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Nidhi/Ridhi/Sidhi

Discussion in 'Gurmat Vichaar' started by Arvind, Aug 5, 2004.

  1. Arvind

    Arvind
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    Sangat,

    There is mention of nidhi/ridhi/sidhi in Gurubani, which can be taken as good as miracles!

    Also, Gurubani talks about these:
    "Sabh Nidhaan Das Ast Sidhaan Thaakur Kar Tal Dhariaa."
    "Tudh Vinn Sidhee Kinai Na Paaeeaa"

    In one discussion on sikhpal.com, it came up with following information:
    Sidhis or supernatural powers are mentioned to be eighteen in number. Of them, the eight are known as major and the remaining are considered minor. The eight principle Sidhis are as follows: the power to assume form as small as atom (Anima), as large as mountain (Mahimaa), as light in weight as air (Laghimaa), and as heavy in weight as the Earth (Grimaa); the power to attain anything desired (Praapati), to bring all senses under one's control (Vasitva), to have unhampered will (Prakaamaya), and the lordliness (Isha). The minor Sidhis are namely the power to be immune from hunger and thirst (Anooram), to hear from afar (Door Sharavan), to see from afar (Door Darshan), to travel fast like thought (Manoveg), to assume any desired form (Kaamroop), to enter into another's body (Parkaayi Parvesh), to die at one's own will (Sai Maritayaa), to enjoy meeting with gods (Surkareeraa), the fulfillment of desires (Sankalap Sidhi), and to go anywhere unobstructed (Apratihat Gat).


    On the other hand, we say sikhism doesnt support miracles. Or Am I missing something?

    Best Regards.
     
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  2. Admin Singh

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    Very interesting topic !! I would love to read more about it.
     
  3. Kandola

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    "prabh ka simran, ridh sidh nau nidh"

    all them sidhs did bhakti and got what they got.

    sikhs will get ridiya sidhiya as well.

    but sikhi says no to this right?

    yes but says not to use it for yourself or show it off. sidhs did that alot, and they lost all their powers.

    hanji, if you do simran, you'll get ridhiya sidhiya, but dont show them off. thats what maharaj says.
     
  4. Arvind

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    Sure Kandola ji. I understand what you say.

    Thanks.
     
  5. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    The ultimate aim of a sikh according to Gurbani is to attain ONE-NESS with Akal Purakh.

    Ridhian sidhian are mere Natak Chetak applicable only in this world according to Guru Gobind Singh ji. Naam Bhiyaas will get us these powers...and if we then begin to use them to show others, we become "magiicnas" and lose them soon enough....and what is frightening is that in the process of being busy with ridhian sidhain.. OUR Bilogical Clock is also running and our life is being spent....so in the end we may not have enough time for our real mission in life - to meet Akal purakh. So what Guru Ji wants to impress upon us is that no matter IF our Life is extended to Nine Yugs, our "Wadiayee" is extended to the heavens and worlds, we can perform all the 9 nindhian and 18 sidhian.... we are ultimatey FAILURES IF we fail to Meet Akal Purakh when our life is at an end. Who respects a "top student" who can rattle of his "knowledge" every now and then...BUT FAILS his FINAL EXAM....answer is NO ONE. He is a FAILURE. Period.

    jarnail Singh
     
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  6. drkhalsa

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    Yes Jarnail singh ji very rightly said , also Gurbani also guide us in a similar way In this verse Guruji has clearly graded even salvation lower than the
    joy of meeting AKAL PURAK so now we can see where ridhi and sidhi stands on a way of sikh:eek:hyeah:

    Page 534, Line 4 -- Guru Arjan Dev

    raaj na chaaha-o mukat na chaaha-o man pareet charan kamlaaray.


    I do not seek power, and I do not seek liberation. My mind is in love with Your Lotus Feet.
     
    #6 drkhalsa, Dec 29, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 5, 2016
  7. Arvind

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    I understand what Gyani ji and drkhalsa are saying. But both of you went off-track, while replying. My question is - Why does Gurubani mention so, if they dont stand a place in sikhism?

    Regards.
     
  8. drkhalsa

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    Well what I think is Guruji is taking care of warning us in advance what we will be coming accross in journey and how to tackle it so it is just a testimony of excelent guide GURU GRANTH SAHIB

    isrIrwgu mhlw 3 ]
    bhu ByK kir BrmweIAY min ihrdY kptu kmwie ]
    hir kw mhlu n pwveI mir ivstw mwih smwie ]1]
    mn ry igRh hI mwih audwsu ]
    scu sMjmu krxI so kry gurmuiK hoie prgwsu ]1] rhwau ]
    gur kY sbid mnu jIiqAw giq mukiq GrY mih pwie ]
    hir kw nwmu iDAweIAY sqsMgiq myil imlwie ]2]
    jy lK iesqrIAw Bog krih nv KMf rwju kmwih ]
    ibnu siqgur suKu n pwveI iPir iPir jonI pwih ]3]
    hir hwru kMiT ijnI pihirAw gur crxI icqu lwie ]
    iqnw ipCY iriD isiD iPrY Enw iqlu n qmwie ]4]
    jo pRB BwvY so QIAY Avru n krxw jwie ]
    jnu nwnku jIvY nwmu lY hir dyvhu shij suBwie ]5]2]35]


    sireeraag mehalaa 3 ||
    bah
    u bhaekh kar bharamaaeeai man hiradhai kapatt kamaae ||
    har k
    aa mehal n paavee mar visattaa maahi samaae ||1||
    man r
    ae grih hee maahi oudhaas ||
    sach sa(n)jam karan
    ee so karae guramukh hoe paragaas ||1|| rehaao ||
    g
    ur kai sabadh man jeethiaa gath mukath gharai mehi paae ||
    har k
    aa naam dhhiaaeeai sathasa(n)gath mael milaae ||2||
    j
    ae lakh eisathareeaa bhog karehi nav kha(n)dd raaj kamaahi ||
    b
    in sathigur sukh n paavee fir fir jonee paahi ||3||
    har h
    aar ka(n)t(h) jinee pehiriaa gur charanee chith laae ||
    th
    inaa pishhai ridhh sidhh firai ounaa thil n thamaae ||4||
    j
    o prabh bhaavai so thheeai avar n karanaa jaae ||
    jan n
    aanak jeevai naam lai har dhaevahu sehaj subhaae ||5||2||35||

    Siree Raag, Third Mehl:
    People wear all sorts of costumes and wander all around, but in their hearts and minds, they practice deception.
    They do not attain the Mansion of the Lord's Presence, and after death, they sink into manure. ||1||
    O mind, remain detached in the midst of your household.
    Practicing truth, self-discipline and good deeds, the Gurmukh is enlightened. ||1||Pause||
    Through the Word of the Guru's Shabad, the mind is conquered, and one attains the State of Liberation in one's own home.
    So meditate on the Name of the Lord; join and merge with the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation. ||2||
    You may enjoy the pleasures of hundreds of thousands of women, and rule the nine continents of the world.
    But without the True Guru, you will not find peace; you will be reincarnated over and over again. ||3||
    Those who wear the Necklace of the Lord around their necks, and focus their consciousness on the Guru's Feet
    -wealth and supernatural spiritual powers follow them, but they do not care for such things at all. ||4||
    Whatever pleases God's Will comes to pass. Nothing else can be done.
    Servant Nanak lives by chanting the Naam. O Lord, please give it to me, in Your Natural Way
     
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  9. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Waheguru ji ka Khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh,


    Veer dr Khalsa Ji has aptly answered your question veer Arvind Ji.

    Guru granth ji is warning us of the dangers that lie along this path that is no wider than a hair and sharper than a sword's blade. When we do Naam Abhiyaas and do simran, we will begin to get these powers of ridhi sidhi..and thats where the real danger lies... we will be so fascinated by these starnge powers that we have so suddenly got in us... that we begin to flex our muscles... exactly what the SIDHS did to GURU NANAK. It is mentioned in the janamsakhis related to Sidh ghost that the Sidhs showed many many miracles to Guru ji to Impress Him..of course Guru Ji was not at all impressed..and thats why these are mentioned in Gurbani...so that we will follow our Beloved Guru Ji's example and NOT be "impressed" by the likes of Babas/sanyts etc who exhibit these powers.

    One more thing about these powers.. they are gained by naam simran abhiyaas etc...BUT they are REDUCED by exhibition... so as they get lesser, the person will in turn do more simran etc to gain back the powers he lost...and when he gets LOST in this CHAKAR.... when the Jamdoots come to take him back to Yamraaj... he will discovert hat eh has squandered his LIFE..doing magic tricks...

    Jarnail Singh
     
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  10. saintnsipahi

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    Sat Sri AKAL,

    Here are too big personalities are in conversation, I'm a too small person. But I want to know that the Sidhis are ban to attain or ban to show? In my opinion, What I think of is, Neither Guruji Nor Gurbani is against the Sidhis. The main thing is that by showing it to get materialistic gain is ban in Gursikhi.Khalsa's are Sidhs of their own. They can interact with their Guru but it has no materialistic value. Gurbani always warn us for not indulging in bad things, So the exposer of Sidhi is Bad always. It is not a muscular power to show off. Its a power of soul. And our soul is always connected with our Guru is the greatest Sidhi of a Gurmukh. And me personnaly want to die only with this Sidhi. Sidhi Is a Kirpa of Satguru, But no waste like other people think. I'm regreted with you all, that I have disrupted your Conversation, But I'm thankful to My Satguru that he has given me a chance to open my words.

    Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh.
     
  11. sukhpaal

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    Riddhis Siddhis are true obstacles reaching the stage of Sach khand such as many bhagats and saints have reached. However helping someone using riddhi/siddhi is NOT bad.
    Many persons tend to FALL during the process.

    Good example of Sant baba sant isher singh ji Rarewale who kept all under control.....bhagti and riddhi/siddhi and helped thousands in various problems is RARE!

    It is exists .........use it carefully.
     
  12. Arvind

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    Here, I agree with most of the contents by saintnsipahi. However sukhpaal veer ji, there are instances in sikh history, when anyone tried to do even 'good' for others by using the ridhi/sidhi, they had to leave the world, as per Guru ji's Hukam.

    IMHO, a Gursikh automatically has these powers with naam-kamayee, however any kind of use of these is NOT allowed. Perhaps Gursikhs realize, there are better purposes. I got no idea, what their understanding level wud be though.

    Regards.
     
  13. saintnsipahi

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    Sat Sri Akaal Arvindji and Sukhpaal veerji,


    It is true that use of any sidhi powers for any purpose Good or Bad it may be, for the other persons are ban in Gursikhi. Otherwise Karankarawanhaar Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharaj can produce Sidhis and to serve people. But they didn't do that then where we are standing to show this to people, nowhere.

    Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh.
     
  14. Arvind

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    haanji veer ji, I agree. Also look at all the Gurus and Shaheeds, they preferred to be in His Razaa, Rabb da Bhaana... this is one of the principles of sikhi, which comes only by faith in Him.

    Regards.
     
  15. BaljeetSingh

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    I am seeing this time and again that some people read and refer to the Gurbani in "paragraph" format, but the truth is that Gurbani is not in "paragraph", but "poetic" format. Here is a 10 minute tour of poetic composition styles of poets of 15th-18th century India.

    There is lot of difference when you read a story and when you read a poem. In a poetic omposition, the poet uses different ways to communicate a message. I think I mentioned it somewhere else in this forum, that the poets in 15th -18th century India used "alankars" in their poetic compositions. "Alankars" are kind of styles. I am not an expert in alakars, but I know a few (believe it or not, 7th grade Hindi classes are helping me a lot now).

    For example, there is an alankar (I lam forgetting the name), where poet uses the same letter as the first letter of all the words in a line. For example,
    kbIr kwieAw kwcI kwrvI kyvl kwcI Dwqu ]
    Kabeer, the body is like a clay vessel or a brittle metal pot.

    Here, Kabir ji used letter "Kakka" as first letter for all but the last word.


    Another alankar called "atishyokti" alankar, used to refer things of impossible proportions, for example:

    jy sau cMdw augvih sUrj cVih hjwr ]

    If a hundred moons were to rise, and a thousand suns appeared,
    eyqy cwnx hoidAW gur ibnu Gor AMDwr ]2]
    even with such light, there would still be pitch darkness without the Guru. ||2||

    Now, here you may question...how is it possible to have hundreds of moon or thousands of suns? But the fact is that the Guru is referring to brightness of a very large proportion.

    Similarly, when Guru ji made reference to Nidhaan, and 18 sidhhis, he is referring to all the powers of world...

    Further, please do not quote a single line from any shabad and start interpreting it as an individual line. In order to get the complete message, refer to the entire shabad along with the "Rahao" line. Get the complete message from the whole shabad, and not one individual line.

    This reminds of a short story (probabely we all read in middle school and have now forgotten) about five blind men who gathered around an elephant. One got hold of elephant's ear and said "this is a big fan", second blind man got hold of the leg of elephant and said, "this is a piller". Third got hold of its tail and said...no it is a rope. Similarly the other two blind men got hold of separate body parts of elephant and declared the elephant as something else. Only a person with vision is able to see the animal wholely and tell it is an elephant and not a rope, piller or fan.

    Regards,


     
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  16. Arvind

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    I agree. Thanks for pointing out.

    About 100s of moons and 1000s of suns, I think, it is already proved, so it is not "atishyokti". About 9 nidhi, 18 sidhi, those are different individual powers, as in the first post above.

    But yes, although examples were slightly off-way, but I understand your intention to quote full shabad just to make sure that single line is not misinterpreted to appear out-of-context.

    Thanks
     
  17. BaljeetSingh

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    Per Mahan Kosh, there are multiple meanings of the words Nidh, Sidh and Ridh

    Nidh - Khazana (Treasure), One of the nine ratans from Kubers treasure, Ocean, Pleace of living

    Sidh - Karamat (one of the eigth supernatural powers (sidhis)), Success, Mukt (Liberation), Budh (knowledge), Sampada (property), Vijay (victory)

    Ridh - Sampada (property), Safalta (success), Unnat (growth)

    Regards,
     
  18. hpluthera

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    Dear Arvind
    In Gurbani it is also written that all Vedas are True and it is also written that ved even could not know your limits.
    Similarly Guru Sahibans have referred to all ridhis Sidhis and in the context of attaining ultimate Naam all these are just small and enslaved to Naam the ultimate goal of life. One in life gets all these when on way to the attainment of Naam but in order to reach the Destination Guru Sahib Says stick to Simran with the Bombardment of the Shabd you can dispel all these hinderences to mett the Lord Sacha patshah in Naam Awastha. Ridhi Sidhis are by products which you just get on this way do not get lost in it get going to wards your goal.
    Stick to naam. Naam is the philosophy Shabd is the Swari and Weapon Swas are the Poles so saas saas simar to get to Naam.
    Namm will give all answer.

    Gurbani Teachings are for all levels of intellect and faiths who are herded through shabd to Naam. That is the crux rest is Just "Bhalekhe" doubts.
    One who develops a habit of doubt believes none not him/herself. That is why Pauri of "mane ki Gat kahi na jayi".
    Dhan Guru nanak
    HP

     
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  19. Arvind

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    Waheguru.

    Thanks veer ji.
     
  20. simpy

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    It might seem like a late view, I was not a member at the time this thought exchange was going on-

    In my understanding, Ridhi/Sidhi is fragrance of the Kanwal that turns upright with Naam Simran. Sidhies etc.s are going to be there, they multiply and get stronger as the Kanwal blossoms more and more. But our purpose is to get the Kanwal blossomed fully, and that happens only when we do not indulge in fragrance but stay focused in the task of self realization.
     
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