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Gurus Did An Italian Surgeon Attend Guru Gobind Singh In 1708? (from Portuguese Sources)

Tejwant Singh

Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jun 30, 2004
5,024
7,183
Henderson, NV.
<table border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td style="border: 1px inset;" class="alt2">Originally Posted by Tejwant Singh
[[....however, it is interesting to notice that he does not see any difference between the British and the Dutch.
</td></tr></tbody></table>Tejwant Ji,

Please qualify your statement.The current line is rather blend, uninteresting in itself and bold, or is it simply meant to lead nowhere?]]


Dear Tejwant Ji ,



As your reply is devoid of any substantive content in response to my question,I will spare myself re-reading again;what you wrote as it would be waste of time.. but will repeat again what I asked as result of your statement which you appear to have sidestepped, in answering now..

YOU suggested I "do not see any difference between the Dutch and the English", I asked you to qualify that.

Never mind, you may not want to reply to that.But please bear me any "intelligence ideation".God has given that same to all.It is how one taps into it.BUT that is not the issue at discussion; and you dont want to expand on what you said ...so we will call it quits on that subject and perhaps explore THE issues as suggested by SPNadmin JI.

GURCHARAN SINGH< KULIM

Chaan Pardesi Ji,

Guru fateh.

It is a shame to notice that you have not read my initial post properly as requested by me for you to give yourself a second chance,and it is not the first time it has happened with you. I am used to it now.:)

You write:

God has given that same to all.It is how one taps into it.
I totally agree with you. I hope you will start applying that on yourself sooner than later. It is for your own benefit.icecreammunda

Regards

Tejwant Singh
 

Chaan Pardesi

Writer
SPNer
Oct 4, 2008
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772
London & Kuala Lumpur
I totally agree with you. I hope you will start applying that on yourself sooner than later. It is for your own benefit.icecreammunda

___________________________________________________

Tejwant Ji,<!-- google_ad_section_end -->

I thought you had the grace of a good Sikh to offer a proper intellectual response to the questions asked.But as you are beating about the bush with no intention of responding appropriately, it reminds me when Guru Ji says ... deletion will take heed of that.


I notice you perhaps find it beneficial to deny what you wrote and be economical with the truth.But such replies really do not befit a forum like this, I am sorry to say.

By the way , you are welcome to have the last word in ...as that seems to relieve you.

Gurcharan Singh
 

Tejwant Singh

Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jun 30, 2004
5,024
7,183
Henderson, NV.
Chaan Pardesi ji,

Guru Fateh

You write:

Tejwant Ji,

I thought you had the grace of a good Sikh to offer a proper intellectual response to the questions asked.But as you are beating about the bush with no intention of responding appropriately, it reminds me when Guru Ji says ... Moorakh naal na loojiye...I will take heed of that.

Let me repeat it for the last time that you should take sometime to read what others are talking about. You once again ignored that fact, which is a shame.

I am glad you are here in this forum to gauge people's intellect and whether they have the grace of a good Sikh or not with your own "intellectual yardstick".:)

It is also not bewildering to notice your usage of Gurbani as a weapon, rather than a tool for self improvement by calling people Moorakhs. An interesting way to use Gurbani, to say the least.

If it makes you feel better than others,go for it as often as possible and allow me to wish you good luck in your judgemental endeavours.:)

Regards

Tejwant Singh
 
Nov 10, 2016
3
1
41
Vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh, is there any quote from dr coll himself in his book that he went to see sri guru gobind singh ji or has this been referenced from
A history of the medical service book, or from the punjab past and present?
 

swarn bains

Poet
SPNer
Apr 8, 2012
1,078
202
An European Surgeon Who Attended Satguru Gobind Singh in 1708.

At the footnote of martyrdom of Guru Arjun ,in "The Panjab-Past And Present" Dr. Gurbachan Singh Nayyar, editor, had given a incomplete but very important information. He wrote--"An European Surgeon,an Englishman, is said to have attended Guru Gobind Singh during his last days at Nander in the Deccan.When Emperor Bahadur Shah,then(September- October, 1708) encamped at Nander, heard the Guru having been Stabbed by a Pathan, he sent a surgeon to attend to his wound.Dhian singh in his( manuscript)" Daswan Patshah Ka Antam Kautak" tells us that(Das Mohran Roz Sahib Dewain Jarahdar Kau, kal Usih Da nam, Angrez Si). He was an Englishman,Call by name, and that the Guiru Paid him ten Mohars a day.But to the best of our knowledge, no recod of him has so far been discovered------"

From a Purtugese book, written by the same surgeon, led me the exact information.Mr. William Irvine has translated the book in English.The name of the original book is"Storia Do Mogor or Mogul India"(1653-1708) written by Niccolao Manucci.He was the official Surgeon of Bahadur Shah.Earlier, he was the surgeon of Dara Shikoh.The brief,but the original story will lead you many new informations.

Less exiciting was the career of Dr. Nicholas Manucci.But he was generally called by the short name of Dr. Call(1639-1717).He left Venice for East Indies at an early age of fourteen to visit the world,he himself told in the first volume of the book. Overall, he has written four volumes and gives the eye-witness account of six years of Shahjahan reign, full reign of Aurangzeb and some years of Bahadur Shah.As told you in the begining, he left his native country.The captain of the ship and other staff members of the crew thought that he was the son of some trader on board, so they did not inquire about him.Almighty God has scattered his food in the distant lands of the east.He took the service with an English traveller, Lord Bellamont in what capacity is not recorded.After staying in Persia and other countries,Manucci came to Delhi from Surat in 1656.He was seventeen year old when in1656, he worked as the Mughal Emperor Shahjahan's son, Dara Shikoh's artillery man at a salary of 80 rupees.After Dara's murder in 1659, he adopted medicine as a profession, apparentally without any training,at Agra.During 1664-1665,he served as a captain of artillary in the Deccan, under Mirza Raja Jai Singh(An acestor of Raja Ram Singh).

During 1671-1678,Dr. Niccolao Manucci practiced medicine in Lahore,where earlier, he served under Dara Shikoh.In last of 1658, he received a special medicine from the Dawakhana of Satguru Har Rai Sahib. Satguru told him that "Aukdh Aye Ras -----" holy page No. 1363 of Sri Guru Granth Sahib.That the medicine works only if God helps the Doctor.He received some personal medicine for Peppers(Kohris). Because, he was the favourite of Dara Shikoh,he accompanied Dara to thanks- giving ceremony of Dara Shikoh at the Bank of Beas when Satguru Har Rai Sahib alongwith 2200 horsemen helped Dara and his men go to Multan.Second time ,he visited Fakir( That is Satguru Har Rai Sahib).But due to the rivalary between Dara Shikoh and Aurangzeb,Dr. Call avoided further details about Sikhs.We have to dig out the contemporary informations.He was very popular in Lahore.From 1672-82, he was the physician of Bahadur Shah.He arrived in Madras in 1686 remained there with his wife.His wife died in 1706.

Bahadur Shah was in Bidar and Nander since June 1708,(reference IV volume of his own book, pp379).He came to meet him from Madras, when this stabbing incidence took place.Bahadur Shah send Dr. Coll(that is Dr. Niccolao Manucci) to attend Satguru Gobind Singh in oct.1708.Earlier he was the first Physician of Shah Alum alias Bahadur Shah.For his photo and other proofs, your worthy can click on"Photo" on my site.



Bibliography--

(1)--Storia Do Mogor or Mughal India Vol I to IV , by Niccolao Manucci, published and translated by William Irvine,printed by Edition Indian, Calcutta,1967.Its first edition was published in 1907.

(2)--A History of the Medical Service, by Lt. col. D.G.Crawford, Vol- I, published by W. Thacker & Co.,Calcutta & Simla,1914.

(3)--The Panjab-Past And Present, VolXXV-I, April 1991, S No. 49, published by, Department of Punjab Historical Studies,Punjabi University, Patiala, 1991.

European Surgeon who Attended Satguru Gobind Singh in 1708
O jackal ; why do you go to the lion. he is going to eat you. ਸਿੰਘ ਸਰਨ ਕਤ ਜਾਈਐ ਜਉ ਜੁੰਬਕ ਗ੍ਰਾਸੈ
ਦੂਜਾ ਭਾਵ ਅਰਥ ਕੀ ਹੈ ਯਾ ਨਹੀਂ
 
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