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ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
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Thintteen (343-344)
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Bhagat Bani (345-346)
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Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
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ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
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Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
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Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
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Gurbani (595-634)
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Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
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Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
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ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
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Anand (917-922)
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Sidh Gosat (938-946)
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Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
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Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
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Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
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Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
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Gurbani (1319-23)
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ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
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Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
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Gurmat Vichaar
Gurmat Vichar - Discussions
Translations Of Sri Guru Granth Sahib: The Difficult And The Contradictory
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<blockquote data-quote="spnadmin" data-source="post: 98461" data-attributes="member: 35"><p><strong>Re: English translation of a hymn by various writers</strong></p><p></p><p>Virinder ji and other participants,</p><p></p><p>Thank you for providing the various translations, I am re-posting part of your original post in order to move in the direction of comparing meanings based on differences in translation. </p><p></p><p>Here is what you posted, as translations by 5 scholars:</p><p></p><p>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~</p><p></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Raavi'">ਕਬੀਰ</span><span style="font-family: 'Raavi'">ਭਾਂਗ</span><span style="font-family: 'Raavi'">ਮਾਛੁਲੀ ਸੁਰਾ ਪਾਨਿ ਜੋ ਜੋ ਪ੍ਰਾਨੀ ਖਾਂਹਿ </span><span style="font-family: 'Mangal'">॥</span><span style="font-family: 'Raavi'"> ਤੀਰਥ ਬਰਤ ਨੇਮ</span><span style="font-family: 'Raavi'">ਕੀਏ ਤੇ ਸਭੈ ਰਸਾਤਲਿ ਜਾਂਹਿ </span><span style="font-family: 'Mangal'">॥</span></p><p> <em><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 12px">Kabir Bhaang Maachulee Sura Paan Jo Jo Praanee Khaaneh, Teerath Barat Naym Keeay Tay Sabhay Rasaatal Jaaneh.</span></span></em></p><p> </p><p> <span style="color: red"><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Translation by Macauliffe in The <a href="http://www.sikhism.us/sikh/" target="_blank">Sikh</a> Religion-Vol-6, Page, 314-published 1909</span></span></span></p><p> </p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Kabir, the mortals who eat bhang, fish (Banares Pundits used to eat fish at the time of Kabir) and drink wine, shall go to hell, whatever pilgramages, fastings, and daily devotion they may perform.</span></span></p><p> </p><p> <span style="color: red"><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Translation by Gurbachan Singh Talib, Vol 4, Page, 2751</span></span></span></p><p>Source:: Sikh Philosophy Network <a href="http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/24574-translations-sri-guru-granth-sahib-maharaj.html" target="_blank">http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=24574</a></p><p> </p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Saith Kabir:Creatures that consume hemp, fish or liquor, Even though visiting holy spots, keeping fasts and vows, All to nethermost hell must go.</span></span></p><p> </p><p> <span style="color: red"><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Translation by Manmohan Singh Vol 8, 1969, Page, 4545</span></span></span></p><p> </p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Kabir, who so ever of the mortals partake of meat (Translated from Bhang), fish, and wine; What ever pilgramages, fasting and daily rites they may perform, they all go to hell.</span></span></p><p> </p><p> <span style="color: red"><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Translation by Gurbachan Singh Makin, Vol 4, Page, 1376/2759</span></span></span></p><p> </p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">O Kabir! Thev persons, who partake of wine, meat,(Extra) and fish (or any viscious thing) waste all their efforts visiting holy place of pilgramage, keeping fasts and other religious formalities as nothing fruitful could be gained by them.</span></span></p><p> </p><p> <span style="color: red"><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Translation by Sant Singh Khalsa.</span></span></span></p><p> </p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Kabir, those mortals who consume marijuana, fish and wine no matter what pilgrimages, fasts and rituals they follow, they will all go to hell.</span></span><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 12px">-----Bhagat Kabir Slokes # 233, AGGS, Page, 1377-2 & 3</span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 12px">Two authors added the word meat, one in place of fish and the other just an additional word.</span></span></p><p></p><p>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~</p><p><span style="color: Blue">I have three questions: </span></p><p></p><p>1. What would be the reason or motivation for a translator to "add" a word (in this case meat) when it is obviously not there. I have observed this in other translations of parts of Granth Sahib Maharaj. The reason cannot be to "clarify" Kabir's meaning in this particular line because bhang, fish and wine/liquor is very specific.</p><p></p><p>2. Does the basic or essential meaning of the line differ in spite of the differences in translation?</p><p></p><p>3. Do we have good reason to believe that Kabir ji is not specifically concerned about bhang, fish and wine/alcohol but instead these refer to or symbolize states of mind on the part of individuals who use them.? As symbols of their arrogance of social status? Or the use of costly foods and substances to brag about their prestige and wealth? Or even the mental amd moral confusion and tendencies to ego, lust, greed, atachment, even anger (in drunkenness) that these substances might cause? </p><p></p><p>Many thanks for your explanations.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="spnadmin, post: 98461, member: 35"] [b]Re: English translation of a hymn by various writers[/b] Virinder ji and other participants, Thank you for providing the various translations, I am re-posting part of your original post in order to move in the direction of comparing meanings based on differences in translation. Here is what you posted, as translations by 5 scholars: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [FONT=Raavi]ਕਬੀਰ[/FONT][FONT=Raavi]ਭਾਂਗ[/FONT][FONT=Raavi]ਮਾਛੁਲੀ ਸੁਰਾ ਪਾਨਿ ਜੋ ਜੋ ਪ੍ਰਾਨੀ ਖਾਂਹਿ [/FONT][FONT=Mangal]॥[/FONT][FONT=Raavi] ਤੀਰਥ ਬਰਤ ਨੇਮ[/FONT][FONT=Raavi]ਕੀਏ ਤੇ ਸਭੈ ਰਸਾਤਲਿ ਜਾਂਹਿ [/FONT][FONT=Mangal]॥[/FONT] [I][FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]Kabir Bhaang Maachulee Sura Paan Jo Jo Praanee Khaaneh, Teerath Barat Naym Keeay Tay Sabhay Rasaatal Jaaneh.[/SIZE][/FONT][/I] [COLOR=red][SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Translation by Macauliffe in The [URL="http://www.sikhism.us/sikh/"]Sikh[/URL] Religion-Vol-6, Page, 314-published 1909[/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR] [SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Kabir, the mortals who eat bhang, fish (Banares Pundits used to eat fish at the time of Kabir) and drink wine, shall go to hell, whatever pilgramages, fastings, and daily devotion they may perform.[/FONT][/SIZE] [COLOR=red][SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Translation by Gurbachan Singh Talib, Vol 4, Page, 2751[/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR] Source:: Sikh Philosophy Network [URL="http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/24574-translations-sri-guru-granth-sahib-maharaj.html"]http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=24574[/URL] [SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Saith Kabir:Creatures that consume hemp, fish or liquor, Even though visiting holy spots, keeping fasts and vows, All to nethermost hell must go.[/FONT][/SIZE] [COLOR=red][SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Translation by Manmohan Singh Vol 8, 1969, Page, 4545[/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR] [SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Kabir, who so ever of the mortals partake of meat (Translated from Bhang), fish, and wine; What ever pilgramages, fasting and daily rites they may perform, they all go to hell.[/FONT][/SIZE] [COLOR=red][SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Translation by Gurbachan Singh Makin, Vol 4, Page, 1376/2759[/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR] [SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]O Kabir! Thev persons, who partake of wine, meat,(Extra) and fish (or any viscious thing) waste all their efforts visiting holy place of pilgramage, keeping fasts and other religious formalities as nothing fruitful could be gained by them.[/FONT][/SIZE] [COLOR=red][SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Translation by Sant Singh Khalsa.[/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR] [SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]Kabir, those mortals who consume marijuana, fish and wine no matter what pilgrimages, fasts and rituals they follow, they will all go to hell.[/FONT][/SIZE][FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]-----Bhagat Kabir Slokes # 233, AGGS, Page, 1377-2 & 3[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]Two authors added the word meat, one in place of fish and the other just an additional word.[/SIZE][/FONT] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [COLOR=Blue]I have three questions: [/COLOR] 1. What would be the reason or motivation for a translator to "add" a word (in this case meat) when it is obviously not there. I have observed this in other translations of parts of Granth Sahib Maharaj. The reason cannot be to "clarify" Kabir's meaning in this particular line because bhang, fish and wine/liquor is very specific. 2. Does the basic or essential meaning of the line differ in spite of the differences in translation? 3. Do we have good reason to believe that Kabir ji is not specifically concerned about bhang, fish and wine/alcohol but instead these refer to or symbolize states of mind on the part of individuals who use them.? As symbols of their arrogance of social status? Or the use of costly foods and substances to brag about their prestige and wealth? Or even the mental amd moral confusion and tendencies to ego, lust, greed, atachment, even anger (in drunkenness) that these substances might cause? Many thanks for your explanations. [/QUOTE]
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Gurmat Vichaar
Gurmat Vichar - Discussions
Translations Of Sri Guru Granth Sahib: The Difficult And The Contradictory
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