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A Conscious Creator In Sikhi And Other Faith Traditions?

Discussion in 'Interfaith Dialogues' started by Harkiran Kaur, Mar 25, 2013.

  1. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Mentor Writer SPNer Thinker

    Jun 30, 2004
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    Akiva ji,

    Guru Fateh.

    That is an interesting outlook and a valid one. Could you please elaborate your thought on what is in bold above and its modus operandi?

    1.How can one share one's personal experience of one's inner spiritual treasures on the internet to the faceless world?

    2. One's awareness in what respect?

    3. How does one go about finding our Gurus' intentions and/or of all the other writers of Gurbani in the SGGS?

    4. Lastly, how can one use that experience and awareness learnt through Gurbani to enhance one's everyday's life?

    Input from all would be highly appreciated.

    Thanks and regards

    Tejwant Singh
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  2. akiva

    akiva Israel
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    Apr 20, 2011
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    Tejwant Ji
    Guru Fateh

    The first "given" is that Spiritual experiences and awareness change how one perceives the world. The degree of that change is proportional to the degree of the experience.

    The second given is that Gurbani was written/taught by people who had undergone that change.

    the "quick" answer is that one can't - because in a real sense it's a non-verbal experience. When talking with another person who has shared that experience one can refer to elements using words (hence the personification and metaphor in Gurbani) and the other person will recognise the context you are refering to.

    Hence the importance of Sangat (in it's original intention)

    The most we can do to share on the internet (or even in person) is 1) try to describe the experience as simply as possible; 2) more importantly --let the lesson of that experience change us and how we relate/interact with the world/people around us.

    (As an aside -- there ARE scientific mappings of the "spiritual experience" space -- Grof is a good place to start.)

    I used "awareness" in the Zen Buddhist sense - both the "self-awareness" and the awareness of the world outside us, that comes when the veil of illusion is stripped away.

    As one progresses in meditation/simran/jap one (should) begin to have flashes of that awareness (by analogy -- outside on a dark night, when a flash of lightning briefly illuminates the world around you). As one progresses that awareness happens more often and for longer periods of time.

    The simple answer: by growing in Spiritual awareness. As one grows the meaning of Gurbani will reveal itself.

    For those of us without that insight: study and contemplation (which is, itself, a form of meditation/simran/jap) can also reveal insights and meaning.

    As we grow it should become harder and harder to do the "wrong" act, and easier to do the "right" act.

    But it's not automatic -- as long as we are here the temptations of the world/flesh are there as well.

    All the best
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  3. Scarlet Pimpernel

    Scarlet Pimpernel
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    We seek him here,we sikh
    SPNer Supporter

    May 31, 2011
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    Veer ji ironically our Mool Mantra is a one liner ,a few words and our root.

    Ps I'm biased towards one liners
    #183 Scarlet Pimpernel, Apr 17, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2013
  4. OP
    Harkiran Kaur

    Harkiran Kaur India
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    Writer SPNer Thinker

    Jul 21, 2012
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    At the Gurdwara last night I noticed on the screen, some words that would assist in this:

    Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji P. 940
    This seems to suggest the creator does not only POSSESS consciousness.... but in fact IS CONSCIOUSNESS.

    Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji P.997 (I didn't quote the whole thing because there really is no other way to interpret the words 'supreme consciousness' however I put the page so that you can read the whole thing yourself.)


    Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji P. 1362
    Again, it is suggesting that our consciousness can be merged with a 'supreme consciousness' I don't see how the word consciousness can just be a metaphor in these cases. It's pretty straight language... and the meaning is pretty straight forward in suggesting that there is a supreme consciousness.

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  5. Original

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    Jan 10, 2011
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    Hello Harkiran & Balbir - hope you good n living it to the T !

    ..it's difficult to comment without full coverage, but suffice to say, your observation stands it's ground and is further supported by the term "parm pad". Parm Pad is a state of consciousness that succeeds the three ordinary states. In other words, chautha pad, meaning the fourth state:

    ਰਜ ਗੁਣ ਤਮ ਗੁਣ ਸਤ ਗੁਣ ਕਹੀਐ ਇਹ ਤੇਰੀ ਸਭ ਮਾਇਆ ॥ ਚਉਥੇ ਪਦ ਕਉ ਜੋ ਨਰੁ ਚੀਨ੍ਹ੍ਹੈ ਤਿਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਹੀ ਪਰਮ ਪਦੁ ਪਾਇਆ
    Raj gun tam gun sat gun kaheeai ih teri sabh maya. Chauthe pad kau jo nar cheenai tin hee param pad paaiaa ||2||: (O Lord) Raajas, Taamas, and Saatav modes are the creations of Your Maya. The man who realizes the Fourth State; he alone obtains the Supreme Status ||2|| [SGGSJ 1123].

    Goodnight !
  6. sukhsingh

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    Writer SPNer Thinker

    Aug 14, 2012
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    Just read this it is a interesting article but I'm not sure I agree.. Would love to explore it further
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