☀️ JOIN SPN MOBILE
Forums
New posts
Guru Granth Sahib
Composition, Arrangement & Layout
ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
Ashtpadiyan (235-242)
Chhant (242-249)
Baavan Akhari (250-262)
Sukhmani (262-296)
Thittee (296-300)
Gauree kii Vaar (300-323)
Gurbani (323-330)
Ashtpadiyan (330-340)
Baavan Akhari (340-343)
Thintteen (343-344)
Vaar Kabir (344-345)
Bhagat Bani (345-346)
ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
Aasaavaree (409-411)
Ashtpadiyan (411-432)
Patee (432-435)
Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
Bhagat Bani (475-488)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
Asatpadhiya (634-642)
Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
Gurbani (876-902)
Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
New resources
Latest activity
Videos
New media
New comments
Library
Latest reviews
Donate
Log in
Register
What's new
New posts
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
Sign up
Log in
Discussions
Hard Talk
Interviews
Taksal - A Critical Analysis
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="vijaydeep Singh" data-source="post: 49507" data-attributes="member: 313"><p><strong>Re: Taksal A critical Analysis</strong></p><p></p><p>Gurfateh</p><p> </p><p>Bro das did put reply of rest of the posts but are not becoming visible as yet.</p><p>So das tries to put them again</p><p>Gurfateh</p><p> </p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Das posted about this but it did not come and clip borard also went of.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">But das will retry to write it.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">As yourself see that das is found out to be as covert agent of RSS or GOI and trying to divide panth as writtan above by das's younger brother.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">So das will explain.for das all forms of Panth are precius and which ever thing we can get from them for Panthic upliftment.We should use.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">1.Kala Afghana Sahib.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">End to ritualism and social reform.</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">2.AKJ</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Hight Facot dynamic,thier motiavation can be used for geting things done for Panth at internation forums and in battle fields also.They think by thier Heart.such are good in taking risk.</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">3.Taksal.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Thier knwoledge and intellect is great and they can preach Gurmat more to Turbaned Hindus and non Sikhs.In fact in thier university other faiths are thought by Pandit,Maulvis etc..</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">For Brahman and Vedas.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=59&english=t&id=2399" target="_blank"><u>Page 59, Line 8</u></a></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ਪੂਛਹੁ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੇ ਨਾਰਦੈ ਬੇਦ ਬਿਆਸੈ ਕੋਇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥</span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">पूछहु ब्रहमे नारदै बेद बिआसै कोइ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">poochhahu barahmay naardai bayd bi-aasai ko-ay. ||1|| rahaa-o.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">Go and ask Brahma, Naarad and Vyaas, the writer of the Vedas. ||1||Pause||</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: green"><strong>Guru Nanak Dev</strong></span> - [SIZE=-1]<span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=59&L=8" target="_blank"><u>view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok</u></a></span>[/SIZE]<span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=230&english=t&id=10051" target="_blank"><u>Page 230, Line 17</u></a></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਮੂਲੁ ਵੇਦ ਅਭਿਆਸਾ ॥</span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ब्रहमा मूलु वेद अभिआसा ॥</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">barahmaa mool vayd abhi-aasaa.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">Brahma is the founder of the study of the Vedas.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: green"><strong>Guru Amar Das</strong></span> - [SIZE=-1]<span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=230&L=17" target="_blank"><u>view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok</u></a></span>[/SIZE]</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=423&english=t&id=19476" target="_blank"><u><span style="font-size: 15px"><span style="color: #0000ff">Page 423, Line 5</span></span></u></a></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="font-size: 15px"><span style="color: black">ਚਾਰੇ ਵੇਦ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੇ ਕਉ ਦੀਏ ਪੜਿ ਪੜਿ ਕਰੇ ਵੀਚਾਰੀ ॥</span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">चारे वेद ब्रहमे कउ दीए पड़ि पड़ि करे वीचारी ॥</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">chaaray vayd barahmay ka-o dee-ay parh parh karay veechaaree.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">You gave the four Vedas to Brahma, for him to read and read continually, and reflect upon.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: green"><strong>Guru Amar Das</strong></span> - [SIZE=-1]<span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=423&L=5" target="_blank"><u>view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok</u></a></span>[/SIZE]</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: #0000ff">Das also read in spokesmen Kala Afghana Sahib arguing that why did not Brahma who wrote Vedas become Bedi and and why did family of First Master becaem Bedis.(Das replied this in Dasham Granth thread in this forum only).</span></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: #0000ff">Das views of Gurbani and Vedas will be answered at last.</span></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">The about Brahma and lotus see below.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=227&english=t&id=9857" target="_blank"><u>Page 227, Line 2</u></a></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲੁ ਪਇਆਲਿ ਨ ਪਾਇਆ ॥</span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ब्रहम कमलु पइआलि न पाइआ ॥</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">barahm kamal pa-i-aal na paa-i-aa.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">Brahma entered the lotus, and searched the nether regions, but he did not find the end of it.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: green"><strong>Guru Nanak Dev</strong></span> - [SIZE=-1]<span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=227&L=2" target="_blank"><u>view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok</u></a></span>[/SIZE]<span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=350&english=t&id=16054" target="_blank"><u>Page 350, Line 17</u></a></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ਨਾਲਿ ਕੁਟੰਬੁ ਸਾਥਿ ਵਰਦਾਤਾ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਭਾਲਣ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਗਇਆ ॥</span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">नालि कुट्मबु साथि वरदाता ब्रहमा भालण स्रिसटि गइआ ॥</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">naal kutamb saath vardaataa barahmaa bhaalan sarisat ga-i-aa.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">Brahma, the bestower of blessings, entered the stem of the lotus, with his relatives, to find the extent of the universe.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: green"><strong>Guru Nanak Dev</strong></span> - [SIZE=-1]<span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=350&L=17" target="_blank"><u>view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok</u></a></span>[/SIZE]<span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=489&english=t&id=22107" target="_blank"><u>Page 489, Line 8</u></a></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ਨਾਭਿ ਕਮਲ ਤੇ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਉਪਜੇ ਬੇਦ ਪੜਹਿ ਮੁਖਿ ਕੰਠਿ ਸਵਾਰਿ ॥</span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">नाभि कमल ते ब्रहमा उपजे बेद पड़हि मुखि कंठि सवारि ॥</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">naabh kamal tay barahmaa upjay bayd parheh mukh kanth savaar.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">From the lotus of Vishnu's navel, Brahma was born; He chanted the Vedas with a melodious voice.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: green"><strong>Guru Nanak Dev</strong></span> - [SIZE=-1]<span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=489&L=8" target="_blank"><u>view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok</u></a></span>[/SIZE]<span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=1237&english=t&id=53197" target="_blank"><u>Page 1237, Line 17</u></a></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ਨਾਭਿ ਵਸਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੈ ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਜਾਣਿਆ ॥</span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">नाभि वसत ब्रहमै अंतु न जाणिआ ॥</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">naabh vasat barahmai ant na jaani-aa.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">Brahma, in the lotus of the navel, does not know the limits of God.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: green"><strong>Guru Nanak Dev</strong></span> - [SIZE=-1]<span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=1237&L=17" target="_blank"><u>view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok</u></a></span>[/SIZE]<span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=1309&english=t&id=56114" target="_blank"><u>Page 1309, Line 7</u></a></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-family: 'AnmolUniPr'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲ ਪੁਤੁ ਮੀਨ ਬਿਆਸਾ ਤਪੁ ਤਾਪਨ ਪੂਜ ਕਰਾਵੈਗੋ ॥</span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">ब्रहम कमल पुतु मीन बिआसा तपु तापन पूज करावैगो ॥</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">barahm kamal put meen bi-aasaa tap taapan pooj karaavaigo.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 9px"><span style="color: black">Brahma, the son of the lotus, and Vyaas, the son of the fish, practiced austere penance and were worshipped.</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: green"><strong>Guru Ram Das</strong></span> - [SIZE=-1]<span style="color: #0000ff"><a href="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=1309&L=7" target="_blank"><u>view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok</u></a></span>[/SIZE]</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black"><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="font-size: 12px">Bro anyway at deeper study of Gurbani das finds that Brahma or anydemigod are false and do not exist at all.</span></span></span></span></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black"></span> </span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Bro act of putting water towards field in Haridwar was acting like ilitrate but let ilitrate get some sprituality.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Dressing up like Arab or say if we go by Bhai Gurdas Var giving Azan(deduced to be of Sat Kartar) was more a way to coming to the level of intellectualy lower to uplift them.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">One was to go into mud or swamp,if one was to rescue them from there.</span></span><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">In True democrcy,it is OK to be Anti scince(Darwins Theory) and let weak(here intellectuly) also be given support.</span></span><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black">Bhagat was a socialist.And was from Arya Samaji family.He was part of adding term Socialist in his his organisations name.He wanted to end what he call rule of native Burgeons after Britshers go and that was a real freedom.</span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Bro he was a fake person.Yet Gandhi was able to misguide the masses and still is father of the nation.His mean was OK but motive was not OK neither for Sikh nor for Hindu.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">But das has read that Tenth Master when went into farmer Area said,Jaisa Des Vaisa Bhes,(Das forgets this word but more to do with aroud the belt so perhaps Kamari) Lungi Mode Khes.(Sau Sakhi).</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Even if you can not belive this but First Master did wear Arebic dress in Arebia.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">When we go to preach someone our ideology.It is OK that they win our confidance,and let them think that we are thier own.Let them have sense of belonging towards us.Then only we win thier confidance and they may find we talk good for them and they be like us.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">In India(AP) Christian(Catholics) missioanaries wear saffron cloaths to let Hindus be attracted.</span></span><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">This thing only is more to do with going to the lelve of target potential convert and then after dialogue making him converted.</span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Bro das is more like slave to Great Gursikh and Good human like you.So do not call him lord.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">They are wrong if we take them literaly but das thinks that they were not in context of Kachhera but were more to encourage Jat and Sat related to it.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">One more thing.our Niuhngs make fun of them.They say that when Husban has to make love with wife both keep one leg still attached to Kachhehra.THey may not be very genrous to Taksal either.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">There could be one more thing.some one can misquote thier (Taksal's) Jathedar Saying.Which he might have told to person with lower intellect.and it is coontextual and not absolute.May be it could be interpolated or may be only for context of ew Taksalis and know been told to whole Panth.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Das has habit to be devil advocate and did defends Islam also(you can ask this from Bhai Manbeer Singh,Raj Khalsa,KDSingh).As no Taksali is there so Das is doing there duty.Had some been writtan for AKj or Kala Afghana Sahib,das would have doe the same.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Das just gave qoutes above from Gurbani.Like Brahma bron from lotus(which may not be true) but a symbol of Anti Castism.so Hanuman may false in existance but symbol of Jat Sat was to be taken into consideration. </span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">brother,</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">so far such thing was used by Ghugga Sahib when he said that Guru ate Halal.</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Doing and talking is difernent.Act of putting Water in west as das metnioed beore was doing an act of illitrate to expose flaw of illitrate.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Say if das goes to preach Gurmat in Basti of Churha(Habitation of sweepers) and due to succhham thing and veggy thing do not eat cat or dog they cook them das may not be able to bring them to Gurmat.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Did not Guru use Hindu terms and Muslims terms for Akal.Why did not he replace all them with Wahiguru or Karta Purakh.</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">reasons</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">1.Hindu /Muslimsmay get to know true meanigs of the worlds.</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">2.Sikhs should not be attracted to other faith.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Das recomends you to read Sister Harsimrat Kaur work,she is from Missioary side.She is using Biblical terms to let followers of bible follow Gurmat(she is not becoimgn like that but trying to let them be like us).Did not Yogi Bhajan also used Jesus refreacanc eand similar things Baba Virsa Singh Ji used.All got converts from Judeo Chrsitain back ground.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">It depends upon our state of mind if we have less of faith then we lose our faith while preaching in non belivers and if faith is strong.Our faith in adopted by non belives we are preaching.Das hopes that you have got the point.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Yuo have talked about Dasham Granth,it was more to do with bringing in revolt for rulers in mind of those who were enslaved for ages.And Guru succeded in that.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">There was some logic behind Gurus using Farsi and Sanskrit also in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.To attract Pandits and Farsi reading Muslims into faith and let them also get some idea.Sikhism is not for Sikhs only but for world.Guru made it a preaching faith and we if do not continue with it,We are not following the footsteps of Gurus.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Kareem(Attribute of Allah),Sivpuri(Salvation of Yogi) are used in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.Guru used that language but neither he did Salat(Namaz) nor he did Hath Yoga.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Das hopes it is OK by now what das wanted to convey.Das will try to clrify this again,if needed.</span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black"></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black">To be very clear ,when Sant Samaj or Taksalis tell Guru Panth to follow Gurmat as former dictate.Say do not eat meat or do not leave berad open.Guru Panth is higher state then Sants and Taksalis especialy,who look themselves better then Guru Panth.</span></p><p> <span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black">We as Guru Panth still thiink student of lower classes of school.Seniors should love juniors and let them be promoted then condeming them.</span></p><p> <span style="color: black"></span></p><p><span style="color: black">Das hope he is OK to explain.</span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Bro kindly bear with das.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">his presentation skills are very poor.For that only he was not taken in Indian Army and had to go for Paramilitary intelligence force.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Help das while editing faults of das and das hopes to learn more from you and rectfy the weakness's of das.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Das is sorry but work of das is like that he is habtual to provide good lot of Data.some time usefull info becomes hidden in that.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Das agrees that this is weakness of Das and with age das will try to ove come this.</span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">Bro Das apriciate your views and finds a bit of differance between his and yuorself preception of Gurmat.</span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">What das has understod of Gurmat das will try to be precise.</span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">1.All acts are done by God</span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">2.Things are only manifestations of God.</span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">3.Differance between us and Vedanta is that they only have knowledge(Very much like Kala Afghana Sahib) and think that as end to thier faith.In Sikhs we are also told about devotion(Vedanta does not has this),We have to behold universe as form of Akal.If Akal wants,then we serve Akal while serving universe with devotion.If Akal wills,we reach a state when we realsie what we knew.so far we knew that Akal is in all.When we see Akal in all,we realise what we knew.That is state when our ego is no long and we are one with Akal.</span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">Khalsa is one with Akal,while being alive.</span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">So coming back to Bani of Tenth Master and First Master.Brother!</span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">non of the Bani is writtan by any Guru or any Sufi or Bhagat or any Sikh or any Bhatt.All bani is from Akal.Akal does all and can say anything.It was unto Great personalities das mentioed here and they recorded it for us.As Akal does all and can do self description so Ram ,Siam,Mahakal,Gobind etc. are all name of Akal in Dasham Granth and Akal is actual poet.Sri Mukh Wak mean Sri(Respected) Mukh(also mean Mukhi/mukhiya or (village)head or big boss) and Wak(Sentance).</span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">So Gurus were mere recroders.</span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><span style="color: black">When we talk of Nanakian philosophy.It has nothing to do with Gurmat.That is more a copying wwith Christains(protestants).It is Akali Philosophy.Directly rom God.Who reason of all apprant sin and virtue and does not Akal described Sin in Japu Sahib also and told that they are relative and Akal is absolute.</span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"><p></span><p></span><p><span style="color: black">Bro so far das did not discuss that vedic thing at all.If at all you find mention of Vedas and Brahma by das as something suspicisus then das will say one thing as a Sikh.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Vedic things is 20 and Gurmat is 100 so 80 more then Vedic.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">and as a neutral social scinctists.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">There were may things which were to develop during Vedic times.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">But when Gurmat came evolutuion was already there.So ours in modern Faith and with Gurbani Vedas etc. are not needed for salvation.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Many weakness in Vedic time were over come by Gurbani.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Das is with you and surprised to see that you have not recogansed das's point of views.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Das has so far not talked about Vedas as such as we do not need anything if Guru is with us.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">It is in Vachitar Natak.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Jin Mat Bed Kateban Tyagi Parbrahm Ke Bhye Anuragi</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Those to renoice the views of Vedas,Bilbe and Kuran,become Beloved for Beyond matter(Akal).</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Bed Kateeb Bikhe Har Nahi,Jan Leho Har Jan Man Mahi.</span></p><p><span style="color: black">In Vedas,Bible and Kuran,sustainer is not there,Behold sustainer(God) in the mind of public.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">That is from Dasham Granth and controvversial Bachitar Natak.and iota of other deeper things embbeded.</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Das agrees that if person who does not follow Dasham Granth can get salvation if Akal wants.But also does not feel bad either if some one say that person like das who has faith in Dasham Granth,will go to hell(be reborn).</span></p><p> </p><p><span style="color: black">Das only want that as much time Akal send das again to earth with new birth .Let Akal make him Sikh of Akal.If Das is rebron as Animal,then also let das maintain faith in Akal.Das does not need any other salvation but faith in Akal is more then anything else for das.Das is kept best as das should be by Akal.No more need of any urther good.</span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Thanks but das only want to yourself also try to preach Gurmat to non Sikhs.May be you may make more Akashdeep Singhs.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Vijaydeep Singh ,anyway,was made by litratrue of Sikh Missioary collage along side Nirmalas from a Hindu fanatics.</span></span></p><p> <span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: black"><span style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'">Best of Luck and we are togather brother.</span></span></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="vijaydeep Singh, post: 49507, member: 313"] [b]Re: Taksal A critical Analysis[/b] Gurfateh Bro das did put reply of rest of the posts but are not becoming visible as yet. So das tries to put them again Gurfateh [COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] Das posted about this but it did not come and clip borard also went of. But das will retry to write it. As yourself see that das is found out to be as covert agent of RSS or GOI and trying to divide panth as writtan above by das's younger brother. So das will explain.for das all forms of Panth are precius and which ever thing we can get from them for Panthic upliftment.We should use. 1.Kala Afghana Sahib. End to ritualism and social reform. 2.AKJ Hight Facot dynamic,thier motiavation can be used for geting things done for Panth at internation forums and in battle fields also.They think by thier Heart.such are good in taking risk. 3.Taksal. Thier knwoledge and intellect is great and they can preach Gurmat more to Turbaned Hindus and non Sikhs.In fact in thier university other faiths are thought by Pandit,Maulvis etc.. [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] For Brahman and Vedas. [SIZE=1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=59&english=t&id=2399"][U]Page 59, Line 8[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ਪੂਛਹੁ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੇ ਨਾਰਦੈ ਬੇਦ ਬਿਆਸੈ ਕੋਇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]पूछहु ब्रहमे नारदै बेद बिआसै कोइ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]poochhahu barahmay naardai bayd bi-aasai ko-ay. ||1|| rahaa-o.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]Go and ask Brahma, Naarad and Vyaas, the writer of the Vedas. ||1||Pause||[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=green][B]Guru Nanak Dev[/B][/COLOR] - [SIZE=-1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=59&L=8"][U]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=230&english=t&id=10051"][U]Page 230, Line 17[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਮੂਲੁ ਵੇਦ ਅਭਿਆਸਾ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ब्रहमा मूलु वेद अभिआसा ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]barahmaa mool vayd abhi-aasaa.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]Brahma is the founder of the study of the Vedas.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=green][B]Guru Amar Das[/B][/COLOR] - [SIZE=-1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=230&L=17"][U]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=423&english=t&id=19476"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]Page 423, Line 5[/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][SIZE=4][COLOR=black]ਚਾਰੇ ਵੇਦ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੇ ਕਉ ਦੀਏ ਪੜਿ ਪੜਿ ਕਰੇ ਵੀਚਾਰੀ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]चारे वेद ब्रहमे कउ दीए पड़ि पड़ि करे वीचारी ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]chaaray vayd barahmay ka-o dee-ay parh parh karay veechaaree.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]You gave the four Vedas to Brahma, for him to read and read continually, and reflect upon.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=green][B]Guru Amar Das[/B][/COLOR] - [SIZE=-1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=423&L=5"][U]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#0000ff][/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000ff]Das also read in spokesmen Kala Afghana Sahib arguing that why did not Brahma who wrote Vedas become Bedi and and why did family of First Master becaem Bedis.(Das replied this in Dasham Granth thread in this forum only).[/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000ff][/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000ff]Das views of Gurbani and Vedas will be answered at last.[/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000ff][/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000ff][/COLOR] The about Brahma and lotus see below. [SIZE=1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=227&english=t&id=9857"][U]Page 227, Line 2[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲੁ ਪਇਆਲਿ ਨ ਪਾਇਆ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ब्रहम कमलु पइआलि न पाइआ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]barahm kamal pa-i-aal na paa-i-aa.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]Brahma entered the lotus, and searched the nether regions, but he did not find the end of it.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=green][B]Guru Nanak Dev[/B][/COLOR] - [SIZE=-1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=227&L=2"][U]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=350&english=t&id=16054"][U]Page 350, Line 17[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ਨਾਲਿ ਕੁਟੰਬੁ ਸਾਥਿ ਵਰਦਾਤਾ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਭਾਲਣ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਗਇਆ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]नालि कुट्मबु साथि वरदाता ब्रहमा भालण स्रिसटि गइआ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]naal kutamb saath vardaataa barahmaa bhaalan sarisat ga-i-aa.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]Brahma, the bestower of blessings, entered the stem of the lotus, with his relatives, to find the extent of the universe.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=green][B]Guru Nanak Dev[/B][/COLOR] - [SIZE=-1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=350&L=17"][U]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=489&english=t&id=22107"][U]Page 489, Line 8[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ਨਾਭਿ ਕਮਲ ਤੇ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਉਪਜੇ ਬੇਦ ਪੜਹਿ ਮੁਖਿ ਕੰਠਿ ਸਵਾਰਿ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]नाभि कमल ते ब्रहमा उपजे बेद पड़हि मुखि कंठि सवारि ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]naabh kamal tay barahmaa upjay bayd parheh mukh kanth savaar.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]From the lotus of Vishnu's navel, Brahma was born; He chanted the Vedas with a melodious voice.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=green][B]Guru Nanak Dev[/B][/COLOR] - [SIZE=-1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=489&L=8"][U]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=1237&english=t&id=53197"][U]Page 1237, Line 17[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ਨਾਭਿ ਵਸਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੈ ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਜਾਣਿਆ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]नाभि वसत ब्रहमै अंतु न जाणिआ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]naabh vasat barahmai ant na jaani-aa.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]Brahma, in the lotus of the navel, does not know the limits of God.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=green][B]Guru Nanak Dev[/B][/COLOR] - [SIZE=-1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=1237&L=17"][U]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=1309&english=t&id=56114"][U]Page 1309, Line 7[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=AnmolUniPr][SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲ ਪੁਤੁ ਮੀਨ ਬਿਆਸਾ ਤਪੁ ਤਾਪਨ ਪੂਜ ਕਰਾਵੈਗੋ ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]ब्रहम कमल पुतु मीन बिआसा तपु तापन पूज करावैगो ॥[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]barahm kamal put meen bi-aasaa tap taapan pooj karaavaigo.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=black]Brahma, the son of the lotus, and Vyaas, the son of the fish, practiced austere penance and were worshipped.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=green][B]Guru Ram Das[/B][/COLOR] - [SIZE=-1][COLOR=#0000ff][URL="http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=KeertanPage&K=1309&L=7"][U]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/U][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman][COLOR=black][COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]Bro anyway at deeper study of Gurbani das finds that Brahma or anydemigod are false and do not exist at all.[/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR] [SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][/SIZE] [/COLOR] [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] Bro act of putting water towards field in Haridwar was acting like ilitrate but let ilitrate get some sprituality. Dressing up like Arab or say if we go by Bhai Gurdas Var giving Azan(deduced to be of Sat Kartar) was more a way to coming to the level of intellectualy lower to uplift them. One was to go into mud or swamp,if one was to rescue them from there.[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=black] [/COLOR][COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] In True democrcy,it is OK to be Anti scince(Darwins Theory) and let weak(here intellectuly) also be given support.[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=black] Bhagat was a socialist.And was from Arya Samaji family.He was part of adding term Socialist in his his organisations name.He wanted to end what he call rule of native Burgeons after Britshers go and that was a real freedom.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] Bro he was a fake person.Yet Gandhi was able to misguide the masses and still is father of the nation.His mean was OK but motive was not OK neither for Sikh nor for Hindu. But das has read that Tenth Master when went into farmer Area said,Jaisa Des Vaisa Bhes,(Das forgets this word but more to do with aroud the belt so perhaps Kamari) Lungi Mode Khes.(Sau Sakhi). Even if you can not belive this but First Master did wear Arebic dress in Arebia. When we go to preach someone our ideology.It is OK that they win our confidance,and let them think that we are thier own.Let them have sense of belonging towards us.Then only we win thier confidance and they may find we talk good for them and they be like us. In India(AP) Christian(Catholics) missioanaries wear saffron cloaths to let Hindus be attracted.[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black][/COLOR] [COLOR=black]This thing only is more to do with going to the lelve of target potential convert and then after dialogue making him converted. [/COLOR][COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] Bro das is more like slave to Great Gursikh and Good human like you.So do not call him lord. They are wrong if we take them literaly but das thinks that they were not in context of Kachhera but were more to encourage Jat and Sat related to it. One more thing.our Niuhngs make fun of them.They say that when Husban has to make love with wife both keep one leg still attached to Kachhehra.THey may not be very genrous to Taksal either. There could be one more thing.some one can misquote thier (Taksal's) Jathedar Saying.Which he might have told to person with lower intellect.and it is coontextual and not absolute.May be it could be interpolated or may be only for context of ew Taksalis and know been told to whole Panth. Das has habit to be devil advocate and did defends Islam also(you can ask this from Bhai Manbeer Singh,Raj Khalsa,KDSingh).As no Taksali is there so Das is doing there duty.Had some been writtan for AKj or Kala Afghana Sahib,das would have doe the same. Das just gave qoutes above from Gurbani.Like Brahma bron from lotus(which may not be true) but a symbol of Anti Castism.so Hanuman may false in existance but symbol of Jat Sat was to be taken into consideration. [/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] brother, so far such thing was used by Ghugga Sahib when he said that Guru ate Halal. Doing and talking is difernent.Act of putting Water in west as das metnioed beore was doing an act of illitrate to expose flaw of illitrate. Say if das goes to preach Gurmat in Basti of Churha(Habitation of sweepers) and due to succhham thing and veggy thing do not eat cat or dog they cook them das may not be able to bring them to Gurmat. Did not Guru use Hindu terms and Muslims terms for Akal.Why did not he replace all them with Wahiguru or Karta Purakh. reasons 1.Hindu /Muslimsmay get to know true meanigs of the worlds. 2.Sikhs should not be attracted to other faith. Das recomends you to read Sister Harsimrat Kaur work,she is from Missioary side.She is using Biblical terms to let followers of bible follow Gurmat(she is not becoimgn like that but trying to let them be like us).Did not Yogi Bhajan also used Jesus refreacanc eand similar things Baba Virsa Singh Ji used.All got converts from Judeo Chrsitain back ground. It depends upon our state of mind if we have less of faith then we lose our faith while preaching in non belivers and if faith is strong.Our faith in adopted by non belives we are preaching.Das hopes that you have got the point. Yuo have talked about Dasham Granth,it was more to do with bringing in revolt for rulers in mind of those who were enslaved for ages.And Guru succeded in that. There was some logic behind Gurus using Farsi and Sanskrit also in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.To attract Pandits and Farsi reading Muslims into faith and let them also get some idea.Sikhism is not for Sikhs only but for world.Guru made it a preaching faith and we if do not continue with it,We are not following the footsteps of Gurus. Kareem(Attribute of Allah),Sivpuri(Salvation of Yogi) are used in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.Guru used that language but neither he did Salat(Namaz) nor he did Hath Yoga. Das hopes it is OK by now what das wanted to convey.Das will try to clrify this again,if needed. [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=black] To be very clear ,when Sant Samaj or Taksalis tell Guru Panth to follow Gurmat as former dictate.Say do not eat meat or do not leave berad open.Guru Panth is higher state then Sants and Taksalis especialy,who look themselves better then Guru Panth. We as Guru Panth still thiink student of lower classes of school.Seniors should love juniors and let them be promoted then condeming them. Das hope he is OK to explain.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] Bro kindly bear with das. his presentation skills are very poor.For that only he was not taken in Indian Army and had to go for Paramilitary intelligence force. Help das while editing faults of das and das hopes to learn more from you and rectfy the weakness's of das. Das is sorry but work of das is like that he is habtual to provide good lot of Data.some time usefull info becomes hidden in that. Das agrees that this is weakness of Das and with age das will try to ove come this.[/FONT][/COLOR] [LIST=1] [*][SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman][/FONT][/SIZE][/LIST][SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman][COLOR=black]Bro Das apriciate your views and finds a bit of differance between his and yuorself preception of Gurmat.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]What das has understod of Gurmat das will try to be precise.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black]1.All acts are done by God[/COLOR] [COLOR=black]2.Things are only manifestations of God.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black]3.Differance between us and Vedanta is that they only have knowledge(Very much like Kala Afghana Sahib) and think that as end to thier faith.In Sikhs we are also told about devotion(Vedanta does not has this),We have to behold universe as form of Akal.If Akal wants,then we serve Akal while serving universe with devotion.If Akal wills,we reach a state when we realsie what we knew.so far we knew that Akal is in all.When we see Akal in all,we realise what we knew.That is state when our ego is no long and we are one with Akal.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Khalsa is one with Akal,while being alive.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]So coming back to Bani of Tenth Master and First Master.Brother![/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]non of the Bani is writtan by any Guru or any Sufi or Bhagat or any Sikh or any Bhatt.All bani is from Akal.Akal does all and can say anything.It was unto Great personalities das mentioed here and they recorded it for us.As Akal does all and can do self description so Ram ,Siam,Mahakal,Gobind etc. are all name of Akal in Dasham Granth and Akal is actual poet.Sri Mukh Wak mean Sri(Respected) Mukh(also mean Mukhi/mukhiya or (village)head or big boss) and Wak(Sentance).[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]So Gurus were mere recroders.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]When we talk of Nanakian philosophy.It has nothing to do with Gurmat.That is more a copying wwith Christains(protestants).It is Akali Philosophy.Directly rom God.Who reason of all apprant sin and virtue and does not Akal described Sin in Japu Sahib also and told that they are relative and Akal is absolute.[/COLOR] [LIST=1] [*][/LIST][/FONT][LIST=1][/list][/SIZE][LIST=1][/LIST][COLOR=black]Bro so far das did not discuss that vedic thing at all.If at all you find mention of Vedas and Brahma by das as something suspicisus then das will say one thing as a Sikh.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Vedic things is 20 and Gurmat is 100 so 80 more then Vedic.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]and as a neutral social scinctists.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]There were may things which were to develop during Vedic times.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]But when Gurmat came evolutuion was already there.So ours in modern Faith and with Gurbani Vedas etc. are not needed for salvation.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Many weakness in Vedic time were over come by Gurbani.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Das is with you and surprised to see that you have not recogansed das's point of views.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Das has so far not talked about Vedas as such as we do not need anything if Guru is with us.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]It is in Vachitar Natak.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Jin Mat Bed Kateban Tyagi Parbrahm Ke Bhye Anuragi[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Those to renoice the views of Vedas,Bilbe and Kuran,become Beloved for Beyond matter(Akal).[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Bed Kateeb Bikhe Har Nahi,Jan Leho Har Jan Man Mahi.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black]In Vedas,Bible and Kuran,sustainer is not there,Behold sustainer(God) in the mind of public.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]That is from Dasham Granth and controvversial Bachitar Natak.and iota of other deeper things embbeded.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Das agrees that if person who does not follow Dasham Granth can get salvation if Akal wants.But also does not feel bad either if some one say that person like das who has faith in Dasham Granth,will go to hell(be reborn).[/COLOR] [COLOR=black] [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Das only want that as much time Akal send das again to earth with new birth .Let Akal make him Sikh of Akal.If Das is rebron as Animal,then also let das maintain faith in Akal.Das does not need any other salvation but faith in Akal is more then anything else for das.Das is kept best as das should be by Akal.No more need of any urther good.[/COLOR] [COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman] Thanks but das only want to yourself also try to preach Gurmat to non Sikhs.May be you may make more Akashdeep Singhs. Vijaydeep Singh ,anyway,was made by litratrue of Sikh Missioary collage along side Nirmalas from a Hindu fanatics. Best of Luck and we are togather brother.[/FONT][/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Discussions
Hard Talk
Interviews
Taksal - A Critical Analysis
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
Accept
Learn more…
Top