Dasam Granth - A Critical Study

[vijaydeep Singh]

Gurfateh Parwan Ho !


Das is only writing about a view of Sirdar Sahib Gurbax singh Ji Kala Afghana Sahib article in english and that also part 2 from spokesmen magzine july 1999.

Das realy respect Sirdar Sahib and if Talwara has made him a sort of 'outcaste' then Talwara has done a big wrong to Panth.As per Das he is gem of a man.

Yet being a former Hindu and still being with the Sangh Parivar Das perhaps knows hinduism better then Sirdar Sahib.And thats what das is going to prove that there could have been interpetation of whole Dasham Guru Darbar,which would have been liked by so called Missionarries(This word is wrong for them better is to use reformers).

So preachers are those who bring non Sikh to Sikhism like Nirmalas,Nihungs Sewa Panthis,Nanaksar,Rara Sahib,Akhand Kirtani Jatha or like sikhmissionary collage etc. So they are real missionaries.Das knows that missoneris in south Asia or in east Africa or in Indian towens are more reformers trying to a sort of 'purifying' or detoxifying Sikhism from pagan rituals,It is a good work.

But they are a more definsive.There record shows say in burma till this day not a single neo convert.But if we say In organisation mentioned above or in Jogi Bhajan or Baba Virsa Singh Ji there are many neo converts.A person can convert a person from another faith only if he /she is aware of his own idealogy.

So far when Das has interacted with missioaries,Das has found out them talking more like christians then Sikhs.They talk of free will of man geven by God.Another old respected person Haqeem T{censored}em Singh Ji was even unable to describe the God of Sikhs yet he a sort of humiliated Das for his faith in Dasham Granth and called him still a hindu.Das gave his point ,he said that he want to meet Das but Das will not be allowed to speak and he will explain.Das so far could not meet him due to some reasons.

But there are many people who after meeting das have understood his point of view.Das is trying to make it public.Only if Akal or Gurubar Akal bless if a single person could understand it Das will feel that Akal has mercy on him.
Das may not be able to complete it today but will try to finish the whole matter as soon as possible.

first of All das is giving a poem written by him and seek the help of any meber of forum to decode it.Perhaps Das knows what he has written and other may try.It is in hindi but letters are in romen.

Neech Bihari
Lehu Ubari
Syam Kandhari
Chhabi Tumari
Bach Uchari
Dhram Hamari
Ichchhit Sanghari
Naam Katari
Oorja Sari
Jitb Pyari

Das will wait for a few days if some one can understand that what das meant. Das wrote it as many writing of Vachitra Natak had some stornger message written in them.A policemen(A Sahib Gurbax Singh Ji was an inspector) may do Danda Pani or Kambal parade to commen civilians but with spies or soldiers it may not happen.

Sleuth or police man is one who protects status que,doubts each and every move and is a bit more defincive and aggresive in approach.This more ture in India.He is a detective.

Spies or soldiers(Das did have training in one of that) are aware of all acts of policemen but they are often more aggresive,they are good in decoding and always try to enter the opponent area and carry out there operation.

Tenth Guru was saint and soldeir equally.Das does not want to enter into slander campaign loucned by a few idiots towards Kala Afghana Sahib but here he wants to tell that after the 'descovery' of Bhag Singh Ji Ambala only did Nirankaris made derogaotry remarks towards Guru that he lived in forest and non is his writing.In Fact Nirnakris are outshoot of reformers only.

But Amabala Sahib did came Back after undoing Tankha.Dasham Granth remained where it was to remain.Das will try that respected Gurbax Singh Ji also undserstand the words of a person who knows more then policemen and can understand by mercy of Akal what Guru Ji wanted to convey.

First Das will give there references he has drawn from Gurmat.

1. In all universe there is nothing else but God.So all forms are made up of God and nothing else but God.
2. God does everything and can do every thing.
3. Salvation can not be obtained by everyone by his/her own deeds but by mercy of Akal.So by mercy of Akal suurender to Akal is to be realised

And concept of dualism/Dwait bhav or Dutiya Bhav or what is more called Duja Bhav in Gurbani.(Das is avoiding giving numbers of Ang as for Das Gurbani is something to be brought in life then a matter of study.Anyone caN read Adi Guru Darbar and get the term Duja Bhav from it).

So as per Duja bhav,That talks of any thing second or other to God.So the root of pain and suffering is this Dujs Bhav.If whole universe is seen as form of God then self ego will be not there and neither there will be others to be afraid of or to be made envious so at that stage by mercy of Akal person gets salvation while alive.

For Das this is the main message of Gurbani.And keeping that in mind das will give those translation or explantion which will be if Akal permits acceptable to Gurbax Singh Ji.

As Das write further lets ask someone in world to give a b c d e from v w x y z.Das thinks it is not possible.So can Gurbax Singh Ji Kala Afghana Ji give OSI model of network from Adi Guru Darbar or TCP/IP model instead.There can be explanation even based on it from Adi Guru Darbar the way it can realy tell us how the automobile runs.But it may not be word to word same.

As he had asked to give at least five verses from Adi Guru Darbar to Justify some parts of Dasham Guru Darbar. The way in 7 there could be 7 1s or 3 2s but in 1 or 2 no seven so as per fact that Dasham Guru Darbar is after Adi Guru Darbar so it will have something more.

It was irony that when Arya Samajis made wrong interpatations of Adi Guru Darbar and coward Bhasuria agreed that Bhagat Bani is not the part of it.A former hindu Prof Sahib Singh Ji did a an explantion better then even Nirmalas of Fareedkot.But when hindutva idiots did same with Dasham Guru Darbar,All enlightened souls joined to Bash it. No one ever tryed to give an unbiased look.

There are some portion of Adi Guru Darbar also like Ramkali Saddu or say something in Verses by First master regarding Jains(Sir Ghitte Saitanis),Had some one not aware of Gurubani can easly take it as if it from 'Brahmin' as Vachitar Natak is taken for.

It is strange Adi Guru Darbar may have been used or Japu Sahib or Akal Ustat to prove that Guru Did not mean that point but points meant some thing else.Same things are even repeated in Vachitar Natak.Das will highlight it.Das is not offending any elder as das is like a worm in front of them but is trying to give a bit more of meaning of Vachitar Nataks wrong explantions as he read in that Magzine.

There is many stuff in Punjabi in his email box but Punjabi of das is weak and so did he got english hard copy version so he did work on it.

So it was Hindutva fools who,did wrong interpetations,Our schoolers surrendered to them and disowned the Granth al toaghter. They were happy as they did do a harm to Panth.There were some agents of them in us who further fueled the fire by saying Sikhs are from generation of Luv Kush.

Perhaps Das is not from that generation.Das father is hindu Vaishya and lowest of all teli.Mother is Hindu Khatri ,who is to do with Pandavas but not Luv Kush,being a product of Pratiloom Vihvah as per hinduism Das is lower to Sudra in Pancham Varna.

So there are two type of people who support Dasham Granth but can not oppose Kala Afghana Ji,One are traiters who work to let us be absorbed in swamp,which Das left to be Sikh.That is hindutva peoiple.In fact They even made 3 Makara of Tantric Vamarg to 5 just to prove that it is like 5ks.And may be they were helped by theory of Kala Afghana Ji to prove Mahakal of Vachitra Natak as Tantik God of Vammarg,the way Ambala Sahib helped nirankaris.

Second type of person are those who are aware that Gurbax Singh Ji is on the wrong side.They have many other important works like to bring mankind to Khalsa fold.They are more busy with that work then to counter his idealogy as they are aware that one or the other day by mercy of Akal,when he reaches the state of Brahm Gyan he will understand what is there in Dasham Guru Darbar.

here das will only give a trailer of how definsive his mentality is,like the one of those Singhs,whom as per Panth Parkash were offered kingdom of foregn land but they prefered to stay in Punjab and make it there state.But know Sikhi has crossed the fronteries of Punjab and new races are coming to its fold.Das is bihari not Punjabi.So when on offensive there is no need to defend.

Cowrads are those hindutva or Arya Samajis who made standrad of Vedas,then based on them wrote a recent version of Manu Samriti.And there to there somethings which were saying something else yet they meant otherwise and removed some verse calling them interpolated.

Who gave authority to police man to make a standard of Adi Guru Darbar to test other Granth.And is his standardisation of idealoguy perfect? Thats the moot question.

More use of logic and no of devotion is mark of Vedanta and not of Gurumat.so those who do this with books are Vedantics and not Gurmukh.Someone said that since Dr. Jodh Singh new Vedas so he did not understand Gurmat and his version of translation is not OK.

Very God,Arya Samajis also said that Gurus did not knew Vedas and his comments apperantly anti to Vedas are due to his obliviance towads VEDAs.

So is it a rule that a person who knows Veda can never be A Sikh or such person is unfit to be Sikh and did Gurus or Bhagats ,who commented on Vedas were unaware of it as they were indeed aware of Gurmat.

Das wants to say that after understanding Gurbani real crux of Veda is understood.

to be continued....

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

swrg mhlw 5 ] (1204-4)
saarag mehlaa 5.
Saarang, Fifth Mehl:

mweI siq siq siq hir siq siq siq swDw ] (1204-5, swrMg, mÚ 5)
maa-ee sat sat sat har sat sat sat saaDhaa.
O mother, True, True True is the Lord, and True, True, True is His Holy Saint.

bcnu gurU jo pUrY kihE mY CIik gWTrI bwDw ]1] rhwau ] (1204-5, swrMg, mÚ 5)
bachan guroo jo poorai kahi-o mai chheek gaaNthree baaDhaa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
The Word which the Perfect Guru has spoken, I have tied to my robe. ||1||Pause||

inis bwsur niKAqR ibnwsI riv ssIAr bynwDw ] (1204-6, swrMg, mÚ 5)
nis baasur nakhi-atar binaasee rav sasee-ar baynaaDhaa.
Night and day, and the stars in the sky shall vanish. The sun and the moon shall vanish.

igir bsuDw jl pvn jwiego ieik swD bcn AtlwDw ]1] (1204-6, swrMg, mÚ 5)
gir basuDhaa jal pavan jaa-igo ik saaDh bachan atlaaDhaa. ||1||
The mountains, the earth, the water and the air shall pass away. Only the Word of the Holy Saint shall endure. ||1||

AMf ibnwsI jyr ibnwsI auqBuj syq ibnwDw ] (1204-7, swrMg, mÚ 5)
and binaasee jayr binaasee ut-bhuj sayt binaaDhaa.
Those born of eggs shall pass away, and those born of the womb shall pass away. Those born of the earth and sweat shall pass away as well.

cwir ibnwsI Ktih ibnwsI ieik swD bcn inhclwDw ]2] (1204-7, swrMg, mÚ 5)
chaar binaasee khateh binaasee ik saaDh bachan nihchalaaDhaa. ||2||
The four Vedas shall pass away, and the six Shaastras shall pass away. Only the Word of the Holy Saint is eternal. ||2||

rwj ibnwsI qwm ibnwsI swqku BI bynwDw ] (1204-8, swrMg, mÚ 5)
raaj binaasee taam binaasee saatak bhee baynaaDhaa.
Raajas, the quality of energetic activity shall pass away. Taamas, the quality of lethargic darkness shall pass away. Saatvas, the quality of peaceful light shall pass away as well.

idRsitmwn hY sgl ibnwsI ieik swD bcn AwgwDw ]3] (1204-9, swrMg, mÚ 5)
daristimaan hai sagal binaasee ik saaDh bachan aagaaDhaa. ||3||
All that is seen shall pass away. Only the Word of the Holy Saint is beyond destruction. ||3||

Awpy Awip Awp hI Awpy sBu Awpn Kylu idKwDw ] (1204-9, swrMg, mÚ 5)
aapay aap aap hee aapay sabh aapan khayl dikhaaDhaa.
He Himself is Himself by Himself. All that is seen is His play.

pwieE n jweI khI BWiq ry pRBu nwnk gur imil lwDw ]4]6] (1204-10, swrMg, mÚ 5)
paa-i-o na jaa-ee kahee bhaaNt ray parabh naanak gur mil laaDhaa. ||4||6||
He cannot be found by any means. O Nanak, meeting with the Guru, God is found. ||4||6||


This is whats from Adi Guru Darbar Sirdar Sahib gurbax Singh Ji has given to say that words of Saint soory it is only been talk about Sadhu and not Saint.Sadhu is one who has started to move to God and saint is one who is one with God.

But read it clearly at the last line which give the actual thing.That all is God.All is God by self,showing self as play.Can not be found by any mean but by meeting Guru it happens to meet God.But Guru Parmaeshwar Eko Jaan so Guru is God only and when God wants does this happen.

At start relative terms like saying of Sant or Sadhu is given but of more it is telling of God who is in form of Sant or in all other things.

to be continued...

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

kbIr kwgd kI EbrI msu ky krm kpwt ] (1371-15, slok, Bgq kbIr jI)
kabeer kaagad kee obree mas kay karam kapaat.
Kabeer, the paper is the prison, and the ink of rituals are the bars on the windows.

This was wriiten in that magzine that Kabir,Vedas form prision and ink of ritual its shutter.

This is not true if Das is correct.

Further here Kabir Sahib say

kbIr kwrnu so BieE jo kIno krqwir ] (1371-11, slok, Bgq kbIr jI)
kabeer kaaran so bha-i-o jo keeno kartaar.
Kabeer, the Creator does whatever He pleases.

By chance Das also got versde regarding Duja bhavdUjI Coif kuvwtVI ieks sau icqu lwie ] (1426-1, slok vwrW qy vDIk, mÚ 5)
doojee chhod kuvaatarhee ikas sa-o chit laa-ay.
Forsake duality and the ways of evil; focus your consciousness on the One Lord.

dUjY BwvˆØI nwnkw vhix luV@MdVI jwie ]16] (1426-2, slok vwrW qy vDIk, mÚ 5)
doojai bhaaveeN naankaa vahan lurhHaNdarhee jaa-ay. ||16||
In the love of duality, O Nanak, the mortals are being washed downstream. ||16||

(To Be continued)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

Das was busy with some physical fitness to be used in training so he did not come for last two days so thus das starts.

Das also has come accross other references made by Sirdar Kala Afghana Sahib from Adi Guru Darbar,Which das is posting belowgauVI kbIr jI ] (329-6)
ga-orhee kabeer jee.
Gauree, Kabeer Jee:
byd kI puqRI isMimRiq BweI ] (329-6, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
bayd kee putree simrit bhaa-ee.
The Simritee is the daughter of the Vedas, O Siblings of Destiny.
sWkl jyvrI lY hY AweI ]1] (329-6, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
saaNkal jayvree lai hai aa-ee. ||1||
She has brought a chain and a rope. ||1||
Awpn ngru Awp qy bwiDAw ] (329-7, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
aapan nagar aap tay baaDhi-aa.
She has imprisoned the people in her own city.
moh kY PwiD kwl sru sWiDAw ]1] rhwau ] (329-7, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
moh kai faaDh kaal sar saaNDhi-aa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
She has tightened the noose of emotional attachment and shot the arrow of death. ||1||Pause||
ktI n ktY qUit nh jweI ] (329-8, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
katee na katai toot nah jaa-ee.
By cutting, she cannot be cut, and she cannot be broken.
sw swpin hoie jg kau KweI ]2] (329-8, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
saa saapan ho-ay jag ka-o khaa-ee. ||2||
She has become a serpent, and she is eating the world. ||2||
hm dyKq ijin sBu jgu lUitAw ] (329-8, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
ham daykhat jin sabh jag looti-aa.
Before my very eyes, she has plundered the entire world.
khu kbIr mY rwm kih CUitAw ]3]30] (329-9, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
kaho kabeer mai raam kahi chhooti-aa. ||3||30||
Says Kabeer, chanting the Lord's Name, I have escaped her. ||3||30||

kbIr mwie mUMfau iqh gurU kI jw qy Brmu n jwie ] (1369-19, slok, Bgq kbIr jI)
kabeer maa-ay moonda-o tih guroo kee jaa tay bharam na jaa-ay.
Kabeer, shave the mother of that guru, who does not take away one's doubt.
Awp fuby chu byd mih cyly dIey bhwie ]104] (1370-1, slok, Bgq kbIr jI)
aap dubay chahu bayd meh chaylay dee-ay bahaa-ay. ||104||
He himself is drowning in the four Vedas; he drowns his disciples as well. ||104||
<> siqgur pRswid ] (746-16)
ik-oNkaar satgur parsaad.
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:
siqgur pwis bynµqIAw imlY nwmu AwDwrw ] (746-17, sUhI, mÚ 5)
satgur paas banantee-aa milai naam aaDhaaraa.
I offer this prayer to the True Guru, to bless me with the sustenance of the Naam.
quTw scw pwiqswhu qwpu gieAw sMswrw ]1] (746-17, sUhI, mÚ 5)
tuthaa sachaa paatisaahu taap ga-i-aa sansaaraa. ||1||
When the True King is pleased, the world is rid of its diseases. ||1||
Bgqw kI tyk qUM sMqw kI Et qUM scw isrjnhwrw ]1] rhwau ] (746-17, sUhI, mÚ 5)
bhagtaa kee tayk tooN santaa kee ot tooN sachaa sirjanhaaraa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
You are the Support of Your devotees, and the Shelter of the Saints, O True Creator Lord. ||1||Pause||
scu qyrI swmgrI scu qyrw drbwrw ] (746-18, sUhI, mÚ 5)
sach tayree saamagree sach tayraa darbaaraa.
True are Your devices, and True is Your Court.
scu qyry KwjIinAw scu qyrw pwswrw ]2] (746-19, sUhI, mÚ 5)
sach tayray khaajni-aa sach tayraa paasaaraa. ||2||
True are Your treasures, and True is Your expanse. ||2||
qyrw rUpu AgMmu hY AnUpu qyrw drswrw ] (746-19, sUhI, mÚ 5)
tayraa roop agamm hai anoop tayraa darsaaraa.
Your Form is inaccessible, and Your Vision is incomparably beautiful.
hau kurbwxI qyirAw syvkw ijn@ hir nwmu ipAwrw ]3] (746-19, sUhI, mÚ 5)
ha-o kurbaanee tayri-aa sayvkaa jinH har naam pi-aaraa. ||3||
I am a sacrifice to Your servants; they love Your Name, O Lord. ||3||
sBy ieCw pUrIAw jw pwieAw Agm Apwrw ] (747-1, sUhI, mÚ 5)
sabhay ichhaa pooree-aa jaa paa-i-aa agam apaaraa.
All desires are fulfilled, when the Inaccessible and Infinite Lord is obtained.
guru nwnku imilAw pwrbRhmu qyirAw crxw kau bilhwrw ]4]1]47] (747-2, sUhI, mÚ 5)
gur naanak mili-aa paarbarahm tayri-aa charnaa ka-o balihaaraa. ||4||1||47||
Guru Nanak has met the Supreme Lord God; I am a sacrifice to Your Feet. ||4||1||47||
rwgu sUhI mhlw 5 Gru 7 (747-3)
raag soohee mehlaa 5 ghar 7
Raag Soohee, Fifth Mehl, Seventh House:
<> siqgur pRswid ] (747-3)
ik-oNkaar satgur parsaad.
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:
qyrw Bwxw qUhY mnwieih ijs no hoih dieAwlw ] (747-4, sUhI, mÚ 5)
tayraa bhaanaa toohai manaa-ihi jis no hohi da-i-aalaa.
He alone obeys Your Will, O Lord, unto whom You are Merciful.
sweI Bgiq jo quDu BwvY qUM srb jIAw pRiqpwlw ]1] (747-4, sUhI, mÚ 5)
saa-ee bhagat jo tuDh bhaavai tooN sarab jee-aa partipaalaa. ||1||
That alone is devotional worship, which is pleasing to Your Will. You are the Cherisher of all beings. ||1||
myry rwm rwie sMqw tyk qum@wrI ] (747-5, sUhI, mÚ 5)
mayray raam raa-ay santaa tayk tumHaaree.
O my Sovereign Lord, You are the Support of the Saints.
jo quDu BwvY so prvwxu min qin qUhY ADwrI ]1] rhwau ] (747-5, sUhI, mÚ 5)
jo tuDh bhaavai so parvaan man tan toohai aDhaaree. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Whatever pleases You, they accept. You are the sustenance of their minds and bodies. ||1||Pause||
qUM dieAwlu ik®pwlu ik®pw iniD mnsw pUrxhwrw ] (747-6, sUhI, mÚ 5)
tooN da-i-aal kirpaal kirpaa niDh mansaa pooranhaaraa.
You are kind and compassionate, the treasure of mercy, the fulfiller of our hopes.
Bgq qyry siB pRwxpiq pRIqm qUM Bgqn kw ipAwrw ]2] (747-6, sUhI, mÚ 5)
bhagat tayray sabh faraanpat pareetam tooN bhagtan kaa pi-aaraa. ||2||
You are the Beloved Lord of life of all Your devotees; You are the Beloved of Your devotees. ||2||
qU AQwhu Apwru Aiq aUcw koeI Avru n qyrI Bwqy ] (747-7, sUhI, mÚ 5)
too athaahu apaar at oochaa ko-ee avar na tayree bhaatay.
You are unfathomable, infinite, lofty and exalted. There is no one else like You.
ieh Ardwis hmwrI suAwmI ivsru nwhI suKdwqy ]3] (747-7, sUhI, mÚ 5)
ih ardaas hamaaree su-aamee visar naahee sukh-daatay. ||3||
This is my prayer, O my Lord and Master; may I never forget You, O Peace-giving Lord. ||3||
idnu rYix swis swis gux gwvw jy suAwmI quDu Bwvw ] (747-8, sUhI, mÚ 5)
din rain saas saas gun gaavaa jay su-aamee tuDh bhaavaa.
Day and night, with each and every breath, I sing Your Glorious Praises, if it is pleasing to Your Will.
nwmu qyrw suKu nwnku mwgY swihb quTY pwvw ]4]1]48] (747-8, sUhI, mÚ 5)
naam tayraa sukh naanak maagai saahib tuthai paavaa. ||4||1||48||
Nanak begs for the peace of Your Name, O Lord and Master; as it is pleasing to Your Will, I shall attain it. ||4||1||48||
sUhI mhlw 5 ] (747-9)
soohee mehlaa 5.
Soohee, Fifth Mehl:
ivsrih nwhI ijqu qU kbhU so Qwnu qyrw kyhw ] (747-9, sUhI, mÚ 5)
visrahi naahee jit too kabhoo so thaan tayraa kayhaa.
Where is that place, where You are never forgotten, Lord?
AwT phr ijqu quDu iDAweI inrml hovY dyhw ]1] (747-10, sUhI, mÚ 5)
aath pahar jit tuDh Dhi-aa-ee nirmal hovai dayhaa. ||1||
Twenty-four hours a day, they meditate on You, and their bodies become spotless and pure. ||1||
myry rwm hau so Qwnu Bwlx AwieAw ] (747-10, sUhI, mÚ 5)
mayray raam ha-o so thaan bhaalan aa-i-aa.
O my Lord, I have come searching for that place.
Kojq Kojq BieAw swDsMgu iqn@ srxweI pwieAw ]1] rhwau ] (747-11, sUhI, mÚ 5)
khojat khojat bha-i-aa saaDhsang tinH sarnaa-ee paa-i-aa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
After seeking and searching, I found Sanctuary in the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy. ||1||Pause||
byd pVy piV bRhmy hwry ieku iqlu nhI kImiq pweI ] (747-11, sUhI, mÚ 5)
bayd parhay parh barahmay haaray ik til nahee keemat paa-ee.
Reading and reciting the Vedas, Brahma grew weary, but he did not find even a tiny bit of God's worth.
swiDk isD iPrih ibllwqy qy BI mohy mweI ]2] (747-12, sUhI, mÚ 5)
saaDhik siDh fireh billaatay tay bhee mohay maa-ee. ||2||
The seekers and Siddhas wander around bewailing; they too are enticed by Maya. ||2||
ds Aauqwr rwjy hoie vrqy mhwdyv AauDUqw ] (747-12, sUhI, mÚ 5)
das a-utaar raajay ho-ay vartay mahaadayv a-uDhootaa.
There were ten regal incarnations of Vishnu; and then there was Shiva, the renunciate.
iqn@ BI AMqu n pwieE qyrw lwie Qky ibBUqw ]3] (747-13, sUhI, mÚ 5)
tinH bhee ant na paa-i-o tayraa laa-ay thakay bibhootaa. ||3||
He did not find Your limits either, although he grew weary of smearing his body with ashes. ||3||
shj sUK Awnµd nwm rs hir sMqI mMglu gwieAw ] (747-13, sUhI, mÚ 5)
sahj sookh aanand naam ras har santee mangal gaa-i-aa.
Peace, poise and bliss are found in the subtle essence of the Naam. The Lord's Saints sing the songs of joy.
sPl drsnu ByitE gur nwnk qw min qin hir hir iDAwieAw ]4]2]49] (747-14, sUhI, mÚ 5)
safal darsan bhayti-o gur naanak taa man tan har har Dhi-aa-i-aa. ||4||2||49||
I have obtained the Fruitful Vision of Guru Nanak's Darshan, and with my mind and body I meditate on the Lord, Har, Har. ||4||2||49||
sUhI mhlw 5 ] (747-15)
soohee mehlaa 5.
Soohee, Fifth Mehl:
krm Drm pwKMf jo dIsih iqn jmu jwgwqI lUtY ] (747-15, sUhI, mÚ 5)
karam Dharam pakhand jo deeseh tin jam jaagaatee lootai.
The religious rites, rituals and hypocrisies which are seen, are plundered by the Messenger of Death, the ultimate tax collector.
inrbwx kIrqnu gwvhu krqy kw inmK ismrq ijqu CUtY ]1] (747-16, sUhI, mÚ 5)
nirbaan keertan gaavhu kartay kaa nimakh simrat jit chhootai. ||1||
In the state of Nirvaanaa, sing the Kirtan of the Creator's Praises; contemplating Him in meditation, even for an instant, one is saved. ||1||
sMqhu swgru pwir auqrIAY ] (747-16, sUhI, mÚ 5)
santahu saagar paar utree-ai.
O Saints, cross over the world-ocean.
jy ko bcnu kmwvY sMqn kw so gur prswdI qrIAY ]1] rhwau ] (747-16, sUhI, mÚ 5)
jay ko bachan kamaavai santan kaa so gur parsaadee taree-ai. ||1|| rahaa-o.
One who practices the Teachings of the Saints, by Guru's Grace, is carried across. ||1||Pause||
koit qIrQ mjn iesnwnw iesu kil mih mYlu BrIjY ] (747-17, sUhI, mÚ 5)
kot tirath majan isnaanaa is kal meh mail bhareejai.
Millions of cleansing baths at sacred shrines of pilgrimage only fill the mortal with filth in this Dark Age of Kali Yuga.
swDsMig jo hir gux gwvY so inrmlu kir lIjY ]2] (747-18, sUhI, mÚ 5)
saaDhsang jo har gun gaavai so nirmal kar leejai. ||2||
One who sings the Glorious Praises of the Lord in the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, becomes spotlessly pure. ||2||
byd kqyb isimRiq siB swsq ien@ piVAw mukiq n hoeI ] (747-18, sUhI, mÚ 5)
bayd katayb simrit sabh saasat inH parhi-aa mukat na ho-ee.
One may read all the books of the Vedas, the Bible, the Simritees and the Shaastras, but they will not bring liberation.
eyku AKru jo gurmuiK jwpY iqs kI inrml soeI ]3] (747-19, sUhI, mÚ 5)
ayk akhar jo gurmukh jaapai tis kee nirmal so-ee. ||3||
One who, as Gurmukh, chants the One Word, acquires a spotlessly pure reputation. ||3||
KqRI bRwhmx sUd vYs aupdysu chu vrnw kau swJw ] (747-19, sUhI, mÚ 5)
khatree baraahman sood vais updays chahu varnaa ka-o saajhaa.
The four castes - the Kh'shaatriyas, Brahmins, Soodras and Vaishyas - are equal in respect to the teachings.

gurmuiK nwmu jpY auDrY so kil mih Git Git nwnk mwJw ]4]3]50] (748-1, sUhI, mÚ 5)
gurmukh naam japai uDhrai so kal meh ghat ghat naanak maajhaa. ||4||3||50||
One who, as Gurmukh, chants the Naam, the Name of the Lord, is saved. In this Dark Age of Kali Yuga, O Nanak, God is permeating the hearts of each and every being. ||4||3||50||



mÚ 1 ] (1091-1)
mehlaa 1.
First Mehl:
mWdlu byid is bwjxo Gxo DVIAY joie ] (1091-1, mwrU, mÚ 1)
maaNdal bayd se baajno ghano Dharhee-ai jo-ay.
The drum of the Vedas vibrates, bringing dispute and divisiveness.
nwnk nwmu smwil qU bIjau Avru n koie ]2] (1091-2, mwrU, mÚ 1)
naanak naam samaal too beeja-o avar na ko-ay. ||2||
O Nanak, contemplate the Naam, the Name of the Lord; there is none except Him. ||2||


and das will discuss about it later on.

Das also want to say that in military there are many a type of writtan matterial.

1. Book related to code of conduct or Military act or other policies which are made public and is to do with public relation.

2. Next are the one realted to strategic issues.Only a few think thanks of army or a few outsiders like the one who help army due to there expiertees in military startegy are aware of that.ORBAT or order of battalian section of miliatary intelligence deals with this.

3.Then there is book only acceable to higher ranks.Which deals with motivation of soldiers.That book only army uses for self purpose.If that is understood by basic ranks then it may that they are ready to understand the each and every act of higher Rank.

Why das wrote this ?

As Khalsa was born in turbulent situations.And born with necter of Sabre.Das read from one sau Sakhi (out of 500 Sakhis nothing to do with one written by Baba Gurbax Singh previously called Ram Kaur and from the family of Baba Budha) That state that when female were given amrit. Males objected that with Amrit all become brothers then this will mean that all female including there wive will also become like sisters.

Guru replyed that it is more to do with symbolism and not as Such a ritual or magic(what das understood from writing).But if that curious person is very much carefull then he and his wife must undergo Baptism in separate Amrit Sanskar.

So That was intellect of Guru,who was figting the war on oppressors as well as on ritualism rusting the socity that each and every thing of reform was been put an obsticle by Brahminical brain.

As at present many schoolar are rewriting the books of contemproray to Gurus period time writers by removing influence of Paganism so did Guru rewrote the stories of Hindu and Muslim holy person of Past using devine knowledge,Devotion and logic and removed flaws or misinterpetations in them whcih were so far been used to trample down trwadden or female folk.

Lkie in Ram Avtar Sita Ji did not die unhappy or Sambook is not killed for his beeing Sudra but due to his Tap killed a young boy of a Brahmin.

Or say in Kalki Avtar,Unlike in hinduism,Kalkis restore Satyuga and From his head Brahmin comes out and from other parts other castes here in Dasham Granth it is written that Kalki becomes highheaded and does not rember the name of Akal.So Akal makes Mihadi Meer,Who kills Kalki and resotre order.But Mihadi Meer,who is respected in Islam also does repeat the mistake of Kalki.
Then by mere insect he is elimnateeby Akal.

(To Be continued)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

so in Avtars Guru Ji are trying to nullyfy the absolutes prophecies made by Hindu or Muslims over the might or will of Akal.

Often it may happen that as many missioaries who are infact refomers say that follweing Sanits of Dasham Granth in fact do krishan Leela(immoral act) in there Deras.Same thing in details via Triya charitar is been done regarding prevelant hindu or muslims household of that time.das will also touch Kapal Mochan episode.

Thing to remeber is that often while supporting the views of Kala Afghana Ji person may abuse him or disociate himeslf while say a few good words for rival Jatha person.All this is done to make the views presentable to the rival Jatha and let them follow the idealogy of Kala Afghana Ji.

Even Guru Ji used many ironical statements regarding Hindu or Muslims holymen which depending on the intellect of the person can be decoded.Guru Wanted Hindus to take baptism so does he wanted to non hindus like jain or Muslims.

For hindus he had a way that instaed of making then feel offended (as many present day Kala Afghana type peole do) He prefered to use there own Puranic storys to undo the most powerfull status of demi gods and proving Akal is supreme.

example

Ther is a verse story of Rama is permanent for ages,
Everyone says daily
Rama went to reside in heaven with whole of his city.

Hindus with lower intellect will find it vey good and jump that ah! Guru is worshipping Rama.Say if Das give a report on history of thugs this does not mean that Das is approveing thugs.Police can repaort but that is not an approval.There is Lal Manohar Upadhyay,Who keeps one writing say Shiva worship in Sikhism based on Rudra Avatar,In Rudra Avtar not a single time it is writtan that to worship Shiva.

As per shaiva,Vishnu emreged from Shiva Jyoti.But in Dasham Granth,By taking order of Akal,does Vishnu takes birth as Shiva or Rudra.foolish idolators,they do not understand what Guru want to say.Vishnu is servent of Akal as Devi is Dasi.And Shiva or Rudra once was born.Both are creation of Akal and can be destroyed at any time.That is the main mooto.

Coimng Back to story of Rama.Guru means

Is not that an irony that story of Rama is been called permanent for ages and every one saying it habitually when Rama and his whole city is dead.

If some one say or sing it sorrows and sins will not come near ? ! thats the problem that at that time only full stops '.' was there not '?' or '!'.

So Das yesterday wrote a lot about three types of books or litrature in Army.
Das also want to say that jsut to look unique to a bunch of western educated persons and to get there claps just by trying to prove that our Faith is more near to science or unlike other scritpture Adi Guru Darbar is doen by Guru himself why do we miss the oppertunity to bring people from other faith to us.

Rather more time is spend to slander Hinduism or other faith say Islam .While people often called Dera dars rahter due to mushrooming of black sheep Deradars even go to the temple or other religous palce by invitation and preach Sikhism there and win Sikhs convert.Thats what is great of understanding others faith as own and self as there extension and that is more via Dasham Guru Darbar or Sarbloh Guru Darbar.

Adi Guru Darbar can not be said as bible of Sikhs.It is rather Jesus for US.Bible or such things can be sorted with Dasham Guru Darbar or Sarbloh Guru Darbar as Jesus bless all so Adi Guru Darbar,While Dasham Guru Darbar is more to do with Sikhs themselves.And Hindus must not touch them at all.

So As Das told that missioan statement or other human right charter of an army are to be made public.the strategy must be in the hands of higher UP or ORBAT experts.Say if enemy gets it that he/she may misuse it.Thats what Hindutva fools have done.It may be unlike of commen act book.So if enmy let it go to other Ranks who may make hue and cry as some missioanary with out the eyes of expert are making.They are only aware of idealogy ,not about figure of speach or ornaments or Alankars or Ragas or tunes or Rasa or language signature(typical style attached to person or era),That needs objective seeing.

But anti Dasham Guru Darbar is at present is part of curricullam of many missioary.There is a Triya charitar,A lady sells Mishri as diamond.Then she trevels in a cart.She with her lover indulge in male female compromising acts but due to the jerks and the movement of cart no one can find that.

Oh how vulger how graophical,Well at that time this was the language of rough military persons(Adi Guru Darbar only has perhaps Peepa who was a prince but not a warrier,So was Ninth Master ,who fought in a young age ,and became Teg Bahadur from Tyagmal.He got Guruship and Bani After long time of that and latterduring the time when he was bringing peace between Assammase and Moghuls.)So what was in above story.Did not Guru sent mules full of filth under the garb of nice cloths via route blokked by hill chefe tains,They attacked and found nothing,Next time he realy went out and reached at long distance off them.This time enemy was not sure due to distraction been casued before(Like US force did attack on Iraq,at one side it was dumy to distract while on other it was real).So That story was giving a type of style of covert operation.

It is starnage but true that often intellegence operative use porn matterial online to pass information.Terrorits like Al qaeda also does this.Only about latter we come to know as former do not divulge but latter on being cought reveal.So In the case of Triya Charitar,whcih look often as fancy of some one interested in sex,It is often attack on Deradars of that time or even secrest messages or style or instruction to be given out.As Moghuls themselves were of low charector at that time so they may find it only porn so of no use in War but messages were sent.

Main reason of its getting from other sources may prove that Guru migfht have used it to send messages to Far of Sangat for getting logistics or for other offencive as after Khalsa making and before leaving Anandpur as per Panth Prakash Nihungs of Majha already strated to act as if they are indipendent.That was furhter proven by the fact that After leaving Anandpur Sahib Guru did preaching in Malwa but to help Banda there was a big force from Majha.Moghuls realy did not imagine that Guru was using the technique which people use in 21st centuary.

Das is going to address a few quistions raised by Sirdar Sahib

Why Bedis where Bedis by reading Vedas,Why Nirmalas were not?Why Brahma was not ?

Why Raghuvanshis become Sodis ?

booms of Bedi to sodis ?

Why Tulsi Das did not talk about Lahore or kasur ?

Why did writer connect Gurudev with Rama and four Vedas do they have with the birth of four Gurus and why only four births?

Why are not whole family tree given ? Why did is written that out of scope of the text to write further?

Is such text bestow Vedas has highest ?
Why in War of bhangani Bhuddhan Shah is not mentioned(from some other site)?
Why sunnat is not mentioned while talking of holy prophet?

Is Kal ,Mahakal,Mahakal Kalka,Deb Kalaka is to with shiva or shakti of hindus ?

And so on an so forth Das will give reason for all.

(to Be continued)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

As das was busy with fighting ritualism and hindu type saintism in our faith so today das may not be able to complete the whole topic.

Allah ho Akbar,Allah is greatest of all,he is the one who sits one the throne on seventh sky with angels holdin him.Man is of no might in front of Allah.man lives in womb for 9 months,He is delivered out in 30 minutes.And grows up and so forth .Only if some good guidence is given in maddrrassa by Maulvis and parent also teach himm then only he can be good Muslim.I have a brother born in lahore,when he went aborad and went to mcdonald he was not knowing that unlike in lahore in that nation they do not serve Halal food.
He tells me that he tought yaar Muashtaq in this country on all shops Halal food is written but on Mcdonld it is not.so he asked them and found that it did not serve Halal over there.So thats the way he did not went astray from deen.

Das wrote a story above this could be from one Jeehadi element to another.both of them in realty are working as spies to decept other Jeehadis.So if a third person of Jeehadi menatiltiy read this letter,he will find both of them are great Jeehadis(as this third person is maniac of Jeehad and as it is said that blind of monsson sees green every where) so he will find that both the people are very intelligent and good for jeehad.

But this had an encoded message 9:30,Lahores Mcdonald,Meet Mushtaq(another implant).

So may be in triya Charitar or avtars or other thing lots of things reagardsing preaching,Deception ,logistic and many messages are decoded.Yes they may not have value for Clerics or Sants who are Sants only but for fighter, for spies ,for ploticians male or female like Chankya style or Shukra or Vidur or shkuni or Alif Laia or Rostan or Bostan or Parable or stories told by Jesus Gospels just imaginory to let others understand or in our Gurus case only selected few understand other hindu or turks who are after luxury of immoral sex or lust or under Shringaar Rasa will only get thing which they like ie pervert mind will sea porn images and forget real message as being deviated.

If we visit glossary section of www.budhadal.com there are many code words used by Nihungs still in there life.That they have taken from Kalgian Wale Guru Gobind Singh Ji.It is possilbe that shyam could be his code name or shyam kavi used to encrypt there messages.

Why did Guru used deception and why not miracles reason is clear as he did not want world to worship him but Akal and Akal only shows miracle.So it is hoax to combine miracle with Guru.In Delhi from Motibagh about 10 KM from red fort he sent the message of his arrival to moghul king via arrow,King said it is a mirealce soon next message acme that it is art of archary and not a miralce(May be Guru did inovation of it).May be whole of this Sakhi is unture but what was main purpose that Guru did not show miracle but using worldy means as provided to him by Akal did he carried out struggle to enemy who was much more stronger in matterial.

Eg of Nihung vocalburay
Dhai Phat return and attack
Haran tactical retreat
Dalla Prasad pork
Anna Idloworhipper
Loola idol of Jagannath at orrisa(they do not offend hindus on face)
Mahaprasad meat
Gopal Pera egg
Kazi checken
Kuttabdeen Dog
Kastooriya pig
Kabul doobna urinate

etc.

Only one who is close to Nihungs can understand it.

Likewise why did Guru talks about so many Demi Gods?

(to Be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

Das is realy sorry that he had to come for an abrupt halt in here as Das was busy with some findings of nihungs of UK regarding Damdami Taksal.Das will bring that issue over here latter.

Coming Back to various deities in Dasham Granth.Let us see,There was Nihung of UK who went to Anandpur Sahib and he converted a Brahman to Sikhism.

How did he do it.

He said,(Das does not rember Exact as it has been long meeting him so Das is giving his own version),Karra in my hand is Chakra or Vishnu,Kirpan is Devi herself.Kachhera is from Hanuman.Jatta or Kes are from Shanker and Kangha from Sarswati of Vevek.

That Nihung does not has faith in any god or godess but was able to make that Brahman uunderstand that theses mythological figures may not be a realty but just some symbols for inspiration.

Like shanker is to remeber God always,Hanuman for high Charector,Devi for power,Saraswati for knowledge and Vishnu for protection.And in Sikhism all things are there.Pandit became Singh.Nihungs name is Kamalroop Singh.

In fact often in various scripture related to Tenth Master often this is showen that deities are helping/giving him or Sikhs.It is even true will mean that by worship of Akal the God or gods(Devan dev),These gods created to serve human are serving the true Sikh.It is like all Angels were to do Sajda(Bowing) to Adem.So all gods if they are true are nothing but creations to serve man.If we do not worship Akal but worship these demi gods.

It is like bribing minsters or officials so that short sighted intersest like not paying tax in full to king(God) is fullfilled.Maybe idolatory and Avtar or Demigod worship is the root cause of crruption in India.But unlike other Kings this King has all knowledge that who worship King and who try to bribes the King's staff.Only who suurender to king by King's mercy are salvaged other may get some earthly benefit but will be reborn on earth.

So as Das starts of Vachitar Natak.Before that das will only give name of a few ornaments of poetary called Alankar,Upma,Rupak,Utpreskha,Atiokti,Atishyokti,Anupras,Slesh,Yamak,Anyokti.

Das does not rember there sub divisions and there are in fact many other over there.

Das will not be defing each of them but will give example of a few(Das did them in school)

Yamak is perhaps the one where two words are given which are deto but having similar meaning.

like teen Ber Kati Thi
use to eat three times
use to eat three berries.

Shlesh here same word is there giving two different meaning.

This is often used by Guru Ji also.

Like Ajaat in Japu Sahib.this means no Birth or may mean no Caste.

Like often in Raagmala Alam may be talking of not the Raag(a music tune) but of Raag(love) to God.

Then das want to talk of Annyokti this is not the littral ornament but is more to do with meaning.

Here something else is said and some thing else is to be understood.Like in Guru Granth Sahib Ji Kabir Das Ji's saying that God has so many angel may not mean that God has so much of them but are just to tell the might of God(Das could be wrong here as God can have Angels).Sant Namdev Ji say Dhan Mata Devki or Brindabana or Bhatts saying Guru Nanak was rebirth of Baman,Rama and Krishna from previous birth's in previous ages. may have totaly differnt meaning then what they are if we go verbely by them or take there littaral meaning.Prof Sahib Singh Ji did understand the actual meaning.

Das is givng another example of Lakshna or such type of things.Had Kala Afghan Sahib been working for Hindus he would have become star as hindus are not fool.(Das here want to tag those of us fool who hate Kala Afghana Sahib).

(to Be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

As Singhvj are here on the forum and to deal with such covert Hindutva people das does not get time to answer the question raised by Kala Afghana Sahib(Das could say he is Dayanand Ji of Sikhs).
Das is reapeating a few questions and answe given to them.But Das is only doing it for the consumption of Guru Granth Sahib Ji's Purists and Das still can have faith in what Santhia can say as Das knows that there is nothing impossilbe.

Did by reading Vachitar Natak one's becomes follwer of Veda or Did Guru booosted Caste?

Answer to that is in there for Vachitar Natak

For Vedas and Kateebs

See Page No 75 as per Dasham Granth at Dashamgranth.org

Those who loved Samritis,they Have left the movement of God.(As they think god is bounded by Books).
Those who have there mind stick to feet(refuge) of God,That nevers come in the Ways of Samritis.
Brahman made Four Vedas,They moved (codifed) deeds in all worlds.
Those who have thier heart with feet(Refuge) of God,they become renoucers of Vedas.
Those who renouce the views of Vedas and Kateeb,they become lover of ParaBrahm(God beyond matter).
Those who move on thier(Vedas and Kateeb) view,Will be trampled by various sorrow.

It is also writtan elsewhere (Das will give Page Number later)

In Veda and Kateeb there is no God.Behold God in People (and thier) Mind.

So regarding if Guru was trying for showing his upper Caste see line on the same page 75.

Those who have daoubt on Caste/birth.They do not leave love with God.
They get Salvation,There is no differance between them and God.

Those people who are afaraid of birth/castes(System).Leaves God and goes after them(Has faith in them)..They go into lake of hell(ie) Again and Again are born.

This is more then sufficent things which Guru gave here so that Kala Afghan Sahib do not think that he is trying to sprad Vedas or Casteism as Sirdar Sahib have accused writier of Vachitar Natak to boost these to things.Then Das will now touch what actually Guru want to convey as far as Veads are concerned.
(To be Contunued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

So before Das starts Das will tell a Sakhi,Once Singhs told Guru that Ragis are doing very Good Singing of holy verses.They are Great.

Guru told them a story that a chaudhri(Headman) of village was drawing water out of well via Rahat.his Kassi(a tool) was lost.He searched whole the village and his brother did spoke to all in annucement.Kassi was not found.

Then he started to brake houses of villagers.Someone said why not see the home of your brother.it was searched and Kassi was found.So Guru Said that preachers Pandit,Ragis all are good to speak but may not be good in deeds.

His bani state Preach other oh animal,who are yourself unawre.

So that Sakhi he told was may not be true but a way to explain to the illitrate or semi litrate persons.Who may not read or write.

So by saying Bedis were those who read Vedas Guru wanted to tell that Veda's which have been highest of revereance to hindus were understood by Bedi family for generations.The very Same Family gave the writer of Gurumat.

Who is saying that God is not traped or bound by Vedas.Veda 's experts have now switched to Gurubani and that is the real Veda and instead of reading it better to read Gurubani(Guru was an aggressive preacher and not a defensive reformer).

Same could be said by Saying about linage with Rama.Yes he had it but told that his forefather was just an insect in front of Akal.Do not worship Ram his forefather but Akal.It is strange that in us also there is system in some part to rever family related to Guru(Bedis or Sodis).So do hindu rever some family related to old Brahmins like Parshuram.Like Sayyads are respected in Islam.

But Guru just gave a testomony that his linage is that of normal humans.Those who worship Rama must stop as some one from Rama's own Family is saying to stop worship Ram(who is created by Akal) and worship Akal.If some Sudra would have said Kshriya or Brahmins did not have understood it.But some one from family of Rama is saying.Say to convert to christianity a Boda triabal will preferabley given a testomony of Bodo convert then of Naga cconvert.

(To Be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh
TodAY das will put end to a few more doubt raised by sirdar Sahib.

Like why not Nirmalas,Brahma and such people dod not become Bedis and reason of Sodi dynasty.

He askes why does a person change his surname.

Das can ask that he had surname KALA AFGHANA after his village.His forefather may not have the same.So do of often there were surnames in hindus after one of thier fathers or Grand Fathers also like Aggerwal are from the sons of Raja Agersen of Agroha(Haryana).

He had many sons like Tayal,bindal,Jindal so sons of Tayal can be having Surname as Tayal and Aggarwal also but may not have Bindal gotra.

Same way from Bhrigu we have Bhargav and from Bhartdvaj we have Bardwaj .

Likewise their are Suraj Vanshis who write gotra virk after one of the great men Baba virk who was a product of Suraj Vanshi and a tribal lday during the time of invasion of Ghaznavi.

Juneja khatri say that they have a linage with Raja Janmejaya.

So if Tarkhan or Kalal all of them can be Ramgarhia or Ahluwalia based on Ramgarh or Ahlu village then what is wrong with sodis.In fact previously Ramgarhia were Ichhogillias as that was thier native village.

Wait,what about changing of Gotra when we all become Singh since Vaishakhi 1699.In fact surnames like Kalsi or Ranghretta or Nakai are based upopn name of one elder or title of misl.

In that views kindly read Vachitar Natak again.

Kal Ket became unlimited mighty.He makes Kal rai to leave towen.
They(here thing to rember is that plural is used so that could mean that Kal rai went with his supporters) went fleeing Sanod country(state).There married priencees of that state(here plural can be for Kal Rai).28.
From whom which son was onn place(was born).Name of him was kept as Sodi Rai).
From that day dynasty became sanod(name of state or country),complelte,holy,supreme(God) did it..29..

There after who so ever was son or grand son .they all were called as sodis..
There after there is a good lot of story of thier rise and fall due to internal conflict.(Das here want to say that Guru can be totaly ruthless to about faimly background as he was more to do with Akal then caste or race).
Here Kala Afghana ji did a very big mistake.As he is from casteless Sikh family it could be expected from him.

Well read it again on page 65 of Vachitar Natak of dasamgranth.org.
From the Day there was a child Sodi rai was borm from one praticular pricess.The Vansh or dynasty became Sanod.So here Guru wants to tell that from that day all people who came with Kal Rai became Sanodis from from them sodis and thier sons and Grands Sons also.

Like we can have Elahwadi surnmae from Khatris of Allahbad.He have tailang Brahmans.We have oswal or khandel wal.

We have Bhindrawale as surname.So it is more to do with Sanodi which became sodi as it is clearly mentioed that Vansh is Sanod and from Sanod Sanodi and later on started to be called Sodi.

Even it is also possilble that from the day Sodi Rai was born they were called Sanod.But sons of Sodi rais were called sodis like Virk,Juneja or Bhargav or Aggerwal.It is also possible that like Ramgarhia or Ahluwalia all Sanod started to call themselves as Sodi as it is writtan that thence all sons and Grand sons or what he can say the coming genration.

Then there was a War in between this sodis only and not between Say sons of Kal Ketu and Kal Rai.In fact before coming to Sanod it is said that both of then had many sons.It is possible that when Kal rai fleed as writan also he was not alone but with others(as it is in plural).So he might have had both Lavis and kushis who came with him in Sanid Sanod.

So at initial satge both Lavis and Kushis were sodis.Then later there is a war between them.Till this time it is not divulged that weather Kal Rai was from Lav or Kush.But yes Sodi were both from Luv and Kush.

(to be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

Then as Das starts today.It was both lavi and kushis in sodis as they came with Kal Rai to sanod.Adn Kal Ketu and his follwer the one who let them out of Lahore and Kasur(this aRea is Kekay and at later stage its capital was Jhelum towen.Thing to rember here is that step mother of Rama was from here and even our porus or Parwatershwar who fought with Alexender was king of this area.At present it lies in Pakistan).

Thenat Sanod thus there was a rise of sodis and they did many Yagnas and also they did some good works as Guru writes that they removed sins of family.But with time thier was a WAr among themselves(Not with Kal Ketu Family).

Das can give a bit more example how does surname changes.Sirdar Sahib was never Hindu so he could not imagine how caste works.He is justifed.Let ius see.

Moon Dynasty or Chandra Vansh.Out of them there were Kurus and Yadus.
In Kurus due to great Bharat King(Son of Dushaynt and Shkuntala and on whose name India is Bharat) That whole Brach of Kuuru was thence called Bharat Vanshi(Pronouced as Bhurut like u in cut).This continued till one of thier genration had king Pandu,Till then Kuru there were both Bharat Vanshi and Chandra Vanshi but Dushyant was not BharatVnashi as he was father of Bharat.So is the case of Fore Fathers of Raghu like Surya,Dalip,Sagar or Bhagirath(Who made Ganga touch plains).But his sons lie Dashrath or Rama were both Suraj/Sun Vanshi and Raghuvanshi.It thier surname can be changed then than why could not they be Sodis later on.

There is very good thing again in Vachitar Natak.It tells that Surya or moon etc were/are humans and not angels.Later on many Hindus also agreed to it.

See just before telling about his family he says(in Akalustat also he says the same that DEvta(Angel) ,Adev(Demons),Jachh,Kinar,Turk ,Hindu as influence of attire of various counteries it is part of Behold human race as one).

Have a look what is writtan in Vachitar Natak. Page 64 as per dasamgranth.org Vachitar Natak.

Sadh Karam Je Purakh Kamave.Nam Devta Jagat Kahave.Kukrit Karam Je Jag ?Mien Kare.NaM aSUR Tin ko Sab Dharehi..15..

Person who earns good deeds.World calles (that) name of Angel(call him/her Angel).If does bad deeds in world.All keep that's name as demon..15..

So can a Brahmin writes that or father of Das and Kala Afghan Sahib Tenth Master ?

Coming Back to Chandra Vansh so after Pandu his five sons were called Pandav and rest of Kurus remain Kauravs.

Even those Kurus who went with Pandavs to thier five city state called Indrprashta made on Khandav Van were thence Pandavs.

Same way could be said to Yadavs who were having a united tribal funditation in Braj.Shorsen was head of one part ,who was paternal Grand father of Krishna and Uggersen was his maternal Grand father and both were rulers.

At those time these tribes had various permutations and combitnations and Das is infact not as yet confired with how Yadavas were functioning but Sirdar Sahib at once passed the verdict.

Can he tell that why all Tarkhans weather or not having blood relationship with Ramgarhia Sardar(Jassa Singh Ji) or why all Kalal similarly become Ahluwalia.Then after some of them takin cannabis why thier is still a 'caste' or surname called Bhangu or Bhangi in Jatts of India or Pakistan.
http://www.bhangoo.com/ws/b/main.html

Das hope that answer to changing of surname by area or by great man is resoved.Even Sadiqis aND aNSAris also have some thing to do with role of thier forefathers realted holy Prophet.

Jews are Jews perhaps by judea and what about whole Isreal?

As per bhvishya Puran,Chauhan were son of tomar.(may be thier Agni Vansh story means bringing them to up word).

And needless to say thaT many coblers/taners use surname Ravidasi and many scavengers/sweepers use Valmiki.

Then coming Back to Vachitar Natak,There was an internal feud among Sodis.And Guru clearly tells that due to mammon or wealth they were fighting.It was Guru who is telling truth about wrongs happened in his family and why it became so himble that Guru Ramdas Ji also said,Hum Rulte Firte and he use to sell boiled Black grams.If Guru wrote relation with Rama then told also that his next Generation may not have been so great.Brahmins may not think such.#

Then later on it becomes clear that there was a feud based upon forefathers ie Lav and Kush and war which is Bad was due to Bad influence of ancestorage of Lava Or Kusha wich made lots of blood shed in sodis and caused lack of unity.

So by this Guru is telling us to lay off by feud realted to weather my father was a Brahmin or was a sultan or naything.What counts is what i am or what you are.

And then from this WAR.Greed ,Wealth,Ego and not rembering God casued that see Page No. 66.Das is not writing whole lines whcih are ondemoing War and facotrs which are casusing it.

From this War till Page No 70 Guru keeps on describing War.And it is full of Veer Rasa.Brahmin whould have devoted more Pages to family tree as they do in Haridwar and other places(May be from some documents in Hundi etc from Brahmin Guru could know his Family history which also he utised to preach Khalsa Panth to all.) But here a motivator is using WAR as medium to incite or rise courage in Sikhs.

So at last of this page Luvis(from sodis) won and Kushis(From Sodis) were defeated and went to Benaras.Thier they lived for Long and leanrt Vedas.Here first time another surname was also used.Lavi and Kushi.Like we have Kalsi fromm sub mils Kalsia as Gotra in Ramgarhias so could be thier we have two surname.In Virks we have sub Gotra Batth.Or say in Arora we may have Makkad,Kumra,Chhbra etc.In Hindus till this day it is possible.

Why Guru Ji told it here was he preaching hinduism?

No! He was opposing such system as such system lead to WAR and deaths.See the last four lines of same page 70.Whom so ever mighty(from Kushis ) were left ran taking thier life with them.

He is rahter opposing the gloryfication of the Family of Gurus and telling them to be just like anyother family as Guru were always against personal worship as that may spill over to family members like we see Wife of Gurbachan nirnakari is Raj Mata.And many such cases in hindus.
(To Be continued...)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

So there could be War in between Kushi Sodis and Lavi Sodis.Thats what Das understand.

And Kushis went to Benaras and learnt Vedas and became Bedi.

Like iron smith due to loha becomes lohar,Poter due to pot(kumbh becomes Kumahar.And one who reads Ramayan becomes Ramyani and like who reads Guru Granth Sahib ji is called Granthi.

Well one thing to rember here is that due to lack of script being developled.Vedas were in past rembered by heart and they used to be stored in mind.There are four Vedas and in Brahmins who use to rember one was Vedi,Two Dwivedi(dube),Trivedi and Chaturvedi(chaube).And like this we have thier surname.There are no one at present who learns Vedas like Parret but yes there are Many Muslims who take pride that they learn and can say whole holy Kuran by heart.

But Bedis from Kush were differnt.They stuedied Veda(This thing to be rembered that we can draw inferance that all studied Vedas but next line said that only those who studeied Vedas).And as they studied so there called Bedis(it is taking of understanding of essence of Vedas and not what we call Ratta or just recording them in mind here Veda is taken aas all four VEDAs .Veda is called VEd in Sanskrit and can be used as singular and plural,This type of Vedis who were Bedis were due to plural sense while Brahmins were to do with individual Vedas which they learnt by heart and recorded it).

Here Pathna or reading word is used.(page 71).

Then there is another very important thing.Just after thier saying to be reading Vedas.

They Moved/preached Dhram(Rightiousness's)'s Deed(Karam) (of ) Good(Neekye).

They encoraged the good and rightous deeds.

So is it not possible for person who understand VEDAS to be good or to do good.Thier are many Bhagats before Adi Guru Granth Sahib Ji were writtan who did good deeds and they were also having knowledge of VEDAs.Das Just want to prove from that line that these Bedis were doing Good work also alongside learning VEDAS.

Kala Afghana Sahib are in impression that thier reading Vedas is tagged as good deed by fictatious Brahman.When Guru Granth Sahib was not their does he wants to say that no one was doing good work? And if some one knows Veda then he can not do good work? In Fact Gurus also knew Vedas and did good work.

Well are all Granthis also may not be doing good inspite of just read Guru Granth Sahib JI.Das can say this that doing something and getting result of it is more to do with hinduism,Panth tells to be happy in will of God.

Like due to Vanijya(trade) we have Vanjara in Sikhs also,Due to polish on metal we have Sikligars so we had Bedis who studied Vedas.

Well why not Brahma became Bedi? Or why not Nirmala?

Das deals with Nirmalas first.

Nirmalas were sent by Guru to trap all the knowledge whcih was so far in the hands of Brahmins.
Like
history
Scripture of Hindus
Yoga
Ayurveda
Astrology
Logic
Vedantan
Purana
And also Sanskrit and also Vedas.

At the time of Bedis it is possible that many Puranas were yet to be wrrttan.

So bowler is bowler,Batter is Batter and one who does both is all rounder.

Nirmala means pure. And work of Nirmalas is to detoxify or purify hindus from hinduism and make them Sanatan Dhrami or Khalsa.So thense is thier name.

Sirdar Sahib also talk of something Nanak Nirmal Panth Chalaya.REad it carefully.Panth was Chalaya or maved and not Bannaya or made.Guru made Dharam to move by will of Good on Path(Panth) which was stagnent till then.

As a Nirmala Das can say that differnt between way of his moving Dhram then preivous one was that He had preached rightiousness in unprcedented manner by will of Akal.Our Faithg is combine therapy of devotion(Bhakti) and Knowldge(Gyan). This never happened before.God made it to happen.Kala Afghan Sahib is near Gyan and Akhand Kirtani Jatha is near Bhakti.Both need to learn from each other.

so due to Extra education Nirmalas can not just be called Vedis or Bedis.

Then lets talk about Brahma.Even if he transfered Vedas to mankind from God and even if he was not perfect(He had a lust on his own doughter Sarwati as per a few Purana),He could be very much like our own Granthis who delivers us a good lot of Gurmat from Akal (Guru Granth Sahib Ji are Akal's verbal manifestation) but may not follow themselves.So deliveres of Veda can not be Bedi.

like Valmiki can not be Ramayani but one who read it and preach it are the one.Many of the Bhagats like Shekh Farid who made contribution in Guru Granth Sahib Ji can never be called Granthi.Das hope that those questions raised by Kala Afghana Sahib were only to show thier sense of humour and had no logic.

A writter of a book is writer and reader and student of it is reader or student.Brahma did not understand Veda even after delivering them to us from Akal.So how can he be called Bedi.And As his mention in that article said that thier is a Sabad in Guru Granth Sahib Ji,Brahma did not understand the name of Akal.So like Swami Dayanand Ji,If we go by interpetaion of Gurubani by Kala Afghana sahib Brahm Ji were not knowing God.He was binding himself to a book and intead of leanring about God from book he learnt about book itself.

Anand Sahib when says in Vedas(Scripture) supreme name ,that does not listen and move like ghost in dead body.There Guru wants to talk of all books or scriptures as all tell about God and God binding us via books and we can not bound God with book.(Guru Granth Sahib ji are more clear in it).But in case of other faiths some vested intersets did do misinterpetations to bound God with book.Like our own Kala Afghana Sahib are trying.

Can any writer of book is oblige to go by book which he/she writes.Say when some docters write a therpy to a pateint them does docter also has to under go therpy.

So by all Das thinks that Das could prove from other Examples how can Ram the Grand son of Raghu became Raghuvanshi but mandhata father of Raghu did not.So Kal Rai was not sodi but later one did became.

Like we have some Granthis we had Bedis.

Then why did Tulsi Das did not mention this thing in his Ramchritar Manas.Well Sirdar Sahib may be knowing hindus upto the level or primary book by Tulsidas.

Tulsidas was a Brahmin.And Soory to say that Kala Afghana Sahib does not know these Brahmin better then Das so Sirdar Sahib are afraid of Brahmins as if Sahib are Budhist or jain who were absorbed by BRahmins.

Well both of them were Nastiks like Arya Samaj or personal worshipper but we worship Akal.And our Guru is great neither born nor die.

Tulsidas Ji were not the fool that he would tell the people that yuonger generation of Rama has abondined Rama Worshipping and started to worship akal and no longer are Hindu.

Thing to rember here is that this would have made his follwers to leave hindusim and become Sikh.

Then let us talk of north of Aydhya.In North we have Braj area which was won from demon by youngest brother of Rama Shatru Ghana.Further north is say Madra and Kekaya. Further north is Gandhara.

There is a story that Gandhrvas of Ghandhras were Bad unlike heavnely one.So another brother of Rama Bharat sent his sons Tax and perhaps Purush ,who defeated Gandhravas(perhaps Pathans of tody) and set up two towens,TaxShila(still there) and Purushpur(Peshawar).This das read from a Puran in childhood but it is true as per Puranas.So if Bharat's son can do this why not sons of Rama can not go to north and make Lahore and Kusur.

In Fact Sau Sakhi call Lahore as Luvpur.Ludhiana as Ludhpur etc.Tulsi Das was a real Brahmin and as per that always to live in high spirit.He did not lacked Chardi Kala like our Kala Afghana Sahib.After Ghaznavi over took Punjab in Brahminical Granths there is very littel referance of them.They did not want to put 'lower spirit' or Dhandiyan Kala in the minds of hindus that thier areas are under infidals control.

They rather banned thier movement to areas which they ruled in past so that they may not go outside India and come out of the influence of Brahmanism.If it is Jayas,Amethi,Benaras,Ayodhya where thier were still hindu majority and often hindu chiefe tains were ruling and Army of Naga Sanyasi was ever ready for holy War then Brahmins did write about such place.

But in Areas where hindus were not allowed to ride horse even then why should they talk of Katasraj(Near Taxial) whcih is birth place of Shiv,Lahore,Kasur,Hinglaj(Balochistan where Rama did peneace for forgivness of Brahm Hatya of Pandit Ravana),Ruqqband or Kabul where Hindus were like salt in flour and in bad shape.

No one especialy like hindus who has attachemnt to land like we have to God will tell that thier holy lands are now under the controls of infidals.Sanskrit Brahimns only knew till Nirmalas came some exception could be great holy men from rich classes but commen hindu was only able to understand Hindi and so in hindi writings there was nothing brought in from Sanskrit.And words of Sanskrit were also twisted so that actual reaSON only oftten Brahmin understand.

So to not to demoralise Hindus from worshipping Rama Personaly did Tulsidas Ji did not mentioed that younger generation is now givung up hinduism and thier empire has Muslim rule as well as Muslim majority.

Then question come s that why does not famiy tree given as a whole?

Well writer was Guru and not the one who could bother about the fancy of some purist of fabricated idealogy.

Had writer gave the family tree as a whole then it would have been taken by the same critic that look he is giving the whole family tree and encouraging caste system and he can not be Guru but a Brahmin.

Guru gave name of only important persons.

Actual setter of dynasty Surya
Rama
His sons

Then how they became sodis

Then how some became Bedis

and he was not interested about thier negative or positive life but about proving his linage for the intention of preaching Sikhism.Why should he write irrelavent just to make thing bulky and complex and thats why does Guru tell that he is not puting irrealvent hings in here.

Rattan Singh Bhangu also used such thing that the things which are not of any use so use of them is out of scope.In Fact Guru's Life was so busy and an Army man as well as great schooloar when working as a preacher,why should he write irrelvent things as policemen of Punjab police write(Kala Afghan Sahib Ji were also inspector in that depratment).And Guru tells that thing time and again but sleuth doubts Guru.

In Fac reason of not writng abouot all linage during Krishana times has another thing attached.At that time main attraction was Krishana and all regarding it is writtan in Krishana avtar.

When a Bhat says that Guru Nanakdev Ji were Baman,Rama and Krishan in preivous ages and Guru gives that line a place in Guru Granth Sahib Ji,That Bhat can not be an agent of Brahmanism but when Guru who is the light of First form only writes about same light of Akal taking form of Rama or Krishana in past then he becomes Brahmin.Sirdar Sahib must know that In Bali and Baman,In Rama and Ravan,In Krishana and Kansa and In Guru Gobind Singh Ji and Aurangzeeb,There is only one light and that is Akal.

Yes there are very prevert type of attempts to paint whole Previous Sanatan Dharmi people just as myth which is nothing else but copying evenglist who are not at all succesful by this attempt.Rather they are ahteed by Hindus for contempt.

Das has seen some Granthi saying that Krishan was rapist.This means at least they say that Krishana was there but he quote Gurbani,Asa Di War,

He says He brought Parijat(according to him it is a female but das know that it is tree and of good importance to enviroment) and did Rang in Braindaban.

So as per him Guru used term Rang(pleasure) for sinister act like Rape.

(To Be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

Das wanted to prove so far regarding Bedi and Sodis that there could be possibilty in hindus to have such surnames and reasons were given.

And Guru wanted to tell pubic that being hindus there forefathers were not as perfect as he was or as Guru Panth Khalsa is.

Reason for Gratness of Panth Khalsa over hinduism can be adjudged that if any religeon which has given the largest convert to Sikhism then that is hinduism.

And weather Rama or Krishana are false or true In Adi Guru Granth Sahib Ji also Das can say that to let Hindus also understand Gurmat Examples of thier heros are given.

Rama or Krishana live in the heart of general hindu public and Guru Ji did realise it and in presentalbe manner proved that they are false in front of thier God ,Akal.God of Vedas also. False something which is created as it can be destroyed.

So coming Back to Granthi who (not from Kala Afghana gruop but some hypocratic pro vegitarian lobby) was not a missioary was making fun of Hindu visitors to Gurudwara and having prevert pleasure to humiliate hindus by misinterpreting Gurubani and trying to prove that Krishana was a rapeist.Das is aware that this can make Hindus to not to come to Gurudwara and thier avenues to be Sikh be come dim.

Sants do not do this.And often missioanries brother make fun of them also.So by this both Hindus and Sikhs who are mopre with devotion go to them and thier might increase.Why canot our missionerns learn this thing from sants whcih is presentation methods.
(To Be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Gurfateh

So far we have reached to the point that Bedis leanrt Vedas and thence got the name and they were an offshoots of those sodis who had linage from Kush.


Then there is another impoteant thing which we came to know

When Bedis did good work of Rithious deeds.

King of Madra area reads the paper about improvemnt.

Here it is possbile that at that time paper may not exist but term Kagadan is used for paper but it can be used for report.King of Madra gets the report of thier getting reforemed.

As Bedis he knew were were improved so he forgets the feeling of hatred towards them.

Sirdar Sahib Kala Afghan Ji again did very big mistake.

He termed Madra Desh as Punajb but Madra is only part of PunjaB.Including Paur,Malawa and noerhten Haryana.

Kingdom of Kal Ketu had to be in area near Kekai or Lahore or Kasur while Kal Raya came to sanod.and Sodis from Lav had king in Madra Area.It is possbile that sanod could be there or it is possible that as they did carry oout expansions via horese killing ritual(after sodi rai) and so some of them might have overtaken Madra Desh(from here did second wife of Pandu and mother of Nakul Sahdev belonged.Her brother said to have ditched Karna in Mahbhrata so Pandavas could win).

So this is giving us a lesson to be forget enimity with good doer.

(to be continued..)

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

Das wants to say that at that time when Guru wrote this story Bedis and sodis may not be living their as it is more history or say more some messages Guru want to tell us as similar History of Hindu Mythology or Even Islamic terms are used in Adi Guru Granth Sahib ji also.


Then King sent an agent who was there went as a caller(mulkian).Sirdar Sahib say that his name was Muklian.But in Haryana Mulkiyan is one who goes to tell for Muklava(calling girl back to the house of husband as she attains puburty as she was married as a child).It is called Gauna in UP,Bihar.

So Here Muliyan is term perhaps something to do with caller or inviter.He is sent to Kansi and tells all the secrets to Bedis there.As term Secert or Bhed is used that means that king could have had a secret news(intelligence was there since the time of Rama when Vibhishana use to sent his agents who were Rakshas to Lanka and Ravana also sent same in Rama' Camp)..

On understanding/learning this Bedis moved to Madra area of Punjab.They came and after(kai) How (Many Kai)salutations were given to them by king.Here Kai word is used twice and both are same but having differant meanings.

Then King made then to do tune of Vedas ie to talk of Vedas.(it will come later).All brothers sat in seminar.(brother hoods between two rival in Past in the form of Sat Sang).Read Sam Veda and story of Yajur Veda,This could be understood that they did reading and explaination of both of these Vedas.So it was done in explaination manner.As further proved by next line Rig Veda was read with gesticulation of hands.This means that hands were used to explain what was read it means that they understood Vedas so do they tried to make it understand to king.

Question arise here king called them after reprots of thier becoming good and after loosing all enimity.Was it just for let them read Vedas that he could have got done from anyone.Then what was the reason of his calling them and then let them read Vedas.

Perhaps King wanted to undo injustuce done to them as they have reformed as they were doing good work.Then why Vedas were made to be read by them.Well King got two informations regarding them.

1.They are expert in Vedas.
2. They are doing good.

Well all know if King gets a news King who is realy practical verifys the truth.
His agent did tell Bedis that King knows that they have understood Vedas and are doing Good.

Say if anyone wants to test others for weather he/she does good or not.In exam environemt or in testing situation even a Bad person can sham to do good.In the same way did King called them and told them to testyfy that they are good doer,even if they were not good there could have been a possilbity to sham.And this method to understand the truth could fail.

Other method could be to verfy other information.Thier knowing Vedas.Das can say that learning Vedas is very difficult then being good.We could see a Veda harper here who neither is good nor a learned of Veda.

But in this case King did verfied fisrt part of the information from sample which could be verifyable and did concluded that other information was also correct.

Das is aware that logic of Sirdar Sahib may ask what would have happened if they did new Vedas and were not doing good works and intelligence report to king was currupted.Das can answer that in text writer is givng tesomony of thier doing good work and it was king who might not have knew it.Writer here is bigger then one charector of King.And likewise reports may not come form mone agent and agent could have been sent after grapewine comes jsut to verify truth.

and why should the reporter side with Veda readers and dithch his king.King was to verfy himself as he was to take a major decision that was to transfer his responsibility to them.

(To Be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

Then as we see in text that All brother sat and Vedas were explained after reading as gesticulation has come.

Then it is writtan Reading of Arthrav Veda,Hearing Sins running.

Das has tried to tranlate nearnes to it.

It can have many meanings.

It is generaly heard that by reading Athrav veda,Sins run away.It is a statement whcih could mean in genral.

When statement is made it does not mean that writer supports it.

Say in Japuji sahib lets say there is a statement,Many filthy eat eat filth.

This satement only is an observance and not an endrosement to it.

By the way Das was interested to know that what are the views of Sirdar Sahib regarding those people who were born Before Adi Guru Granth Sahib Ji was writtan.And how does they use to let thier sins go?

Guru Granth Sahib Ji clearly state God for ages created devotes and kept thier honur.God killed evil Harnakashyap,Prahlad was salvaged/afloat.Person Nanak servered that sustainer(God),Got Delvered (from) theend.

Gurmat time and again use old or mythical people just to show that in past also salvage was given by God.And thier are many Holy men whose verses are in Guru Granth Sahib Ji who born Before Guru Granth Sahib Ji was complied.

So one who have been used by God to deliver holy verses are they not going to be salvaged as they are not following Guru Granth Sahib JI.

Wait let Das give a similar Sirdar Sahib style of referance over here.

From Japu Ji Sahib.
suixAY swsq isimRiq vyd ] (2-19, jpu, mÚ 1)
suni-ai saasat simrit vayd.
Listening-the Shaastras, the Simritees and the Vedas.

nwnk Bgqw sdw ivgwsu ] (2-19, jpu, mÚ 1)
naanak bhagtaa sadaa vigaas.
O Nanak, the devotees are forever in bliss

suixAY dUK pwp kw nwsu ]9] (3-1, jpu, mÚ 1)
suni-ai dookh paap kaa naas. ||9||
Listening-pain and sin are erased. ||9||

suixAY squ sMqoKu igAwnu ] (3-1, jpu, mÚ 1)
suni-ai sat santokh gi-aan.
Listening-truth, contentment and spiritual wisdom.


here Das will not say that by listening Vedas or Samritis sin or Sorrow run away but by listening Name of God it does go away.

And by Anand Sahib it is clearly stated that in Vedas/scriptures there is name of God.

Das can give Page numbers of those Veds which clearly state that God is in All.And Guru worshipped that God.

But in relative terms there are many occults in Athrav Vedas and all rituals of Hinduism to remove Sins or other such things are often drivan from Athrav Veda.In Fact BraHama has four Faces(Chaautranan) and each one repersent one Veda and perhaps at one point of time it was later story being made that Due to curese Brahma may not have Temple by There were instance when Like We Worship Guru Granth Sahib Ji,Hindus even worhipped not only books like four Vedas but even made images of four single headed Brahmas sitting on lotus and they were termed Vedas.

Perhaps in us worship of Book like deity has come from this Hindu ritualism and this need to be reomved.It is a Brahmanical ritaul so Das will say that worship of Guru Granth Sahib Ji is also Manmat.

Before Das moves ahead some Granthi told that Anti Sikh people may make fun as they make it of Raag Maala so in the case of parts of Shri Dasham Granth.Das can quote from Gurbani by Sant Ravidas Ji,

Teri Bhagat Na Chhodoon,...Lok Hasein.

(i) will not leave your(God's) devotion,Even people loguh at me.

Then what sort of people Arya Samajis who fabricated that Vedas were writtan by four Rishis at Bank of Indus.

Das wants to tell this that there were no four Rishis at all.Angeera(Earth),Agni(Fire),Vayu(Air),Aditya(Sun but here it talks of sky) are four elements and Fifth indus is termed as Sindhu(which is sea used four Water).

Aryvart means Area off civilisation.It is Biosphere made up of Atomosphere(Air and Sky),Hydroshpere(sea) and Lithosphere(Earth and fire in it).Those guys do not know Veds properly and fabiracte and how can they come nearn us.

And then Hindutva,Das can say one thing that tern Hindu was derogatory and Term as per them should be Sanatan Dharam or Arya.

Coming Back to say if we belve that by reading Arthv Veda as influence and truth reagrding occult is removed so concept of Sins also Go.then what?

Even if sin go and good deeds or Punya reamin then even we will have ego that we did this and we will not be beyond Three Gunas(qulities) and due to this we will have to be reborn(Das think Sirdar Sahib Ji belive in rebirth).

So this does not in any way tells that Vedas are greater then Gurmat But Das personaly Say that roots(Vedas) are always lower then fruit(Gurmat).
In Vedas there has been scope for wrong interpetaions but in Gurmat Guru made a Taksal so let there be no adultration in Gurbani.And Vedas are more with knowled But Gurmat has Devotion also along side knowledge much much more then Vedas and more relevent and unaffected by time.

But yet Das can again say that we can take this meaning of verse

Athrav Ved Pattihyan,Sune Pap Nathiyan.

On reading of Athrav Veda(at that time),it is heard (that thier) sins ran away.

Guru himself is quting an information which he is not confirming.

Other thing could be that
Athrav Veda was read.It is heard that by that sin run away.



These are open statements and prticeple is used which can make it in any time.As timless God is God of Guru so statements of Guru are beyond the boundaries of Time.

but listening to religeous things are never bad and can be of some use in general and running of sins could be step in that direction this is the version so far by Taksali or Nirmalas side.And missioranies have right to oppse them.

But in general listeing to others may remove sin if we have towards other in our mind as this is the main purpose of dialogue so that he have no sin or bad intenetion towars other.

Then it comes King became Happy.Gave all matterial.(this could mean that King verifed that these people were good and they were returend matterial on whcih since long sodis were having control).

(to be continued..)

Gurfateh!

Since know King was happy due to good deeds of Bedis and King did a good deed to return them thier right which his wrong ancestor took by force here ancestors of both were Bad but as Bedis were reforemed so did Sodis also followed the suit.

It is something being told to let us rember that 'it is good to live in the company of good people and we also become good like metal becaomes gold by touching Paras(Gold stone).

Then it is said that Raja or King made living in Jungle or in forest.

At once people without knowledge of Puranas and only Adi Guru Granth Sahib Ji will say that he is renocing the world.As in Guru Granth Sahib Ji Hath Yogis are told not to go to forest.And Tenth Guru also said that understand your home as Forest.Ban Se Sadan Sabhe kar Samjheo(this part of Dasham Granth Ji is undisputed).

So in old Puranic world there were mnay Rishis who use to have thier schools or Patth Shalas in Jungle and there students use to live near nature and in peacefull surrouonding they use to learn education.

Those teachers were also marred.In Brahsutra,Grahsth Ashram is writtan to be supreme as Student(Brahmchari) also live with Grahsti Teacher in Pathshala.Vanprasth and Sanyasis also take foods from Grihashtis.

Then Ved Vysa,Vashsith,Jamdagini,Draoncharya,Sandipani all were married.

It was only due to Nath yogis that Rishis were more often refered as renoncers.That is only part of them.

Then Five Pandavas were given Khandav Forest.They made it civlised by five brothers making five Vilages.Inderpat(Delhi),Sonipat,Panipat,Bagpat,Tilpat and Sixth Towen was given to Guru so it was Gurugram or Gurugaon of today.Well to all those who say Mahabharta is a myth this could be in that way that late on some Sanatan Dharmi could have named new cities based on old scriptures but Old Fort of Delhi is said to be city of Pandvas later rejunivated by Baber/Humyoon as Far as belivers are concerned and they are justifed..

So as it was happening in Aryas of that time King might have taoght to make a new home,A new towen by making Jungle habitable.

And by this 'sin' it is a realtive term was removed or old enimity was removed as it could have simmered like it is there in Hindus and Muslims till day regarding Babari Mosque that Hindus say it is our place and our claim and you(muslims) took it and give it back to us.Similarly there are many instances of Family feueds between tribes in past.Like Parshuran Bhagwan Ji also killed Kshtriyas 21 times as he wa sBrahmin and Kshteriyas were troubling him and his tribe.

So there GReat sin was destroyed or Maha Pap Nasiyan is writtan.

Then it is writtan

Rikhan Bhes Kiyan.Tise Raj Deeyan.

This means two things.

King took the attire of sage(here it could mean that he took fatigue to be worn in jungle as in Jungle he may to have rough anf tough attrie as Rishis use to wear at that time and no ornament or he could be looted as he was no longer a king but one who is going to start a settlement).And that person gave kingdom.

Another meaning could be one who had attrise like that of Sages(as Bedis were from abode of Saints Benaras and learnign Vedas there so they may wear sage like cloath or one of them who wore).That one was given Kingdom(may be due to his attirse of renuocer like or sage like he could have been deemed to be a wirthy ruler in futre without any greed,King could have choosen him after seeing all Bedis over there).At that time King use to chose successsor who may not have been his son like King Bharata also did not give kingdom to his unworthy sons but worthy third person while leaving kingdom.

In old Sanatan Dhrama traditions to avoid conflict after death of king term YuvRaj or Crowned prince is used.Who may over take kingdom after King(Wali Ahed e Saltanat is term in Mughals but it failed there).But still this was thing mentioned in past as safegurad to turmoill after king passes away that King use to give his throne while he is alive to an able person.

Next it comes

Rest of the people ,left all sorrows.(only a stamenst of description and can not be taken as an endorsment till we intentionly not say as Sirdar Sahib Ji are saying).

Then it comes Dhan Dham Tyage.Parbhu Prem Page.

It can mean three things

King left wealth and home and by inspiring from it others also had faith in God strong.Good deeds lead to sternghting in faith of God.

(sodi)People themselves got thier Wealth and home given Up to Bedis and started to love God.

All people lost the desire of Wealth and Home and had love for God increse due to this act.

There could be many other such explainations.May be one more can be that other people(not all people) also left thier home due to love of Prabhu(also means for King) and may have accompanied King into Jungle as they wanted him only as thier KIng and under his command they want to make a new civilisations(Das wants you all to rember that often Sikhs along side Gurus went to make a similar new Towens and Cities).Anandpur Sahib was made by Ninth Master.But here thing seems to be a bit differant as here King is doing a sort of recounciliation of wrong deeds of either of their ancestors while in the case of Ninth Master this was not there).

Best thing as per Das could be that
other people who were there.There sorrows left(them).
They left(greed of) Wealth and home.And went to the refuge of God.

Here Tyag or leaving or sacrifise may not mean litrally as it is clearly staTED that the had love towards feets(refuge of) God so any person in that state becomes detached with wealth and Home and Detachemeant also can be used for Tyag in sanskrit.

Then comes the main thing of contention as per Das and as per Sirdae Sahib.

Bedi Bhye Parsan Raj Kah Payeke.Det Bhayo Vardaan Heeye Hulsaye Ke.

Here thing to rember that in Nirmala and other versions of taksal it is Bedi Bhaye(plural) is used but in site of Gobind Sadan Bhyo(singlular) is writan.

Perhaps Gobind Sadan version is wrong.And that decides the main issue of boom or blessing.
(to Be continued...)

Gurfateh

Before Das gives his views Das want to bring a very Good thing which Sirdar Sahib gave in the same article

from 1204 of Guru Granth Sahib Ji

Das gave it upstairs also

swrg mhlw 5 ] (1204-4)
saarag mehlaa 5.
Saarang, Fifth Mehl:

mweI siq siq siq hir siq siq siq swDw ] (1204-5, swrMg, mÚ 5)
maa-ee sat sat sat har sat sat sat saaDhaa.
O mother, True, True True is the Lord, and True, True, True is His Holy Saint.

bcnu gurU jo pUrY kihE mY CIik gWTrI bwDw ]1] rhwau ] (1204-5, swrMg, mÚ 5)
bachan guroo jo poorai kahi-o mai chheek gaaNthree baaDhaa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
The Word which the Perfect Guru has spoken, I have tied to my robe. ||1||Pause||

inis bwsur niKAqR ibnwsI riv ssIAr bynwDw ] (1204-6, swrMg, mÚ 5)
nis baasur nakhi-atar binaasee rav sasee-ar baynaaDhaa.
Night and day, and the stars in the sky shall vanish. The sun and the moon shall vanish.

igir bsuDw jl pvn jwiego ieik swD bcn AtlwDw ]1] (1204-6, swrMg, mÚ 5)
gir basuDhaa jal pavan jaa-igo ik saaDh bachan atlaaDhaa. ||1||
The mountains, the earth, the water and the air shall pass away. Only the Word of the Holy Saint shall endure. ||1||

AMf ibnwsI jyr ibnwsI auqBuj syq ibnwDw ] (1204-7, swrMg, mÚ 5)
and binaasee jayr binaasee ut-bhuj sayt binaaDhaa.
Those born of eggs shall pass away, and those born of the womb shall pass away. Those born of the earth and sweat shall pass away as well.

cwir ibnwsI Ktih ibnwsI ieik swD bcn inhclwDw ]2] (1204-7, swrMg, mÚ 5)
chaar binaasee khateh binaasee ik saaDh bachan nihchalaaDhaa. ||2||
The four Vedas shall pass away, and the six Shaastras shall pass away. Only the Word of the Holy Saint is eternal. ||2||

rwj ibnwsI qwm ibnwsI swqku BI bynwDw ] (1204-8, swrMg, mÚ 5)
raaj binaasee taam binaasee saatak bhee baynaaDhaa.
Raajas, the quality of energetic activity shall pass away. Taamas, the quality of lethargic darkness shall pass away. Saatvas, the quality of peaceful light shall pass away as well.

idRsitmwn hY sgl ibnwsI ieik swD bcn AwgwDw ]3] (1204-9, swrMg, mÚ 5)
daristimaan hai sagal binaasee ik saaDh bachan aagaaDhaa. ||3||
All that is seen shall pass away. Only the Word of the Holy Saint is beyond destruction. ||3||

Awpy Awip Awp hI Awpy sBu Awpn Kylu idKwDw ] (1204-9, swrMg, mÚ 5)
aapay aap aap hee aapay sabh aapan khayl dikhaaDhaa.
He Himself is Himself by Himself. All that is seen is His play.

pwieE n jweI khI BWiq ry pRBu nwnk gur imil lwDw ]4]6] (1204-10, swrMg, mÚ 5)
paa-i-o na jaa-ee kahee bhaaNt ray parabh naanak gur mil laaDhaa. ||4||6||
He cannot be found by any means. O Nanak, meeting with the Guru, God is found. ||4||6||

here all visible is said to be writtan as to be destroyed but not the word of Sadh and not saint as trasnalter does here nor saint as Sirdar Sahib did.

It is Sadh and Sadh is one who does Sadhana or do something good to get sainthood.It is a person who wants to be saint and is not saint as yet.

Das only want to say that in Vachitar Natak also bedis are told to be going Good and they are not saint as yet by this yet they are Sadh a level less then Saint.
jo pRwnI inis idnu BjY rUp rwm iqh jwnu ] (1427-19, slok, mÚ 9)
jo paraanee nis din bhajai roop raam tih jaan.
That mortal who meditates and vibrates upon the Lord night and day - know him to be the embodiment of the Lord.

hir jn hir AMqru nhI nwnk swcI mwnu ]29] (1428-1, slok, mÚ 9)
har jan har antar nahee naanak saachee maan. ||29||
There is no difference between the Lord and the humble servant of the Lord; O Nanak, know this as true. ||29||

(to be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh

Before Das starts to think what Sirdar Sahib Quoted from Guru Granth Sahib Ji Das wants to give two more meaning of privous verses.

Rikhian Bhes Kiyan

Whose deeds or apperance or outlook was like of Sages.

Rember the thing that due to our too much of familarty with renocers of world like Hath Yogis we have deemed that all sages in Past were like them like at present our mind set for an Amrit Dhari Sikh is more like a ritualist and Vegitarian.

In Hindi for pluran we can add anuswar or Das may comit mistake it could be Anu Nasik one of them.

like we have term Churha for sweeper in Haryana it is not Far away from Gurus Paont Sahib or Anandpur Sahib.We take plural of Churha as Churhan.Anyway at prsent this term is banned by Indian state and das supports this.

Sher or Tiger can be in plural Sheran.And so on.

Likewise Dhanan Dham Tyage

Well Das want to say that in poety to beaotify it poet may not always take care of spelling or Grammer but more of what kind of sound comes or what we call phonetics.

Like Bhartendu Harish Chandra perhaps last gret poet of Classical Hindu also used term Late Pate for creeper and leafe whicxh is wrong as per grammer or spelling but Ok as per poetary and phonetic and tunes.It can be Sung.

And this has been Gurmats speaclaity that most of the verses are Geye or singable.

So
Great are the homes of Renoncers.What a contradiction!

Renouncer within the home.Or Great(plural as many are refered) are places of renoncer or what we call the place where Sat Sang is done.And refuge of the love of Lord.

Respected Sirdar Sahib Ji did another quotes from Adi Guru Granth Sahib but before it Das wants to say another thing.

Often verse whcih tend to positive towards Vedas our missioaris tend to generalise it for scripturues or thier could be some deepr meanin in them while when there are negitive then they take it verbaly thaT they are anti Vedas.

Let us take an example of one verse which Sirdar Sahib Ji gave from Page 747 of Guru Granth Sahib Ji.According to him it is by Fifth Guru but Das stronly belives that any of the Bani of Guru Granth Sahib Ji is not the poettry of any Human but words of God sent via Human to humans.And das can prove that that it is not says Nanak in Kahe Nanak but can be an order to Guru Nanak Ji in any body by Akal as Say! Oh NANAK!

Coming Back to same verse that by reading Vedas and holy books of Muslims(as Sirdar Sahib has translated),Samriti and and The Sahstras by reading them Salvationn is not obtained.

Das can ask that by reading mechanically Guru Granth Sahib Ji in Akhand Path and without understanding it does any one get Salvation?Das can say by Mercy of Akal yes.But after long time perhaps.

Guru here are opposing reading as worship or usage of Mantras or Kalimas or hyms as a spell.Same applies to Sikhs scriptures.Das want to say one more thing that Das does respesct those who do Sampat Path or Akahnd Path but can say that that Sahaj Path is better where meanings are obtained and reading Teeka or meaning is also good.By the way Das here want to say that Das is opposing the Prakash of Dasham Granth and taking Vak from it but whole heartedly support its reteinsion as it is its Sahij Path and its understadning for Sikhs who have political aspirations.

Then he talks about 1091 page of Guru Granth Sahib Das will again oppose his using term Guru Nanak as it is by Akal.

It sates that
mehlaa 1.
First Mehl:

mWdlu byid is bwjxo Gxo DVIAY joie ] (1091-1, mwrU, mÚ 1)
maaNdal bayd se baajno ghano Dharhee-ai jo-ay.
The drum of the Vedas vibrates, bringing dispute and divisiveness.

nwnk nwmu smwil qU bIjau Avru n koie ]2] (1091-2, mwrU, mÚ 1)
naanak naam samaal too beeja-o avar na ko-ay. ||2||
O Nanak, contemplate the Naam, the Name of the Lord; there is none except Him. ||2||

Here Guru is again talking of scriptures in General.There are Six diiferant philosopyis on Vedas caled Khat Darshan and they fifht on wrong interpetations and not knowing that God is one.God is word or name and not an Idol.

By the way Sirdar Sahib are the same gentalman who wrote book Mans Mans Kar Moorakh Jhagre or fools queral on meat.

And there he was argueing on the verse from Guru Granth Sahib Ji with AKJ people(Das is yet to understand thier ideolgy but like thier devotion and Respected leaders of Damdami Taksal,Das like all Sanatan Sikhs respect it a lot and can tell that Sirdar Sahib Ji has misunderstood it a lot).

And Dear Joginder Singh Ji Talwara and his atom bomb type of book called why to kill chicken.He tried to prove that killing as per Gurmat is a sin.Das whats to know that all Babber Singhs were sinner when they killed and got killed also.So if not there are are similar gruopism coming for Guru Granth Sahib Ji's interpetations and if all have one Faith in Akal and devotion then this can be overcome.

(To Be continued..)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Gurfateh

as Das is in full time work so Das is getting a short time period to be online so Das could not give more reply on that so thus Das try to write more.

Well Dhanan Dham Tyage,Prabhu Prem Page may also means that left the place of wealth(greed in heart) and steped into love of lord.

then coming back to one more quote Sirdar Sahib gave from Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

Just see from page 1369 and 1970 here Sant Kabir had Bani which says that unworhty teacher due to being to much after scripture leads to distruction of futre of studnets also.
kbIr mwie mUMfau iqh gurU kI jw qy Brmu n jwie ] (1369-19, slok, Bgq kbIr jI)
kabeer maa-ay moonda-o tih guroo kee jaa tay bharam na jaa-ay.
Kabeer, shave the mother of that guru, who does not take away one's doubt.
Awp fuby chu byd mih cyly dIey bhwie ]104] (1370-1, slok, Bgq kbIr jI)
aap dubay chahu bayd meh chaylay dee-ay bahaa-ay. ||104||
He himself is drowning in the four Vedas; he drowns his disciples as well. ||104||

das is intersted that weather followers of Sirdar Sahib have all doubts removed.

Then page no 320(Ang or part)
gauVI kbIr jI ] (329-6)
ga-orhee kabeer jee.
Gauree, Kabeer Jee:

byd kI puqRI isMimRiq BweI ] (329-6, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
bayd kee putree simrit bhaa-ee.
The Simritee is the daughter of the Vedas, O Siblings of Destiny.

sWkl jyvrI lY hY AweI ]1] (329-6, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
saaNkal jayvree lai hai aa-ee. ||1||
She has brought a chain and a rope. ||1||

Awpn ngru Awp qy bwiDAw ] (329-7, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
aapan nagar aap tay baaDhi-aa.
She has imprisoned the people in her own city.

moh kY PwiD kwl sru sWiDAw ]1] rhwau ] (329-7, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
moh kai faaDh kaal sar saaNDhi-aa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
She has tightened the noose of emotional attachment and shot the arrow of death. ||1||Pause||

ktI n ktY qUit nh jweI ] (329-8, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
katee na katai toot nah jaa-ee.
By cutting, she cannot be cut, and she cannot be broken.

sw swpin hoie jg kau KweI ]2] (329-8, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
saa saapan ho-ay jag ka-o khaa-ee. ||2||
She has become a serpent, and she is eating the world. ||2||

hm dyKq ijin sBu jgu lUitAw ] (329-8, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
ham daykhat jin sabh jag looti-aa.
Before my very eyes, she has plundered the entire world.

khu kbIr mY rwm kih CUitAw ]3]30] (329-9, gauVI, Bgq kbIr jI)
kaho kabeer mai raam kahi chhooti-aa. ||3||30||
Says Kabeer, chanting the Lord's Name, I have escaped her. ||3||30||

here Bani tells that bounding by code of Samriti puts us in Sato Guna ie here we work and as we be doer so we get the result and even by reading or listening Vedas even if sins go away that will not give us salvation till punyas or chaste acts aslo go out of us.

As if we say I am without sin.I do good.That means we have ego.If Das is not mistaken Sukhmani Sahib states that one who say i do will get birht again.Till we do not agree and realise that real doer or Karta is Akal we are not full Khalsa.

Now Das talks about Bedi Bhaye Prsan Raj Kah Paye Kai Det Bhayo Vardan Heye hulsaye Kaye. it is one 71 no page from online version by Gobind Sadan.

(to be continued...)

 

[vijaydeep Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Gurfateh

Das is just giving page 220 of Guru Granth Sahib Ji.
Page 220

byd purwn swD mg suin kir inmK n hir gun gwvY ]1] rhwau ] (220-1, gauVI, mÚ 9)
bayd puraan saaDh mag sun kar nimakh na har gun gaavai. ||1|| rahaa-o.
This mind listens to the Vedas, the Puraanas, and the ways of the Holy Saints, but it does not sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord, for even an instant. ||1||Pause||

durlB dyh pwie mwns kI ibrQw jnmu isrwvY ] (220-1, gauVI, mÚ 9)
durlabh dayh paa-ay maanas kee birthaa janam siraavai.
Having obtained this human body, so very difficult to obtain, it is now being uselessly wasted.

mwieAw moh mhw sMkt bn qw isau ruc aupjwvY ]1] (220-2, gauVI, mÚ 9)
maa-i-aa moh mahaa sankat ban taa si-o ruch upjaavai. ||1||
Emotional attachment to Maya is such a treacherous wilderness, and yet, people are in love with it. ||1||

AMqir bwhir sdw sMig pRBu qw isau nyhu n lwvY ] (220-3, gauVI, mÚ 9)
antar baahar sadaa sang parabh taa si-o nayhu na laavai.
Inwardly and outwardly, God is always with them, and yet, they do not enshrine Love for Him.

nwnk mukiq qwih qum mwnhu ijh Git rwmu smwvY ]2]6] (220-3, gauVI, mÚ 9)
naanak mukat taahi tum maanhu jih ghat raam samaavai. ||2||6||
O Nanak, know that those whose hearts are filled with the Lord are liberated. ||2||6||

gauVI mhlw 9 ] (220-4)
ga-orhee mehlaa 9.
Gauree, Ninth Mehl:

swDo rwm srin ibsrwmw ] (220-4, gauVI, mÚ 9)
saaDho raam saran bisraamaa.
Holy Saadhus: rest and peace are in the Sanctuary of the Lord.

byd purwn pVy ko ieh gun ismry hir ko nwmw ]1] rhwau ] (220-4, gauVI, mÚ 9)
bayd puraan parhay ko ih gun simray har ko naamaa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
This is the blessing of studying the Vedas and the Puraanas, that you may meditate on the Name of the Lord. ||1||Pause||

loB moh mwieAw mmqw Puin Aau ibiKAn kI syvw ] hrK sog prsY ijh nwhin so mUriq hY dyvw ]1] (220-5, gauVI, mÚ 9)
lobh moh maa-i-aa mamtaa fun a-o bikhi-an kee sayvaa. harakh sog parsai jih naahan so moorat hai dayvaa. ||1||
Greed, emotional attachment to Maya, possessiveness, the service of evil, pleasure and pain - those who are not touched by these, are the very embodiment of the Divine Lord. ||1||

surg nrk AMimRq ibKu ey sB iqau kMcn Aru pYsw ] (220-6, gauVI, mÚ 9)
surag narak amrit bikh ay sabh ti-o kanchan ar paisaa.
Heaven and hell, ambrosial nectar and poison, gold and copper - these are all alike to them.

ausqiq inMdw ey sm jw kY loBu mohu Puin qYsw ]2] (220-6, gauVI, mÚ 9)
ustat nindaa ay sam jaa kai lobh moh fun taisaa. ||2||
Praise and slander are all the same to them, as are greed and attachment. ||2||

duKu suKu ey bwDy ijh nwhin iqh qum jwnau igAwnI ] (220-7, gauVI, mÚ 9)
dukh sukh ay baaDhay jih naahan tih tum jaan-o gi-aanee.
They are not bound by pleasure and pain - know that they are truly wise.

nwnk mukiq qwih qum mwnau ieh ibiD ko jo pRwnI ]3]7] (220-8, gauVI, mÚ 9)
naanak mukat taahi tum maan-o ih biDh ko jo paraanee. ||3||7||
O Nanak, recognize those mortal beings as liberated, who live this way of life. ||3||7||

gauVI mhlw 9 ] (220-8)
ga-orhee mehlaa 9.
Gauree, Ninth Mehl:

mn ry khw BieE qY baurw ] (220-8, gauVI, mÚ 9)
man ray kahaa bha-i-o tai ba-uraa.
O mind, why have you gone crazy?

Aihinis AauD GtY nhI jwnY BieE loB sMig haurw ]1] rhwau ] (220-9, gauVI, mÚ 9)
ahinis a-oDh ghatai nahee jaanai bha-i-o lobh sang ha-uraa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Don't you know that your life is decreasing, day and night? Your life is made worthless with greed. ||1||Pause||

jo qnu qY Apno kir mwinE Aru suMdr igRh nwrI ] (220-9, gauVI, mÚ 9)
jo tan tai apno kar maani-o ar sundar garih naaree.
That body, which you believe to be your own, and your beautiful home and spouse

ien mYN kCu qyro ry nwhin dyKo soc ibcwrI ]1] (220-10, gauVI, mÚ 9)
in maiN kachh tayro ray naahan daykho soch bichaaree. ||1||
- none of these is yours to keep. See this, reflect upon it and understand. ||1||

rqn jnmu Apno qY hwirE goibMd giq nhI jwnI ] (220-11, gauVI, mÚ 9)
ratan janam apno tai haari-o gobind gat nahee jaanee.
You have wasted the precious jewel of this human life; you do not know the Way of the Lord of the Universe.

inmK n lIn BieE crnn isNau ibrQw AauD isrwnI ]2] (220-11, gauVI, mÚ 9)
nimakh na leen bha-i-o charnan siN-o birthaa a-oDh siraanee. ||2||
You have not been absorbed in the Lord's Feet, even for an instant. Your life has passed away in vain! ||2||

khu nwnk soeI nru suKIAw rwm nwm gun gwvY ] (220-12, gauVI, mÚ 9)
kaho naanak so-ee nar sukhee-aa raam naam gun gaavai.
Says Nanak, that man is happy, who sings the Glorious Praises of the Lord's Name.

Aaur sgl jgu mwieAw moihAw inrBY pdu nhI pwvY ]3]8] (220-12, gauVI, mÚ 9)
a-or sagal jag maa-i-aa mohi-aa nirbhai pad nahee paavai. ||3||8||
All the rest of the world is enticed by Maya; they do not obtain the state of fearless dignity. ||3||8||

gauVI mhlw 9 ] (220-13)
ga-orhee mehlaa 9.
Gauree, Ninth Mehl:

nr Acyq pwp qy fru ry ] (220-13, gauVI, mÚ 9)
nar achayt paap tay dar ray.
You people are unconscious; you should be afraid of sin.

dIn dieAwl sgl BY BMjn srin qwih qum pru ry ]1] rhwau ] (220-13, gauVI, mÚ 9)
deen da-i-aal sagal bhai bhanjan saran taahi tum par ray. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Seek the Sanctuary of the Lord, Merciful to the meek, Destroyer of all fear. ||1||Pause||

byd purwn jws gun gwvq qw ko nwmu hIAY mo Dru ry ] (220-14, gauVI, mÚ 9)
bayd puraan jaas gun gaavat taa ko naam hee-ai mo Dhar ray.
The Vedas and the Puraanas sing His Praises; enshrine His Name within your heart.

pwvn nwmu jgiq mY hir ko ismir ismir ksml sB hru ry ]1] (220-15, gauVI, mÚ 9)
paavan naam jagat mai har ko simar simar kasmal sabh har ray. ||1||
Pure and sublime is the Name of the Lord in the world. Remembering it in meditation, all sinful mistakes shall be washed away. ||1||

mwns dyh bhuir nh pwvY kCU aupwau mukiq kw kru ry ] (220-15, gauVI, mÚ 9)
maanas dayh bahur nah paavai kachhoo upaa-o mukat kaa kar ray.
You shall not obtain this human body again; make the effort - try to achieve liberation!

nwnk khq gwie krunw mY Bv swgr kY pwir auqru ry ]2]9]251] (220-16, gauVI, mÚ 9)
naanak kahat gaa-ay karunaa mai bhav saagar kai paar utar ray. ||2||9||251||
Says Nanak, sing of the Lord of compassion, and cross over the terrifying world-ocean. ||2||9||251||

rwgu gauVI AstpdIAw mhlw 1 gauVI guAwryrI (220-18)
raag ga-orhee asatpadee-aa mehlaa 1 ga-orhee gu-aarayree
Raag Gauree, Ashtapadees, First Mehl: Gauree Gwaarayree:

<> siqnwmu krqw purKu gur pRswid ] (220-18)
ik-oNkaar satnaam kartaa purakh gur parsaad.
One Universal Creator God. Truth Is The Name. Creative Being Personified. By Guru's Grace:

iniD isiD inrml nwmu bIcwru ] (220-19, gauVI guAwryrI, mÚ 1)
niDh siDh nirmal naam beechaar.
The nine treasures and the miraculous spiritual powers come by contemplating the Immaculate Naam, the Name of the Lord.

pUrn pUir rihAw ibKu mwir ] (220-19, gauVI guAwryrI, mÚ 1)
pooran poor rahi-aa bikh maar.
The Perfect Lord is All-pervading everywhere; He destroys the poison of Maya.

iqRkutI CUtI ibml mJwir ] (220-19, gauVI guAwryrI, mÚ 1)
tarikutee chhootee bimal majhaar.
I am rid of the three-phased Maya, dwelling in the Pure Lord


Then Das will quote two verse from Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

Sabhe Ghat Ram Bole

In all atoms it is absorbed(Ram God) speaks.

Then

Bani Har Ki Sab Ko Bole(all speak the voice of God).
There also it is again further stated to verfy from scriptutres.

(to Be continued..)

Gurfateh

In Vachitar Natak only it is writtan that
God is without limt(Na Rekh) or withour form(Nirankar) without place(attham).it can be seen on page 53 and 54 from online version of Dasham Granth.

Then it is futher stated
Kahon roop Anek Dhare anop.It sates that un equalble(god) takes many form.

Any entity without form,limit or place can not live or be in one place.

If Arya Samji say that God is seperated from 5 elements,Hindus say in Baikunth.Chiristian say in Heavan,Muslim say on 7th sky and Sikh from somne Jatha says in some place called Sachkhand then that God can not be formless Nirnakar,Space less Attham or Limit less aRekh.

As if say God is only in Sachkhand/Jannat/Heavan or Baikunth then god is occupying some sapce which give God a limit of space.So due to space there is a shape,volume or form.It may be regular or irregualar.

But Guru who wrote Whole of Dasham Granth said that God can be Nirankar only if God is every where.As there is no single limit,place or form of God due to the fact that all form,space or limits are of God.

AS God occupies whole space so we can not say God is only at one place so that is the main reason for God s being formless or Nirankar.
Das wants to joke here about fake Nirnakaris who show god in palm of there great fake guru.

So if some one says God is Nirkankar that imples that God is Nirnakar as God has no single space or volume to occupy as God is in all psace and beyond.Even if some thing like that then one gets un explaiable feeling.

In the same page Guru says till where i describe as in saying(words) God can not be accomodated(as God is beyond them also).

(to Be continued..)

 

[Neutral Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

Amazing thread , vijaydeep Singh ji , Please keep it up !!

Best Regards

 

[Sher Singh]

Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth

wow that's a lot of info!!!