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'Begging' In Gurbani
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<blockquote data-quote="Ishna" data-source="post: 193240" data-attributes="member: 2709"><p>So, in a thread about prayer, Admin ji, Lucky ji and I took a short detour about 'begging'. The detour started <a href="http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/questions-and-answers/41843-prayers-do-they-really-change-things.html#post193222" target="_blank">here </a>(for the <em>really</em> curious SPNers :grinningkaur<img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" />.</p><p> </p><p>Anyway, long story short, I said:</p><p></p><p> </p><p>And Admin ji said:</p><p></p><p> </p><p>Admin ji also suggested that Vedic/Christian overtones in the translation might be skewing the impression in English. Here's an example where the idea of begging makes an appearance:</p><p> </p><p>From <a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=321" target="_blank">Ang 321</a></p><p><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="color: #800000"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਪਉੜੀ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਪਉੜੀ </span></a>॥</span></span></p><p>Pa▫oṛī.</p><p><span style="color: #000080">Pauree:</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="color: #800000"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਸਭੇ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਸਭੇ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਵਸਤੂ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਵਸਤੂ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਕਉੜੀਆ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਕਉੜੀਆ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਸਚੇ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਸਚੇ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਨਾਉ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਨਾਉ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਮਿਠਾ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਮਿਠਾ </span></a>॥</span></span></p><p>Sabẖe vasṯū ka▫uṛī▫ā sacẖe nā▫o miṯẖā.</p><p><span style="color: #000080">All material things are bitter; the True Name alone is sweet.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="color: #800000"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਸਾਦੁ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਸਾਦੁ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਆਇਆ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਆਇਆ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਤਿਨ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਤਿਨ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਹਰਿ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਹਰਿ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਜਨਾਂ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਜਨਾਂ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਚਖਿ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਚਖਿ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਸਾਧੀ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਸਾਧੀ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਡਿਠਾ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਡਿਠਾ </span></a>॥</span></span></p><p>Sāḏ ā▫i▫ā ṯin har janāʼn cẖakẖ sāḏẖī diṯẖā.</p><p><span style="color: #000080">Those humble servants of the Lord who taste it, come to savor its flavor.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="color: #800000"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮਿ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮਿ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਜਿਸੁ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਜਿਸੁ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਲਿਖਿਆ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਲਿਖਿਆ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਮਨਿ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਮਨਿ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਤਿਸੈ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਤਿਸੈ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਵੁਠਾ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਵੁਠਾ </span></a>॥</span></span></p><p>Pārbarahm jis likẖi▫ā man ṯisai vuṯẖā.</p><p><span style="color: #000080">It comes to dwell within the mind of those who are so pre-destined by the Supreme Lord God.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="color: #800000"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਇਕੁ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਇਕੁ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਰਵਿ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਰਵਿ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਰਹਿਆ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਰਹਿਆ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਭਾਉ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਭਾਉ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਦੁਯਾ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਦੁਯਾ </span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਕੁਠਾ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc">ਕੁਠਾ </span></a>॥</span></span></p><p>Ik niranjan rav rahi▫ā bẖā▫o ḏuyā kuṯẖā.</p><p><span style="color: #000080">The One Immaculate Lord is pervading everywhere; He destroys the love of duality.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="color: #800000"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਹਰਿ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc"><strong>ਹਰਿ </strong></span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਨਾਨਕੁ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc"><strong>ਨਾਨਕੁ </strong></span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਮੰਗੈ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc"><strong>ਮੰਗੈ </strong></span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਜੋੜਿ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc"><strong>ਜੋੜਿ </strong></span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਕਰ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc"><strong>ਕਰ </strong></span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਪ੍ਰਭੁ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc"><strong>ਪ੍ਰਭੁ </strong></span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਦੇਵੈ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc"><strong>ਦੇਵੈ </strong></span></a><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਤੁਠਾ" target="_blank"><span style="color: #0066cc"><strong>ਤੁਠਾ </strong></span></a><strong>॥੧੩॥</strong></span></span></p><p><strong>Har Nānak mangai joṛ kar parabẖ ḏevai ṯuṯẖā. ||13||</strong></p><p><strong><span style="color: #000080">Nanak begs for the Lord's Name, with his palms pressed together; by His Pleasure, God has granted it. ||13||</span></strong></p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>So, what does 'mangai' in the above mean? Does it mean 'to beg' in the literal sense of begging, and is this a thought pattern we should be encouraging in our minds?</p><p> </p><p>Please Lucky ji, Admin ji, feel free to add if you think I've left anything out.</p><p> </p><p>Many thanks.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ishna, post: 193240, member: 2709"] So, in a thread about prayer, Admin ji, Lucky ji and I took a short detour about 'begging'. The detour started [URL="http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/questions-and-answers/41843-prayers-do-they-really-change-things.html#post193222"]here [/URL](for the [I]really[/I] curious SPNers :grinningkaur:). Anyway, long story short, I said: And Admin ji said: Admin ji also suggested that Vedic/Christian overtones in the translation might be skewing the impression in English. Here's an example where the idea of begging makes an appearance: From [URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=321"]Ang 321[/URL] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਪਉੜੀ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਪਉੜੀ [/COLOR][/URL]॥[/COLOR][/FONT] Pa▫oṛī. [COLOR=#000080]Pauree:[/COLOR] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਸਭੇ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਸਭੇ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਵਸਤੂ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਵਸਤੂ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਕਉੜੀਆ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਕਉੜੀਆ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਸਚੇ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਸਚੇ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਨਾਉ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਨਾਉ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਮਿਠਾ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਮਿਠਾ [/COLOR][/URL]॥[/COLOR][/FONT] Sabẖe vasṯū ka▫uṛī▫ā sacẖe nā▫o miṯẖā. [COLOR=#000080]All material things are bitter; the True Name alone is sweet.[/COLOR] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਸਾਦੁ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਸਾਦੁ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਆਇਆ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਆਇਆ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਤਿਨ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਤਿਨ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਹਰਿ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਹਰਿ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਜਨਾਂ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਜਨਾਂ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਚਖਿ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਚਖਿ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਸਾਧੀ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਸਾਧੀ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਡਿਠਾ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਡਿਠਾ [/COLOR][/URL]॥[/COLOR][/FONT] Sāḏ ā▫i▫ā ṯin har janāʼn cẖakẖ sāḏẖī diṯẖā. [COLOR=#000080]Those humble servants of the Lord who taste it, come to savor its flavor.[/COLOR] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮਿ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮਿ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਜਿਸੁ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਜਿਸੁ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਲਿਖਿਆ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਲਿਖਿਆ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਮਨਿ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਮਨਿ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਤਿਸੈ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਤਿਸੈ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਵੁਠਾ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਵੁਠਾ [/COLOR][/URL]॥[/COLOR][/FONT] Pārbarahm jis likẖi▫ā man ṯisai vuṯẖā. [COLOR=#000080]It comes to dwell within the mind of those who are so pre-destined by the Supreme Lord God.[/COLOR] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਇਕੁ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਇਕੁ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਰਵਿ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਰਵਿ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਰਹਿਆ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਰਹਿਆ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਭਾਉ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਭਾਉ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਦੁਯਾ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਦੁਯਾ [/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਕੁਠਾ"][COLOR=#0066cc]ਕੁਠਾ [/COLOR][/URL]॥[/COLOR][/FONT] Ik niranjan rav rahi▫ā bẖā▫o ḏuyā kuṯẖā. [COLOR=#000080]The One Immaculate Lord is pervading everywhere; He destroys the love of duality.[/COLOR] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਹਰਿ"][COLOR=#0066cc][B]ਹਰਿ [/B][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਨਾਨਕੁ"][COLOR=#0066cc][B]ਨਾਨਕੁ [/B][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਮੰਗੈ"][COLOR=#0066cc][B]ਮੰਗੈ [/B][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਜੋੜਿ"][COLOR=#0066cc][B]ਜੋੜਿ [/B][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਕਰ"][COLOR=#0066cc][B]ਕਰ [/B][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਪ੍ਰਭੁ"][COLOR=#0066cc][B]ਪ੍ਰਭੁ [/B][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਦੇਵੈ"][COLOR=#0066cc][B]ਦੇਵੈ [/B][/COLOR][/URL][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.dictionary?Param=ਤੁਠਾ"][COLOR=#0066cc][B]ਤੁਠਾ [/B][/COLOR][/URL][B]॥੧੩॥[/B][/COLOR][/FONT] [B]Har Nānak mangai joṛ kar parabẖ ḏevai ṯuṯẖā. ||13||[/B] [B][COLOR=#000080]Nanak begs for the Lord's Name, with his palms pressed together; by His Pleasure, God has granted it. ||13||[/COLOR][/B] So, what does 'mangai' in the above mean? Does it mean 'to beg' in the literal sense of begging, and is this a thought pattern we should be encouraging in our minds? Please Lucky ji, Admin ji, feel free to add if you think I've left anything out. Many thanks. [/QUOTE]
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'Begging' In Gurbani
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