Welcome to SPN

Register and Join the most happening forum of Sikh community & intellectuals from around the world.

Sign Up Now!

Meaning of Shabad

Discussion in 'Sikh Sikhi Sikhism' started by Taranjeet singh, Aug 8, 2013.

  1. Taranjeet singh

    Taranjeet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    Messages:
    451
    Likes Received:
    895
    I could not understand the overall message contained in the following shabad that appears on ang 1300. Kindly help.

    ਕਾਨੜਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥ Kaanraa, Fifth Mehl:

    ਸਾਧ ਸਰਨਿ ਚਰਨ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਇਆ ॥
    In the Sanctuary of the Holy, I focus
    my consciousness on the Lord's Feet.

    ਸੁਪਨ ਕੀ ਬਾਤ ਸੁਨੀ ਪੇਖੀ ਸੁਪਨਾ ਨਾਮ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
    When I was dreaming, I heard and saw only dream-objects.
    The True Guru has implanted the Mantra of the Naam,
    the Name of the Lord, within me. ||1||Pause||

    ਨਹ ਤ੍ਰਿਪਤਾਨੋ ਰਾਜ ਜੋਬਨਿ ਧਨਿ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਫਿਰਿ ਧਾਇਆ ॥
    Power, youth and wealth do not bring satisfaction;
    people chase after them again and again.

    ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਤ੍ਰਿਸਨਾ ਸਭ ਬੁਝੀ ਹੈ ਸਾਂਤਿ ਪਾਈ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਇਆ ॥੧॥
    I have found peace and tranquility, and all my
    thirsty desires have been quenched,
    singing His Glorious Praises. ||1||

    ਬਿਨੁ ਬੂਝੇ ਪਸੂ ਕੀ ਨਿਆਈ ਭ੍ਰਮਿ ਮੋਹਿ ਬਿਆਪਿਓ ਮਾਇਆ ॥
    Without understanding, they are like beasts,
    engrossed in doubt, emotional attachment and Maya.

    ਸਾਧਸੰਗਿ ਜਮ ਜੇਵਰੀ ਕਾਟੀ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਹਜਿ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥੨॥੧੦॥
    But in the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy,
    the noose of Death is cut, O Nanak, and one intuitively
    merges in celestial peace. ||2||10||
     
    • Like Like x 4
  2. Loading...

    Similar Threads Forum Date
    Meaning of the shabad in this video Intellectual Translations by SPNers Feb 8, 2014
    Meaning of this Shabad Please Ang 388 Gurmat Vichaar May 4, 2012
    Meaning of Shabad - Prem Patolā Tai Sėh Diṯā Dẖakaṇ Kū Paṯ Merī. Gurmat Vichaar Dec 6, 2011
    The Meaning of Shabad Guru Surat Dhun Chela: Holy Word as Soul Teacher Sikh Sikhi Sikhism Oct 26, 2007
    Question and Meaning Of A Shabad in Savaiyas Interfaith Dialogues Oct 11, 2005

  3. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    Taranjeet Singh ji

    Let me post an alternative translation that may make more sense. This one is from Dr. Manmohan Singh. I did a cross-check of Gurmukhi to English, and this translation is closer to the original

    Dr. Manmohan Singh's approach tends less to the metaphysical of dreams and mantras and more to the relaxing of the mind, away from the attachments of the ordinary world and more toward the soothing effects of attachment to the satguru. See if this second translation gives you a somewhat different impression. Then maybe you will be able to identify where you are stuck and need more clarity. Or maybe you will be satisfied that you are fine with your understanding.

    Possibly the two images that would need more clarification are "guru's feet" and "death's noose." Possibly also "saint's refuge."

    ਕਾਨੜਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥
    Kānṛā mėhlā 5.
    Kanra 5th Guru.

    ਸਾਧ ਸਰਨਿ ਚਰਨ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਇਆ ॥
    Sāḏẖ saran cẖaran cẖiṯ lā▫i▫ā.
    Repairing to the saints refuge, I have attuned my mind to the Lord's feet.

    ਸੁਪਨ ਕੀ ਬਾਤ ਸੁਨੀ ਪੇਖੀ ਸੁਪਨਾ ਨਾਮ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
    Supan kī bāṯ sunī pekẖī supnā nām manṯar saṯgurū driṛ▫ā▫i▫ā. ||1|| rahā▫o.
    When the true Guru enshrined the spell of the Name within me, then did I see, as I had heard, that the world is but a thing of a dream, yea, only a dream. Pause.

    ਨਹ ਤ੍ਰਿਪਤਾਨੋ ਰਾਜ ਜੋਬਨਿ ਧਨਿ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਫਿਰਿ ਧਾਇਆ ॥
    Nah ṯaripṯāno rāj joban ḏẖan bahur bahur fir ḏẖā▫i▫ā.
    Man is satiated not with power, youth and wealth and runs after them again and again.

    ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਤ੍ਰਿਸਨਾ ਸਭ ਬੁਝੀ ਹੈ ਸਾਂਤਿ ਪਾਈ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਇਆ ॥੧॥
    Sukẖ pā▫i▫ā ṯarisnā sabẖ bujẖī hai sāʼnṯ pā▫ī gun gā▫i▫ā. ||1||
    Singing the Lord's praises, I have obtained peace, gathered tranquility and my desire is wholly stilled.

    ਬਿਨੁ ਬੂਝੇ ਪਸੂ ਕੀ ਨਿਆਈ ਭ੍ਰਮਿ ਮੋਹਿ ਬਿਆਪਿਓ ਮਾਇਆ ॥
    Bin būjẖe pasū kī ni▫ā▫ī bẖaram mohi bi▫āpi▫o mā▫i▫ā.
    Without true understanding, the mortal is like the beast and he is engrossed in doubt, worldly love and wealth.

    ਸਾਧਸੰਗਿ ਜਮ ਜੇਵਰੀ ਕਾਟੀ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਹਜਿ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥੨॥੧੦॥
    Sāḏẖsang jam jevrī kātī Nānak sahj samā▫i▫ā. ||2||10||
    Associating with the saints society, death's noose is cut and one merges in his Lord, O Nanak.
     
    • Like Like x 6
    #2 spnadmin, Aug 8, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2013
  4. Luckysingh

    Luckysingh Canada
    Expand Collapse
    Writer SPNer

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,634
    Likes Received:
    2,749
    ਸੁਪਨ ਕੀ ਬਾਤ ਸੁਨੀ ਪੇਖੀ ਸੁਪਨਾ ਨਾਮ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
    Supan kī bāṯ sunī pekẖī supnā nām manṯar saṯgurū driṛ▫ā▫i▫ā. ||1|| rahā▫o.

    When the true Guru enshrined the spell of the Name within me, then did I see, as I had heard, that the world is but a thing of a dream, yea, only a dream. Pause.

    OR- When I was dreaming, I heard and saw only dream-objects.
    The True Guru has implanted the Mantra of the Naam,
    the Name of the Lord, within me. ||1||Pause||

    What strikes me about this rahao line is the many slightly different variances in interpretation.
    However, one of the important messages that I get is that -
    -The world and this life is only successive moments of 'reality'.
    Just like a dream seems very real for the moments you dream it, but in reality the whole dream was not a true reality or the whole truth. In the same way this life only consists of successive moments of reality but the whole world and life experienced is Never the Whole Truth.

    To me, I know that mistakes I've made or wrongful interactions I've had in my past were my 'real' actions at the time and the reality for that moment, but it would be unfair to judge me and class my Whole being based on these moments that were not the True me or my Whole Truth !

    Has there been moments in my life and world that would be helping define the whole truth or one's that were not unreal like a dream ???
    I like to think of 'Sehaj' as a state of mind when there are absolutely No thoughts in your mind and your mind is completely 'Steady'.
    This may only be a period of a few seconds or minutes, but I think this is a state of naam or his name being completely enshrined in my mind and every cell!
    Personally, I feel that these very short moments of sehaj, when only the name of waheguru is prevalent Both within and without, then I am actually living a very small fraction of the 'Whole Truth' !
     
    • Like Like x 5
  5. Taranjeet singh

    Taranjeet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    Messages:
    451
    Likes Received:
    895
    Very many thanks for responses.
    1.Could you also explain as to what is Naam Mantra in the context.
    2.Secondly the 'shabad' contains reference to Satguru.
    Who is satguru being referred to.?
     
  6. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    Taranjeet singh ji

    It would be better for discussion if you described what you believe Naam Mantra and Satguru to mean.


    Here is why I say this. Naam Mantra has been translated in 2 different ways in 2 different translations on this thread. The concept one has of Naam and of Mantra is going to shape how the translator translates If we pull out 6 more translations we will have even more translations of Naam Mantra (maybe not 6 exactly, but more).

    Satguru has a different meaning depending on how closely one thinks of "guru" to the dera culture of the times of the Guru Sahibhan. There the satguru is a real person. It is unlikely that Guru Arjan dev ji was thinking of it that way because if he did, then he would be penning a poem in praise of himself. Not likely!

    We did have a old and animated conversation here once called Who Was Guru Nanak's Guru? It got nowhere.

    We all learn more if you tell us what you think these words mean first. Then we can think about it and give our own replies. Then we have a conversation instead of a deposition.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    #5 spnadmin, Aug 9, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2013
  7. Taranjeet singh

    Taranjeet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    Messages:
    451
    Likes Received:
    895
    Thanks for your reply.
    I am clueless , in so far, as to what is naam Mantra. It should be some mantra that is given by Guru to disciple for jaap or continuous recitation either loudly or in whisper.

    Satguru should refer to the Guru of Guru Arjan Dev ji i.e the fifth Mehl or it may be Akaal Purukh who give naam Manra through Guru as an intermediary.Kindly correct me.

    This is my personal thinking that may not even be remotely connected with that is correct. KIndly correct me.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    Taranjeet singh ji

    On your second point I agree that Akaal is one way of understanding the nature of the Sat Guru. However by thinking of "giving" the naam in a literal way as a mantra things go awry.

    The understanding that Naam is Sat or Truth was discerned by Guru Nanak after serious contemplation on the nature of God. His conclusion could not have come in the form of a mantra given by any particular divinity, in the way that a human guru gives a mantra to a chella. The Sat, Kartar Purakhu, Akaal of Guru Nanak does not "give" in the human sense of giving, but its gifts are disclosed in jyote (a flash of light, enlightenment, understanding).

    When I think about the "naam mantra" I go back to the tuk. Grammatically "naam" stands as the possessive even though it is not bearing a grammatical ending for the possessive case. Naam Mantra in form is much like Gur Fateh. Gur Fateh = victory is the guru's, or victory belongs to the guru. Naam Mantra = the Mantra belongs to the Naam, is a quality of the Naam, is of the Naam. This would be completely different from the idea that the naam is the mantra. Or that the naam would be repeated as a mantra.

    So what is "mantra?" In modern times we think of a mantra as a word or a formula used in prayer, meditation, usually repeated many times. It could be a sacred syllable. In ancient Sanskirt mantra refers to both the idea of "word" and the idea of "consciousness"... a word that liberates the mind so that it can become aware of something greater than its own awareness. In ritual practice that would be repeating a sacred word and syllable over and over to aid meditation, to come to consciousness through repetition of a syllable or phrase.

    In the tuk something else is going on, and it is not about the repetition of sacred syllables. Naam Mantra, in my grammatical sense of this, the mantra belongs to the naam = .... the consciousness that engulfs, enchants and then liberates the mind belongs to the Naam. Consciousness that liberates the mind belongs to the Naam whose identity is Truth (Sat Nam).

    The way to test this is to see if it fits with the overall message of the shabad. Does this liberating consciousness come from repeating a word? Or does it come to us in a different way?

    p/s It is interesting to me that Manmohan Singh translates " When the true Guru enshrined the spell (mantar) of the Name within me," ... in other words Naam casts its spell. Mantra is not the way to discover the Naam. Quite the opposite, the change in consciousness, the Mantra is the effect of Naam within. Forgive my errors.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    #7 spnadmin, Aug 10, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2013
  9. arshi

    arshi United Kingdom
    Expand Collapse
    Writer SPNer

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Messages:
    202
    Likes Received:
    488
    ਕਾਨੜਾ ਮਹਲਾ ਸਾਧ ਸਰਨਿ ਚਰਨ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਇਆਸੁਪਨ ਕੀ ਬਾਤ ਸੁਨੀ ਪੇਖੀ ਸੁਪਨਾ ਨਾਮ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਇਆ੧॥ਰਹਾਉ॥
    <?"urn:<img src=" />
    First of all I am grateful to the OP for offering me the sight <I>(darshan)</I> of this beautiful pankti. It is the first time I have looked at this shabad in such detail.

    I concur with Professor Sahib Singh ji (Guru Granth Darpan) that ‘sadh’ in this context means Guru. This gives a different complexion to the meaning of the <I>pankti</I> in question and also clarifies the meaning of ‘Satguru’.

    My interpretation of this pankti is not too different from that of Professor Sahib Singh ji. However I approached the translation in first person, primarily to convince myself of its meaning than to influence others.

    Rajinder Singh ‘Arshi’
     
    • Like Like x 2
    #8 arshi, Aug 14, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 10, 2015
  10. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200

    Yes, in the context of


    ਸਾਧ ਸਰਨਿ ਚਰਨ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਇਆ॥


    ਸਾਧ ਸਰਨਿ = sadh saran = refuge of the saints

    That is exactly how satguru is described in the context of the verse. To take refuge in the guru defines being close to the guru as a place of spiritual safety. And, the "holy" are those who know to take refuge there.

    I am not sure that was what Taranjeet ji was asking, because I had raised the point that "refuge of the saints" is important to this shabad. Taranjeet ji did not follow up. Glad you did, because it is a good way of understanding the nature of the satguru.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  11. arshi

    arshi United Kingdom
    Expand Collapse
    Writer SPNer

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Messages:
    202
    Likes Received:
    488
    As mentioned in my earlier post I translate ‘sadh’ as ‘Guru’ as opposed to ‘saints’. This has a subtle but an important impact on the interpretation. ‘Sadh saran’ therefore translates as ‘invoking the help of my Guru’.

    When I translate Gurbani, it is primarily for my own guidance, to direct me on my own path to live as per His Hukam. It is not my intention to preach or claim that my translation is better or the only one. Only Guru Nanak has the monopoly on the correct meaning/message.

    <?"urn:<img src=" />
    The following is my humble attempt at the interpretation as perceived by me. I have approached this in first person, primarily to convince myself of its meaning.There are, of course, many alternative interpretations as lack of appropriate vocabulary always complicates matters. Our earthly vocabulary is often insufficient to cater for spiritual issues. However, the important thing is to reach the right conclusion to guide one as per the individual present spiritual status.

    I have invoked my Guru’s help (or taken refuge in Guru’s Sanctuary), and through his teachings, focused myself on Lord’s feet. I had heard (from many) that this world is a dream. Since my Guru has enshrined in me His Name I am convinced the world is, indeed, nothing but a dream.

    Humbly
    Rajinder Singh ‘Arshi’
     
    • Like Like x 1
    #10 arshi, Aug 14, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 10, 2015
  12. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    Thank you for sharing once again your insight arshi ji
     
  13. findingmyway

    findingmyway
    Expand Collapse
    Writer SPNer Contributor Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2010
    Messages:
    1,667
    Likes Received:
    3,767
    My interpretation, formulated with the help of Prof Sahib Singh's darpan, with other sources of help too. Please comment if you agree or disagree.

    ਕਾਨੜਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥ Kaanraa, Fifth Mehl:

    ਸਾਧ ਸਰਨਿ ਚਰਨ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਇਆ ॥
    I completely surrender my mind to Ik Oankaar.

    ਸੁਪਨ ਕੀ ਬਾਤ ਸੁਨੀ ਪੇਖੀ ਸੁਪਨਾ ਨਾਮ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
    I equate Naam to Gurbani. So here Guru ji is saying that when the Guru's message (Naam) has been internalised and incorporated into your very core, that is when I realise that the world around me is an illusion (dream-like). This fits in with the constant message throughout the SGGS of the way duality or maya is an illusion. ||1||Pause||

    ਨਹ ਤ੍ਰਿਪਤਾਨੋ ਰਾਜ ਜੋਬਨਿ ਧਨਿ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਫਿਰਿ ਧਾਇਆ ॥
    This mind is not satisfied by power, youth and wealth. Time and again it suns after material possessions.

    ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਤ੍ਰਿਸਨਾ ਸਭ ਬੁਝੀ ਹੈ ਸਾਂਤਿ ਪਾਈ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਇਆ ॥੧॥
    When Naam is followed, the thirst for those things is quenced, the mind becomes peaceful and I find peace. ||1||

    ਬਿਨੁ ਬੂਝੇ ਪਸੂ ਕੀ ਨਿਆਈ ਭ੍ਰਮਿ ਮੋਹਿ ਬਿਆਪਿਓ ਮਾਇਆ ॥
    Without understanding of spiritual living, we stay just animals, the mind wanders and remains held by the attachment of illusion.

    ਸਾਧਸੰਗਿ ਜਮ ਜੇਵਰੀ ਕਾਟੀ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਹਜਿ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥੨॥੧੦॥
    But, Nanak tells us, joining your mind to Ik Oankaar breaks the noose of spiritual death, and the mind merges into a steady peaceful state. ||2||10||
     
    • Like Like x 2

Share This Page