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Discussion in 'Sikh Sikhi Sikhism' started by harcharanjitsinghdhillon, Nov 9, 2012.
what is duality please discuss and give your oppinion on it?
Duality of what motherlylove ?
Please explain some of the specifics to focus the thread!
duality is a world of pairs of opposites....our whole creation is based on pairs of opposites....
pairs of opposites create an experience to be had... experience of good wont exist if bad didnt exists. we wouldnt know what Hot is, if cold didnt exist....how can we really understand what love is if hate didnt exist. By going through these experiences we get a true understanding of what god is. Without experiencing the opposite of god we would never be able to understand the true reality of god i.e. love, compasion, selflessness, forgiveness etc etc....we wouldnt know what all these divine qualities are...all of those qualities as an experience wouldnt exist without the opposite.
ChazSingh ji, and Ambarsaria ji and Namjivan ji as well,
While good and bad, male and female etc are part of duality, what is significantly talked about in Guru Granth Sahib is the duality that is perceived by us in relation to God. By default, we think God and I are two separate things. This is it. This is the main problem, the dubidha, also called bharam, dooja bhav, dvait bhav, etc.
The beliefs Gurus, Bhagats and Bhatts express is that we are part of God, separated but we can through bhagati merge back, ie. Qualified Non-Dualism. Even though we are separated there is a light of God in us. Learning to see this light is the key to knowing God.
ਹੋਇ ਇਕਤ੍ਰ ਮਿਲਹੁ ਮੇਰੇ ਭਾਈ ਦੁਬਿਧਾ ਦੂਰਿ ਕਰਹੁ ਲਿਵ ਲਾਇ ॥
Join together and meet others, my brothers, and dispel your problem of duality by immersing yourself [into His name, His light].[SIZE=-2]
Guru Granth Sahib Page 1185[/SIZE]
Dubidha Door Karho - Bhai Harjinder Singh Ji Sri Nagar Wale - Fremont Gurdwara Sahib - YouTube
Explained well by Chazji and Bhagatji !!
Just to add a little- These same dualities that exist are what lead us away from the true ONE.
By stripping ourselves from ego and worldly desires, we start to strip away and see through the dualities.
In sprituality Duality refers to the state of living with two thoughts of different
One is required to always be thinking or living with NIRANKAAR but if one only
suprfacially thinks of NIRANKAAR and worships some other FIGURE in thoughts.
This is living with DUALITY.
One can ponder over this Sabad for understanding Duality as
<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=5><TBODY><TR><TD>kbIr jI gauVI ] </TD></TR><TR><TD>Gauree, Kabeer Jee: pp324SGGS</TD></TR><TR><TD>kabeer jee ga-orhee. </TD></TR><TR><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>ikAw jpu ikAw qpu ikAw bRq pUjw ] </TD></TR><TR><TD>What use is chanting, and what use is penance, fasting or devotional worship, </TD></TR><TR><TD>ki-aa jap ki-aa tap ki-aa barat poojaa. </TD></TR><TR><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>jw kY irdY Bwau hY dUjw ]1] </TD></TR><TR><TD>to one whose heart is filled with the love of duality? ||1|| </TD></TR><TR><TD>jaa kai ridai bhaa-o hai doojaa. ||1|| </TD></TR><TR><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>ry jn mnu mwDau isau lweIAY ] </TD></TR><TR><TD>O humble people, link your mind to the Lord. </TD></TR><TR><TD>ray jan man maaDha-o si-o laa-ee-ai. </TD></TR><TR><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>cqurweI n cqurBuju pweIAY ] rhwau ] </TD></TR><TR><TD>Through cleverness, the four-armed Lord is not obtained. ||Pause|| </TD></TR><TR><TD>chaturaa-ee na chaturbhuj paa-ee-ai. rahaa-o
duality is where ego is preserved.. when ego is preserved, death is always there.. all actions done on name of 3 gunas, are done by those who think maya is eternal.. they all are lost in duality thoughts who forget the lord- akal moorat.. sikhis are not interested in heavens and hells where duality and ego still exist. in duality there is death
Yes there is death in duality and we all have to face it so we can't escape the duality can we ?
No we cannot, but we should learn to recognize and accept that it is a perception.
To be able to first distinguish between them first, and then by accepting them both equally helps to fade out the line that separates 2 dualities.
FOR EXAMPLE- When one is Gurmukh, the goal is to accept ALL good, happiness and Joy etc.. with EQUAL effect to ALL bad, sadness and sorrow..etc...
So a gurmukh hearing very bad news gets the same effect and reaction to hearing very good news of some sort. A gurmukh does NOT distinguish too much with good/bad, happy/sad and therefore does NOT have a solid line that separates both dualities.
So the dualities don't just vanish, they still exist but the different effects and reactions we have for one duality over the other simply vanish and become the same.
Thank you for your explanation in such plain language that a slow coach like me can understand.
What do you make of Gurbani that talks about joy and bliss, like anand Sahib, or sukhmani Sahib? Are those states too far in one direction of a duality? Or is it the state that is achieved when you're contentedly focused in the middle? The TRUE sukh/anand - OMG lightbulb moment! ...
Here's another shabad that talks about duality on NO uncertain terms by Guru Arjun Sahib Ji on Ang 237 http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=237&L=17&id=10399
We must kill the sense of duality.
How does one eliminate a sense of duality yet retain a moral compass? Is the trick in keeping your own self (your mind, your reaction to things) stable and centered but accepting we live in a world of duality and choosing to act for the good? The act is in duality but the mind isn't? I dunno, I'm just blabbering now.
These are some very interesting questions.... I think there is a difference between Joy/bliss vs happiness. Living with in anand (or so my own interpretation is), is like living in constant contentment with whatever the situation is around you. Non-judgement and accepting it as joyous, so all situations look the same. Happiness, can be situational as a result of something causing something else, this to me would fall into the realm of duality and Anand beyond that?
I dont think moving out duality and acting morally are at odds with each other, I think because we are tied to this world like you said you still do what is required of you but while accepting and being content with it all under the same light. There's this story I heard a while back about a zen master that I think fits with this:
A beautiful girl in the village was pregnant. Her angry parents demanded to know who was the father. At first resistant to confess, the anxious and embarrassed girl finally pointed to Hakuin, the Zen master whom everyone previously revered for living such a pure life.
When the outraged parents confronted the Zen master with their daughter's accusation, he simply replied "Is that so?"
When the child was born, the parents brought it to the Hakuin, who now was viewed as a pariah by the whole village. They demanded that he take care of the child since it was his responsibility. "Is that so?" Hakuin said calmly as he accepted the child.
For many months he took very good care of the child until the daughter could no longer withstand the lie she had told. She confessed that the real father was a young man in the village whom she had tried to protect. The parents immediately went to Hakuin to see if he would return the baby. With profuse apologies they explained what had happened. "Is that so?" Hakuin said as he handed them the child.
Satnaam Ishna Ji,
i sometimes think that we can 'mentally' try to water down the sense of duality, but deep down i feel the illusion of duality can only be removed once we can maybe feel, see, know that God is 'All', then no matter what we experience within the dualistic world...we no longer see things as they were...we now only see God....everywhere, then duality although still existing around us...doesnt affect us as before.
I firmly believe that our awareness of creation can expand to that level through grace...
until then doing this mentally through our actions as best we can is all we can do...
these dualistic experiences are a must i feel in-order to experience God fully and to understand God at a deeper level. A fish would never notice/appreciate/understand the importance of water until one day it is seperated from it.
Recently i have started to learn Tai Chi. in my whole life i could never have imagined brute force (being used by an apponent) could be successfully controled and tamed using almost no force whatsoever.
Such is the great experience of duality
Just my current feeling Ji