☀️ JOIN SPN MOBILE
Forums
New posts
Guru Granth Sahib
Composition, Arrangement & Layout
ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
Ashtpadiyan (235-242)
Chhant (242-249)
Baavan Akhari (250-262)
Sukhmani (262-296)
Thittee (296-300)
Gauree kii Vaar (300-323)
Gurbani (323-330)
Ashtpadiyan (330-340)
Baavan Akhari (340-343)
Thintteen (343-344)
Vaar Kabir (344-345)
Bhagat Bani (345-346)
ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
Aasaavaree (409-411)
Ashtpadiyan (411-432)
Patee (432-435)
Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
Bhagat Bani (475-488)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
Asatpadhiya (634-642)
Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
Gurbani (876-902)
Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
New resources
Latest activity
Videos
New media
New comments
Library
Latest reviews
Donate
Log in
Register
What's new
New posts
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
Sign up
Log in
Discussions
Sikh Sikhi Sikhism
Moving Forward, Or Sliding Backward
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="spnadmin" data-source="post: 135667" data-attributes="member: 35"><p>Sunmukh ji</p><p></p><p>It is very clear that our Gurus Sahiban rejected no one. It is clear that Sri Guru Gobind Singh rejected no one. He did not even reject Auranzeb, even after his elder sons became Shaheeds. </p><p></p><p>Some say Guru Gobind Singh did not write Zafaranameh. Others say that he did. I believe he did write Zafaranameh. Let us for the sake of this discussion accept for this one time only that Dasam Pita did utter these words:</p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">Come to me that we may converse with each other,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">And I may utter some kind words to thee. (60)</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">I’d send thee a horseman like one in a thousand,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">Who will conduct thee safe to my home. (61)</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">I’m a slave of the King of kings,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">And ready to obey His Call with all my heart. (62)</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">If He were to order me thus,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">I’d with utmost pleasure present myself to thee. (63)</span></p><p></p><p>His words are poignantly words of a desire for spiritual brotherhood. Only a great soul could utter these words. And then he goes on to say the following. In the couplete he gives Auranzeb credit for being able to enter into spiritual brotherhood and honor a reasonable reques, based on a mutual connection through One God:</p><p></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">And if you are a believer in One God,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">Tarry not in what I ask you to do. (64)</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen"></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">And the Dasam Pita emjoins Auranzeb to accept dharma because he recognizes that God. </span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen"></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">It is incumbent upon you to recognise the God,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">For He told you not to create strife in the world. (65)</span></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yet Dasam Pita is no fool! And does not mince words.</p><p></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">You occupy the throne, in the name of God, the Sovereign of all creation,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">But strange is thy justice, stranger thy attributes! (66)</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen"></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">What sense of discrimination is this? What regard for religion?</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">O fie on such a sovereignty! Fie a hundred times!! (67)</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen"></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">Stranger than strange are thy decrees, O king,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkOliveGreen">But beware that broken pledges boomerang on those who make them. (68)</span></p><p></p><p>For this is a "brother" whose thirst for the blood of those who did not accept his tyranny could never be satisfied.</p><p></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">Shed not recklessly the blood of another with thy sword,</span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen">Lest the Sword on High falls upon thy neck. (69) </span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"><span style="color: Black"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"><span style="color: Black">These are sweet words, "Come to me so that we may converse with each other." These could be the words that draw me or anyone else to worship in a mosque (or dera, or temple, or synagogue, or church). But what should you do when you sit reverently before the scriptures of your brother knowing he might not hesitate to "shed" "the blood of another" through stoning of women, through jihad, through bombings? Or praise the deeds of those who do? </span></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"><span style="color: Black"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"><span style="color: Black"></span></span><span style="color: DarkGreen"><span style="color: Black"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"><span style="color: Black">If a Sikh finds comfort in shared worship, who am I to judge? However,</span></span><span style="color: DarkGreen"><span style="color: Black"> Gobind Singh is not giving an unqualified endorsement to the idea of spiritual brotherhood. In Zafaranameh he invites his "brothers" to rise up to a shared moral standard. It is a fact that there are beliefs in other religions that are inconsistent with Sikhi. It is a fact that beliefs, which are hostile to Sikhs, are inscribed in Summa, hadith, Sharia, and in Old Testament and New. If a Sikh choses to worship as a Sikh, and only as a Sikh, who are you to judge?</span></span></p><p><span style="color: DarkGreen"></span></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="spnadmin, post: 135667, member: 35"] Sunmukh ji It is very clear that our Gurus Sahiban rejected no one. It is clear that Sri Guru Gobind Singh rejected no one. He did not even reject Auranzeb, even after his elder sons became Shaheeds. Some say Guru Gobind Singh did not write Zafaranameh. Others say that he did. I believe he did write Zafaranameh. Let us for the sake of this discussion accept for this one time only that Dasam Pita did utter these words: [COLOR=DarkGreen] Come to me that we may converse with each other, And I may utter some kind words to thee. (60) I’d send thee a horseman like one in a thousand, Who will conduct thee safe to my home. (61) I’m a slave of the King of kings, And ready to obey His Call with all my heart. (62) If He were to order me thus, I’d with utmost pleasure present myself to thee. (63)[/COLOR] His words are poignantly words of a desire for spiritual brotherhood. Only a great soul could utter these words. And then he goes on to say the following. In the couplete he gives Auranzeb credit for being able to enter into spiritual brotherhood and honor a reasonable reques, based on a mutual connection through One God: [COLOR=DarkOliveGreen]And if you are a believer in One God, Tarry not in what I ask you to do. (64) And the Dasam Pita emjoins Auranzeb to accept dharma because he recognizes that God. It is incumbent upon you to recognise the God, For He told you not to create strife in the world. (65)[/COLOR] Yet Dasam Pita is no fool! And does not mince words. [COLOR=DarkOliveGreen]You occupy the throne, in the name of God, the Sovereign of all creation, But strange is thy justice, stranger thy attributes! (66) What sense of discrimination is this? What regard for religion? O fie on such a sovereignty! Fie a hundred times!! (67) Stranger than strange are thy decrees, O king, But beware that broken pledges boomerang on those who make them. (68)[/COLOR] For this is a "brother" whose thirst for the blood of those who did not accept his tyranny could never be satisfied. [COLOR=DarkGreen]Shed not recklessly the blood of another with thy sword, Lest the Sword on High falls upon thy neck. (69) [COLOR=Black] These are sweet words, "Come to me so that we may converse with each other." These could be the words that draw me or anyone else to worship in a mosque (or dera, or temple, or synagogue, or church). But what should you do when you sit reverently before the scriptures of your brother knowing he might not hesitate to "shed" "the blood of another" through stoning of women, through jihad, through bombings? Or praise the deeds of those who do? [/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=DarkGreen][COLOR=Black] If a Sikh finds comfort in shared worship, who am I to judge? However,[/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=DarkGreen][COLOR=Black] Gobind Singh is not giving an unqualified endorsement to the idea of spiritual brotherhood. In Zafaranameh he invites his "brothers" to rise up to a shared moral standard. It is a fact that there are beliefs in other religions that are inconsistent with Sikhi. It is a fact that beliefs, which are hostile to Sikhs, are inscribed in Summa, hadith, Sharia, and in Old Testament and New. If a Sikh choses to worship as a Sikh, and only as a Sikh, who are you to judge?[/COLOR] [/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Discussions
Sikh Sikhi Sikhism
Moving Forward, Or Sliding Backward
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
Accept
Learn more…
Top