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Jatts and Tharkans have a fight!

Discussion in 'Hard Talk' started by badshah, Aug 4, 2010.

  1. badshah

    badshah
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    YouTube- Jatt Vs. Tarkhaan

    "Jazz81177
    2 weeks ago
    Wow its an awesome way to explain todays situation, well its not good to discriminat other community, we are SIKH & casts are just the names for the different kinda work we do, Jatt (Farmers), Ramgarhia(Blacksmit or carpenter), Rajput (warrior) Khatri (administration) & so on...."

    TBH - we are divided without external people having to lift a finger! How on Earth do we break this divide, it seems so strong with all the internet, India and foreign Sikh dividing each other by caste. I do not see any unity ever, because there are already differentiations based on getetic stock of people marking two distinct races of people with Sikhism and now Sikhism is split.

    Its almost like being a Muslim Siat and sunnis..... whats the future for sikhs?
     
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    Heritage Who are the Jatts ਜੱਟ ? History, Culture and Controversy History of Sikhism Oct 11, 2010

  3. spnadmin

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    badshah ji

    One way would be for Jaats and other "castes" within Sikhi to stop glorifying themselves as a "race." I have noticed more and more of this on Jaat forums. So far I have not read any Tharkan forums. Probably need to do that. A basic course in population genetics or cultural anthropology might help some understand their error of thinking - but only those who find they grow when their assumptions are challenged.
     
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    #2 spnadmin, Aug 4, 2010
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  4. badshah

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    DO you have the punjab split of Sikhs by caste stats by any chance?
     
  5. spnadmin

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    badshah ji

    Not at my finger tips I don't. I do know that there are several listings/indices like this and they are not always close in estimates. To get it I would need to go back to some forum discussions on jaatworld, and there are other smaller forums, that provide some information. You could also try Wikipedia, but the problem with Wikis is that anyone can start a page and anyone can edit and that makes them unreliable.
     
  6. badshah

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    Yeah I check out Jattworld sometimes too, but the ideolgy is comparable to what the BNP is doing - a preservation of a race.

    Sikhs are in too small numbers as it is and the divisions are too great, oh well!

    The internet is so powerful that is can change people perceptions of each other, for example Jatts are considered to be an ultimate race, all are very pretty, fair skinned, very tall, handsome, tough fighters, the best. The rest are shown as being meek, black, skinny/fat a discrace to Sikhism. Although we talk about how Hindus portray Sikhs in Hindi films, what about how we portray ourselves? On the one hand you have cut hair, smoking tattoo ridden, with naked girls representing Jatts and then you have the rest as those Sikhs that the Hindi films portray....

    Now although yes we should not worry about these things about caste etc etc..... all I am pointing out is just how powerfull any type of media can be. It almost appears the new age of propoganda is so powerful through the internet that it actually works! I wouldnt be suprised if most are non-sikhs behind some of these things.... since any one behind a computer screen turns into a tough guy over night!

    Also just to point out that many companies use testimonials to get sales sales and alot of threads on the internet are testimonial for cutting hair (to get girls) and dividing sikhs and when youngsters read that kind of stuff I bet most of them are heavely effected by what is written.
     
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  7. spnadmin

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    The part that echoes in the back of my mind is the idea of a pure martial race. Who else said that? Not that long ago? And the same one despised darker people? And the same one also claimed ancestry from the Aryan migrations from the central plains of Asia into northern India and then to Europe? It is not a good scene to get into. But I think that some of this is actually innocent though it has tough implications.

    Any kind of bitterness and exclusivity among Sikhs is not good for us.
     
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  8. kds1980

    kds1980 India
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    Division is in the nature of Humans.We humans just need anything to boost our ego.even educated people have ego of their education.What is happening in sikhism is quite sad
     
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  9. ugsbay

    ugsbay United Kingdom
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    SSA.
    Narayanjot ji that description sounds like the views of "David Duke" i think, he was or still is the head member of the Klu klux Klan.
     
  10. badshah

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    The only problem with celebrating ancestary is that I bet half the people who talk about this elitness or Greek God like bodies and bravado does not actually exist - is this called maya... I dont know?

    I can bet you that majority of the people who write on Jatt world do not resemble this super hero Jatt that they all talk about..... since this now diverges on to genetics I can tell you that I have seen Chamars, Tharkans, Khatris and others that have these imaginary Jatt traits..... and often get msitaken for Jatts because only Jatts are suppose to have those characteristics for some reason.

    Another pathetic thing that is being preached on Jatt world is that Jatts come from I think Russian origin and the Indian SIkhs are from Hindu stock of genetics so are a weaker race...... I don't think Hindus could fight in epic battles such as Mahabarata if they had weak genetics. I think people are confused slightly because Jatts probably had very good physiques due to working the land but nowadays especially in the West for those Jatts who get themselves good educations will have different builds due to reading books all day and therefore different body.........

    I have also fallen for this rubbish through being brain washed that Jatts are some super gene human race and had a bit of a shock when I went to a wedding some time ago. All the people there were very wealthy and in the group of people that I was talking to they were all Jatt and then I got introduced to some really wealthy rich business guy just to bounce some ideas off him and he was just like the other Jatt, tall, good build, lot of money. Then the next day when I asked my dad about the Jatt I was talking to, he said he is not Jatt but a Chamar and has worked really hard to get where he is. Just goes to show that we are all brainwashed by these sterotypes of people! However I do not think Jatt world is doing Jatt people a favour because their fantasy genetics are not seen amongst the overall population, you only have to go to Singh Sabha gurudwara to see people come in all sorts of colours, shapes and sizes too and not all the people walking in to do mata taek look like Arnold Schwarzengger.

    So although these posts can wind me up, its not actually that bad in the real world which goes back to my point at just how powerful the internet is and how we should use it to make good of things.
     
  11. spnadmin

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    Jaat bashing would not be helpful either. Just more discrimination, only in reverse. It would be more helpful if divisions within the Siikh quom were understood in light of their historical causes. Until we can do that we will never be able to appreciate the value of diversity, as an opportunity to learn from others and from their point of view. Certainly that Jaat vs Tharkan division is only one example of how much learning we have left to do.

    The people who are advocating Russian origins of the Jaats are a bit mixed up. There are several theories - and they are only theories of the origins of the Jaats. None of these theories can be proved scientifically because of the diverse gene pool of Northern India, the result of many waves of invasion from the north. By Russian, what they really mean is Scythian. The Scythian hypothesis is one that historians do debate. These peoples were a nomadic and war-like culture that inhabited the steppes of central Asia in what once once the Soviet Union. That is where the Russian connection comes in, but not really. The Scythians BTW roamed over a very wide area and are also believed to be the ancestors of more than only the Jaats.
     
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    #10 spnadmin, Aug 5, 2010
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  12. badshah

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    Yeahh but sterotypes are so engrained in our people for some reason:

    Jatts - love to fight
    Tharkans - stingy, dont spend money
    Khatris - satanic, stuck-up
    Chamars/Churays - well hey just got stigma attched to them which just does net get shaken off

    I have noticed though money and education does seem to break these barriers, if you have plenty money then you bypass alot of these things
     
    #11 badshah, Aug 5, 2010
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  13. spnadmin

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    badshah ji

    On your last point- I am not in a position to really know. Take your word. I am aware that the Jaat/Tharkan animosities are extreme in the UK, and the reason for more than one forced marriage arranged to break up a budding but forbidden inter-caste romance.
     

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