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Sikh News Sushma Stands By Her Remarks On Sikh Guru, Flays Critics (Deccan Herald)

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Sushma stands by her remarks on Sikh Guru, flays critics (Deccan Herald)
http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/rss/search/sikh/SIG=12d2tonjs/*http%3A//www.deccanherald.com/deccanherald/jun242006/update932312006624.asp
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Sat, 24 Jun 2006 09:30:20 GMT
Under attack from pro-Congress Sikh religious leaders here for her comments on the martyrdom of Guru Arjan Dev, senior BJP leader Sushma Swaraj today said she stood by her remarks that a Hindu courtier had little role in the execution of the fifth Guru ordered by emperor Jehangir.
 
Dec 8, 2005
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Dear brother

SSAKAL

I think Respected Sushmaji is right.

Courtiers have no religion . They are mere servant . Also fear of life and cowardice in face of challenge has been India's weak point till the advent o f SIKHISM .

Today India has many brave sons both Sikhs and non sikhs who love there mother land .

Also what religion can a servant have except his masters wishes.

They carry out the orders of there masters.

It is like a soldier who carries out a order.

This is a totally wrong way to potray history.

Sikh and hindus have always been like brothers .

An odd courtiers does not define the relationship.

Love

Nanak nam chadi kala tere ban sarbat th bhalla

hps62:) :star::cool: :wah:
 

drkhalsa

SPNer
Sep 16, 2004
1,308
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Dear Friend


The issue was not regarding which religion Chandu did represent but instead distorting Sikh History to fit Political Speech .

Anyway As I have read she quoted from a book on sikh history where it has been written that Chandu had little role in whole issue So it like making total out of context thing that people Like Sarna ( DGPC Head ) raise for their personal interest


Jatinder Singh
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh
if we see in opposite idrection we may find that she may behold Guru as Hindu and Chandu being Hindu not anti to Guru and Islamic king being main reason to oppose Hindu Guru,a sort of hindu v/s Muslim issue and no Sikh Panth in between.Just a comment.
 
Mar 27, 2006
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Satsriakaalji Saadh Sangat...
These news had shocked me before i saw it and read it ....well...i fail to understand .something....why are they after a lady who belongs to the Viraat Hindu Samaj ideology..and would want to stop being the servant referred as a hindu...since he failed to be a hindu..he backstabbed the Guru.....The Gurus were fighting against evil and oppression....the musalmaans..who saw a problem in any thing unislamic and wanted to go their way marauding..

The congress or the press when refferring to terrorists will not name the religion....then we are so careful...but if a hindu lady who holds the Guru in great respect...does not agree to that servant being a hindu....all of them pounce on her.
We are ready to lick the {censored} of a musalmaan..and a christian..we will say all are part of God....and terrorism has nothing to do with religion..but we are such big {censored}..that we pounce our own people ..when they see a prob in naming the religion of a traitor...
Such references are made by khalistanis to poison the mind of keshdhaaris against their people....i have come across so many sites...when they will readily refer ..'Hindu Rajas of the hills' ....well do u ever understand what it is to be a hindu ???
HOW can a person who is a traitor to his country and Guru continue to be a hindu....?????

We are so shameless that we dont not see the difference....
there are 10000s of musalmaans attending ..the namaaz for the slain terrorists...and we turn a blind eye...they can honour a person by doing namaz...for what ??? to wish that he get Jaanat for cheating his own people and country ? for raping and arson ???

In our society we do not glorify people who have a nusience...even in punjab the slain terrorists did nto have people coming to their funerals....in such large numbers

We sing secular tones...but we dont have the courage...we are fit for the hell we suffer ....

Guru Maharaj sadbuddhi bakshe....pls dont mind my language ...its my way to expression....

Raaj Karega Khalsa
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

BJP guys are also spineless,Tigeress Uma sister has left them therefore.

Reason is that recently when respected Brother Vinay Katiyar and Dr Sahib Singh Verma annouced the price on the head of the terrorsits and killer clould be Hindu ,Muslim or Sikh,then they did not support these greatmen.

Das can find a caste angle also that Kurmi(Gujar ) and Jaat were not allowed to rise further perhaps.Is not that shamefull that Haji Yakub Kurshi ,when declares reward on the head head on western cartonists for making disrespect to Prophet(PBUH),nothing is done to him.And that has nothing to do with India.

but when Indian are told to get reward to kill imntruder,a case is filed aganst them.Wortst was BJP's not supporting the own leaders.
 
Mar 27, 2006
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Satsriakaalji Saadhsangat,

Excellent point ...very right Vijaydeepji.....the bjp has had a lots of spine less people...Umaji did take the step but lets watch what goes further...the good ones will all leave some day...

Veerji are you aware of some fiasco at Harimandirsaheb?? Simranjit Mann and his guys ..there has been some commotion..does anyone know abt it ??

pls let me know ..i m curious...

Guru Fateh
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

In Panth there is need that good leaders like Resepected K C Sudershan Ji or say Bhai togadia Ji should take over and throw the crap like Badal or even Mann both are not behaving well but still das do have good respect for Mann.

Das attenmds meeting of Sangh and finds that thier leaders are far more commited to thier casue(which may be not well but das talsk about thier commitment).Badal did copied from BJP and some false cadres of RSS,the way to make fool of the community in the name of Faith but better was to lerant from high ranking ,comited soliders of Seva Bharti or Vanvasi Kalyan Parishad about self sacrifise as Dadhchi did.

Sikhs are any happy to have motivated cadres in Missionaries,AKJ and DDT but sgpce is still under control of Jatts.

Das hopes that when large chunk of Indians will be Sikh then they will kick thses jatts out.They anyway prevented Dr Ambedkar with lower caste to convert so that thier Majorty is not effected.

Das is using word jatt is not for racial sence but same term may mean carefree rural guy but on high posts such things may not work.Das's father has gotra solkani,which is sameas Virk in Punjab and das has good family relationms with Jaats of Haryana.But das oppsoe jattism the way he does oppse Brahmanism in panth.In anycase das does not regonansie any race or salnder that.
 
Dec 8, 2005
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Dear brother 's
sskal:)


I do not know why we discuss Issues like caste at a SIKH site.

It is absolutely SIN to criticize any sikh on basis of his caste.

In any case People like Badal are the weak component of Sikhs.

Just like the west pakistani sikhs who lost there lands due to there laziness ;as they could not till it and depended on Muslims to do it.

They arrived like {censored}s in this part of INDIA as refugees and are condemed by :wah: to whole life be refugees. To mix and get lost in the great Indian melting pot of lost races and tribes.

Jatt tilled his land and so is a proud owner of SIKH religion and refuses to merge himself in the melting pot of lost races. So dont feel envious of him.

These weak people lie people Darwins theory shall look after .

There is no need to extrapolate these weak SIKHS to a whole tribe of Sikh.

You will find many of like of Badal in the Khatri, Ramgarhia , lobana , mazbi tribes of SIKhs.

When we talk of SIKHS we need to remember our Heros like Jassa singh ahluwalia , Hari Singh nalwa , Ajit singh Sekhon , Ramgarhia etc the list is lengthy.

So take it easy.

IF sikhs are being run by Jatts then they have earned it by there good deeds.

There is some thing in them that they are shining among the all the sikhs tribes.

So remember to CRITICIZE a SIKH on basis of his caste is a SIN and should be vociferously protested.:down:
You can criticize him as a individual only and say Badal is a weak leader of SIkhs. Generalization is not permitted.

Love to all the SIKh tribes and to the world at large.

May the spirit of CHADI KALA PREVAIL.

Nanak nam chadi kala ter bana sarvat the bhalla.


love

hps62:) :cool: :star: :wah:

As for Amritsar Akal takth story . I view it differently.

When two tigers meet there shall be fire works . Men have a way to decide there hieararchy

Dont talk like mahatma Gandhi.

We are the SIKHS we live by our swords next to us.

This event only shows that we still have androgens ( like Yin of chinese philosophy ) in us.

Be proud of it. Indian worship the ling that is the man in any society.

If you want to join a sophisticated protest there is one going on in AIIMS these day you are welcome to join them.

love

hps62:wah: :star:
 
Last edited:

drkhalsa

SPNer
Sep 16, 2004
1,308
54
Dear Brother hps62

I dont know what made you wite this post

What kind of protest you want to protest ?

In his post Vijaydeep Singh has very Clearly described what he meant by Jattism

Das is using word jatt is not for racial sence but same term may mean carefree rural guy
May be you missed it .well I hope so.

One more thing that it is a thing difficult to understand whether JATT Really is caste ?

Which caste systen you are refering to . Hindu or some native original Sikh Caste system which should never had existed . In my understanding JATT is more of group of clans with different backgrounds and some even migrated from rajasthan and some refer them as rajputs of rajasthan. So does this make a caste .


Just like the west pakistani sikhs who lost there lands due to there laziness ;as they could not till it and depended on Muslims to do it.
I could not understand what you say here .

In my understanding do you mean to say that peopel who migrated from pakistan , the sole reason was that they were not doing cultivation so they left pakistan . does this makes any sense .


They arrived like {censored}s in this part of INDIA as refugees and are condemed by :wah: to whole life be refugees. To mix and get lost in the great Indian melting pot of lost races and tribes.

Which {censored}s you are refering to , the people who has to undergo the real difficulties in hand of circumstances and they came here leaving everything behind .
or you are refering to Indian Prime Minister who was also born in Pakistan came to india after partition or couple of others like Bhajan Yogi.

There is no need to extrapolate these weak SIKHS to a whole tribe of Sikh.

You will find many of like of Badal in the Khatri, Ramgarhia , lobana , mazbi tribes of SIKhs.

When we talk of SIKHS we need to remember our Heros like Jassa singh ahluwalia , Hari Singh nalwa , Ajit singh Sekhon , Ramgarhia etc the list is lengthy.

So take it easy.

I agree with you here that Badal like sikhs are weak sikhs and they are earning bad names for all they represent but dear dont forget the thing that BADAL Always win his election with support if Rural People people.My educated Hindu Collegue in Punjab Hate Badal and his RUDY Methods but it is Number game in Democracy as most of the hindu are in Cities .


Jatt tilled his land and so is a proud owner of SIKH religion and refuses to merge himself in the melting pot of lost races. So dont feel envious of him.

IF sikhs are being run by Jatts then they have earned it by there good deeds.

There is some thing in them that they are shining among the all the sikhs tribes.

First of all mention was of SIKH Institute Like SGPC which has nothing Sikh left in it and no body mentioned that SIKHISM IS OWNED BY JATTS

If you feel so then so then I dont think anybody will have problem .

Sayings Sikhs has nothing to do with Caste and then debating TRIBES of sikh does not seem nice .


Reading your Post really shook me as this was very unusal of your post in the past .Anyway I dont think anybody has right over others way of thinking So jsut thought of sharing what I think of it.


As for Amritsar Akal takth story . I view it differently.

When two tigers meet there shall be fire works . Men have a way to decide there hieararchy

Dont talk like mahatma Gandhi.

We are the SIKHS we live by our swords next to us.

This event only shows that we still have androgens ( like Yin of chinese philosophy ) in us.

If removing turbans of each other and that too when still Guru Ji Parkash was there , also when people started running out of hall for safety aal this is Good show of Sikhi
Then I suggest to start new Sikh game In which 50 years old can practice remving each others turban in Gurdwara.


As for me it was Hieght of IDIOCY on public display and it has been news in masala western media in which Sikhs are debating for their peaceful way of life




Jatinder Singh
 
Jul 30, 2004
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Gurfateh

Dear Bro hpSingh Ji,

forgive das and das tenders an apology to you.

Das finds that there is no caste in faith but people who still cling to it are more fake Sikh.And Badal Sahib rther ended the Sikh cause by calling Akali Dal as Punjbi party.

how can eternal Akal's floower be punjabi or say having a created regoanal entity like say Punjab or how can Sikh be bihari? but Punajbi can be jatt and Bihari can be teli.

Das is sorry and das only pointed this debate over the management in various Gurudwaras or spgc fighting like farmers figth for their own peice of Land while this Gurudwara is not thier ownership but they are servent there for whole Panth.

So makker is Bhapa or khatir yet he showed Jattism and if das querl with you then das will also show jattism.Like people call ritaul ism as brahmnism so lack of unity with ego is more to do with jattism and no offend to any race.Das seeks forgiveness with folded hands.Do forgive him.
 
Dec 8, 2005
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"Sayings Sikhs has nothing to do with Caste and then debating TRIBES of sikh does not seem nice ."


I am against the word caste as it has a very negative connation in India.

It makes you stuck in a particular profession decided by your birth .

It also does not connate equality of all humans which sikhism propogate.

Tribe word does not suffer from any of these problems.

Like the Jewish tribes.


You can become any thing by tribe definition you are not condemened to a particular profession.

Love
hps62

PS :- I stand by statement of West punjabis . Not to add salt to there wounds even I am from that part of punjab.

I can say about my ancestors that they are the weakest part of our quam.

Lazy , cowardly and only interested in making money.

May :wah: give them the values of Khalsa so that they are not uprooted again or run out of fear by being outnumbered.

WGKWGF

hps62:) :cool: :star: :whisling:
 

drkhalsa

SPNer
Sep 16, 2004
1,308
54
Dear hps62,


Thanks for your post

and forgive me if I have misunderstood you.

Personally I dont belong to any of the two background but has lived in punjab all my life and was my views and do respect your views


Thanks


Jatinder Singh
 
Mar 27, 2006
458
96
Satsriakaalji Saadh Sangat...
Very truely said abt ...these caste supremacy..they have destoryed us and our mindsets....the moment we ask names ..we eagerly want to know what caste the other person belongs to........
Bhai vijaydeepji....u truely said....the vanvasi kalyan ashram has done excellent work....i have been to one of the units in Madhya Pradesh, jhabua district....and there is a place called bhaaji doongra...veerji...there has been a dam..there since 1933...and no repairs happened...now what happened is a part has collapased..and there isnt enough water...veerji people are drawing water frm the ground..by diggin .i tell u tis not clear...its muddy...i had drank it ....and that water is not enough for people for irrigation...the people live in poverty.....

VKA had taken up this project but there has been a lack of funds....Saadh sangatji...if any one here wishes ..to donate can do ...so...the biggest punn..of arranging water to someone is associated....i am pasting the costs involved....
Bhaji Dungra

Particulars of the Dam Wall:

Length 18 mts.
Width (at the base) 3 mts.
Width (at the top) 90 cm.
Height 7 mts.

Cement Required 1000 bags @ Rs. 180 per bag = Rs. 1,80,000

In case a Returning Wall is constructed:

Total Cement Required (for Existing Wall & Returning Wall) 1890 bags @ Rs. 180 per bag = Rs. 3,40,200
Steel Required 700 kg @ Rs. 30 per kg = Rs. 21,000
Mud Required worth Rs. 50,000
Sand & Stones are available naturally at the site.
Total Estimated Expenditure Rs. 4,11,200



 
Jul 30, 2004
1,744
88
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Gurfateh

Thanks for the estimates.

Das also rembers Raja Daleep Singh Jodeo's work in Chatisgarh to convert many people in hindu fold back.

Das just wants that many of our reformers missionaries understand that just by bashing sgpc,dera dars,rss for wrong of panth and sitting in AC rooms and keep on saying ills of Brahmins and invasion via Dasham Granth it is better to do similar works in backword Area.while doing the same contact with people may make them aware of idelogy also.So think it as a way to spread your ideolgy.


Best place for them could be Uttracnchal or Himachal or J & K and in Punjab it can be South west Malwa or Kandi Area.
 

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