttered by your tongue, repeat the good you do, repeat the rewarding moments of helping someone etc..etc..
Most importantly repeat the gurbani. Isn't it convenient that we have the attached gift of raags and music with gurbani ?
-- This makes the whole repeating process easier and more pleasing.
For those with the Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji at home, they are to read and do 'sehaj paath'' and after they finish they are to REPEAT.
Some sad sikhs just keep it sat there in a room and attend to it only when they NEED!!!!

All the good, the praise, the moments of pure love connection with creation are to be repeated and repeated.
It is a fact that after repeated repetition of any task, man becomes much better at that procedure.

What better way to keep embracing Waheguru more and more increasing with time than to keep repeating it !

To me personally, the mention of ''jap'' in any shabad, implies to affirm, to say, to act and to REPEAT!!!

Japo Waheguru, waheguru, waheguru jijapposatnamwaheguru:
 
Aug 29, 2010
1,514
1,116
68
My understanding is that the word "JAP" is NOUN and VERB also.
As Noun the meaning is "Understanding" and as VERB the meaning is "To Understand"
To assert repeatation,
the same word is used twice as "JAP JAP"

Prakash.S.Bagga
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Shabad Vichaar by SPN'ers

In an attempt to bring more Gurbani into our lives it would be great to analyse one shabad every week. It will be wonderful to get your thoughts about what the shabad is telling us and how we can...

SPN on Facebook

...
Top