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Guru Granth Sahib
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ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
Ashtpadiyan (235-242)
Chhant (242-249)
Baavan Akhari (250-262)
Sukhmani (262-296)
Thittee (296-300)
Gauree kii Vaar (300-323)
Gurbani (323-330)
Ashtpadiyan (330-340)
Baavan Akhari (340-343)
Thintteen (343-344)
Vaar Kabir (344-345)
Bhagat Bani (345-346)
ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
Aasaavaree (409-411)
Ashtpadiyan (411-432)
Patee (432-435)
Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
Bhagat Bani (475-488)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
Asatpadhiya (634-642)
Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
Gurbani (876-902)
Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
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Hard Talk
Is There A God?
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<blockquote data-quote="Archived_member14" data-source="post: 129096" data-attributes="member: 586"><p>Atheist ji, (Bhagat ji),</p><p></p><p>Quote Bhagat Singh:</p><p><<My intention is not to convert you to Sikhism but please break out of your current mindset of "oh there is no evidence so I am right" and start thinking beyond that. Ask yourself: Why is there no evidence? What do I mean when I say evidence? What would it take to show me that there is a God? That sort of thing will expand your thinking. You'll still be atheist after that but will be a better, more intelligent atheist.>></p><p></p><p>Quote Atheist:</p><p><<Well if you ask me a question it is only fair for me to ask you the same/similar question: What evidence would be "good" evidence to convince you that jesus is the son of god and born of a virgin and rose from the dead?</p><p></p><p>The answer to your question is very simple: Testable, provable, empirical evidence.</p><p></p><p>An atheist simply goes one step further than a theist. We have a common belief: Neither of us, I presume, believe that Joseph Smith had a genuine vision from god & jesus and that the book of mormon is another testamant of jesus christ and that jesus = god. We agree on this right? I just go one step further and have a dis-belief in any religion. In other words, people that believe in a religion/system of beliefs/whatever word you want to use tend to NOT believe in all the other ones. So I just NOT believe in one more. For example if there were 100 religions on this planet, everyone would not believe in 99 of them and believe in 1 of them (of those that had a belief in something). I just have a disbelief in 100 of them and not 99 - a difference of merely one.>></p><p>--------------------</p><p></p><p>Perhaps there is something to be learnt from Bhagat Singh ji’s statement above. </p><p>You ‘dis-believe’ in all religions, and I’m not asking you to simply believe in what I quote and comment on below. Someone just mentioned the Buddha, so I take the opportunity to quote something said by him here:</p><p></p><p>Quote:</p><p>"By & large, Kaccayana, this world is supported by (takes as its object) a polarity, that of existence & non-existence. But when one sees the origination of the world as it actually is with right discernment, 'non-existence' with reference to the world does not occur to one. When one sees the cessation of the world as it actually is with right discernment, 'existence' with reference to the world does not occur to one.</p><p></p><p>"By & large, Kaccayana, this world is in bondage to attachments, clingings (sustenances), & biases. But one such as this does not get involved with or cling to these attachments, clingings, fixations of awareness, biases, or latent tendencies; nor is he resolved on 'my self.' He has no uncertainty or doubt that, when there is arising, only stress is arising; and that when there is passing away, only stress is passing away. In this, one's knowledge is independent of others. It is to this extent, Kaccayana, that there is right view.</p><p></p><p>"'Everything exists': That is one extreme. 'Everything doesn't exist': That is a second extreme. Avoiding these two extremes, the Tathagata teaches the Dhamma via the middle:</p><p></p><p>"From ignorance as a requisite condition come fabrications.</p><p>From fabrications as a requisite condition comes consciousness.</p><p>From consciousness as a requisite condition comes name-&-form.</p><p>From name-&-form as a requisite condition come the six sense media.</p><p>From the six sense media as a requisite condition comes contact.</p><p>From contact as a requisite condition comes feeling.</p><p>From feeling as a requisite condition comes craving.</p><p>From craving as a requisite condition comes clinging/sustenance.</p><p>From clinging/sustenance as a requisite condition comes becoming.</p><p>From becoming as a requisite condition comes birth.</p><p>From birth as a requisite condition, then aging & death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, distress, & despair come into play.</p><p>Such is the origination of this entire mass of stress & suffering.>><end quote></p><p></p><p>And he then goes on to show how the process is reversed leading to the end of the cycle of existence.</p><p></p><p>My comment:</p><p>Our moment to moment experiences, some of them are causes and some are effects. Each of these is conditioned by complex set of factors all of which are extremely fleeting. Ignorance is a root condition which arises most if not all the time when we ‘think’ about things. Wisdom is the opposite of this, and it has many degrees which can be developed. There are basically two types of this wisdom, one not being necessarily related to the other. One type understands the ethical value of the moment’s experience, in other words, the value of good states and harm in bad ones, but it does not however know “ignorance” for what it is. The other more important type, understands the nature, including the fact of it being conditioned and fleeting and whether it is a cause, effect or indeterminate, and related to all this, the harm in ignorance. </p><p></p><p>This second type starts with the level of what is called ‘intellectual understanding’ which when developed leads to direct understanding and insight. But even at the beginning level, it is one which begins to understand the difference between what is *reality* and what is *concept*. And along with this comes the inclination to studying the present moment experience rather than being caught up in the “concepts” which invariably arises all the time and follows any sense experiences, believing wrongly, that these are the objects of knowledge and understanding. The imperative is therefore, to understand the nature of the present moment, since it is this that is *real* and where causes and effects arises and fall away constantly.</p><p></p><p>Failing this is the reason we instead end up dealing with what I’d call ‘shadows of reality’ and believing in the kind of cause and effect which amount to no more than being mere ‘stories’. This is where science is at. Indeed science and every other field of knowledge are involved in what could be compared to the seven blind men who are holding each, one part of the elephant and making statements about the ‘reality’ of the elephant. The Truth obviously can’t be arrived at this way. Each person ends up throwing concepts at each other and even if some end up agreeing, this would only be by way of belief in some concept and never a reality. Which is why getting at the Truth requires “insight” into the nature of the present moment, because otherwise we deal only with concepts, arguing and remaining lost in such an ocean. </p><p></p><p>We think ‘ignorance’ is lack of knowledge about things. But the truth is that all such knowledge are the product of the proliferation of thought fuelled by ‘ignorance’ which itself is a mental reality, whose function is to obscure the true nature of what is really *real* NOW.</p><p></p><p>I hope the above has given some food for thought. And if you think fit, we can take the discussion elsewhere.</p><p>Sukinder</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Archived_member14, post: 129096, member: 586"] Atheist ji, (Bhagat ji), Quote Bhagat Singh: <<My intention is not to convert you to Sikhism but please break out of your current mindset of "oh there is no evidence so I am right" and start thinking beyond that. Ask yourself: Why is there no evidence? What do I mean when I say evidence? What would it take to show me that there is a God? That sort of thing will expand your thinking. You'll still be atheist after that but will be a better, more intelligent atheist.>> Quote Atheist: <<Well if you ask me a question it is only fair for me to ask you the same/similar question: What evidence would be "good" evidence to convince you that jesus is the son of god and born of a virgin and rose from the dead? The answer to your question is very simple: Testable, provable, empirical evidence. An atheist simply goes one step further than a theist. We have a common belief: Neither of us, I presume, believe that Joseph Smith had a genuine vision from god & jesus and that the book of mormon is another testamant of jesus christ and that jesus = god. We agree on this right? I just go one step further and have a dis-belief in any religion. In other words, people that believe in a religion/system of beliefs/whatever word you want to use tend to NOT believe in all the other ones. So I just NOT believe in one more. For example if there were 100 religions on this planet, everyone would not believe in 99 of them and believe in 1 of them (of those that had a belief in something). I just have a disbelief in 100 of them and not 99 - a difference of merely one.>> -------------------- Perhaps there is something to be learnt from Bhagat Singh ji’s statement above. You ‘dis-believe’ in all religions, and I’m not asking you to simply believe in what I quote and comment on below. Someone just mentioned the Buddha, so I take the opportunity to quote something said by him here: Quote: "By & large, Kaccayana, this world is supported by (takes as its object) a polarity, that of existence & non-existence. But when one sees the origination of the world as it actually is with right discernment, 'non-existence' with reference to the world does not occur to one. When one sees the cessation of the world as it actually is with right discernment, 'existence' with reference to the world does not occur to one. "By & large, Kaccayana, this world is in bondage to attachments, clingings (sustenances), & biases. But one such as this does not get involved with or cling to these attachments, clingings, fixations of awareness, biases, or latent tendencies; nor is he resolved on 'my self.' He has no uncertainty or doubt that, when there is arising, only stress is arising; and that when there is passing away, only stress is passing away. In this, one's knowledge is independent of others. It is to this extent, Kaccayana, that there is right view. "'Everything exists': That is one extreme. 'Everything doesn't exist': That is a second extreme. Avoiding these two extremes, the Tathagata teaches the Dhamma via the middle: "From ignorance as a requisite condition come fabrications. From fabrications as a requisite condition comes consciousness. From consciousness as a requisite condition comes name-&-form. From name-&-form as a requisite condition come the six sense media. From the six sense media as a requisite condition comes contact. From contact as a requisite condition comes feeling. From feeling as a requisite condition comes craving. From craving as a requisite condition comes clinging/sustenance. From clinging/sustenance as a requisite condition comes becoming. From becoming as a requisite condition comes birth. From birth as a requisite condition, then aging & death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, distress, & despair come into play. Such is the origination of this entire mass of stress & suffering.>><end quote> And he then goes on to show how the process is reversed leading to the end of the cycle of existence. My comment: Our moment to moment experiences, some of them are causes and some are effects. Each of these is conditioned by complex set of factors all of which are extremely fleeting. Ignorance is a root condition which arises most if not all the time when we ‘think’ about things. Wisdom is the opposite of this, and it has many degrees which can be developed. There are basically two types of this wisdom, one not being necessarily related to the other. One type understands the ethical value of the moment’s experience, in other words, the value of good states and harm in bad ones, but it does not however know “ignorance” for what it is. The other more important type, understands the nature, including the fact of it being conditioned and fleeting and whether it is a cause, effect or indeterminate, and related to all this, the harm in ignorance. This second type starts with the level of what is called ‘intellectual understanding’ which when developed leads to direct understanding and insight. But even at the beginning level, it is one which begins to understand the difference between what is *reality* and what is *concept*. And along with this comes the inclination to studying the present moment experience rather than being caught up in the “concepts” which invariably arises all the time and follows any sense experiences, believing wrongly, that these are the objects of knowledge and understanding. The imperative is therefore, to understand the nature of the present moment, since it is this that is *real* and where causes and effects arises and fall away constantly. Failing this is the reason we instead end up dealing with what I’d call ‘shadows of reality’ and believing in the kind of cause and effect which amount to no more than being mere ‘stories’. This is where science is at. Indeed science and every other field of knowledge are involved in what could be compared to the seven blind men who are holding each, one part of the elephant and making statements about the ‘reality’ of the elephant. The Truth obviously can’t be arrived at this way. Each person ends up throwing concepts at each other and even if some end up agreeing, this would only be by way of belief in some concept and never a reality. Which is why getting at the Truth requires “insight” into the nature of the present moment, because otherwise we deal only with concepts, arguing and remaining lost in such an ocean. We think ‘ignorance’ is lack of knowledge about things. But the truth is that all such knowledge are the product of the proliferation of thought fuelled by ‘ignorance’ which itself is a mental reality, whose function is to obscure the true nature of what is really *real* NOW. I hope the above has given some food for thought. And if you think fit, we can take the discussion elsewhere. Sukinder [/QUOTE]
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