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Guru Granth Sahib
Composition, Arrangement & Layout
ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
Ashtpadiyan (235-242)
Chhant (242-249)
Baavan Akhari (250-262)
Sukhmani (262-296)
Thittee (296-300)
Gauree kii Vaar (300-323)
Gurbani (323-330)
Ashtpadiyan (330-340)
Baavan Akhari (340-343)
Thintteen (343-344)
Vaar Kabir (344-345)
Bhagat Bani (345-346)
ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
Aasaavaree (409-411)
Ashtpadiyan (411-432)
Patee (432-435)
Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
Bhagat Bani (475-488)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
Asatpadhiya (634-642)
Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
Gurbani (876-902)
Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
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As A Sikh Do You Ever Ask When Hurting Or Feeling Low, God/Creator, Why Me?
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<blockquote data-quote="Archived_member15" data-source="post: 163806" data-attributes="member: 17438"><p>Thank you brother Ambarsaria! :whatzpointkudi: Very well put, I agree 100% and I love those smilies too! lol</p><p> </p><p>I also hope that this teaching is reppealed. Its been a burden from the beginning and an unnecessary one at that. </p><p> </p><p>But things like this have happened throughout Catholic history. Its nothing new. The church hierarchy is the <em>trustee </em>if you like of the <em>Tradition </em>and we believe that it will never teach anything expressly <em>against the Tradition</em>, however its fallible human members have often broke <em>the Tradition</em> and its taken ordinary Catholics to stand up and re-claim it for ourselves. </p><p> </p><p>The Catholic Church has a long history of what we call <em>faithful dissenters - Catholics who in their lifetimes are often condemned but soon after or later are recognised by the hierarchy as saints, the most splendid and brilliant Catholics of their time. </em></p><p> </p><p>Differing with church authority is a noble tradition and today countless "good" Catholics routinely defy the teaching on artificial contraception. The dissenting tradition includes the likes of Galileo, Blessed John Henry Newman, Saint Catherine of Siena, Saint Hildegard of Bingen, Meister Eckhart, Servant of God Matteo Ricci, and John Courtney Murray. </p><p> </p><p>Do you know of Saint Francis of Assisi, the thirteenth century nature-loving Catholic friar? Well, he opposed the then Pope too his face for corruption. The pope prohibited his order at first, the Franciscans, but then relented and admitted that he'd got it wrong. </p><p> </p><p>Saint Joan of Arc was burnt on a stake in the 1400s for heresy at the age of just 19, by French Bishops in league with her English enemies. 20 years later she was absolved by the Pope himself who admitted that the Church hierarchy in France had made a terrible mistake, had in fact put nationality and factionalism above truth and her murderers were then condemned. She was later declared a <em>Saint.</em></p><p> </p><p><em>Saint John of the </em>Cross was imprisoned in the sixteenth century by members of his own order, and deprived of food and kept in chains. He was later declared not only a Saint but also a Doctor of the Church in recognition of the wonderful, exuberant, inspired poetry he wrote to his Beloved - <em>God</em> - while in prison. </p><p> </p><p>Mary MacKillop, an Australian nun who was excommunicated in 1871 for challenging a bishop's efforts to govern her religious community. More than a century later, Pope John Paul II declared her "blessed" and in 2010 she was declared a "Saint". </p><p> </p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: black">In twelfth century Germany, the Benedictine abbess Saint Hildegard of Bingen, healer, scientist, composer and author of 10 books, awakened popes and abbots alike, firing off letters like this one to Pope Anastasius IV: “O man, you who sit on the papal throne, you despise God when you don’t hurl from yourself the evil but even worse, embrace it and kiss it by silently tolerating corrupt men. . .And you, O Rome, are like one in the throes of death. You will be so shaken that the strength of your feet, the feet on which you now stand, will disappear. For you don’t love the King’s daughter, justice.”</span></span></p><p> </p><p> </p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: #000000">She is now <em>Saint Hildegard and a Doctor of the Church:sippingcoffeemunda:</em></span></span></p><p> </p><p> </p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: #000000">Saint Symeon (949–1022 AD) spoke from personal experience of the vision of God. One of his principal teachings was that humans could and should experience theoria (literally "contemplation", or direct experience of God). Symeon endured severe opposition from church authorities, particularly from the chief theologian of the emperor's court, Archbishop Stephen, who at one time was the Metropolitan of Nicomedia. Stephen was a former politician and diplomat with a reputation for a thorough theoretical understanding of theology, but one which was removed from actual experience of the spiritual life. Symeon, in contrast, held the view that one must have actual experience of the Holy Spirit in order to speak about God, at the same time recognizing the authority of scripture and of the earlier church fathers. </span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"></span></p><p> <span style="color: #000080"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: #000080">In one of his hymns, Saint Symeon had Christ speaking the following rebuke to the bishops:</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: #000080"></span></p><p> <span style="color: #000080"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: #000000"><strong>"They (the bishops) unworthily handle My Body</strong></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"><strong><span style="color: #000000">and seek avidly to dominate the masses...</span></strong></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"><strong><span style="color: #000000">They are seen to appear as brilliant and pure,</span></strong></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"><strong><span style="color: #000000">but their souls are worse than mud and dirt,</span></strong></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"><strong><span style="color: #000000">worse even than any kind of deadly poison,</span></strong></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"><strong><span style="color: #000000">these evil and perverse men!"</span></strong><span style="color: #000000"> <em>(Hymn 58)</em></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000080">He became - SAINT SYMEON! :sippingcoffeemunda:</span></p><p></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: black">Saint Thomas Aquinas, who followed a century after Hildegard, wrote commentaries on 10 works by the greatest scientist of his day, Aristotle, even though the pope had forbidden Christians to study Aristotle. So controversial was Aquinas in his day that the king of France had to call out his troops to surround the convent where Aquinas lived to protect him from Christians aroused by fundamentalist clergy. For Aquinas, “revelation comes in two books—the Bible and Nature” and “a mistake about nature results in a mistake about God.”</span></span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: black">Aquinas insisted that one is always responsible to one’s conscience, more than to any other authority. (Indeed, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. cites Aquinas on this point in his famous Letter from Birmingham Jail.) Aquinas was condemned by church authorities three times after he died but eventually was declared a saint and Doctor of the Church; and in the 19th century Catholics were not allowed to study any theologians apart from Thomas Aquinas' works in seminary! </span></span></p><p> </p><p> </p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: black">Another Dominican, Meister Eckhart, is probably the greatest mystic the West has produced. His writings abound with depth, humor, paradox and challenges to establishment Christianity. For example, he declares, “I pray God to rid me of God.” He emphasizes what contemporary Biblical scholars are saying, that Christ is found not just in Jesus but in all of us. Eckhart says, “<em>What good is it to me if Mary gave birth to the son of God 1,400 years ago and I do not do so in my time and my person and my culture</em>?” Eckhart was never condemned or declared a heretic but the Church gave him a very hard time. He was tried for heresy but beat the hierarchy with the stunning statement that left them gob-smacked: "<em>I may err like all men but I am not a heretic, for the first has to do with the mind and the second with the will</em><strong>".</strong> It was reading Eckhart that converted Fr Thomas Merton from atheism in the 1930’s to Catholicism and eventually into becoming a prophetic mystic of the 60‘s. Pope John Paul II was a devotee of Eckhart! </span></span></p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: black">Teilhard de Chardin was a French Jesuit mystic and scientist who was banished from his home country to China early in the 20th century by church authorities, but who found plenty of scientific and mystical work to delve into in his exile. He spent his life researching the deeper meanings of science and spirituality and, being forbidden to publish most of his works in his life time, he left his books in the hands of a lay woman who got them published after he died. He is now considered to be one of the greatest Catholic mystics of the 20th century and is going to a candidate for canonisation pretty soon. </span></span></p><p> </p><p>These are all noble dissenters, and it was explained well by Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn, a somewhat eccentric German Catholic polymath, in 1952: </p><p> </p><p> </p><p><strong>"...The Catholic has the duty of forming, educating and training his conscience...Yet the Catholic who has lost his faith and who honestly accepts the teachings of another religious body <em>commits a mortal sin</em> if he does not publically embrace whatever religion he believes in. Father O'Karr very wisely points out that George Bernard Shaw was very much mistaken when he claimed Saint Joan of Arc for Protestantism. It was precisely her defiance of ecclesiastical authority and her strict adherence to her conscience which made her canonization (elevation to sainthood) possible within Catholicism...According to Catholic theology it is, therefore, quite likely that Jan Hus' soul went straight to heaven after his death, provided he sincerely believed in his own views, however erroneous [he rebelled against Catholic dogma and was a precursor to Protestantism]..."</strong></p><p> </p><p> </p><p>I am reminded of words spoken by the younger Pope Benedict XVI, when he was still Fr Joseph Ratzinger and wrote a commentary on the Second Vatican Council in which he said:</p><p> </p><p> </p><p><strong>“Not everything that exists in the Church must for that reason be also a legitimate tradition…. There is a distorting tradition as well as a legitimate tradition, ….[and] …consequently tradition must not be considered only affirmatively but also critically.”</strong></p><p> </p><p> </p><p>I would suggest that contraception is clearly part of this distorting tradition. </p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p><span style="color: #000080"><span style="color: #000000">So on the issue of dissenting from the teaching on contraception, Catholic history is encouraging - the dissenters of today are often the saints of tommorrow in Catholicism :sippingcoffeemunda:</span></span></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Archived_member15, post: 163806, member: 17438"] Thank you brother Ambarsaria! :whatzpointkudi: Very well put, I agree 100% and I love those smilies too! lol I also hope that this teaching is reppealed. Its been a burden from the beginning and an unnecessary one at that. But things like this have happened throughout Catholic history. Its nothing new. The church hierarchy is the [I]trustee [/I]if you like of the [I]Tradition [/I]and we believe that it will never teach anything expressly [I]against the Tradition[/I], however its fallible human members have often broke [I]the Tradition[/I] and its taken ordinary Catholics to stand up and re-claim it for ourselves. The Catholic Church has a long history of what we call [I]faithful dissenters - Catholics who in their lifetimes are often condemned but soon after or later are recognised by the hierarchy as saints, the most splendid and brilliant Catholics of their time. [/I] Differing with church authority is a noble tradition and today countless "good" Catholics routinely defy the teaching on artificial contraception. The dissenting tradition includes the likes of Galileo, Blessed John Henry Newman, Saint Catherine of Siena, Saint Hildegard of Bingen, Meister Eckhart, Servant of God Matteo Ricci, and John Courtney Murray. Do you know of Saint Francis of Assisi, the thirteenth century nature-loving Catholic friar? Well, he opposed the then Pope too his face for corruption. The pope prohibited his order at first, the Franciscans, but then relented and admitted that he'd got it wrong. Saint Joan of Arc was burnt on a stake in the 1400s for heresy at the age of just 19, by French Bishops in league with her English enemies. 20 years later she was absolved by the Pope himself who admitted that the Church hierarchy in France had made a terrible mistake, had in fact put nationality and factionalism above truth and her murderers were then condemned. She was later declared a [I]Saint.[/I] [I]Saint John of the [/I]Cross was imprisoned in the sixteenth century by members of his own order, and deprived of food and kept in chains. He was later declared not only a Saint but also a Doctor of the Church in recognition of the wonderful, exuberant, inspired poetry he wrote to his Beloved - [I]God[/I] - while in prison. Mary MacKillop, an Australian nun who was excommunicated in 1871 for challenging a bishop's efforts to govern her religious community. More than a century later, Pope John Paul II declared her "blessed" and in 2010 she was declared a "Saint". [COLOR=#000080][COLOR=black]In twelfth century Germany, the Benedictine abbess Saint Hildegard of Bingen, healer, scientist, composer and author of 10 books, awakened popes and abbots alike, firing off letters like this one to Pope Anastasius IV: “O man, you who sit on the papal throne, you despise God when you don’t hurl from yourself the evil but even worse, embrace it and kiss it by silently tolerating corrupt men. . .And you, O Rome, are like one in the throes of death. You will be so shaken that the strength of your feet, the feet on which you now stand, will disappear. For you don’t love the King’s daughter, justice.”[/COLOR][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080][COLOR=#000000]She is now [I]Saint Hildegard and a Doctor of the Church:sippingcoffeemunda:[/I][/COLOR][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080][COLOR=#000000]Saint Symeon (949–1022 AD) spoke from personal experience of the vision of God. One of his principal teachings was that humans could and should experience theoria (literally "contemplation", or direct experience of God). Symeon endured severe opposition from church authorities, particularly from the chief theologian of the emperor's court, Archbishop Stephen, who at one time was the Metropolitan of Nicomedia. Stephen was a former politician and diplomat with a reputation for a thorough theoretical understanding of theology, but one which was removed from actual experience of the spiritual life. Symeon, in contrast, held the view that one must have actual experience of the Holy Spirit in order to speak about God, at the same time recognizing the authority of scripture and of the earlier church fathers. [/COLOR][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080] [COLOR=#000080]In one of his hymns, Saint Symeon had Christ speaking the following rebuke to the bishops:[/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][B]"They (the bishops) unworthily handle My Body[/B][/COLOR] [B][COLOR=#000000]and seek avidly to dominate the masses...[/COLOR][/B] [B][COLOR=#000000]They are seen to appear as brilliant and pure,[/COLOR][/B] [B][COLOR=#000000]but their souls are worse than mud and dirt,[/COLOR][/B] [B][COLOR=#000000]worse even than any kind of deadly poison,[/COLOR][/B] [B][COLOR=#000000]these evil and perverse men!"[/COLOR][/B][COLOR=#000000] [I](Hymn 58)[/I][/COLOR] [/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080]He became - SAINT SYMEON! :sippingcoffeemunda:[/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080][COLOR=black]Saint Thomas Aquinas, who followed a century after Hildegard, wrote commentaries on 10 works by the greatest scientist of his day, Aristotle, even though the pope had forbidden Christians to study Aristotle. So controversial was Aquinas in his day that the king of France had to call out his troops to surround the convent where Aquinas lived to protect him from Christians aroused by fundamentalist clergy. For Aquinas, “revelation comes in two books—the Bible and Nature” and “a mistake about nature results in a mistake about God.”[/COLOR][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080][COLOR=black]Aquinas insisted that one is always responsible to one’s conscience, more than to any other authority. (Indeed, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. cites Aquinas on this point in his famous Letter from Birmingham Jail.) Aquinas was condemned by church authorities three times after he died but eventually was declared a saint and Doctor of the Church; and in the 19th century Catholics were not allowed to study any theologians apart from Thomas Aquinas' works in seminary! [/COLOR][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080][COLOR=black]Another Dominican, Meister Eckhart, is probably the greatest mystic the West has produced. His writings abound with depth, humor, paradox and challenges to establishment Christianity. For example, he declares, “I pray God to rid me of God.” He emphasizes what contemporary Biblical scholars are saying, that Christ is found not just in Jesus but in all of us. Eckhart says, “[I]What good is it to me if Mary gave birth to the son of God 1,400 years ago and I do not do so in my time and my person and my culture[/I]?” Eckhart was never condemned or declared a heretic but the Church gave him a very hard time. He was tried for heresy but beat the hierarchy with the stunning statement that left them gob-smacked: "[I]I may err like all men but I am not a heretic, for the first has to do with the mind and the second with the will[/I][B]".[/B] It was reading Eckhart that converted Fr Thomas Merton from atheism in the 1930’s to Catholicism and eventually into becoming a prophetic mystic of the 60‘s. Pope John Paul II was a devotee of Eckhart! [/COLOR][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080][COLOR=black]Teilhard de Chardin was a French Jesuit mystic and scientist who was banished from his home country to China early in the 20th century by church authorities, but who found plenty of scientific and mystical work to delve into in his exile. He spent his life researching the deeper meanings of science and spirituality and, being forbidden to publish most of his works in his life time, he left his books in the hands of a lay woman who got them published after he died. He is now considered to be one of the greatest Catholic mystics of the 20th century and is going to a candidate for canonisation pretty soon. [/COLOR][/COLOR] These are all noble dissenters, and it was explained well by Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn, a somewhat eccentric German Catholic polymath, in 1952: [B]"...The Catholic has the duty of forming, educating and training his conscience...Yet the Catholic who has lost his faith and who honestly accepts the teachings of another religious body [I]commits a mortal sin[/I] if he does not publically embrace whatever religion he believes in. Father O'Karr very wisely points out that George Bernard Shaw was very much mistaken when he claimed Saint Joan of Arc for Protestantism. It was precisely her defiance of ecclesiastical authority and her strict adherence to her conscience which made her canonization (elevation to sainthood) possible within Catholicism...According to Catholic theology it is, therefore, quite likely that Jan Hus' soul went straight to heaven after his death, provided he sincerely believed in his own views, however erroneous [he rebelled against Catholic dogma and was a precursor to Protestantism]..."[/B] I am reminded of words spoken by the younger Pope Benedict XVI, when he was still Fr Joseph Ratzinger and wrote a commentary on the Second Vatican Council in which he said: [B]“Not everything that exists in the Church must for that reason be also a legitimate tradition…. There is a distorting tradition as well as a legitimate tradition, ….[and] …consequently tradition must not be considered only affirmatively but also critically.”[/B] I would suggest that contraception is clearly part of this distorting tradition. [COLOR=#000080][COLOR=#000000]So on the issue of dissenting from the teaching on contraception, Catholic history is encouraging - the dissenters of today are often the saints of tommorrow in Catholicism :sippingcoffeemunda:[/COLOR][/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
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