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Are there different types of Sikhs?

Discussion in 'New to Sikhism' started by Roop Kaur, Mar 14, 2010.

  1. Roop Kaur

    Roop Kaur
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    Connected thread http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/new-to-sikhism/29471-questions-from-non-sikhs-to-sikhs.html#post122540

    Hi guys!

    Okay, so I was having a lot of trouble in regards to starting a new thread - I'm finding a bit difficult to navigate my way around, so I thought I'd just post my question here even though I am a Sikh!

    My question is - Are there different types of Sikhs- like Muslims can be classed as Sunni or Shiat's, is there anything like this in Sikhism. I've tried googling it, but have never really find a satisfying reply.

    :)
     
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  3. Hardip Singh

    Hardip Singh India
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    There is only one type of Sikhs /Gursikhs. They only belive in one God who is omnipresent and Shri Guru Granth Sahib jee. Once they take "Khande ke Pahul" or get bapitaized and enter into Sikhism's mainstream or Panth, then no differntation is left. All are equal and there are no groups. They only and only belive in tenets of Sikhi as prescribed in SRM or SGGS jee.
    Yes, there are some splinter groups but they have belifes in some living Baba or diety and thus :happysingh:are not Gursikhs.
     
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  4. Roop Kaur

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    Thanks for that reply Hardip! I thought the same, however, I was told there were ...Udasi Sikhs? What makes them different?

    Oh, and also .. Nihangs?

    Sorry, these might seem like stupid questions to you all.

    Gurfateh!
    Roop
     
  5. spnadmin

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    Roop Kaur ji

    There are several traditions or sampardayan that differ from "mainstream Sikhism." These are considered historical traditions insofar as they pre-date the formation of the Khalsa in 1699. The Udassis are one of those traditions. They trace their history to the time of Guru Nanak and were founded by his son. Also included are the Nirmalas and the Seva Panthis. Nihangs have an uncertain start date, though they were certainly contemporary with Guru Gobind Singh, and were present at the formation of the Khalsa in 1699.

    They are different because they follow their own rehat's and not the Sikh Rehat Maryada. They give parkash to other scriptures than Sri Guru Granth Sahib. For example, Nihangs give parkash to both "Dasam Granth" and "Sarbloh Granth." Seva Panthi's give parkash to the Koran because they were founded by a Muslim who became a Sikh.

    We have a section in the forum, under Sikh Sikhi Sikhism, called "Sanatan Sikhism" where you can find more information about the sects that are part of these historical traditions.

    The question you raise can lead to considerable controversy because both the Udassis and the Nirmalas are also members of the Sant Samaaj which is an official organization of those "Sikhs" and "Hindus" who consider themselves adherents of "sanatan dharma" and incorporate many beliefs and rituals typical of Brahminism. Those who are strict adherents of the Sikh Rehat Maryada and give parkash on to Sri Guru Granth Sahib on the other hand reject these practices.

    This is a complicated topic and difficult to discuss in a clear-cut fashion. :happykaur:
     
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  6. harbansj24

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    Narayanjot ji wrote
    Exactly! There are no water tight compartments. Even a large majority of "Mainstream Sikhs" have an interface with one or several of these Sampradayas and sometimes they merge seamlessly into one another. Also the situation gets more complicated because Akal Takht which is supposed to uphold SRM has issued contradictory edicts.

    Sikhism is a young religion and is in a state of dynamic flux and it will be some time before it stabilises.

    However the pivotal Guru Nanak's philosophy which cannot change is "Kirit Kar, Nam Jap and Vand Chak" and this is propogated throughout SGGS.
     
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  7. Bmandur

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    Roop Kaur ji

    Gurfateh,
    Sikhs are Sikhs. One Guru that is Guru Granth Sahib JI
    One Type of "Sikhi" SIkh Means Learning each and every day of your life
    Ik On Kar so in My knowlodge One Sikh & One Guru

    Gurfateh
     
  8. Roop Kaur

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    Thanking you all for your contributions :)

    God bless
     
  9. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    Yes. Here's one of the links : Sikh FAQ: Sects
     
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  10. spnadmin

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    This is from the FAQ below

    Quoted from the article: "The Sikh religion is not an entirely monolithic faith - there are several sects which are not recognized by the majority of Sikhs as orthodox in their teachings and beliefs. One is known as the Udasis, a group of holy men which was founded by an elder son of Guru Nanak, Baba Sri Chand. They are celibate and, either nude or while wearing a yellow robe, carry around a begging bowl to receive food or donations (begging is forbidden among orthodox Sikhs). They are very similar to Hindu ascetics in their mannerisms and habits and they have been active as missionaries of the Sikh faith.



    Another group is known as the Sahajdharis, which means "slow adopters." This actually encompasses several smaller sects, all of which tend to be shaven like Hindus and contrary to Sikh tradition. They have largely rejected the more militant teachings which were promoted by Gobind Singh, the tenth and final human Guru.



    The final group is known as the Keshadharis ("hair-wearers") and it, too, encompasses a number of smaller sects. The Nihangs are the most militant of all Sikhs - they regularly carry a variety of weapons and are more willing to take action to defend their religion. They regard themselves as continuing in the tradition of Guru Gobind Singh's Khalsa army and live a semi-nomadic lifestyle. The Nirmalas, on the other hand, are much less militant than average and members tend to lead contemplative lives while secluded in monasteries.



    Another group categorized with the Keshadharis are the Nirankaris, founded by Baba Dayal (d. 1853). They concentrate on the formless, eternal nature of God and accept the existence of a continuing line of living gurus. The final group is known as the Namdari or Kukas. This is a reform group which developed in the 19th century and they follow a living Guru who is descended from he original gurus."


    I don't agree that Sehajdharis and Keshadharis are sects. Sehajdharis are simply "clean shaven Sikhs. Keshadharis are Sikhs who keep hair but may not have taken charan pahul or Sikh baptism. Both can be found in almost any sangat. These are not sects.

    The traditional sampardayas or historical sects include Udassis, Nirmalas, Seva Panthis, and Nihangs. Nirankaris are a sect but not part of the original sampardaya. And the author makes it seem as if Nirankaris are a group within Keshadharis. Which is also wrong. Nirankari did keep hair at one time, but today they may or may not keep hair. Nirankari today are more of an interfaith group that worships one God through prayer and simran that is not taken from the Guru Granth Sahib. They are led by a human satguru. Keshadharis are simply Sikhs who keep hair regardless of tradition. Namdhari are not a sect of Sikhism. Namdhari are an independent tradition. They believe that Guru Gobind Singh did not die but hid in the jungle. They have a tradition of human satgurus, continuing for more than 200 years.

    The author Austin Cline is a bit mixed up.
     
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  11. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    I agree with that. I am wondering if Bhagat Kabir was a keshadhari. In one of his selok he mentioned.....
     
  12. spnadmin

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    I often wonder about that too Nam Jap ji
     
  13. Hardip Singh

    Hardip Singh India
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    I think you are mistaken. Nirankary were folowers of one Avtar Singh of Rawalpindi, who happened to be a bootlegger than. They are no way any sect of Sikhism. Also, Namdharis were never a part of Nirankaris , they existed much before them. Pl check.
     
  14. Hardip Singh

    Hardip Singh India
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    Which Shabad of Bhagat jee, you are refering, pl elebrate.
     
  15. spnadmin

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    Hardip ji

    I don't know how I may have created that impression but you are quite right. I never said that Namdharis are part of Nirankaris. No they never were. The Nirankaris began in the 19th Century. And absolutely, they are not a sect of Sikhism. They have evolved into an interfaith sangat.

    This is what I said about Nirankaris

    Nirankaris are a sect but not part of the original sampardaya. And the author makes it seem as if Nirankaris are a group within Keshadharis. Which is also wrong. Nirankari did keep hair at one time, but today they may or may not keep hair. Nirankari today are more of an interfaith group that worships one God through prayer and simran that is not taken from the Guru Granth Sahib. They are led by a human satguru.

    They are not Sikhs, absolutely not! At this link it describes how the modern Nirankari movement is organized Sant Nirankari Mission

    Then I said this about Namdharis

    Namdhari are not a sect of Sikhism. Namdhari are an independent tradition. They believe that Guru Gobind Singh did not die but hid in the jungle. They have a tradition of human satgurus, continuing for more than 200 years.

    So I apologize if I was not as clear as I should have been. But I do not believe that anything I said was incorrect.
     
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  16. spnadmin

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    Well I cannot speak for NamJap ji - But this is what I was pondering. It is a very long shabad, but a very beautiful one. Here is a part of it.

    ਅਬ ਤਉ ਜਾਇ ਚਢੇ ਸਿੰਘਾਸਨਿ ਮਿਲੇ ਹੈ ਸਾਰਿੰਗਪਾਨੀ ॥
    ab tho jaae chadtae singhaasan milae hai saaringapaanee ||
    Now, I have mounted to the throne of the Lord; I have met the Lord, the Sustainer of the World.


    ਰਾਮ ਕਬੀਰਾ ਏਕ ਭਏ ਹੈ ਕੋਇ ਨ ਸਕੈ ਪਛਾਨੀ ॥੬॥੩॥

    raam kabeeraa eaek bheae hai koe n sakai pashhaanee ||6||3||
    The Lord and Kabeer have become one. No one can tell them apart. ||6||3||

    ਸੰਤਾ ਮਾਨਉ ਦੂਤਾ ਡਾਨਉ ਇਹ ਕੁਟਵਾਰੀ ਮੇਰੀ ॥

    santhaa maano dhoothaa ddaano eih kuttavaaree maeree ||
    I honor and obey the Saints, and punish the wicked; this is my duty as God's police officer.

    ਦਿਵਸ ਰੈਨਿ ਤੇਰੇ ਪਾਉ ਪਲੋਸਉ ਕੇਸ ਚਵਰ ਕਰਿ ਫੇਰੀ ॥੧॥

    dhivas rain thaerae paao paloso kaes chavar kar faeree ||1||
    Day and night, I wash Your feet, Lord; I wave my

    hair as the chauree, to brush away the flies. ||1||

    ਹਮ ਕੂਕਰ ਤੇਰੇ ਦਰਬਾਰਿ ॥
    ham kookar thaerae dharabaar ||
    I am a dog at Your Court, Lord.

    ਭਉਕਹਿ ਆਗੈ ਬਦਨੁ ਪਸਾਰਿ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
    bhoukehi aagai badhan pasaar ||1|| rehaao ||
    I open my snout and bark before it. ||1||Pause||

    ਪੂਰਬ ਜਨਮ ਹਮ ਤੁਮ੍ਹ੍ਹਰੇ ਸੇਵਕ ਅਬ ਤਉ ਮਿਟਿਆ ਨ ਜਾਈ ॥
    poorab janam ham thumharae saevak ab tho mittiaa n jaaee ||
    In my past life, I was Your servant; now, I cannot leave You.


    ਤੇਰੇ ਦੁਆਰੈ ਧੁਨਿ ਸਹਜ ਕੀ ਮਾਥੈ ਮੇਰੇ ਦਗਾਈ ॥੨॥
    thaerae dhuaarai dhhun sehaj kee maathhai maerae dhagaaee ||2||
    The celestial sound current resounds at Your Door. Your insignia is stamped upon my forehead. ||2||


    ਦਾਗੇ ਹੋਹਿ ਸੁ ਰਨ ਮਹਿ ਜੂਝਹਿ ਬਿਨੁ ਦਾਗੇ ਭਗਿ ਜਾਈ ॥
    dhaagae hohi s ran mehi joojhehi bin dhaagae bhag jaaee ||
    Those who are branded with Your brand fight bravely in battle; those without Your brand run away.


    ਸਾਧੂ ਹੋਇ ਸੁ ਭਗਤਿ ਪਛਾਨੈ ਹਰਿ ਲਏ ਖਜਾਨੈ ਪਾਈ ॥੩॥
    saadhhoo hoe s bhagath pashhaanai har leae khajaanai paaee ||3||
    One who becomes a Holy person, appreciates the value of devotional worship to the Lord. The Lord places him in His treasury. ||3||

    Ang 969/970
     
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  17. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਕਬੀਰ ਬੇੜਾ ਜਰਜਰਾ ਫੂਟੇ ਛੇਂਕ ਹਜਾਰ
    कबीर बेड़ा जरजरा फूटे छेंक हजार ॥
    Kabīr beṛā jarjarā fūte cẖẖeʼnk hajār.
    Kabeer, the boat is old, and it has thousands of holes.


    ਹਰੂਏ ਹਰੂਏ ਤਿਰਿ ਗਏ ਡੂਬੇ ਜਿਨ ਸਿਰ ਭਾਰ ॥੩੫॥
    हरूए हरूए तिरि गए डूबे जिन सिर भार ॥३५॥
    Harū▫e harū▫e ṯir ga▫e dūbe jin sir bẖār. ||35||
    Those who are light get across, while those who carry the weight of their sins on their heads are drowned. ||35||


    ਕਬੀਰ ਹਾਡ ਜਰੇ ਜਿਉ ਲਾਕਰੀ ਕੇਸ ਜਰੇ ਜਿਉ ਘਾਸੁ
    कबीर हाड जरे जिउ लाकरी केस जरे जिउ घासु ॥
    Kabīr hād jare ji▫o lākrī kes jare ji▫o gẖās.
    Kabeer, the bones burn like wood, and the hair burns like straw.


    ਇਹੁ ਜਗੁ ਜਰਤਾ ਦੇਖਿ ਕੈ ਭਇਓ ਕਬੀਰੁ ਉਦਾਸੁ ॥੩੬॥
    इहु जगु जरता देखि कै भइओ कबीरु उदासु ॥३६॥
    Ih jag jarṯā ḏekẖ kai bẖa▫i▫o Kabīr uḏās. ||36||
    Seeing the world burning like this, Kabeer has become sad. ||36||


    ਕਬੀਰ ਗਰਬੁ ਕੀਜੀਐ ਚਾਮ ਲਪੇਟੇ ਹਾਡ
    कबीर गरबु न कीजीऐ चाम लपेटे हाड ॥
    Kabīr garab na kījī▫ai cẖām lapete hād.
    Kabeer, do not be so proud of your bones wrapped up in skin.


    ਹੈਵਰ ਊਪਰਿ ਛਤ੍ਰ ਤਰ ਤੇ ਫੁਨਿ ਧਰਨੀ ਗਾਡ ॥੩੭॥
    हैवर ऊपरि छत्र तर ते फुनि धरनी गाड ॥३७॥
    Haivar ūpar cẖẖaṯar ṯar ṯe fun ḏẖarnī gād. ||37||
    Those who were on their horses and under their canopies, were eventually buried under the ground. ||37||
     

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