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Who's in Control?

Discussion in 'Sikh Sikhi Sikhism' started by Manisha, Jun 3, 2010.

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  1. Manisha

    Manisha
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    WJKK WJKF ji.
    <o:p> </o:p>
    As I’ve been reading Gurbani a lot more and trying to contemplate it, I came across a question (that I asked myself while trying to understand Guru Ji’s message) which kind of confused me.
    <o:p> </o:p>
    There are many references in Gurbani that emphasise on how this world is all God’s play and that we aren’t in control of ourselves BUT God causes us to do good things AND bad things. And I am aware of the overall message that we can only be ‘good’ if we obtain the Truth which is only given to us if God blesses us with His Grace. And that we’re ‘bad’ because we may be in ego for example, or we have a lot of sins from our past (incarnations ect).
    <o:p> </o:p>
    These are only a few, mere explanations to summarise because my question is: does God control everything we do or control us to a certain extent? Now, the explanations above are in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, so that IS the Truth and I accept/believe that. And there’s probably no more to ask but for example, me asking this question, am I doing this through God or am I doing it myself? A friend said that God controls everything even our emotions and anyone's doubts. Is that true? Or the fact that as humans, we have our own mind, and so could the way we perceive something (as everyone is different) which will cause us to have doubts or emotions mean that some control is by us?
    <o:p> </o:p>
    One might think I’m being perhaps a bit too sceptical or taking this message as too much than what it stands for, but the meaning of this message is still a bit cloudy in my mind. Therefore, if any one could elaborate or guide me on this, that would be helpful. :happykudi: (by the way, cool smileys!)
     
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    #1 Manisha, Jun 3, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 10, 2015
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  3. Archived_Member_17

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    Sat Shri Akaal Everyone,

    That confusion is actually very common among the Sikhs.

    Gurbani describes that as we sow, so we reap, then Gurbani also says God controls everything! However, we have to remember the link between the two which is God is NOT a dictator but a Just King. Even though nothing CAN happen without God's will, and He is the ultimate controller of all, but His decisions are not RANDOM, but are based upon our own actions, as He is Just, Truth. Therefore, whateve actions we commit, mold our soul accordingly. Under God's laws, we become, behave, act accordingly thereafter. Please read the following Pauri from japji Sahib, this should clarify the above:


    <TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=5 width="98%" align=center><TBODY><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=ggs>ਭਰੀਐ ਹਥੁ ਪੈਰੁ ਤਨੁ ਦੇਹ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=subhead>bhareeai hathh pair than dhaeh ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=shlok>When the hands and the feet and the body are dirty,</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=ggs>ਪਾਣੀ ਧੋਤੈ ਉਤਰਸੁ ਖੇਹ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=subhead>paanee dhhothai outharas khaeh ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=shlok>water can wash away the dirt.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=ggs>ਮੂਤ ਪਲੀਤੀ ਕਪੜੁ ਹੋਇ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=subhead>mooth paleethee kaparr hoe ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=shlok>When the clothes are soiled and stained by urine,</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=ggs>ਦੇ ਸਾਬੂਣੁ ਲਈਐ ਓਹੁ ਧੋਇ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=subhead>dhae saaboon leeai ouhu dhhoe ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=shlok>soap can wash them clean.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=ggs>ਭਰੀਐ ਮਤਿ ਪਾਪਾ ਕੈ ਸੰਗਿ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=subhead>bhareeai math paapaa kai sang ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=shlok>But when the intellect is stained and polluted by sin,</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=ggs>ਓਹੁ ਧੋਪੈ ਨਾਵੈ ਕੈ ਰੰਗਿ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=subhead>ouhu dhhopai naavai kai rang ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=shlok>it can be cleansed by God's Name.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=ggs>ਪੁੰਨੀ ਪਾਪੀ ਆਖਣੁ ਨਾਹਿ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=subhead>punnee paapee aakhan naahi ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=shlok>Virtue and vice do not come by mere words;</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=ggs>ਕਰਿ ਕਰਿ ਕਰਣਾ ਲਿਖਿ ਲੈ ਜਾਹੁ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=subhead>kar kar karanaa likh lai jaahu ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=shlok>actions repeated, over and over again, are engraved on the soul.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=ggs>ਆਪੇ ਬੀਜਿ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਖਾਹੁ ॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=subhead>aapae beej aapae hee khaahu ||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffec><TD class=shlok>You shall harvest what you plant.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=ggs>ਨਾਨਕ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਆਵਹੁ ਜਾਹੁ ॥੨੦॥ </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=subhead>naanak hukamee aavahu jaahu ||20||</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffecec><TD class=shlok>O Nanak, by the Hukam of God's Command, we come and go in reincarnation. ||20||
    </TD></TR><TR><TD class=rmenuheader>
    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

    Now note, that although we come under God's hukam, but His hukam is influenced by our own actions.

    I hope this helps.

    Rani
     
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  4. Archived_Member16

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    Q43. Is there Fate or Freewill, according to Sikhism?

    Sikhism affirms the omnipotence of God and consequently modifies the concept of Karma. Man is not a helpless puppet. The course of fate may be compared to the flow of a river, while individual action may look like an eddy, or a whirlpool or a wave.


    Man has a dual role: firstly, as a person in a particular community and environment, working under certain limitations, and secondly, as an individual with a free will, wanting to do this thing or that to elevate himself.

    He is like a merchant trading with a certain capital. He may lose it or invest it wisely, to earn profit. He is free to sow the seed, but once he has done so, he has no option other than to reap the fruit. Predestination is responsible for the present; but the present gives us an opportunity to mould our future. It is just like the rotation and revolutions of the earth. The earth revolves around the sun and is influenced by it, but it also has its own motion.

    According to Sikhism, man is an action being, a Karma Yogi, who has to overcome his difficulties with understanding and wisdom. The effort of the individual should take the form of detached action and not, feeding his ego. He must work altruistically, for mankind, and not for the self.

    Spiritual effort has to be blessed by Divine favor in order to be successful. This effort requires self-surrender, to His Will. If man works selfishly, in Maya, he suffers; if he works selflessly according to the Will of God he is saved. This self-surrender is a conscious effort to win divine grace. The self-effort is to bring the Divine Will and individual free will into harmony. That is how the two wills become reconciled. Man's salvation lies in his own effort to drown his Ego in the Divine Will.

    Guru Nanak explains the point through a metaphor:
    "The mind is the paper on which are recorded in the sum of our deeds, good and bad, the impressions, of the habits of our cumulative past. Against this, and limitless are the virtues of our Lord, for He turneth dross into gold and the fires(passions) of the body extinguish."

    source: "Introduction to Sikhism" Author: Dr. Gobind Singh Mansukhani

    http://www.gurmat.info/sms/smspublications/introductiontosikhism2/chapter3.html#Is there Fate or Freewill, according to Sikhism?
     
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  5. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    Excellent summary Soul_jyot ji!
     
  6. roopsidhu

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    SSA,
    Very nicely put up by Soul-jyot ji, like he always do.
    Roopsidhu
     
  7. Manisha

    Manisha
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    That definitely puts things into perspective for me, so thanks a lot! :thumbsuppp:
     
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