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How does a Scientist and Saint differ? From Sikh point of view by Maskeen ji

Discussion in 'Sikh Sikhi Sikhism' started by Harpreetsingh492, Aug 21, 2014.

  1. Harpreetsingh492

    Harpreetsingh492
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    To begin with quotes from Gur Granth Sahib ji by Guru Ramdas:

    Piyo daade ka khol deetha khazana,

    Tan mere man pye nidhana,

    To understand, anything and everything in true manner, one has to read, and understand Gurbaani. Gurbaani is like a box full of treasuries in order to fulfill desires,or get answers to your questions, one has to open the box. The key to the Gurbaani are the words, understanding there right meanings, will open the oceans of knowledge.

    Gurmukh har gun gaye,

    Hirdhe rusna rasye,


    Science and religion are related to, connection of two parts of our body is important, for science its the linking of our brain with eyes (Vision) and for religion it's linking our heart with tongue. Even animals have eyes, they are not scientists. All humans have eyes but we not all of us become scientists.

    What do scientists do or How they differ from common man?

    A scientist connects his eyes (visual world) to his brain, more than a normal person does, as he delves or concentrates deeper on matter, he finds the laws it's obeying and then later, using those laws he can transform or change any form of matter the way he wishes to. He may transform the material for money like an engineer does or for other comforts. Take a look at history, you want much scientist on the list who were blind by birth. If a person can't see the matter, how will he make observations and draw conclusions. Scientist do effect it's surroundings, In European countries such vibrant environment for scientists is present. That's why they have lead in innovations.


    What a Saint do?

    A saint connects his tongue( Vocal) to his heart (emotions), more than a normal person does, as he concentrates deeper on the (Naam) words that he or she sings, one can find the true meaning of his life, and achieves peace of mind, a similar vibrant environment is also created around him too, and the radiations that he spreads can eventually make difference in surroundings. Earlier days, we could find Saints in a Punjab's village but now one in 1000 villages. Now, Take a look at religions history ,you won't find any single case for dumb person being a Saint.
    Often people ask what should they think or what picture should they have in mind while mediating. The answer is, we don't have to keep any picture in mind, one has to try and concentrate or listen to what he or she is singing. Gradually with time of practice one can go deeper.

    As long as a scientist could connect eyes (Visual) to his brain more and more he would go deeper and find greatest laws of nature. If he looks up in sky, his thinking or brain will take him beyond our planet, sun, solar system and galaxies etc. Or if he looks deeper into matter he finds the quantum particles, and numerous forces governing the universe.


    Who are the greatest scientists of the world ?

    The person who is able to connect eyes or vision more to his brain.


    Basic difference in a scientist and saint lies in transformation, a scientist would transform a matter into the way he feels like or according to his comfort but in case of saint he has to transform himself the way God is. A scientist even if he discovers something, he would remain unsatisfied and always unfinished, there would always be trouble in his mind. But a saint may not have all worldly things in his hand but he will always be calm, relaxed, blessed and mentally free.


    Scientist have stepping stones, already built base from which he builds next step for science. If you don't have Galileo, Newton, Einstein or Stephen, than it's difficult for science to reach where it's today and make new discoveries. A scientist uses the knowledge of previous scientists, and then processed to research, it's not possible to go ahead on your own. A Space scientist can neither ignore Newton's laws nor Einsteins theories.

    While it's not the case with religious practices, each saint or practitioner has to make his own way, and no one else could simply copy that to his life.

    Bhagat Ravi das ji,

    Jiyon jas manjhe machilo, marg pekhuna na jae,

    Jiyo akashe pankhiyalo, khoj nirkho na jae,


    Like a fish diving in sea, has no specified path to travel, as it moves the way is formed. Similar to a bird flying up in sky.

    Jo praani Gobind diyaave,

    Padeyan Unpad parm gat paaave,


    In religion, there is no compulsion to have previous knowledge, saints like Kabir, Nand Lal, Ravidas, didn't have access to Upanishads,Vedas (Religious texts). All doors of temples wer closed and they were not even allowed to listen religious prayers, if they did, they would be punished. Punishments like removing the ear drums turning them permanent deaf, these are such unfair practices, those prevailed in Ram Raaj too, historians and readers today get shocked when they read about these incidents were present in Ram Raaj.

    All the doors being closed, so they opened the doors of their hearts and became great saints.


    In both the fields hard work is required. In order to find diamonds, Gold one has to dig deeper in earth, on the top there is dust, etc. Similarly, In order to feel as God, one has mediate deep in to Naam ( Words), on the top of human mind there is greed, lust, anger. There is no compulsion of singing or concentrating on which word (Naam) of God, one can choose any like Waheguru, Allah, Ram or any other name because God has no particular name.


    Giving your all or best in science world may result in tiredness, stress because our brain has limit to work. But in religious practice, one can feel as light as flower or feel the true freedom of mind.


    There can be a state that both a scientist and saint could come across.

    Let us take an example when Einstein was doing experimenting on his research to get the right results. He tried 700 times and failed, his assistants, coordinating with him said to him that we are diverting away from the results they are looking for. But Einstein said, we are coming close to results. adding to this he said at least i won't do 700 mistakes again. Such was his level of dedication and didn't loose his confidence and but rather motivated more to carry on his work.

    When a scientist or religious gets upset of not getting any fruitful results, consequences can be that he may remain stuck in the same problem or way and he may even give up. Many coordinators with Einstein left him.

    In case of religion, after long hard work or practice, he can turn to be non-believer or usually remain stuck on their way. At this point in religion one has make a request (Ardas) and has to agree,

    I have tried as hard, as i could to find you, but couldn't find you. I have walked as long as i couldn't locate you. Now, God you help me, you find me. This is because, if you find God by your hard work, then your hard work is of greater importance than God. If your eyes, ears could sense the God presence then your senses would be more powerful than the God.

    A saint would say, I have found God not because of my hard work but by his love, God grace or by Almighty wish.

    Ghalle na milyo, seu na milyo,

    Milya achinchet,


    A scientist won't agree to this, what not because of my hard work, not because of my brain, he would think this is nonsense.


    Today, In all places, we could find scientists, engineers, doctors but not saints.

    As the science knowledge is being more and more imparted on children's in schools and colleges, we see more and more scientist, doctor's engineers than in previous centuries. Earlier we saw saints in a Punjab's village but now one in 1000 villages.Today's education system has neglected religious studies. Religious studies are given least importance. Rather science and religions has to go side by side.



    This is because as the world is developing, the world is loosing emotions, becoming less caring to family, individuals are busy in collecting wealth. A western said, Indians are very emotional, they start crying in weddings, when leaving to another place. The thing is, in the west emotions fading away or love in families is diminished, divorce cases on the same day of marriages, father and wife both are busy earning more and more money, kids are raised by babysitters. No personal or family attachment left, separate from parents.


    There is also a another reason, in a science world, a scientist accepts if he couldn't find what he was suppose to, because he has to prove or show it to fellow scientists. But in a religious world is full of lies, but in most of the cases cults are not ready to accept, and keep claiming themselves to be saints. If a flower says, that he is a flower, then consider it to be paper flower. A flower doesn't have to tell that he's a flower.



    To listen From Maskeen ji, follow the link,
    http://www.gurmatveechar.com/audios/...ar.Gun.Gae.mp3
     
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    #1 Harpreetsingh492, Aug 21, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 27, 2014
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  3. aristotle

    aristotle
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    You could post the Gurbani tuks in Gurmukhi alongwith the page number so that it is possible for readers to reference the whole Shabad. Also, it would be good if you could post the rahau tuk or atleast a whole tuk, instead of half-tuks, otherwise it is just rhetoric.
    Thank You...:)
     
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  4. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Harpreetsingh492 ji,

    Guru Fateh.

    I am also waiting what Aristotle ji requested you so we can make this thread interesting and fruitful for all.
     
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  5. japjisahib04

    japjisahib04 Kuwait
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    I think above pankti has been misunderstood by Maskeen Jee and even you. If you look at the rahao pankti of this sabd you will find, 'ਜਾ ਕਉ ਆਇਓ ਏਕੁ ਰਸਾ ॥ ਖਾਨ ਪਾਨ ਆਨ ਨਹੀ ਖੁਧਿਆ ਤਾ ਕੈ ਚਿਤਿ ਨ ਬਸਾ ॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ it is referred to Manh ki matt which is fixed on self and self only and when you reflect this on 'ਘਾਲ ਨ ਮਿਲਿਓ ਸੇਵ ਨ ਮਿਲਿਓ ਮਿਲਿਓ ਆਇ ਅਚਿੰਤਾ ॥ the interpretation changes that any struggle or karm kand with divineless mind and walk against the will of God it brings no fruit except by sehj or contentment.
     
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  6. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Sorry to say but Maskeen ji has been wrong in many of his kathas. This is what happens when people are not curious at all to learn Gurbani on their own but depend on others to tell them. When one shuns one's own duty as a Sikh, one is likely to become a parrot of meaningless rituals waiting for the miracles to happen.

    Having said that, Maskeen ji helped many like myself to delve deeper into Gurbani on my own and I will always be grateful for that. He did a lot of good for Sikhi.
     
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