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Why Can Racists And Sexists Be So Tolerated?

Discussion in 'Hard Talk' started by RD1, Oct 10, 2016.

  1. RD1

    RD1 Canada
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    I think there are a lot of unique perspectives on this.

    How come some people who promote some form of hate, like sexism or racism (such as Donald Trump), still manage to have such a strong following?

    Why do some people feel compelled to follow those who promote such awfulness?

    As Sikhs, we certainly are not to tolerate this.
     
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    #1 RD1, Oct 10, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2016
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  3. Ishna

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    I think it hits people in the feels. Us vs Them mentality gets people emotional for all the wrong reasons. It hooks into our primitive, tribal urges, and whilst it's not positive, it can certainly feel good to feel some kind of fire in the belly.

    It also plays on people's fears, or biases.
     
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  4. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    sexism and caste ism both exist in Sikhism, Sikhs are not immune from the pack mentality
     
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  5. RD1

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    Sikhism does not promote sexism and caste ism. Sikh teachings are against such discrimination. Anyone can call themselves a Sikh - it does not necessarily mean that they understand and actually practice what the religion says. There is Sikhism, and then there is culture. And certainly culturally, sexism and caste ism do exist. But this is not what Sikhism actually promotes.
    --- Double Post Merged, Oct 10, 2016, Original Post Date: Oct 10, 2016 ---
    I agree. When one person with so much power and influence spews hateful messages, it validates other peoples' so-called fears, and makes them more comfortable to express their ignorant biases.

    Fear and hate seem to be such easy things to manipulate people with.
     
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  6. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    Tell me then, why is that females are restricted as to what seva they can do at Darbar Sahib?
    the facets you are talking about are universal and present in every race and religion, Sikhism is a wonderful religion, but it is no exception, we are all human, we all do our best, but if even the centre of Sikh spirituality has rules and regulations that split the sexes, then we are no better than anyone else, and it is wrong to intimate that we are.
     
  7. RD1

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    I am in no way saying that Sikhism is better than any other religion. If someone is a true Sikh, then social injustice/discrimination towards any particular group is not to be tolerated. Do Sikh teachings actually indicate that women are only allowed to do certain type of seva, or is it something that has culturally evolved?. There is a difference between the actual teachings of a certain religion, and what people actually practice in reality.
     
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  8. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    as is the difference between realism and idealism, the truth is we are all prejudiced in some way or fashion, get enough people together and the pack mentality develops, safety in numbers, we can all be prejudiced together, it is nothing to do with teachings or culture, it is repression, plain and simple.
     
  9. RD1

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    Yep pack mentality is everywhere. Did not say otherwise. This is exactly why people can come together and commit huge acts of violence, such as genocide, regardless of what they claim to believe in. However, there are a select few that can stand against pack mentality, and this can be due to their own individual convictions, spirituality, beliefs, etc.
     
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  10. Harkiran Kaur

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    If you are against the sexism (and racism) you can always start a campaign in your own area, get signatures on a nice write up and send it to Akal Takht. If enough people do it, then maybe it will be possible that we will see women doing kirtan at darbar sahib in our lifetime. That we will see women chosen more as Panj Pyaras, that women will be elected to Gurdwara management committees more often, and as Granthis.

    If nobody does anything, or says anything they are part of what is keeping things the way they are. If everyone who were against discrimination spoke up to Akal Takht, then I think we will see real change. Problem is, a lot of Singhs especially won't say anything because sexism doesn't affect them. So even if they think women should have equal status in Sikhi, they just don't say anything because they personally are not affected by it. :(
     
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  11. RD1

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    Its true, if no one is proactive, then nothing will change. And in all situations, whether it is "male privilege," "white privilege," "upper class privilege," etc., the ones who benefit most from the way a society/community is organized, will not speak up as they have nothing to gain from doing so. And, as you said, as they are not affected by it, they will likely not truly realize the extent of their privilege, which exists at the expense of others.
     
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  12. sikhconvert

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    I've been thinking about this a lot lately. A trend I've noticed of my own peers is either blatant intolerance of anything different (almost Nazi-ish), or being so tolerant they don't mind regressive opinions, ie.) inferiority of women; If a Christian remarked that, they'd be shamed. If a Muslim did, it's tolerated. This is my own observation. It seems like there's no middle path.
     
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  13. RD1

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    I think there is a middle path - but it is not heard so often. The ideas at the extreme ends seem to get the most attention...and i feel we live in a world where its encouraged to choose between one end of the spectrum or the other, and to ignore the huge shade of grey in the middle. People seem to want easy answers so telling yourself that one group is "all bad" and another is "all good" is simpler to handle, than actually looking at the complexity of the situation and realizing that nothing is so black and white.
     
  14. Sikhilove

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    Yes look at Nazi Germany, a prime example of this.

    Most people dismiss practicing Truth as unnecessary and as a waste of time, the disbelief in truth and its power is predominant in this age.

    But if nazi Germany was practicing truth, citizens wouldn't have taken part in the holocaust.

    One only needs to look at the violence, the jealousy and the prevalence of the practice of the 5 thieves in this age to understand how much of a blessing and miracle Truth is.
     
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  15. RD1

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    I agree with this. Practicing truth, trying to cultivate a sense of oneness and compassion, is seen as something "wishy washy," a waste of time.

    Centuries ago, philosophy and contemplation were regarded highly. I am thinking about Greece for example, where the philosophers, the thinkers, were seen in a higher regard than doctors. These days, its the complete opposite. Its like you need to produce and attain something that is tangible, such as material possessions, to show that you are making something of your life - the 5 thieves. Inner growth is disregarded.

    All this drives people further from the truth. It causes the ego to grow, fear to grow, and to see others as very separate and distinct form oneself. Once this happens, all kinds of violence can be inflicted on the "other."
     
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  16. Sikhilove

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    Agreed. Having money and living life isn't a bad thing- the trick is to stay detached from possessions in truth recognition- all is given by him, we have nothing, we are nothing. Otherwise we fall into ego and attachment.
     
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  17. RD1

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    Yes, reminds me of miri piri. Embrace the wordly life given to us, but always remember the spiritual component, too.
     
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  18. Sikhilove

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    Lol completely true! Support your own life through honest means and practice spirituality. Enjoy life, stay positive and in chardi kala- high spirits- all is just Him!

    A balanced soul: 9-5 work (mind)
    6-7 gym (body- the body is our temple)
    Evening: meditate (spirit)
     
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  19. Seeker2013

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    "Center of sikh spirituality" which is Sri Guru Granth sahib , not the present-day sikh institutions or diaspora , do not have sexism . Where in SGGS does it say that women are not equal to men ? Where in SGGS does it say that straights are better than gays , or whites superior to blacks ? nowhere !

    Don't mistake the status of present day sikh kaum to what is instructed by SGGS !
    --- Double Post Merged, Oct 29, 2016, Original Post Date: Oct 29, 2016 ---
    You can interpolate that logic to everyone else , including yourself.
    Its always about "me" . Because of ignorance of what "me" is !
    --- Double Post Merged, Oct 29, 2016 ---
    I used to believe leftists are best people, so liberal, so egalitarian, so full of equality.
    The thing is left will tolerate even the ones who don't tolerate them or the ideas they hold dear !
    The right is always about dislike of the "other" .
    We see it everywhere ! Thats why lefties are called "liberals" and righties "conservatives".

    The christian-muslim difference is what you call "political correctness".
    The leftists wish to have an equal world for women, gays and minorities, but at the same time support (by purposeful ignorance of) something like, for instance, radical islam (not the sufi islam !) , which is inherently misogynistic , homophobic and anti-muslim.

    Its a tough choice in election time.
     
  20. swarn bains

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    seeker jee ask the muslims if the sufis are muslim. they will say them {censored word, do not repeat.}. but if some outsider says that the sufis are spiritual then the muslims will say they are muslims to tell others that muslims are spiritual. but in essence the smuslim religion is worshiper of Adam and the sufis are worshiper of murshad. so say what you want but inside the sufis are different from muslims but outside world calls them muslims because most of the sufis live in muslim dominated world
     

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