☀️ JOIN SPN MOBILE
Forums
New posts
Guru Granth Sahib
Composition, Arrangement & Layout
ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
Ashtpadiyan (235-242)
Chhant (242-249)
Baavan Akhari (250-262)
Sukhmani (262-296)
Thittee (296-300)
Gauree kii Vaar (300-323)
Gurbani (323-330)
Ashtpadiyan (330-340)
Baavan Akhari (340-343)
Thintteen (343-344)
Vaar Kabir (344-345)
Bhagat Bani (345-346)
ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
Aasaavaree (409-411)
Ashtpadiyan (411-432)
Patee (432-435)
Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
Bhagat Bani (475-488)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
Asatpadhiya (634-642)
Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
Gurbani (876-902)
Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
New resources
Latest activity
Videos
New media
New comments
Library
Latest reviews
Donate
Log in
Register
What's new
New posts
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
Sign up
Log in
Discussions
Sikh Sikhi Sikhism
Why Are We Not Allowed To Cut Hair When It's Ok To Cut Nails, Since Both Are Created By God?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Archived_member14" data-source="post: 162716" data-attributes="member: 586"><p>Gyani ji,</p><p></p><p></p><p>I consider the opportunity to hear and discuss these things rare. I therefore would like to be as direct as possible.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It is a general statement not pointing to particular incidents, but universal truths. </p><p></p><p>A Sikh who decides to cut his long hair will not have any spiritual reasons for doing so (if there are some unusual exceptions, we should not consider it). It is clear then that he does it with attachment and if connected with some image, there must also be conceit. </p><p></p><p>A Sikh who maintains hair due to spiritual reasons has wrong understanding, since hair as you have said also, has nothing to do with the ability to develop goodness or wisdom. When there is wrong understanding, there must also be attachment associated with it. But also the very idea of long hair invariable becomes the object of sense attachment especially when there is the kind of wrong understanding. And in thinking that “I have long (or short) hair”, this is clearly an expression of conceit. </p><p></p><p>Do you disagree with this? If so, what is the reason?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You had written in your original message:</p><p></p><p>“Just because a CUT hair person thinks hes BETTER simply due to his short hair”</p><p></p><p>This I took as projecting a situation not likely to ever happen. If there are rare cases that a Sikh decides to cut his hair thinking that he will be a “better” person in doing so, it must be very rare. But certainly this can’t be taken to represent all those other people who do so simply out of attachment and conceit, can it? On the other hand, Sikhs who keep hair as a religious symbol and who convince themselves by making the association with particular moral qualities, this is very common is it not? Even if they do not in their minds, form an idea regarding why hair must be kept, do they not however feel that in cutting their hair they would be doing wrong?</p><p></p><p>Do my statements appear to be made up, if so, in what way? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And according to your criterion, what you state above is just opinion. Doesn't sound right, does it?</p><p>One of us may be right and the other wrong or both are wrong depending on the topic of discussion. Indeed we may both be wrong about everything; however this would be due to conditions and can’t be helped. But to presume that what we say is only opinion, makes pointless any discussion of this sort, I’d think. </p><p></p><p>Would it not be that you have some level of understanding with regard to the truth that there is some validity in your stating that the Gurbani contains the Truth? Why then suggest that we come in thinking that what we say is only opinion? Why not discuss what is said in order to determine whether or not it is in line with the Truth?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>What you describe appears as a case simply of attachment and conceit and is what I had pointed out. But in your original post you had said:</p><p> </p><p>“Just because a CUT hair person thinks hes BETTER simply due to his short hair”</p><p></p><p>As I said, it appears very unusual this particular line of thought. It may be that this had in fact nothing to do with spiritual aims, but why then compare this with the person who keeps his hair whose reasons include spiritual ones?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It is good to hear that you keep friendship with Sikhs regardless of whether they keep or cut their hair. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It is to be expected that everyone, both young and old, is full of attachment. Going to discos and bars is what young people like to do and if not this, they'd be attached to something else. Not going to discos and drinking does not therefore prove that there is no attachment; indeed there may be attachment to *not doing* these things. So why take the concept of amritdhari so seriously? There appears to be so much unnecessary suppression and guilt involved in the whole thing. </p><p></p><p>If attachment to sense objects is wrong, point out to the nature of attachment. In highlighting certain aspects and the idea that in being able to avoid these one is on the right track, this easily becomes yet another object of attachment, which means that in the end it serves no purpose at all. Besides which is worse, a person who drinks but knows that it is not good, or someone who does not drink, but not aware of his attachments?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Archived_member14, post: 162716, member: 586"] Gyani ji, I consider the opportunity to hear and discuss these things rare. I therefore would like to be as direct as possible. It is a general statement not pointing to particular incidents, but universal truths. A Sikh who decides to cut his long hair will not have any spiritual reasons for doing so (if there are some unusual exceptions, we should not consider it). It is clear then that he does it with attachment and if connected with some image, there must also be conceit. A Sikh who maintains hair due to spiritual reasons has wrong understanding, since hair as you have said also, has nothing to do with the ability to develop goodness or wisdom. When there is wrong understanding, there must also be attachment associated with it. But also the very idea of long hair invariable becomes the object of sense attachment especially when there is the kind of wrong understanding. And in thinking that “I have long (or short) hair”, this is clearly an expression of conceit. Do you disagree with this? If so, what is the reason? You had written in your original message: “Just because a CUT hair person thinks hes BETTER simply due to his short hair” This I took as projecting a situation not likely to ever happen. If there are rare cases that a Sikh decides to cut his hair thinking that he will be a “better” person in doing so, it must be very rare. But certainly this can’t be taken to represent all those other people who do so simply out of attachment and conceit, can it? On the other hand, Sikhs who keep hair as a religious symbol and who convince themselves by making the association with particular moral qualities, this is very common is it not? Even if they do not in their minds, form an idea regarding why hair must be kept, do they not however feel that in cutting their hair they would be doing wrong? Do my statements appear to be made up, if so, in what way? And according to your criterion, what you state above is just opinion. Doesn't sound right, does it? One of us may be right and the other wrong or both are wrong depending on the topic of discussion. Indeed we may both be wrong about everything; however this would be due to conditions and can’t be helped. But to presume that what we say is only opinion, makes pointless any discussion of this sort, I’d think. Would it not be that you have some level of understanding with regard to the truth that there is some validity in your stating that the Gurbani contains the Truth? Why then suggest that we come in thinking that what we say is only opinion? Why not discuss what is said in order to determine whether or not it is in line with the Truth? What you describe appears as a case simply of attachment and conceit and is what I had pointed out. But in your original post you had said: “Just because a CUT hair person thinks hes BETTER simply due to his short hair” As I said, it appears very unusual this particular line of thought. It may be that this had in fact nothing to do with spiritual aims, but why then compare this with the person who keeps his hair whose reasons include spiritual ones? It is good to hear that you keep friendship with Sikhs regardless of whether they keep or cut their hair. It is to be expected that everyone, both young and old, is full of attachment. Going to discos and bars is what young people like to do and if not this, they'd be attached to something else. Not going to discos and drinking does not therefore prove that there is no attachment; indeed there may be attachment to *not doing* these things. So why take the concept of amritdhari so seriously? There appears to be so much unnecessary suppression and guilt involved in the whole thing. If attachment to sense objects is wrong, point out to the nature of attachment. In highlighting certain aspects and the idea that in being able to avoid these one is on the right track, this easily becomes yet another object of attachment, which means that in the end it serves no purpose at all. Besides which is worse, a person who drinks but knows that it is not good, or someone who does not drink, but not aware of his attachments? [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Discussions
Sikh Sikhi Sikhism
Why Are We Not Allowed To Cut Hair When It's Ok To Cut Nails, Since Both Are Created By God?
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
Accept
Learn more…
Top