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Discussion in 'Love & Marriage' started by manmohini, Jun 18, 2004.
What are your opinions...
Dear Khalsa Jee,
The answer to the question you have posed depends on your answer to the question ‘Why are you getting married’. However, I give below my response.
The relation between male and female existed ever since the two sexes came into existence. In this premise, there is no choice to be made. It is a natural process. This is what happens in animal kingdom.
The institution of marriage existed in ancient days, much before formal religion came into existence. From this we can say that relationship between two sexes is more fundamental than religion, consequently, religion of the potential spouse should not matter in such selections. This was the case in primitive societies.
In today’s world, we have formal religion, institution of marriage and we are living in knowledge age. There is a purpose behind each marriage; it is not just a natural growth. We all have fundamental right to happiness. We all know that we are the architects of our own future. The selection of spouse is a serous matter; marriage is a one-way process.
Happiness is what one wants most from marriage. It comes if love exists in married life. In the institution of marriage, love is expressed through caring and sharing. This can happen naturally i.e. without deliberate effort, if the values of the two individuals who are married to each other are common. There is more possibility of this happening if the two individuals who are getting married to each other are the followers of the same religion, belongs to the same culture, speak the same language and have similar family background.
If you are a Sikh, there is more possibility that your marriage will be happy if your spouse too happens to be a Sikh.
These are my views on the question you have posed. Marriage is a very personal matter each individual has to decide on its own.
With love and respect for all.
Why religion is so much important in life ? Isn't religion a sort of personal thing ?
that's probably exactly why religion is so important in one's life... because it's so personal.
religion is something that affects everyone deeply, whether they'd like to admit it or not. religion is belief at it's very core.
I believe its ok to marry a non-Sikh.
Some people claim its not, but yet I refute it with the same arguments I refute the inter-caste marriages. Are inter-religious marriages not holding the same boundary?
People say, marry a Sikh because he/she will be raised in a similar way, so its easy for you to adapt to each other.
Jatts claim marry another Jatt because of that SAME EXACT REASON.
Where do we draw the line?
Marriage is about comprimise, and making ends meet. If your a sardar, and another girl from a different religion falls for you, you already know she respects sikhi and is willing to learn, and if she fell in love with your turban and dhari, I'm sure she will want her sons to keep the same. Also she loves your personality, which alot of it is due out of respect and humbleness for Sikhi.
Inter-religious marriages arent bad, if there done for the right reasons.
If you were to give up your outlook and then chase girls, the most likely reason you would marry someone non-sikh is because their "hot". For reasons like those, I oppose marriage of that sort. If you see the beauty in someone and her humbleness to any religion regardless of race, caste, then go ahead, she will respect Sikhi.
Now if a girl wants to marry a boy thats non-sikh, it can draw up harder circumstances. Since girls dont have the same outlook as guys (assuming you dont wear a keski) then the guy may not respect sikhi as much as he does your "hotness".
But I do believe the boundaries of race, and religion are passable in marriage.
Marry a Sikh because you were raised similar to other sikhs?
Thats a pretty lame reason to marry someone, the caste-lovers use the same reason to marry inter-castes.
They key factor is, are you sure your future spouse respects sikhi enough to raise your children as proper sikhs? Are you sure she will stand by your side when situations arise where sikhi must come first and the ultimate sacrifice must be laid? Will she understand when your children come home crying from school about being picked on for their turbans? Or will she say its not that important and to go ahead and get rid of them?
Do not only ask these questions to your future non-sikh spouse, but also if you come across a future sikh-spouse. Many "Sikhs" are merely ethnic-Sikhs and will answer the above questions wrong.
I would like to know your views if the situation was vice versa... I mean a girl is Sikh and the boy is of any other religions. What are your views then ?
It would be too impractical for raising children. For example, you marry a Hindu girl and she wants the kids to learn and practise her religion, would you then tell the kids to go and bow to idols in the Mandir and then Guru Ji in the Gurudwara? Might be too confusing for them I think.
A girl is Sikh, and by this I am assuming you mean she doesnt wear a keski so there is no outlook that one can immediately recognize as being a Sikh. Her hair may be tied up.
If a boy is of another religion and both are at a respectable age, and he is a follower of his current faith, and knows about sikhi and respects the girl for being sikh. He also sees her family is a sikhi practicing family, and she would also like her kids to be raised sikhi, and he doesnt mind, then i have no problem with it.
But that is a very idealistic situation.
What commonly happens is, the boy finds the sikh girl "hot" and it starts from there. He then fakes her into loving her, just to get "some"
If the girl is 16 and she thinks shes in love with a white guy whose changed her life, then I would not accept it as true. We all know how its like to be 16 and around girls.
Factors for a girl need to be taken in include the boys own strength towards his own faith, and his acceptance of others, and his wishing to learn more about sikhi. I would say its harder for a girl to see through it, since some boys would fake the learning just to "love" the girl. This is all to be taken into concern, if the girl wants her kid to be raised as Sikhs. If she does not love sikhi, and is only born sikh, then it shouldnt matter at all.
You see what I mean?
In todays society, the girl-situation would be alot harder to analyze and accept as to the boys. I do accept girls that do it, but if they know what there doing and for the right reasons, and I assume I would want the girls to hold off a bit longer until they are more certain that the boy is true.
In the end its a much harder situation, but I will not completely go against it.
Please read first post on this topic.
When you mention "impractical for raising children" this is the same exact reason our parents give for inter-caste marriages.
And besides, it is possible, if one practices sikhi and the other falls in love with it, and also practices it and wants to raise the kids up as sikhs, there is nothing wrong with it.
What your basically saying is that Sikhs should only marry born-Sikhs.
With that statement, it gives the term "Sikh" a race, and a country, something Guru Nanak said Sikhs should have no alliance to.
I didnt say they should marry only 'born-Sikhs'. That's your own assumption Im afraid. If the partner adopted Sikhi, then there is nothing wrong with it, but these issues should be cleared before planning a family, because it wouldn't be fair to confuse a child.
Also, its traditional for the children to follow the father's religion, Im not saying it's right or wrong, it's just the norm for some cultures. So, that should be taken into consideration.
I definitely agree !!
I am in agreement with what our member Saihajleen has said. in my posting above # 2 in this thread I have mentioned the requirements for happy married life, here I go beyound the couple and talk about children.
As parents we have two responsibilities towards our children. (i) one is to give them anchor so that they can stay in place when the difficulties are faced in life and (ii) to give them wings so that they can soar andreach heights in life. If the husband and wife have two different sets of values coming from two different religions, which in many cases may be contradictory, the children will not be able to choose and become confused. As a result the parents will not be able to give one coherent set of values and beliefs to the children, which may be detrimental to the future welbeing of their children. It is because of this logic that I agree with Saihajleen.
With Love and Respect for all.
I think that if a couple has different views of religion (or politics or any other issue) and still are able to live in a loving and mutually respectful relationship, that may be a very positive situation for the children. They will learn to make up their own minds, and find a solution which is acceptable to themselves as well as to all the family. The children will know that no one has forced them into a certain belief, and will be confident in facing challenges or discussions on those matters.
This is of course an ideal situation, and there will often be unsolveable differences between partners in even minute details of the same creed. But I think that no outsider can set a firm rule for other people's marriages. It is up to the persons concerned if they can accept their partner's beliefs. With the inherent tolerance of Sikhism, I suppose that it will depend on the non-Sikh partner.
I dont find anything wrong if one marries non-sikh, as long as the couple's happiness graph rises upwards with passing time, and they are willing to tackle the present and future issues normally people have due to different culture, upbringing, education, sensitivity levels, place, or shall I now say gender too.
There is nothing wrong in marrying a non-sikh. I also agree that no one from out side has any right to force in issues like marriage. I also agree that the couple belonging to different religion are able to pull through life, there is no doubt about it. As long as the life is limited to the two marrying each other, there is aboslutely nothing wrong in individuals belonging to different religion marrying each other.
Problem is when you go beyond the couple, the children and the families of the either spouse. Problems are in this area. The basic fromatting of the child brain takes place in first three years of life and the child is ready to accept relatively higher learning i.e. what in India we call 'samskaras', then up to seven or so the values gets fully inculcated in the child. This is not the age where child can decide for itself what is right and what is wrong, the mental development is as a result of the infuence that the environment has on it in which it lives. If the child gets contradictory values from the parants, the cild will be confused.
Difficulties also crop up in adjusting to the elders in the family also, this I say from experience in the families I know.
When two individuals belonging to different religion marry each other, the degree of adjustment needed is relatively higher, more compromises will be needed as compared to the two belonging to the same religion.
This does not mean that individuals belonging to different religions should not marry. It is only to say that there is greater probability of the life to be relatively easier and happier if the two belong to same religion. Again I make a statement that all this is not absolute and many possibilities exist.
With Love and Respect for all.
maarying a non sikh (girls point of view)
After reading the above post I got curious and asked one of my sikh sister that what does she think of this, and the reply what i got i m pasting here with her permission
By Keerat Kaur:
Marryinr someone out of caste doesnt mean givin up on your religion !!!!
Its all about ur understandin n willingness to adjust with the other
culture .... u just become enriched n more knowledgable if u shun your orthodox outlook n for a change think that some other religion might have
something that just might make sense to u also. And as far as i have seen ... n understood .. what is written in their scriptures n ours is not very
different... Most of the things are same ..Just that ppl have forgotten
the essence of religion n more bend towards the ritualistic aspect of it.
what is more important ... loving god n feelin near him ... or followin
all the stupid rituals n havin no sense at all what it feels to b with
what it feels to feel his mercy on u.. what it feels to just love him
That should be the real aim of ones life ..not just pointin at others n
attackin them for not followin a certain code!!!
What dou think??
Marrying non-sikhs: Please offer opinions
Let me paint you my picture. I would love feedback from any and all, please read on ...
I am a non-practicing Sikh who inhertied her background and "religion" from her parents. I do not practice all activities and duties of sikhism, in fact some may dispute whether I am a true sikh - however, I have respect for the faith, and those that practice it completely.
I have fallen in love with a man who is a non-sikh, and who is white, as there is a difference in accepting each. We are deeply in love and intend to spend the rest of our lives together. He believes in God, although does not follow a set religion. I can honestly say that neither do I. I take from structured religion what I want and then make the rest my own. He is completely the same and is learning about Sikhism as his own wish. He respects me and all that I have come from, and also respects the sacrifices that my predecessors have made.
Because I have the intention of being with this man for the rest of my lives, and because I want to have children with him, am I a bad person by definition of sikhism? Is that faith not accepting of all? Does it not encourage equality between genders? Is it not accepting of other religions?
Our children will not be confused: the only reason why children would be confused is if their parents did not teach their child about all the faiths from an early age. There is an abundance of culture out there, why not give your child the gift of knowledge? My children will know about my ancestors' heritage, as will they know about the history of their father's ancestors. If you look deep down inside, we all have the same red liquid running through our veins, we are all the same. It is up to people, as indivduals and as groups, if they want to assign labels to others.
Holding people so tightly in your hand will only diminish who they are, or cause them to rebel. I intend to be neither, least of all the latter. I am still growing as a person at my age, as is my partner, but we are both going in the same direction. Our souls are bound, and were bound before we met. It is a changing world, religion is being held onto too tightly in its oldest form, that it isn't allowed to adapt to society. Our religion was borne a long time ago, it is up to the individual to adapt it to their lifestyle and to carrying their love for God into the next generation.
The tone of this discussion is not meant to be angry or argumentative, I am merely tired of the narrow-minded view of some people: All people are beautiful. Please, I would love all your views, questions and comments.
Dear Singhni ji,
Welcome to the discussion forum.
Answer to your queries is already contained in replies by Amarpal ji, in this thread.
Re: Is it okay to marry a non-sikh ?
Curious in England - very inspiring post and the main comment I wish to make on this issue, that I do support inter-religious marriage to an extent, but not when both partners are devout because if they do have kids their will be problems in the religious department, but if one is devout and one isn't then it is ok because then the non-devout one is likely to be ok with the children being a different religion. So if both partners are devout then a lot of reasoning needs to be done.
Re: Is it okay to marry a non-sikh ?
Well what I think is there is nothing in your story that make me feel that you are bad in defination of sikhism . and I agre with you that sikhism is all accepting in term of gender , race, religion ...
About the confusion in you r children I cant say it can be either way no body knows what will happen but you can hope for the best as devout parent does not gurrenty their the same in their life
Now about aim of persons life and love with fellow human
I have some veiw which may appear absurd and forgive me if they offend you as they are not mean to be
What I think is it is almost immpossible for one human to love other in a sense that we hardly are anything that is constant I mean human is just reflection of collected thoughts , practices , beliefs acquired culturally educationally and through our enviorment there is hardly anything in a human personality that really belongs to him it is all aquired things so when we talk of live even soul bondage it is generally more about these things , That is we actually love a person in a form of set of particular aquired personality he has it hardly belongs to him ( Most of it is aquired from others and enviornment ) and more important this is subject to change with time and situation in life and so is you r love to that person . So practically it is quite difficult to love a person whole your life as their is nothing definate( constant) you can stick to it is all changing world
Whwn we talk about loving a person and spending our whole life with one person actually we are talking about something that is constant in him or her all his life or just a blind bondage that you will love him or her no matter how much change occur in his personality ( and this is definately not love but a commitment ) but any way any thing is possible
Now what I presume or you can say that I think is that what we can love in a person is a thng which really exist at the first place and a thing which you can really rely upon and for my understanding it is love for GOD or you can say SPIRTUALITY
Becvause I have no doubt about the exsistance of god ( At least most of the time )
and it is constant thing you can stick to in you r life no matter what happens
For this I am not saying that sikhism is the only way by any means infact there are many ways and it all depends on gods will which way you choose
So as you said you both have believe in god and are kind of spirtual so think there should not be any trouble in you r relation and it hardly matters if you are sikh aor not
But offcourse from my personal experience in Sikhism It can help you both very well if you are willing to give it a serious go.
Any way Best of luck and Best wishes from me