☀️ JOIN SPN MOBILE
Forums
New posts
Guru Granth Sahib
Composition, Arrangement & Layout
ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
Ashtpadiyan (235-242)
Chhant (242-249)
Baavan Akhari (250-262)
Sukhmani (262-296)
Thittee (296-300)
Gauree kii Vaar (300-323)
Gurbani (323-330)
Ashtpadiyan (330-340)
Baavan Akhari (340-343)
Thintteen (343-344)
Vaar Kabir (344-345)
Bhagat Bani (345-346)
ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
Aasaavaree (409-411)
Ashtpadiyan (411-432)
Patee (432-435)
Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
Bhagat Bani (475-488)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
Asatpadhiya (634-642)
Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
Gurbani (876-902)
Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
New resources
Latest activity
Videos
New media
New comments
Library
Latest reviews
Donate
Log in
Register
What's new
New posts
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
Sign up
Log in
Discussions
Questions & Answers
Sikh Rehat Maryada
Occultism - Rejection In Sikh Reht Maryada (SRM)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="BhagatSingh" data-source="post: 174288" data-attributes="member: 2610"><p>Can we all agree that during the times of Gurus these characters and stories were believed in, known by the majority of the population? </p><p></p><p>In India, this is certainly the case <em>even</em> today. The stories are everywhere, in images, in media, in daily conversation. We speak of stories and narratives of our time, stories like big bang, space exploration, evolution by natural selection, string theory, similarly the narratives in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji represent the stories of Guru ji's times and they are not to be taken lightly.</p><p></p><p>Imagine you are a great spiritual teacher of our time. You write a book, inspire millions into following your path, and die in peace. Your book gets analyzed by those from a different culture and belief system. They study your book, and say "When Harry mentions big bang theory, this is not because he himself believes in big bang theory, but because the people whom he was talking to were believers in big bang, and thus to relate to them he used big bang theory as only a metaphor. Big bang did not <em>really</em> happen, and Ambarsaria did not <em>actually</em> believe in it. It is for the sake of relativity."</p><p></p><p>This is just a ridiculous claim.</p><p></p><p>For someone from that culture to understand what 'Sant' Harry and 'Guru' Ambarsaria said and why they said it, they would need to study the big bang theory, along with the related narratives of our Harry's and Ambarsaria's times, our times. They would have to study our culture, our books, pretty everything about us and our environment in order to understand their message.</p><p></p><p>This is true of any of the authors of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, they are from a different time period, different culture. No one in our time and culture (western culture) can take them seriously because we were born in a different environment. We do not constantly hear of the exploits of Chandi in battle, nor hear of the 24 incarnations of Hari. Thus we do not take them to be real or meaningful in anyway. </p><p></p><p>And that's ok. I am not saying to force yourself to do this. I know you can't. Neither can I. For us, those tales do not register on a level they should and indeed did for Gurus and their contemporaries. You guys have made it clear with ample evidence on the forums that they don't register on any level with you. And that's ok.</p><p></p><p>But what is not Ok, is when you go around and claim that those who believe in those tales, for whom those tales resonate, are at odds with the message of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. This is just false, for they are more in touch with the culture of Guru ji's times than you are.</p><p></p><p>And what is equally false is when you claim that there is no need to study that culture. No need to study the belief systems of Gurus and their contemporaries. That is just too ridiculous a claim. It's uninformed.</p><p></p><p>These characters need to be looked in to for us to get a deeper understanding of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Of course the level to which their tales register on any meaningful level will vary with each person. But it would be agreed that they were meaningful to Guru Sahibs and their contemporaries, and need to studied in order to better understand their message. </p><p></p><p>And this is the way of a scholar. To study things in depth, which means studying things that at first may not be meaningful. And only through, either studying ourselves, or by listening to someone who has studied themselves, or both, can we gain a superior insight into Sikh theology, belief system, practices and the path to God.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="BhagatSingh, post: 174288, member: 2610"] Can we all agree that during the times of Gurus these characters and stories were believed in, known by the majority of the population? In India, this is certainly the case [I]even[/I] today. The stories are everywhere, in images, in media, in daily conversation. We speak of stories and narratives of our time, stories like big bang, space exploration, evolution by natural selection, string theory, similarly the narratives in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji represent the stories of Guru ji's times and they are not to be taken lightly. Imagine you are a great spiritual teacher of our time. You write a book, inspire millions into following your path, and die in peace. Your book gets analyzed by those from a different culture and belief system. They study your book, and say "When Harry mentions big bang theory, this is not because he himself believes in big bang theory, but because the people whom he was talking to were believers in big bang, and thus to relate to them he used big bang theory as only a metaphor. Big bang did not [I]really[/I] happen, and Ambarsaria did not [I]actually[/I] believe in it. It is for the sake of relativity." This is just a ridiculous claim. For someone from that culture to understand what 'Sant' Harry and 'Guru' Ambarsaria said and why they said it, they would need to study the big bang theory, along with the related narratives of our Harry's and Ambarsaria's times, our times. They would have to study our culture, our books, pretty everything about us and our environment in order to understand their message. This is true of any of the authors of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, they are from a different time period, different culture. No one in our time and culture (western culture) can take them seriously because we were born in a different environment. We do not constantly hear of the exploits of Chandi in battle, nor hear of the 24 incarnations of Hari. Thus we do not take them to be real or meaningful in anyway. And that's ok. I am not saying to force yourself to do this. I know you can't. Neither can I. For us, those tales do not register on a level they should and indeed did for Gurus and their contemporaries. You guys have made it clear with ample evidence on the forums that they don't register on any level with you. And that's ok. But what is not Ok, is when you go around and claim that those who believe in those tales, for whom those tales resonate, are at odds with the message of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. This is just false, for they are more in touch with the culture of Guru ji's times than you are. And what is equally false is when you claim that there is no need to study that culture. No need to study the belief systems of Gurus and their contemporaries. That is just too ridiculous a claim. It's uninformed. These characters need to be looked in to for us to get a deeper understanding of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Of course the level to which their tales register on any meaningful level will vary with each person. But it would be agreed that they were meaningful to Guru Sahibs and their contemporaries, and need to studied in order to better understand their message. And this is the way of a scholar. To study things in depth, which means studying things that at first may not be meaningful. And only through, either studying ourselves, or by listening to someone who has studied themselves, or both, can we gain a superior insight into Sikh theology, belief system, practices and the path to God. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Discussions
Questions & Answers
Sikh Rehat Maryada
Occultism - Rejection In Sikh Reht Maryada (SRM)
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
Accept
Learn more…
Top