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Christianity Miracles, Stigmata Etc

Discussion in 'Interfaith Dialogues' started by abyss, Jun 29, 2004.

  1. abyss

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    I notice how quickly atheists and evolutionists put their fingers in their ears
    and shout "Lah, lah, Lah, I can't hear you" whenever a Christian or Creationist brings up the subject of miracles. This is what I really want to address because...
    if miracles are possible, it means that supernatural intervention is possible and it means that a God could have created the universe.

    So, bring it on. Who can show clear evidence that supernatural intervention has happened beyond reasonable doubt, on the balance of probability. Meaning..don't cite psychological factors as causes just because it is convenient, while ignoring the balance of probability. I also don't want to hear anything off-topic like WHY God allows such things to happen. We have to assume that God is always right in this instance. This is just a distraction technique. We are just looking at whether miracles happen and their implications for a discussion on creationism and God.

    I'll start it off. I'm a Christian and I believe in Jesus and that his passion and
    sacrifice were meaningful for the world. I'm also fascinated by the many miracles that occur for believers, some of which are seldom heard about because of the humility of the recipients. One such recipient was Therese Neumann a 19th Century German nun who experienced stigmata and other miracles during her lifetime. I direct you to: http://www.thereseneumann.de/thereseenglish/index.htm

    Before racing back to respond at this forum, take a moment to think about what you are saying.

    Thanks for your time.
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  3. Amarpal

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    Mentor Writer SPNer Thinker

    Jun 11, 2004
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    Dear Member (abyss)

    Beliefs are views that one holds to be true, in reality they may or may not be so. Miracles are happening that cannot be explained with the current knowledge of laws of nature. With this in mind I state my views.

    Each breathe that I take, for me, it is an act of God – it is a natural course of God’s action. God is very powerful. ‘The Almighty can do whatever it wants. God knows all what is happening. If God wants to give me some thing it can do so in the normal course itself; if God wants to deny me some thing it will not give me in the first place or take it away from me in the normal course of events. God does not have to create any miracle.

    What all Jews had gone through during Second World War is now a part of recorded history. I am sure there were many believers among the sufferers, who must have sought divine help, no miracle took place; the events took their normal course. This has been the case during human miseries as we learn from recorded history; God has not intervened through miracles. I do not think that God has any ego; there is no need for God to demonstrate its power or its presence through what is known to be miracle.

    I am convinced that God does not take sides, this life is Karam Bhumi, and we have to chart our own course. For me it is not a matter of belief, but conclusion based on observations and rational analysis that there are no miracles.

    These are my considered views, in a democratic world diversity of views is bound to be there.

    With Love and Respect for all

  4. Aman Singh

    Aman Singh
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    Admin SPNer

    Jun 1, 2004
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    What makes an event a miracle ? I think every moment in which we live is a miracle. We term anything out of ordinary as miracle but once we are aware of its happening, it becomes any other event... Do you think the birth of baby isn't a miracle...:)
  5. sukhi

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    Jun 29, 2004
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    i agree with IdealSingh... when you look at things really carefully, it's a wonder that we're all still alive...
  6. Eclectic

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    Nov 11, 2004
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    To you, that is your truth. Everyone has their own version of the truth. Have you not heard the parable of the three blind men and the elephant? If not click here. It's very, very short.

    Just as we all have difference in opinion when it comes to what is right and what is wrong, we have difference in opinion on what is a music and what is not.

    What do you mean by "bring it on?" Is discussion of religion always an issue of "I'm right and you're wrong"? Or should it be more along the lines of "I beleive this and you believe this, but I want to understand (or am interested in) why"?

    And I surely hope we all try to consider each other's feelings and be mindful of who we talk to and how we talk to them. :)

    My personal opinion on miracles is that what we, each and every person consider a miracle is relative. Don't people remember how there was a time when humanity believed that the forces of nature were the result of an action of a God or Goddess? And when we learned of these things and how they truly happen, people didn't turn directly to the notion God. However, in some cases, although we may know the scientific reasons behind the causes of the forces of nature, some (preferably the spiritual) may say God caused these things to happen through the art of science as a sign that God is listening (or whatever that specific sign may mean to you). It's all relative. So I don't think it's fair to "accuse" someone of not believing what you do.
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