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Islam Was Guru Nanak a Muslim?

Discussion in 'Interfaith Dialogues' started by Neutral Singh, Jun 22, 2004.

  1. Neutral Singh

    Neutral Singh
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    Somebody asked...

     
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  3. Neutral Singh

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    I would like to quote from another forum... a reply by a learned member...

     
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  4. Verma1

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    Re: Was Guru Nanak a Muslim ?

    Sasriakal,

    I would just like to say please could you send this message out to all the Sikhs. It is so important to educate everyone that the clkaims these muslims make that Guru Nanak Ji was ase claims a to be abolished. They are false claims and like you said are used to try and convert people and also create rifts between Hindus and Sikhs. These are muslims who are trouble makers and stirrers, 2 faced and make completely FALSE and mindless claims based on teachings that WERE NOT Guru Nanak Dev Ji's.

    I have had so many muslims trying to manipulate me and saying Guru Nanak Dev Ji was a muslim and because I am knowledgable in myReligion, I always tell them this is not true and never will be.

    I urge you to spread this message and educate Sikhs about the tuth and Real Teachings by Guru Nanak Dev Ji. They were born into a Hindu Khatri family, Chant Ram in the Granth in Teachings actually really by Guru Nanak Himself, his mother and father have Hindu names, he marries a Hindu lady and his children were Hindu. And he never changed his name, one of the basic muslim requirements, so he was no way a muslim. These manipulative muslims have no knowledge about the Hindu and Sikh religion and need to be put straight.

    Please put Guru Nnak's Teachings on here that show he was and never would be a muslim.

    Thanks
     
  5. Ambarsaria

    Ambarsaria Canada
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    Re: Was Guru Nanak a Muslim ?

    True source of pride for Sikhs to see Hindus and Muslims wanting to call Sikh Guru Nanak as their own. Guru Nanak ji loved all and conveyed his teachings without regard. The famous Bala and Mardana (Hindu and Muslim) duo who accompanied him are a testament to that.

    Sat Sri Akal.
     
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  6. Seeker9

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    Re: Was Guru Nanak a Muslim ?

    In terms of the answer to the question in the thread title, I must confess I am not sure why it is relevant and how it changes the Scriptures....

    Having declared there is no Hindu or Muslim, why would anyone think he was Muslim?

    Perhaps I have missed something obvious and relevant......
     
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  7. hashir166

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    Re: Was Guru Nanak a Muslim ?

    Assalam-o-alaikum/Sat Sri Akal/Namaste/Hello

    First of all I am an Ahmadi, Muslim. And would like it if at least the community of Sikh do not call us Qadianis as I am not from Qadian, we do not call Sikhs Rāi Bhōi dī Talwandī's or Nanakanas. And secondly we believe there's one God, but we believe as did every single man who brought there teachings, there have been changes in the teaching of Sikhism, as did of the Christians, as did of the Muslims, but Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmed revived them. Also we believe Baba Nanak Ji was a wise and justified man, but he went to Mecca. IT IS A LIE, to say that no Non-Muslim can enter Mecca. Hadhrat Mohammad said that we should all be kind and loving to our neighbour and as all of you must of known but Baba Nanak said so too.

    Please try to keep your offense to minimum.

    Shukria/Jazakallah/Dahnyivad

    Wassalam:mundabhangra:
     
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  8. Ambarsaria

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    Re: Was Guru Nanak a Muslim ?

    hashir166 thanks for your post.

    Can you please clarify the following,

    [​IMG]

    Some one on the Internet paraphrased it as follows,

    " .... although the state of Saudi has opted for the opinion that disallows all non muslims" , kind of supporting what you say that Islam does not but Saudis have. So for all intents and purposes your statement has no practical significance as Saudi manage Mecca.

    I wish all religious places were open to all with some respectful and basic rules of operation.

    Thanks.
     
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    #7 Ambarsaria, Jan 11, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2012
  9. hashir166

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    Re: Was Guru Nanak a Muslim ?

    I clarify it upon the terms that in the 1500s also I believe and lots of Muslims believe that everyone should be allowed in Makkah!

    This then supports our argument that Baba Nanak Ji was a Muslim. And Ek Onhar came from our belief of One God.
     
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  10. Searching

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    hashir166 ji
    The concept of one God was not first given by Islam. Many religions like Christianity, Judaism, Zoroastrianism and even Sanatan dharma of Hinduism gave this concept much before Islam.

    In fact going by your logic Mirza Ghulam was a Hindu as your concept of la ilaha il alla came from sanatan dharma.
     
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  11. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    Re: Was Guru Nanak a Muslim ?

    Hashirji,

    Your post supports the fact that non muslims were allowed into Makkah in the 1500's.

    I am lost to see how this supports the argument that Guru Nanakji was a Muslim, if anything it supports the opposite argument, it clarifies that he was a non Muslim,

    Look forward to your reply

    best wishes
     
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  12. Hashir

    Hashir
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    On the Congregational note of the following user hashir166, I'd like to support his argument and clarify that it is of the decision of the Political system of Saudi Arabia and not in anyway or form to support the argument that Muslims are to prevent Non-Muslims from entering the Holy City, in fact we invite you to the Land of the Holy.

    Also, as hashir166 I think has misunderstood the topic and would like to clarify it!

    At the time of Guru Nanak's death there were no Sikhs as known today. At his funeral only Muslims and Hindus were present and both demanded the body of Guru Nanak. Hindus wanted to burn it as they claimed that he was born into a Hindu family. Muslims wanted to bury the body because they claimed he had converted to Islam and hence should be buried in an Islamic fashion and an Islamic funeral prayer should be carried out. Today Muslims present this as one of the arguments in favour of the claim that Guru Nanak was a Muslim as Muslims do not offer the Islamic funeral prayer for anyone who is not a Muslim regardless of his worldly position.

    The founder of the Ahmadiyya, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, also wrote a book called Sat Bachan in the late 19th century in which he defended Guru Nanak against attacks by a prominent Hindu leader of the time. In his book, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad demonstrates that Guru Nanak was not a person of bad character as claimed by some Hindus at the time but was a very pious holy saint. Later in the book, attention is drawn to several belongings of Guru Nanak such as his chola (a long garment that Guru Nanak used to wear) which had Quranic verses written on it. Along with this historical fact the author presents several other arguments which attempt to show that Guru Nanak was a Muslim.
     
    #11 Hashir, Feb 15, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 15, 2012
  13. prakash.s.bagga

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    At the very first place it is wrong to say that NANAK was baptised by KABIR ji

    The question of NANAK being HINDu or MUSLIM has been very categorically answered by 5Th NANAK in a SABAD as


    ਭੈਰਉ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥ ਵਰਤ ਨ ਰਹਉ ਨ ਮਹ ਰਮਦਾਨਾ ॥ ਤਿਸੁ ਸੇਵੀ ਜੋ ਰਖੈ ਨਿਦਾਨਾ ॥੧॥ ਏਕੁ ਗੁਸਾਈ ਅਲਹੁ ਮੇਰਾ ॥ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਤੁਰਕ ਦੁਹਾਂ ਨੇਬੇਰਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ ਹਜ ਕਾਬੈ ਜਾਉ ਨ ਤੀਰਥ ਪੂਜਾ ॥ ਏਕੋ ਸੇਵੀ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਦੂਜਾ ॥੨॥ ਪੂਜਾ ਕਰਉ ਨ ਨਿਵਾਜ ਗੁਜਾਰਉ ॥ ਏਕ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਲੇ ਰਿਦੈ ਨਮਸਕਾਰਉ ॥੩॥ ਨਾ ਹਮ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਨ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ॥ ਅਲਹ ਰਾਮ ਕੇ ਪਿੰਡੁ ਪਰਾਨ ॥੪॥ ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹੁ ਕੀਆ ਵਖਾਨਾ ॥ ਗੁਰ ਪੀਰ ਮਿਲਿ ਖੁਦਿ ਖਸਮੁ ਪਛਾਨਾ ॥੫॥੩॥ {ਪੰਨਾ 1136}

    So every Sikh should look at this Sabad for this answer.
    Prakash.s.Bagga
     
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  14. Admin Singh

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    with English translation:

    ਭੈਰਉ ਮਹਲਾ
    भैरउ महला ५ ॥
    Bẖairo mėhlā 5.
    Bhairao, Fifth Mehl:
    ਵਰਤ ਰਹਉ ਮਹ ਰਮਦਾਨਾ
    वरत न रहउ न मह रमदाना ॥
    varaṯ na raha▫o na mah ramḏānā.
    I do not keep fasts, nor do I observe the month of Ramadaan.
    ਤਿਸੁ ਸੇਵੀ ਜੋ ਰਖੈ ਨਿਦਾਨਾ ॥੧॥
    तिसु सेवी जो रखै निदाना ॥१॥
    Ŧis sevī jo rakẖai niḏānā. ||1||
    I serve only the One, who will protect me in the end. ||1||
    ਏਕੁ ਗੁਸਾਈ ਅਲਹੁ ਮੇਰਾ
    एकु गुसाई अलहु मेरा ॥
    Ėk gusā▫ī alhu merā.
    The One Lord, the Lord of the World, is my God Allah.
    ਹਿੰਦੂ ਤੁਰਕ ਦੁਹਾਂ ਨੇਬੇਰਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ
    हिंदू तुरक दुहां नेबेरा ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
    Hinḏū ṯurak ḏuhāʼn neberā. ||1|| rahā▫o.
    He administers justice to both Hindus and Muslims. ||1||Pause||
    ਹਜ ਕਾਬੈ ਜਾਉ ਤੀਰਥ ਪੂਜਾ
    हज काबै जाउ न तीरथ पूजा ॥
    Haj kābai jā▫o na ṯirath pūjā.
    I do not make pilgrimages to Mecca, nor do I worship at Hindu sacred shrines.
    ਏਕੋ ਸੇਵੀ ਅਵਰੁ ਦੂਜਾ ॥੨॥
    एको सेवी अवरु न दूजा ॥२॥
    Ėko sevī avar na ḏūjā. ||2||
    I serve the One Lord, and not any other. ||2||
    ਪੂਜਾ ਕਰਉ ਨਿਵਾਜ ਗੁਜਾਰਉ
    पूजा करउ न निवाज गुजारउ ॥
    Pūjā kara▫o na nivāj gujāra▫o.
    I do not perform Hindu worship services, nor do I offer the Muslim prayers.
    ਏਕ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਲੇ ਰਿਦੈ ਨਮਸਕਾਰਉ ॥੩॥
    एक निरंकार ले रिदै नमसकारउ ॥३॥
    Ėk nirankār le riḏai namaskāra▫o. ||3||
    I have taken the One Formless Lord into my heart; I humbly worship Him there. ||3||
    ਨਾ ਹਮ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ
    ना हम हिंदू न मुसलमान ॥
    Nā ham hinḏū na musalmān.
    I am not a Hindu, nor am I a Muslim.
    ਅਲਹ ਰਾਮ ਕੇ ਪਿੰਡੁ ਪਰਾਨ ॥੪॥
    अलह राम के पिंडु परान ॥४॥
    Alah rām ke pind parān. ||4||
    My body and breath of life belong to Allah - to Raam - the God of both. ||4||
    ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹੁ ਕੀਆ ਵਖਾਨਾ
    कहु कबीर इहु कीआ वखाना ॥
    Kaho Kabīr ih kī▫ā vakẖānā.
    Says Kabeer, this is what I say:
    ਗੁਰ ਪੀਰ ਮਿਲਿ ਖੁਦਿ ਖਸਮੁ ਪਛਾਨਾ ॥੫॥੩॥
    गुर पीर मिलि खुदि खसमु पछाना ॥५॥३॥
    Gur pīr mil kẖuḏ kẖasam pacẖẖānā. ||5||3||
    meeting with the Guru, my Spiritual Teacher, I realize God, my Lord and Master. ||5||3||

     
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  15. Hashir

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    Na tusi keh sak deio ke, Baba Naka ji si aai jo thusi dakhaia ve uno khud likkha si!
     
  16. Hashir

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    Teh Prakash Ji, mein Pakistan da vaan menu Gurmukhi parni nai aandhi
     
  17. Harry Haller

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    That is why Amanji has kindly put it in english too brother
     
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  18. Ambarsaria

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    Veer let us review the sabad in plain English if it helps.

    What you got to also recognize how Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is a reflection of a single message with writings of many.

    When Guru ji, including Gur Nanak Dev ji collected writings of Kabir ji, Sheikh Farid ji there was a reason. The reason was the message of Sikhism that was established. One creator everywhere and all ritualistic stuff was just that, rituals; all myths were just thay, myths; and so on.

    The composition and selection of what was to be included was part of a consistent approach where all written by all was not the norm to make it part of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. What was supportive of or in line with all Guru jis understanding as to what were to be the roots of Sikhism was so chosen and chosen with great diligence.

    So in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji one represent all and all represent one as the core thought is one among all.

    In the sabad quoted, there is absolutely cannot be any doubt what Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji represents as a reflection and roots of Sikhism. Now I don't want to repeat the language of the sabad, rather direct and to the point and mainly addressed to Hinduism and Islam as follows,


    • Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji does not support Hinduism in any form
    • Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji does not support Islam in any form
    It is not telling Hindus to believe in Sikhism or Muslims to become Sikhs. It simply states a clear message of "One Creator" unreservedly above all and the only one and without any names in Sikhism.

    So if in spite of all the above, Hindus or Muslims believe that Sikhism offers them something while they stay as Hindus or Muslims, Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji more than welcomes people to learn. Sikhism is understanding and learning based religion and is so focused.

    As a side note the Punjab of the times was a wonderful place of intellectual discourse specially by the Muslim Sufi learned men. At times their thoughts are very close to some of the thoughts in Sikhism. But such Sufi folks were considered by Islam then and to this day as renegades. The equivalent of the Sufi Muslims in Punjab was the Hindu by birth Guru ji who did a specific and detailed revolt and so spoke up to show the pitiable state of the institution of Hinduism and their rituals and beliefs of the times.

    Sat Sri Akal.
     
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    #17 Ambarsaria, Feb 16, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2012
  19. Hashir

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    May someone address the fact of the Chola of Nanak Ji?! Why on Earth, would he have Qura'an verses on there?!
     
  20. Ambarsaria

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    Hashir ji we Sikhs and our Guru ji were least bit picky about material things. Why would Guru Nanak Dev ji have issues with wearing a chola with any inscriptions. He met very many Muslims and many loved him. If chola showed his love back why should it matter. Why are you hung up on a piece of cloth versus what the people and Guru ji believed in? It is like trying to find straws to make a doll.

    Guru ji were much above such material garbage arguments even though he protested wearing a Janeau that Hindus baptize a kid with. He protested first against Hinduism and then shared wisdom that addressed the failings of the rest who were straight jacketed in dogmas, made into sheep to follow, etc.

    Sat Sri Akal.
     
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    #19 Ambarsaria, Feb 16, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2012
  21. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Nothing new at all...the "Religous police/Islamic affairs dept" in my country are always after Muslims wearing hard rock t sirts, t-shirts deemed satanic..rock music..christian cross etc etc....we even REPRINTED an entire lot of Currency notes just becasue there happened to be a Flag pole that at its Top had a Horizontal short stick for hanging additional flags hanging downwards...soem saw that as a CROSS...and of course a muslim country cannot ahve a cross on its currency..so that batch of notes had to go...
    Muslims may be hung up on what to wear and what not..SIKHS are not. period.
     
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