Hinduism Question For All Who Question The Authenticity Of The Sikh Faith

simpy

SPNer
Mar 28, 2006
1,133
126
QUESTIONS FOR ALL THOSE WHO HAVE BEEN TRYING TO CONVINCE THE SIKHS TO BELIEVE THAT THEIR BELIEF IN 'DHAN “DHAN SIRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI” BEING THEIR LIVING GURU' IS SUBJECT TO BE CORRECTED.

A True Guru is a Guru because His Soul is Merged with The Higher Self.
For us(SIKHS) ALL OUR GURUS ARE TRUE GURUS. :)
For us(SIKHS) All our Eleven Gurus are LIVING. :)
For us(SIKHS) TRUTH never dies. It is not bound to time and space. ALL GURU SAHIBAAN AND ETERNAL LIVING JOTE IN THE FORM OF DHAN DHAN SIRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI
are everywhere, all the time, Adole, Apaar……:)
Baani Prabh Ki Sabh ko Bolay, Aap Adole Na Kabhu Doley………

IF ME NEECH IS WRONG PLEASE CORRECT ME.:roll:


Now we all know this Truth that human body is limited to time and space so has to expire one day. So is Guru Ji’s. There is no Guru living in a physical body forever. CAN YOUR GURU'S PHYSICAL BODY LIVE FOREVER??????

And I hope we all agree on this point that Atma never dies. DO WE??????

So for us(SIKHS), all our Gurus are here; now; have not gone anywhere. ARE THEY GONE ANYWHERE????

For all those who have been beating the drum Living Guru, Living Guru; In a Human Body, In a Human Body; The Only Way, The Only Way-
Will your Guru be of NO USE TO YOU AFTER HE/SHE LEAVES HIS/HER HUMAN ABODE??????

Are his/her words(truth) those are coming out of his/her mouth now, will be useless after he/she leaves the physical body???????


forgive me please







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spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
SPNer
Jun 17, 2004
14,500
19,216
QUESTIONS FOR ALL THOSE WHO HAVE BEEN TRYING TO CONVINCE THE SIKHS TO BELIEVE THAT THEIR BELIEF IN 'DHAN “DHAN SIRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI” BEING THEIR LIVING GURU' IS SUBJECT TO BE CORRECTED.

Surinder ji, Harjas ji, Salinder ji, and others

What is most troubling in the several threads that are alive right now? The background message that has been promoted by one or two people that goes like this. "If we understand ourselves, we will find that we are one with God, that we are like God, and that therefore we are God." Of courese, if anyone believes that, then they can give themselves permission to correct Siri Guru Granth Sahib ji! Whenever I read these statements, and they are not subtle suggestions, I want to say it is spiritually frightening. Let me be the slave of the slave who touches the feet of Nanak! It is a kinder, gentler place to be.

Respectfully
 
Apr 20, 2006
80
4
Oh, people, people!
All of you are so wrong!!!
Nobody is saying your faith is wrong.
We are only replying to the vast propoganda people of your domain are churning out against our belief.

Surinder Kaurji, in case you haven't noticed I have only EVER replied to attacks on my beliefs or contributed to debates which I agree with.
If you have the right to express your views and beliefs on Sikhi, so do other Sikhs of other viewpoints.
Don't put yourselves on a pedestial and say 'we' have a right, but you don't. That -when Namdhari Sikhs present their views they are agents of the RSS and other facist organisations out to destroy 'our' version of Sikhi!
I am not saying you say this, but there are those who do!

Nobody can destroy FAITH.

Namdhari Sikhs are not taught to attack anyones faith, even other Sikhs who disagree with us. We know a truth in history that gives us the strong faith we have. You have been presented with a truth that you believe. If both those truths give us our respected 'Faith' then therein lies our respective salvations.

But for one to accuse and attack another or to say "We are candidates for Heaven, Mukti, Jivan Mukti, and the 'others' are 'Narakdharis'." is a sin for both sides.

Let us debate as Gursikhs in search of truth. There is much to learn and cutting each others throats or beliefs is not the way forward.

I have the patience and respect to listen to you. Can you extend the same courtesy to me?
 

simpy

SPNer
Mar 28, 2006
1,133
126
Oh, people, people!
All of you are so wrong!!!
Nobody is saying your faith is wrong.
We are only replying to the vast propoganda people of your domain are churning out against our belief.

Surinder Kaurji, in case you haven't noticed I have only EVER replied to attacks on my beliefs or contributed to debates which I agree with.
If you have the right to express your views and beliefs on Sikhi, so do other Sikhs of other viewpoints.
Don't put yourselves on a pedestial and say 'we' have a right, but you don't. That -when Namdhari Sikhs present their views they are agents of the RSS and other facist organisations out to destroy 'our' version of Sikhi!
I am not saying you say this, but there are those who do!

Nobody can destroy FAITH.

Namdhari Sikhs are not taught to attack anyones faith, even other Sikhs who disagree with us. We know a truth in history that gives us the strong faith we have. You have been presented with a truth that you believe. If both those truths give us our respected 'Faith' then therein lies our respective salvations.

But for one to accuse and attack another or to say "we are candidates for Heaven, Mukti, Jivan Mukti, and the 'others' are 'Narakdharis' is a sin for both sides".

Let us debate as Gursikhs in search of truth. There is much to learn and cutting each others throats or beliefs is not the way forward.

I have the patience and respect to listen to you. Can you extend the same courtesy to me?

Respected Sikh NaamDhari Ji,

if others have said anything 'not acceptable' to you, you have also said a lot to them 'not acceptable'.

i even remember you blaiming me(as i was the reason for that) for all that happened in your dera somewhere.

Please, all this i am asking, to end this useless fight, that is all. i am not saying what you believe is wrong, and certainly what others believe is also not wrong.

Now if we are called 'Sikhs' and are doing something we believe that Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Gobind Singh Ji ordered us to do-what is wrong in it. NOTHING.

And one last thing- if you claim yourself to be so NAAMDHARI- you must not be condemning other's faith and blaming them while you are arguing about it. you should only be defending yourself truthfully. and you instead have done a lot of condeming of shabad guru and all that.......

i am not doing this with any wrong purpose. i respect every one.

tell us good things about you, your faith, so that all can understand what you are, show the goodness.....

And Respected drkhalsa Ji even started a new thread for this purpose. Clear others doubts. Why aren't you doing that.

forgive me please
 
Apr 20, 2006
80
4
Surinder Kaur Bhenji

We seem to be going around in circles. I have NEVER blamed you for anything.|I don't have a 'Dera.' :}--}:
And least of all, I DO NOT WANT TO FIGHT WITH YOU. :wah:

You are my Sister. Brothers do not fight with their sisters. (Well at least in theory. Me and my blood sister have some fearsome rows :eek:!)

Please stop hitting me :{-:) (WAH!)
 

spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
SPNer
Jun 17, 2004
14,500
19,216
Naamdari ji

There are probably dozens of readers (not everyone who reads the forum posts or may even be registered) who would deeply appreciate and benefit from an opportunity to read what you have to say about Naamdari, its history and its beliefs. DrKhalsa started a thread for you which I have read. He has been very detailed and also invites you to be part of that dialog since you would have much more of interest to say. No one is happy when anger breaks out.

Respectfully.
 
Apr 20, 2006
80
4
I have already, at DrKhalsajis request, started the the thread under: 'Naam-Dhari is Sikhi'. All who wish to have dialogue (not fights ;) ) about what Namdharis believe can talk with me there, so that we can stop jumping from forum to forum. :shy:
 
Feb 15, 2006
512
18
Sikh Namdhari writes, "Nobody is saying your faith is wrong. We are only replying to the vast propoganda people of your domain are churning out against our belief."

Oh really?

You people don't need vast propaganda against you. Your beliefs are completely anti-Gurmat. The video below is not people making fun of Naamdharis. It's just video of Naamdharis. They are all matatekking to their dedhari guru Jagjit Singh (Not to Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji), while the kukay among them go berserk in his presence, pulling off dastaar, yelling, gyrating, rolling around, dancing in front of the sangat. I've seen the opposition Naamdharies are voicing against the airing of this video on another site. Since this is part of your religious practice, why get nervous when it is exposed for public awareness? Why rant endlessly about hostility, prejudice and anger by Sikhs toward Naamdharies? The video speaks for itself. And no one seems angry at you. This is some bizarre Naamdhari thing. But it is NOT Sikhi.

Watch This--->YouTube - Kookay Gone Wild


All I see are long-winded diatribes written about alleged abuses, hatred, anger, prejudice of mainstream Sikhs and need for tolerance, acceptance. It is NEVER going to happen. Stop badgering mainstream Sikhs to accept your beadbi.

First, you are not Sikhs of ShabadGuru Sahib Ji, you are Sikhs of a dedhari lineage of gurus NOT RECOGNIZED AS VALID BY THE ENTIRE SIKH PANTH. The very terminology you use to defend yourselves actually condemns you. You endlessly and propagandistically claim legitimacy of your dedhari lineage like termites while distorting Gurbani in missionary fashion, and whine when Sikhs reject this.

I personally am not intolerant of your traditions. I oppose all missionary efforts. If you come here and say, We are Naamdharies, this is our opinion, people will look at it, some will accept some things. But you don't. Naamdhari missionaries come with a deliberate agenda to confuse and distort teachings already long accepted as mainstream Sikhi, to challenge and undermine these sacred beliefs in order to gain some acceptance and confuse the unaware.

In your shameless self-promotion and missionary efforts, you violate the basic definitions of Sikhi. And it is for this you are attacked. People attack your positions strongly, because your positions are an aggressive and hostile attempt to undermine Gursikhi. So you get exactly what you provoke.

For anyone to accept you as "Sikhs," they are acknowledging your dedhari lineage is valid. And by implication, invalidating the legitimacy and sole Gurgaddi of Shabad Guru Sahib Maharaj. It cannot be both ways.

So what is the point of a thread "Naamdhari is Sikhi?" If not to provoke opposition from mainstream Sikhs who have never accepted this, which you then bemoan, cry, attack, belittle and challenge with missionary propaganda?

I don't see abuses against poor beleagured Naamdharis on these threads. I see intelligent, well-thought out, relentless missionary campaign to undermine distinctions of mainstream Sikhi. To distort and reinterpret sacred Gurbani to manipulate favor toward your dedhari cult. People naturally oppose the confusion you propagandistically spout.

Let's be clear on this. You are no brother of mine. You are all outcasted from the Panth. I did not do this. My krodh did not do this. My narrow-minded prejudice and whatever else you rant and accuse did not do this. THE AKAL TAKHT DID THIS. End of story. You are not Sikhs by any accepted Panthic definition no matter how many websites you infiltrate.

Sikh Namdhari writes, "Don't put yourselves on a pedestial and say 'we' have a right, but you don't. That -when Namdhari Sikhs present their views they are agents of the RSS and other facist organisations out to destroy 'our' version of Sikhi!


Paycheck from Badal and SAD/RSS-BJP accepted by Naamdhari "satguru" Jagjit Singh.
3196_NaamdhariBadal.jpg


Panthic Weekly: Badal Promises Revival of Anti-Sikh ‘Namdhari’ Cult

"The Sikh community is fully cognizant that the same extremist Brahmanic forces that have attempted to annihilate the Sikh nation via actions such as 'Operation Bluestar' and the November 1984 Anti-Sikh Pogroms, are also the driving forces behind terrorist organizations such as the RSS. Where in the past few decades, the primary objective of these Brahmanic forces was the physical annihilation of the Sikh Nation; the RSS has now coordinated with them to destroy the fundamental institutions and core-principals of the Sikh religion through other means."

Panthic Weekly: RSS Attempt to Infiltrate Panth using counterfeit Sikh organizations

Welcoming Former Hindus Back to the Fold
In the afternoon session Jagadguru Shri Vishyesh-Teertha of the Madhav Sampradaya, Sadguru Jagajit Singh of Namdhari Sikh Panth; Guru Raghavacharya of Ramanuja Panth; Buddha Bhikshu Shasan Rashmi and Shri Dhunda Maharaj of the Bhagwat Sampradaya of Maharashtra, spoke on the basic values and ideals common to all sects of the Hindu Society.
Swami Vishvesh Teertha in his brilliant and inspiring speech in Hindi emphatically dealt with the need for all the Sampradayas coming together to lead the Hindu society. He said, "We are all in one boat. If the Hindu society is to sail smoothly to its destined course ahead in future, all those who are guiding, piloting, as also those who are being led and directed must act in unison and steer this great ship of Hinduism to safety, security and prosperity. We cannot and should not quarrel amongst ourselves and pull in opposite directions."

A significant resolution adopted in this session pertained to Hindus who had renounced Swadharma, because of coercion or temptation, and said that "the pressing need of the time is the assimilation, through return back of all such people, who may desire, out of their own free will, to return to the faith of their forefathers."

Vishva Hindu Parishad

From the Vishwa Hindu Parishad Website:

Namdhari Sikh Radio
Description: Listen to Shabad Gurbani and Katha Kirtan performed by Namdhari Sikhs online, Free! Also available: Namdhari MP3s and Video clips.
Added on: 31-Dec-2003 Hits: 320
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Category: Hinduism

Rashtriya Swayam Sevak
Description: A unique phenomenon in the history of Bharat in the twentieth century is the birth and unceasing growth of Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS).
Added on: 31-Dec-2003 Hits: 313
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Category: Hindu Organizations

Vishwa Hindu Parishad of America - Web Links

Sadly Naamdharis and their traitor "satguru" ARE IN FACT agents of the RSS working to assimilate Sikhs into the Hindu fold.

Whatever Jagjit Singh is, he is definitely NOT a SIKH! And he is most definitely NOT Guruji!
 
Aug 29, 2010
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We have to understand the correct reference meaning of the word "GURU" from Gurbaani then our most of the questions would be solved.
We would find that in Gurbaani the word "GURU" is the reference for A WORD as SABADuand not the reference for any physical body person.
This is thus very important .
Prakash.S.Bagga
 
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