• Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
    Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
    Sign up Log in

japjisahib04

Mentor
SPNer
Jan 22, 2005
822
1,294
kuwait
I posed this question directly to Maskin ji when he came to Kuwait. He said you can eat, gurbani does not stop us. He himself used to eat, but 2/3 years before his death he stop eating.
Regards sahni
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
May 25, 2005
2,935
2,949
55
United Kingdom
I posed this question directly to Maskin ji when he came to Kuwait. He said you can eat, gurbani does not stop us. He himself used to eat, but 2/3 years before his death he stop eating.
Regards sahni

Thanks for the answer. I just found out last night myself from my Mum. She knows people who were his neighbours and friends and can confirm what you said. I don't know whether he stopped eating though.:happy:
 

mein murakh

SPNer
Dec 2, 2008
7
1
sad:shock: only for the sake of taste u r :advocate:advocating. don`t take the meaning of gurbani in lightly. "log jaane eh geet hai eh to barahm bichaar" the first lesson for the lokaaee from the GOD BY THE WAY OF G.NANAK JI was "daeyaa kapah santokh soot........sat watt" think without mercy how one can become the part of GOD" its the first step of humanity and without the base whole concept will colapse which is showing.
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jul 4, 2004
7,708
14,381
75
KUALA LUMPUR MALAYSIA
People swear by "Amrtisari Daal"..Makhni Daal..Mahan dee daal of Guru Ka Langgar Harmandir Sahib Amritsar..sarson da saag makee dee roti...kapurthala de channeh/samosa....etc etc etc etc...places all over the world are FAMOUS for certain culinary "specials"........ all due to "TASTE" and TASTE ONLY.
The "anti-meat" lobby always lumps it all on "Jeebh da swaad"/taste etc..as IF the Daal eaters eat daal simply because it tastes AWFUL ( that would be punishing the body ??? just like the "brahmgianis" standing on one leg...standing in freezing waters in the depth of winter...simply to prove their devotion to God ??. Dont they add salt/spices/onions and stuff to their DAAL to make it TASTE better/palatable ?? Dont they eat tarrka daal ?? Why Tarrka the Saag/Daal ? IF NOT for TASTE ??
Height of absurdity/hypocracy !!
Gyani jarnail Singh:inca:
 

spnadmin

1947-2014 (Archived)
SPNer
Jun 17, 2004
14,500
19,219
Gianni ji

It is too early in the morning over here for me to be laughing as hard as I am :D Nonetheless, laughter is good for the soul.

:)
 

pk70

Writer
SPNer
Feb 25, 2008
1,582
627
USA
People swear by "Amrtisari Daal"..Makhni Daal..Mahan dee daal of Guru Ka Langgar Harmandir Sahib Amritsar..sarson da saag makee dee roti...kapurthala de channeh/samosa....etc etc etc etc...places all over the world are FAMOUS for certain culinary "specials"........ all due to "TASTE" and TASTE ONLY.
The "anti-meat" lobby always lumps it all on "Jeebh da swaad"/taste etc..as IF the Daal eaters eat daal simply because it tastes AWFUL ( that would be punishing the body ??? just like the "brahmgianis" standing on one leg...standing in freezing waters in the depth of winter...simply to prove their devotion to God ??. Dont they add salt/spices/onions and stuff to their DAAL to make it TASTE better/palatable ?? Dont they eat tarrka daal ?? Why Tarrka the Saag/Daal ? IF NOT for TASTE ??
Height of absurdity/hypocracy !!
Gyani jarnail Singh:inca:

Gyani ji welcome back again !
If I listen to you, what I will do with the following Guru Vakas where Guru ji himself calls meat"a chaska" why he doesn't call "daal" a chaska, reasonable answer will be appreciated. Mind it, I feel, if some eat meat, it doesn't make them sinners, it is a choice of food. So dont think for a second that I am promoting any thing, just questioning your anology in context of hypocrisy:)
ਰਸੁ ਸੁਇਨਾ ਰਸੁ ਰੁਪਾ ਕਾਮਣਿ ਰਸੁ ਪਰਮਲ ਕੀ ਵਾਸੁ
Ras su▫inā ras rupā kāmaṇ ras parmal kī vās.
The pleasure of gold, pleasure of silvers and damsels, pleasure of fragrance of sandal,

ਰਸੁ ਘੋੜੇ ਰਸੁ ਸੇਜਾ ਮੰਦਰ ਰਸੁਮੀਠਾਰਸੁਮਾਸੁ
Ras gẖoṛe ras sejā manḏar ras mīṯẖā ras mās.
pleasure of horses, pleasure of common cushion with a houri and a palace, pleasure of sweets and pleasure of meats,
(
ARENT they special and not common as availability of “tarke dee daal?)
ਏਤੇ ਰਸ ਸਰੀਰ ਕੇ ਕੈ ਘਟਿ ਨਾਮ ਨਿਵਾਸੁ
Ėṯe ras sarīr ke kai gẖat nām nivās. ||2||
So many are the relishes of the human body. How can then God's Name secure an abode within the heart?
Isn't it all about going out of track while going deep into mind fulfilling tastes regardless how these tastes are taken on as priority? I feel both sides in favor of meat or apposing it, often miss the point Guru ji expressing it.
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
May 25, 2005
2,935
2,949
55
United Kingdom
sad:shock: only for the sake of taste u r :advocate:advocating. don`t take the meaning of gurbani in lightly. "log jaane eh geet hai eh to barahm bichaar" the first lesson for the lokaaee from the GOD BY THE WAY OF G.NANAK JI was "daeyaa kapah santokh soot........sat watt" think without mercy how one can become the part of GOD" its the first step of humanity and without the base whole concept will colapse which is showing.

Here we go again *Yawn* :rolleyes:
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
May 25, 2005
2,935
2,949
55
United Kingdom
Gyani ji welcome back again !
If I listen to you, what I will do with the following Guru Vakas where Guru ji himself calls meat"a chaska" why he doesn't call "daal" a chaska, reasonable answer will be appreciated. Mind it, I feel, if some eat meat, it doesn't make them sinners, it is a choice of food. So dont think for a second that I am promoting any thing, just questioning your anology in context of hypocrisy:)
ਰਸੁ ਸੁਇਨਾ ਰਸੁ ਰੁਪਾ ਕਾਮਣਿ ਰਸੁ ਪਰਮਲ ਕੀ ਵਾਸੁ
Ras su▫inā ras rupā kāmaṇ ras parmal kī vās.
The pleasure of gold, pleasure of silvers and damsels, pleasure of fragrance of sandal,

ਰਸੁ ਘੋੜੇ ਰਸੁ ਸੇਜਾ ਮੰਦਰ ਰਸੁਮੀਠਾਰਸੁਮਾਸੁ
Ras gẖoṛe ras sejā manḏar ras mīṯẖā ras mās.
pleasure of horses, pleasure of common cushion with a houri and a palace, pleasure of sweets and pleasure of meats,
(
ARENT they special and not common as availability of “tarke dee daal?)
ਏਤੇ ਰਸ ਸਰੀਰ ਕੇ ਕੈ ਘਟਿ ਨਾਮ ਨਿਵਾਸੁ
Ėṯe ras sarīr ke kai gẖat nām nivās. ||2||
So many are the relishes of the human body. How can then God's Name secure an abode within the heart?
Isn't it all about going out of track while going deep into mind fulfilling tastes regardless how these tastes are taken on as priority? I feel both sides in favor of meat or apposing it, often miss the point Guru ji expressing it.


Depends where you live. If you are an Eskimo or are a hunter gatherer, then daal would be worth it's weight in gold and the taste of it heavenly (which it is).

The shabad you have picked out is a metaphor about attachment. I for example am attached to "white channay" (just cannot stop eating them), and they make me very windy :D

Also please share page numbers with us so we may examine entire shabads.
 

pk70

Writer
SPNer
Feb 25, 2008
1,582
627
USA
Randip Singh ji
Question was asked to Gyani ji particularly, not in context of a debate about meat at all, I wonder what you want to say or prove;)
The quote is on 15 SGGS Ji
The metaphorical approach here is not applicable in context of the stuff that is pointed out by Guru ji. The people who are non Vegetarian and who are Vegetarian have a problem, they just jump on thins without even thinking that question is not even asked about meat eating or not eating. To be honest with you, personally I didn’t expect it from you. Thanks for trying, my question still remains unanswered.:)
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
May 25, 2005
2,935
2,949
55
United Kingdom
Randip Singh ji
Question was asked to Gyani ji particularly, not in context of a debate about meat at all, I wonder what you want to say or prove;)
The quote is on 15 SGGS Ji
The metaphorical approach here is not applicable in context of the stuff that is pointed out by Guru ji. The people who are non Vegetarian and who are Vegetarian have a problem, they just jump on thins without even thinking that question is not even asked about meat eating or not eating. To be honest with you, personally I didn’t expect it from you. Thanks for trying, my question still remains unanswered.:)

Can you put the page number for the shabad you posted please.

Look, all I am saying is, that is the Land of Sugar, where only sugar is available, sugar would be seen as a worthless commodity, and the taste would lose its appeal. The man who sold salt in the land of sugar would surely be king?

In other words, regardless of what food we eat, we are a slave to taste.
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
May 25, 2005
2,935
2,949
55
United Kingdom
Randip Singh ji
Question was asked to Gyani ji particularly, not in context of a debate about meat at all, I wonder what you want to say or prove;)
The quote is on 15 SGGS Ji
The metaphorical approach here is not applicable in context of the stuff that is pointed out by Guru ji. The people who are non Vegetarian and who are Vegetarian have a problem, they just jump on thins without even thinking that question is not even asked about meat eating or not eating. To be honest with you, personally I didn’t expect it from you. Thanks for trying, my question still remains unanswered.:)



Look, all I am saying is, that is the Land of Sugar, where only sugar is available, sugar would be seen as a worthless commodity, and the taste would lose its appeal. The man who sold salt in the land of sugar would surely be king?

In other words, regardless of what food we eat, we are a slave to taste.

Lets put the entire shabad up:

Page 15, Line 9
ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ ਮਹਲਾ ੧ ॥
सिरीरागु महला १ ॥
Sirīrāg mėhlā 1.
Siree Raag, First Mehl:
view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 9
ਲਬੁ ਕੁਤਾ ਕੂੜੁ ਚੂਹੜਾ ਠਗਿ ਖਾਧਾ ਮੁਰਦਾਰੁ ॥
लबु कुता कूड़ु चूहड़ा ठगि खाधा मुरदारु ॥
Lab kuṯā kūṛ cẖūhṛā ṯẖag kẖāḏẖā murḏār.
Greed is a dog; falsehood is a filthy street-sweeper. Cheating is eating a rotting carcass.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 10
ਪਰ ਨਿੰਦਾ ਪਰ ਮਲੁ ਮੁਖ ਸੁਧੀ ਅਗਨਿ ਕ੍ਰੋਧੁ ਚੰਡਾਲੁ ॥
पर निंदा पर मलु मुख सुधी अगनि क्रोधु चंडालु ॥
Par ninḏā par mal mukẖ suḏẖī agan kroḏẖ cẖandāl.
Slandering others is putting the filth of others into your own mouth. The fire of anger is the outcaste who burns dead bodies at the crematorium.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 10
ਰਸ ਕਸ ਆਪੁ ਸਲਾਹਣਾ ਏ ਕਰਮ ਮੇਰੇ ਕਰਤਾਰ ॥੧॥
रस कस आपु सलाहणा ए करम मेरे करतार ॥१॥
Ras kas āp salāhṇā e karam mere karṯār. ||1||
I am caught in these tastes and flavors, and in self-conceited praise. These are my actions, O my Creator! ||1||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 11
ਬਾਬਾ ਬੋਲੀਐ ਪਤਿ ਹੋਇ ॥
बाबा बोलीऐ पति होइ ॥
Bābā bolī▫ai paṯ ho▫e.
O Baba, speak only that which will bring you honor.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 11
ਊਤਮ ਸੇ ਦਰਿ ਊਤਮ ਕਹੀਅਹਿ ਨੀਚ ਕਰਮ ਬਹਿ ਰੋਇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
ऊतम से दरि ऊतम कहीअहि नीच करम बहि रोइ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Ūṯam se ḏar ūṯam kahī▫ahi nīcẖ karam bahi ro▫e. ||1|| rahā▫o.
They alone are good, who are judged good at the Lord's Door. Those with bad karma can only sit and weep. ||1||Pause||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 12
ਰਸੁ ਸੁਇਨਾ ਰਸੁ ਰੁਪਾ ਕਾਮਣਿ ਰਸੁ ਪਰਮਲ ਕੀ ਵਾਸੁ ॥
रसु सुइना रसु रुपा कामणि रसु परमल की वासु ॥
Ras su▫inā ras rupā kāmaṇ ras parmal kī vās.
The pleasures of gold and silver, the pleasures of women, the pleasure of the fragrance of sandalwood,
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 12
ਰਸੁ ਘੋੜੇ ਰਸੁ ਸੇਜਾ ਮੰਦਰ ਰਸੁ ਮੀਠਾ ਰਸੁ ਮਾਸੁ ॥
रसु घोड़े रसु सेजा मंदर रसु मीठा रसु मासु ॥
Ras gẖoṛe ras sejā manḏar ras mīṯẖā ras mās.
the pleasure of horses, the pleasure of a soft bed in a palace, the pleasure of sweet treats and the pleasure of hearty meals -
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 13
ਏਤੇ ਰਸ ਸਰੀਰ ਕੇ ਕੈ ਘਟਿ ਨਾਮ ਨਿਵਾਸੁ ॥੨॥
एते रस सरीर के कै घटि नाम निवासु ॥२॥
Ėṯe ras sarīr ke kai gẖat nām nivās. ||2||
these pleasures of the human body are so numerous; how can the Naam, the Name of the Lord, find its dwelling in the heart? ||2||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 13
ਜਿਤੁ ਬੋਲਿਐ ਪਤਿ ਪਾਈਐ ਸੋ ਬੋਲਿਆ ਪਰਵਾਣੁ ॥
जितु बोलिऐ पति पाईऐ सो बोलिआ परवाणु ॥
Jiṯ boli▫ai paṯ pā▫ī▫ai so boli▫ā parvāṇ.
Those words are acceptable, which, when spoken, bring honor.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 14
ਫਿਕਾ ਬੋਲਿ ਵਿਗੁਚਣਾ ਸੁਣਿ ਮੂਰਖ ਮਨ ਅਜਾਣ ॥
फिका बोलि विगुचणा सुणि मूरख मन अजाण ॥
Fikā bol vigucẖṇā suṇ mūrakẖ man ajāṇ.
Harsh words bring only grief. Listen, O foolish and ignorant mind!
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 14
ਜੋ ਤਿਸੁ ਭਾਵਹਿ ਸੇ ਭਲੇ ਹੋਰਿ ਕਿ ਕਹਣ ਵਖਾਣ ॥੩॥
जो तिसु भावहि से भले होरि कि कहण वखाण ॥३॥
Jo ṯis bẖāvėh se bẖale hor kė kahaṇ vakẖāṇ. ||3||
Those who are pleasing to Him are good. What else is there to be said? ||3||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 15
ਤਿਨ ਮਤਿ ਤਿਨ ਪਤਿ ਤਿਨ ਧਨੁ ਪਲੈ ਜਿਨ ਹਿਰਦੈ ਰਹਿਆ ਸਮਾਇ ॥
तिन मति तिन पति तिन धनु पलै जिन हिरदै रहिआ समाइ ॥
Ŧin maṯ ṯin paṯ ṯin ḏẖan palai jin hirḏai rahi▫ā samā▫e.
Wisdom, honor and wealth are in the laps of those whose hearts remain permeated with the Lord.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 16
ਤਿਨ ਕਾ ਕਿਆ ਸਾਲਾਹਣਾ ਅਵਰ ਸੁਆਲਿਉ ਕਾਇ ॥
तिन का किआ सालाहणा अवर सुआलिउ काइ ॥
Ŧin kā ki▫ā salāhṇā avar su▫āli▫o kā▫e.
What praise can be offered to them? What other adornments can be bestowed upon them?
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 15, Line 16
ਨਾਨਕ ਨਦਰੀ ਬਾਹਰੇ ਰਾਚਹਿ ਦਾਨਿ ਨ ਨਾਇ ॥੪॥੪॥
नानक नदरी बाहरे राचहि दानि न नाइ ॥४॥४॥
Nānak naḏrī bāhre rācẖėh ḏān na nā▫e. ||4||4||
O Nanak, those who lack the Lord's Glance of Grace cherish neither charity nor the Lord's Name. ||4||4||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok



Is it me or does this shabad not read a little differently now? Reads to me about attachment and greed?
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
May 25, 2005
2,935
2,949
55
United Kingdom
I found this excellent essay, by Gurbaksh Singh ji (who is not one of the authors for this essay here) :

http://www.sikhs.wellington.net.nz/meat.pdf

http://www.sikhstudies.org/Periodicals.asp?TtlCod=214

Page 1[/FONT] MEAT EATING AND REHIT MARYADA
G
URBAKHSH SINGH
*
Meat eating has unnecessarily become a controversial topic among the
Sikhs. The usual question asked is, —Is eating of meat permitted for a Sikh ?“
The expected answer is —yes“ or —no“. Unless explained properly, each answer,
whether —yes“ or —no“, can cause a problem. Both answers have, therefore,
been analysed in the light of Gurbani.
Interpretation of the Rehit Maryada Instructions
The decision of the Panth on the issue of meat eating, according to the
Rehit Maryada Bulletin, is : —Eating kuthha is prohibited for a Sikh. Kuthha
is meat of animals slaughtered in the Muslim way.“
There are no instructions in the booklet regarding eating or not eating
of other meat. Unfortunately, there are very strong and opposing opinions
about eating non-kuthha meat.


Some Sikhs, in view of the prohibition of kuthha, assume that eating

non-kuthha meat (which is usually called jhatka) is not prohibited.
Accordingly, they conclude that Sikhs are permitted to eat any meat,
beef, pork, poultry, etc., provided the animals have not been slaughtered
in the Muslim way.


Other Sikhs do not agree with the above interpretation. They say kuthha

means a dead animal, hence Sikhs are not allowed to eat any kind of
meat. They argue that both methods, kuthha and jhatka, involve taking
away the life of an animal, which according to them is a sin. Therefore,
all kinds of meat are prohibited for a Sikh.

A few Sikhs have a third view. They say being vegetarian is a Hindu
Vaishanav philosophy. To break away from that and to become a Sikh,
one must eat jhatka meat.
Many articles and even books have been written by each side to justify
their opinion and to prove the other side to be wrong. Of course, both sides
support their view by quoting Gurbani. This issue has, thus, divided Sikhs
regarding the interpretation of Gurbani. Supporters of each view pick up a
few hymns and interpret them out of context to authenticate their own opinion.
* Gurdwara Sahib, Kanthala, Opp. Tribune Chowk, Chandigarh,


Page 2

They translate hymns literally and ignore the real meaning. The present attempt
is to understand the correct message of the hymns related to the subject, and
discuss the meat issue under a wider perspective of Gurmat philosophy, with
Gurbani as the guiding light.
Literal Translation Misleading
Different meanings obtained from the same hymn are the result of
interpreting it literally and ignoring the context in which a word or a phrase
has been used. Here are a couple of examples.
i.
s? ;kfjp eh pks fi nky? ej[ BkBe fenk dhi? ..
;h;[ tY/ efo p?;D[ dhi? ftD[ f;o ;/t eohi? ..
Guru Granth Sahib, p. 558
If someone speaks to you about the Lord, chop off your head and request
him to sit on it. Then serve him without the head on your body.
ii.
ib e? wifB i/ rfs j't? fBs fBs w/Iv[e Bktfj ..
i?;/ w/Iv[e s?;/ UfJ Bo fcfo fcfo i'Bh nktfj ..
p. 484
If bathing could save a person, the frog bathes a lot. Anyone, who, like
a frog, takes bath again and again, will be reborn again and again.
iii.
......
rktfj ykDh uko/ ..
Jap Pauri 27
The four khanis (categories of living beings) sing (His praises).
e/shnk ykDh e/shnk pkDh
......
Jap Pauri 35

The khani and bani (kinds of speech) number is beyond count.
Obviously, the above literal translations either do not make sense or
convey a wrong message, which does not agree with Gurmat. However, if
we study words and phrases according to the context of the hymn, there is no
problem of understanding the correct message. The message of the above
three hymns is clear and all of us agree with it when we do not stick to their
literal translation :
i. A Sikh should show maximum respect and make highest sacrifice to
serve the person, who speaks about the virtues of God. (The hymn does
not ask a Sikh to literally chop off his head. It is a phrase to express
complete submission and highest sacrifice.)
ii. The hymn does not mean that bathing makes one to be reborn again and
again. Actually it tells that repeated physical bathing has no spiritual
benefit (bathing does not clean the mind). Those, who believe that just
bathing at sacred places will benefit them, are ignorant and, therefore,
they remain in the cycle of birth and death.
iii. The numbers of khanis mentioned in the two pauris do not agree. In
pauri 27, Guru Nanak does not mean to say that only four khanis of
living beings sing His praises. The mention of the number four means all
the khanis (which according to the Guru are innumerable as stated in
pauri 35.) The Guru here is using the old Indian terminology (the whole


Page 3

ABSTRACTS OF SIKH STUDIES
–JANUARY - MARCH 2000

16 hymn refers to the Hindu mythology related to creation) which classifies

all life into four khanis.
What is Meat Eating ?
Guru Nanak has given a very unique definition of —meat eating“. He
says that taking away the rights of others is the worst kind of sin, because it
is like sucking the blood of human beings.
i.
je[ gokfJnk BkBek T[;[ ;{no T[;[ rkfJ ..
p. 141
Any person who takes away the rights of others is extremely sinful, like
a Muslim who eats pork or like a Hindu who eats beef.
i/ os[ br? egV? ikwk j'fJ gbhs[ ..
i' os[ ghtfj wkD;k fsB feT[ fBowb[ uhs[ ..
p. 140
A dress stained with blood is considered polluted. How can the mind of
those who suck the blood of human beings (make dishonest earnings, it
does not mean literally drinking of actual blood of people) be pure ?
e{V[ p'fb w[odko[ ykfJ ..
p. 139
Telling lies (cheating people and taking the rights of others) is eating a
corpse.

The message of Gurbani, thus, is that taking the rights of others is
—sucking their blood“, that is —eating their meat“. Hence, it is sinful to take
away the rights of other people.
ii. Other hymns, which endorse the above statement, i.e., to take away the
rights of the weak or helpless by the misuse of authority (religious or
political) is un-pious and sinful, are given below :
wkD; ykD/ eofj fBtki .. S[oh trkfJfB fsB rfb skr ..
p. 471

Literally, the hymn says that a Mullah, though performs Nimaz, (an
essential religious act for a Muslim), but devours human beings. A
Brahmin wears a holy thread (to show himself to be a religious person),
but carries a dagger (to get blood of the people).
Neither a Mullah devours human beings nor is a Brahmin going around
killing people with a dagger. These words

wkD; ykD/

and
S[oh

are phrases, and
both mean to take away the rights of the weak. The Guru used strong words
to severely criticise religious hypocrites, because they perform rituals only to
maintain their credibility among their followers. Actually, such persons are
most sinful, because they extract donations from the naive believers and make
false promises of assuring them heaven after their death. Guru Nanak says
that extracting donations from the people is —eating meat of the people“ and
declares it to be a most sinful act.
Another hymn of the Guru repeats the same message for the leaders of
the three major religions, Kazi, Brahmin, and Yogi :
ekdh e{V[ p'fb wb[ ykfJ .. pqkjwD Bkt? ihnk xkfJ ..
i'rh i[[rfs B ikD? nzX[ .. shB/ UikV/ ek pzX[ ..
p. 662


Page 4

17 MEAT EATING AND REHIT MARYADA
iii. The Guru also protested against the unjust and tyrannical rulers by calling
them blood-sucking beasts (they were drinking the blood of the poor by
taking away their rights).
oki/ ;hj w[edw e[s/ ..
p. 1288

These hymns give a clear message of Gurmat, that taking away the
rights of others is a most sinful act, it is —eating flesh of human beings“. This
—meat eating“ is unambiguously and strictly prohibited for a Sikh. However,
we rarely talk about it. There is no organization which campaigns against this
kind of —meat eating“, that is, taking away the rights of the weak.
The sakhi of Bhai Lalo and Malik Bhago is told to show the greatness
of Guru Nanak; he squeezed milk from the bread of Bhai Lalo, an honest
worker, and blood from the delicious food of Malik Bhago, a corrupt official.
We miss the lesson to be learnt from this sakhi, that honest earnings are the
path of a Sikh. One should enjoy the earnings of hard labour and avoid dishonest
earnings, which is like sucking the blood of innocent people. Therefore, we
should give priority to preach and practise honest living, that is, —not eating
human meat“ or not usurping the rights of others.

Meat Eating – A Non-Issue
According to Gurbani, one can lead a pious life without getting involved
in the controversy over meat eating.
wk;[ wk;[ efo w{oy[ MrV/, frnkB[ fXnkB[ Bjh ikD? ..
eT[D[ wk;[ eT[D[ ;kr[ ejkt?, fe;[ wfj gkg ;wkD/ ..
p. 1289
A fool, without knowing the truth, unnecessarily quarrels (argues) about
eating or not eating meat. Who knows what is
wk;
(meat) and what is
;kr
(vegetarian food)* ? Further, who can say where does the sin lie, in
eating meat or in eating vegetarian food ?

Attachment Prohibited
Gurbani says attachment (addiction, weakness for anything) is wrong.
Here is the hymn which explains that attachment not only to meat, but also to
many other things of daily use is wrong.
bp[ e[sk, e{V[ u{jVk mfr ykXk w[odko[ ..
go fBzdk go wb[ w[fy ;[Xh nrfB eq'X[ uzvkb[ ..
o; e; nkg[ ;bkjDk, J/ eow w/o/ eosko ..1..
pkpk p'bhn? gfs j'fJ ..
T{sw ;/ dfo T{sw ejhnfj Bhu eow pfj o'fJ ..1.. ojkT[ ..
o;[ ;[fJBk o;[ o[gk ekwfD o;[ gowb eh tk;[ ..
* Milk is the changed form of the blood of the cow. Is it meat or not ? We cannot
decide, we can only argue about it. Those who are vegetarian and drink milk give
101 arguments to justify drinking milk, but the fact remains that milk is a changed
form of cow‘s blood, red cells are sieved out and fat is added to it.


Page 5

ABSTRACTS OF SIKH STUDIES
–JANUARY - MARCH 2000

18
o;[ x'V/ o;[ ;/ik wzdo o;[ whmk o;[ wk;[ ..
J/s/ o; ;oho e/ e? xfN Bkw fBtk;[ ..2..
p. 15
Essence : Holy people are honoured in His court. They, who commit
vices, have to repent there. O man, therefore, speak those words (perform
those actions), which will bring honour to you (in His court).
In the first part of the hymn, the Guru names some common vices
(greed, cheating, anger, etc.) in society and tells us how they hurt people.
In the second part, he mentions some routine human needs (wealth,
spouse, meat eating, etc.), which also become vices, if one gets attached to
them. In the last line, the message is clear. How can a mind attached to
(addicted to) so many worldly pleasures (eating meat is only one of them)
enjoy the taste of Naam ?

The theme of the hymn is that God provides human beings with the
necessities of life. However, if one gets attached to them (i.e., gets addicted
to them, uses them not for need, but suffers from a weakness for them), they
become vices. Addiction to anything, including meat, therefore, is wrong.
We know that earning money honestly is not prohibited for a Sikh.

Love of wealth (addiction to wealth) is, however, prohibited, because the
mind devoted to wealth cannot be devoted to God. Further, addiction to
wealth leads one to collecting it even through dishonest means.

No one disagrees with this interpretation. The whole hymn needs to be
interpreted in the same spirit. Some other aspects of life, riding horses,
marrying, living in palaces, eating tasty foods, meat, etc., have also been
mentioned in the hymn. Obviously, not their use, but addiction to them is
prohibited in this hymn. We should have no difficulty to conclude from this
hymn that not eating meat, but craving for meat (addiction to eating meat) is
prohibited for a Sikh.

Keeping in view the above message of Gurmat, we can say that those,
who crave meat and eat it to calm the craving for it, commit a sin. However,
if a person eats meat as just another food, (because he is hungry), he does not
do anything against the Rehit.

This explains why Rehit Maryada does not say whether one should or
should not eat meat. It is not the meat which matters, it is the reason for
eating meat which matters.

Message of the —Meat Prohibiting“ Hymns
The following hymn is often quoted to support the view that a Sikh
should not consume meat.
epho GKr wkS[bh ;[ok gkfB i' i' gqkBh yKfj ..
shoE pos B/w ehJ/ s/ ;G? o;ksfb iKfj ..233..
p. 1377
Bhagat Kabir says that those who consume bhang (marijuana), fish
(machhali is also a name given to a kind of drug), or alcohol, will lose the


Page 6

19 MEAT EATING AND REHIT MARYADA

benefit of practising
shoE pos B/w, the holy rituals.
However, Gurbani repeatedly says there is no benefit at all of
shoE pos
B/w like actions.
pos B/w ;ziw wfj ojsk fsB ek nkY[ B gkfJnk ..
nkr? ubD[ nT[o[ j? GkJh T{Ijk ekfw B nkfJnk ..
p. 216
pos B/w shoE ;fjs rzrk ..
p. 1305

Should we, therefore, conclude that one loses nothing by eating fish
and drinking alcohol ? This interpretation, of course, does not agree with the
message of Gurmat.

In this hymn, the words,
GKr wkS[bh ;[okgkfB are used as a phrase (which
does not mean these three specific things, but it means all vices), and refer to
a vicious life in which people do not restrain themselves. Today, such persons
are mentioned as shrabi-kababi, i.e., living a vicious life.

Similarly, in the second line,
shoE, B/w, pos, do not mean just these three
rituals, i.e., visiting holy places, daily rituals, and fasting, but refer to all kinds
of rituals.

The meaning of the hymn, therefore, is that one does not benefit at all
by performing holy rituals or doing religious deeds, if one continues to lead a
vicious life (sinful life). The message is that one must give up vices to benefit
from religious practices. This hymn, thus, prohibits a vicious life, which has
been explained in the hymn above, it does not say anything for or against
eating meat.

Why Prohibition of Kuthha ?
Some argue that kuthha is prohibited because the animal suffers a lot
during slow killing. This is not the reason. We know that birds and animals,
when shot by a gun, may not die immediately. They do suffer pain after being
hit by a bullet till they breathe their last. Even by jhatka method, the animal
does not die immediately, it does suffer pain for some time. In some cases,
the animal may walk a few steps (as a reflex) even after losing its head.
Kuthha (halal, sanctified meat according to the Muslims) is prohibited
for a Sikh, because it is fed to non-Muslims to convert them to Islam, as it is
sanctified by Muslim ritual.

Conclusion
In the end, for the information of the readers, it may be stated that
eating or not eating meat has a religious sanction in all major faiths; for example,
Kosher is allowed for Jews, Halal for Muslims, Bali for Hindus (killed in the
name of the goddess). Secondly, some religions prohibit meat of certain
animals; pork is prohibited for Muslims and Jews, and beef for Hindus. Some
prohibit eating meat, or a particular kind of meat, on some days.
Sikh faith is unique in not prescribing any such condition for eating


Page 7

ABSTRACTS OF SIKH STUDIES
–JANUARY - MARCH 2000
20

meat, if it is needed to meet the hunger of a Sikh. Addiction (u;ek,o, not

only to meat, but even to ”things‘ of daily use (spouse, wealth, affluent life,
etc.), is prohibited.

The purpose of this article is to explain, in the light of Gurbani, the
correctness of the injunction of the Rehit Maryada, prohibiting only kuthha
meat (meat of animals slaughtered in the Muslim way) and not saying anything
about other meat. I do not eat meat, not even eggs, but I feel hurt when some
Sikh preachers declare that meat eating (actually a non-issue) is a cardinal sin
(
pio e[ofjs) by misinterpreting the meaning of Gurbani. This creates
unnecessary and undesirable divisions and bitterness among Sikhs. These
preachers are requested to preach, with the same enthusiasm, Guru Nanak‘s
message

je[ gokfJnk BkBek, T[;[ ;{no T[;[ rkfJ
(taking away the rights of others
is as sinful as eating beef by a Hindu and pork by a Muslim.)

If a Sikh lives an honest life and is known not to take away the rights of
others (is not corrupt, is not a liar), people will hold such a Sikh in high
esteem, and the community will be respected by everyone. Let, therefore, all
the sants and preachers vigorously advise Sikhs not to take —
je[ gokfJnk
“, itbeing the greatest sin; it is —os[ ghtfj wkD;k“, drinking human blood. The
unnecessary controversy about eating meat may be avoided, and preference
be given to the preaching of truthful living (
T[gfo ;u[ nkuko[).
 

pk70

Writer
SPNer
Feb 25, 2008
1,582
627
USA
Is it me or does this shabad not read a little differently now? Reads to me about attachment and greed?(quote Randip Singh Ji)
Randip Singh ji
I thought I made it clear in my PM. I feel eating or not eating meat is one’s own choice; it is not a sin to eat it and by not eating it one doesn’t become pious. This shabad though deals with greed and attachment but very clearly it addresses what special things are that keep us involved in this mess. Again what you are pointing has nothing to do with what I pointed out. Guru ji picked up “meat” as special one like gold, show off, power etc and didn’t pick up an ordinary dish of Daal as a part of this. So promoting both sides to use this Shabad is an error.My question started there and ended there. Even though I cannot swallow it but I do not advocate vegetarianism. As a matter of fact, I am the last person to get involved in "eating or not eating meat debate” Thanks.:)
 

Gyani Jarnail Singh

Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
Mentor
Writer
SPNer
Jul 4, 2004
7,708
14,381
75
KUALA LUMPUR MALAYSIA
Guru Piayere Jio...
Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki Fateh.

Although i feel personally that enough ( more than enough actually) has been said on the subject....and Dr Gurbaksh Singh Ji's articles in the Abstracts of Sikh Studies IOSS make things even clearer....Gurbani is about Attachment..Moh..Lobh...addiction of all kinds.
Now Guru Ji picked "meat" ( and not daal..tandoori roti...Hokkien Mee..Pizza...dahi..lassi..??)..He picked "Gold/Silver" ( and NOT diamonds..rubies..USD..British Pounds.. Euros...Russian Roubles..) ????
I absolutely used to CRAVE..dahi/lassii..mahan dee daal _ i could have these 24/7 for a decade and still not tire or get bored....but just one meal of Fried chicken...and it felt like i have been having chicken for a year.... THAT IS ADDICTION...ATTACHMENT..( i think....and I have worked at it to get rid of it.....and i have finally succeeded....Now i eat what i get..and it could be just behi rootis ( day old rotis) with chah/achaar..or the latest promotion of newest Pizza..BOTH "excite" me as much as a ???? words fail me...
I think I have got the truth in Guru jis Message !!! through personal experiencing of the Truth of Gurbani. DONT BE ATTACHED TO ANYTHING..EXCESSIVELY..EAT TO LIVE AND NOT LIVE TO EAT.
Sikhs today arent much interested in the Truth of Gurbani....see how so many of us are attached to GOLUCK...when Guru Gobind Singh ji has specifically called this POOJA DA DHAAN and ZEHR POISON.....all the fights in Gurdwaras are 100% about GOLUCK/Pooja da dhaan..yet one sees the most "Amrtidharees" in Gurdwaras (SGPC is a point)..All the Medical Jounals scream day and night about the WHITE POISON (SUGAR)..yet most humans happily consume tons of it..and our Gurdwara langgars use tons as well..that is also ADDICTION and is against the teachings of GURU JI..but who cares...??? Moohn Mittha karlo ji....is our culture !!! even though we may become obese//get diabetes..and get our ankles cut off..again i beleive GURBANI should be our GUIDE...even in staying away from SUGAR...
Randip Singh Ji is absolutley right regarding Haak paraya Nanaka us soor us gayeh...THAT is the REAL NO NO NO Sikhs should be preaching agianst. MEAT-VEGE IS A NON-ISSUE. Sadly Haak Praya hardly gets mention...meat seems to excite each and every so called sant/gyani/brahmgyani/raagi.

Sorry for rambling....
Gyani jarnail Singh
 

Randip Singh

Writer
Historian
SPNer
May 25, 2005
2,935
2,949
55
United Kingdom
Is it me or does this shabad not read a little differently now? Reads to me about attachment and greed?(quote Randip Singh Ji)
Randip Singh ji
I thought I made it clear in my PM. I feel eating or not eating meat is one’s own choice; it is not a sin to eat it and by not eating it one doesn’t become pious. This shabad though deals with greed and attachment but very clearly it addresses what special things are that keep us involved in this mess. Again what you are pointing has nothing to do with what I pointed out. Guru ji picked up “meat” as special one like gold, show off, power etc and didn’t pick up an ordinary dish of Daal as a part of this. So promoting both sides to use this Shabad is an error.My question started there and ended there. Even though I cannot swallow it but I do not advocate vegetarianism. As a matter of fact, I am the last person to get involved in "eating or not eating meat debate” Thanks.:)

Brother this was not meant to be a swipe at you but I wanted to share this essay and its conciseness on this forum.
 

vsgrewal48895

Writer
SPNer
Mar 12, 2009
651
663
89
Michigan
Meat in sikhism

MEAT IN SIKHISM


ABSTRACT


Whether to consume any kind of meat should be a matter of personal preference on the basis of taste etc. It is foolhardy to bring religion into this issue. Guru Nanak has explained it very well: Only God knows what is good and what is bad. Meat has been eaten in all the four ages and has been referred in all religious books. Guru Angad in Raag Ramkali ponders on the life in ocean;

ਜੀਆ ਕਾ ਆਹਾਰੁ ਜੀਅ ਖਾਣਾ ਏਹੁ ਕਰੇਇ ॥

Jī▫ā kā āhār jī▫a kẖāṇā ehu kare▫i.

Animals eat other animals; this is what the Akal Purkh has given them as food. -----Guru Angad, Raag Ramkali, AGGS, Page, 955-11

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Water is the source of every thing in creation whether vegetation or meat. It quenches thirst and cleanses the body but not consciousness says Guru Nanak in Raag Sarang;

ਪਾਣੀ ਚਿਤੁ ਨ ਧੋਪਈ ਮੁਖਿ ਪੀਤੈ ਤਿਖ ਜਾਇ ॥ਪਾਣੀ ਪਿਤਾ ਜਗਤ ਕਾ ਫਿਰਿ ਪਾਣੀ ਸਭੁ ਖਾਇ ॥

paanee chit na Dhop-ee mukh peetai tikh jaa-ay, Paanee Pitaa Jagat Kaa Fir Paanee Sabh Khaa-ay.

The consciousness is not washed with water. You drink it to quench your thirst. Water is the father of the world. In the end water destroys it all.-----Guru Nanak Dev, Raag Sarang, AGGS, Page, 1240-9

The goodness of food or clothes depends on the purity of heart, as explained by Guru Nanak in Raag Majh and Siri Raag;

ਕਿਆ ਖਾਧੈ ਕਿਆ ਪੈਧੈ ਹੋਇ ॥ਜਾ ਮਨਿ ਨਾਹੀ ਸਚਾ ਸੋਇ ॥ਕਿਆ ਮੇਵਾ ਕਿਆ ਘਿਉ ਗੁੜੁ ਮਿਠਾ ਕਿਆ ਮੈਦਾ ਕਿਆ ਮਾਸੁ ॥

Ki-aa KhaaDhai Ki-aa PaiDhai Ho-ay, Jaa Man Naahee Sachaa So-ay,Kiaa Mayvaa Kiaa Gheo Gurh Mithaa Kiaa Maidaa Kiaa Maas.

What good is consuming delicacies and wearing fine clothes, if the True Akal Purkh does not abide within the mind? What good are fruits, butter, sugar, sweets, flour and meat? -----Guru Nanak, Vaar Raag Majh, AGGS, Page, 142-12

ਪਹਿਲਾ ਸਚੁ ਹਲਾਲ ਦੁਇ ਤੀਜਾ ਖੈਰ ਖੁਦਾਇ ॥

Pahilā sacẖ halāl ḏu¬ė ṯījā kẖair kẖuḏā¬ė.

Let the first be truthfulness, the second honest living, and the third charity in the Name of God. -----Guru Nanak, Raag Majh, AGGS, Page, 141- 4

Sabd Guru categorically forbids mind altering substances that have immoral consequences as indicated by Guru Nanak in Siri Raag;

ਬਾਬਾ ਹੋਰੁ ਖਾਣਾ ਖੁਸੀ ਖੁਆਰੁ ॥ ਜਿਤੁ ਖਾਧੈ ਤਨੁ ਪੀੜੀਐ ਮਨ ਮਹਿ ਚਲਹਿ ਵਿਕਾਰ ॥

Baabaa Hor Khaanaa Khusee Khu-aar, Jit Khadhai Tan Peerhai Man Meh Chaleh Vikaar.

O Baba, the pleasures of other foods are false. Eating them, the body is ruined, and wickedness and corruption enter into the mind.-----Guru Nanak, Siri Raag, AGGS, Page, 16-14

Sikh thought is more concerned with the ethical side of the life rather than physical or material things or Maya. Food of any type makes little difference. What is important is the spiritual part of remembering God, since it enhances spiritual growth. Those not remembering God are heading toward delusion, as described by Guru Nanak in Raag Majh:

ਇਕਿ ਮਾਸਹਾਰੀ ਇਕਿ ਤ੍ਰਿਣੁ ਖਾਹਿ ॥ਇਕਨਾ ਛਤੀਹ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਪਾਹਿ ॥ਇਕਿ ਮਿਟੀਆ ਮਹਿ ਮਿਟੀਆ ਖਾਹਿ ॥ਨਾਨਕ ਮੁਠੇ ਜਾਹਿ ਨਾਹੀ ਮਨਿ ਸੋਇ ॥ Ik Masaharee Ik TriN Khaaeh, Ikna Chateeh Amnrit Paaeh, Ik MiTee-aa Meh MiTee-aa Khaaeh, Nanak Muthay Jaahi Naahee Man So-ay.

Some eat meat, while others eat grass. Some have all the thirty-six varieties of delicacies, while others live in the dirt and eat mud. O Nanak, those who do not enshrine the Akal Purkh within their minds is deluded. -----Guru Nanak, Raag Majh, AGGS, Page, 144

Here is another Sloke of Mardana in Raag Bihaagrha stressing the spiritual side of life:

ਗੁਣ ਮੰਡੇ ਕਰਿ ਸੀਲੁ ਘਿਉ ਸਰਮੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਆਹਾਰੁ ॥ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਗੁੜੁ ਸਾਲਾਹ ਮੰਡੇ ਭਉ ਮਾਸੁ ਆਹਾਰੁ ॥ਨਾਨਕ ਇਹੁ ਭੋਜਨੁ ਸਚੁ ਹੈ ਸਚੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਆਧਾਰੁ ॥

GouN ManDay Kar Seel Gheo Saram Maas Aahaar, Giaan Gourh Salaah ManDay Bhou Maas Aahaar, Nanak Ih Bhojan Sach Hai Sach Naam AaDhaar.

Make virtue your bread, good conduct the ghee, and modesty the meat to eat. So make spiritual wisdom your molasses, the Praise of God your bread, and the Fear of God the meat you eat. O Nanak, this is the true food; let the True Name be your only Support. -----Mardana, Raag Bihaagrha, AGGS, Page, 553-6

Kabir originally was idolater and follower of Ramanand and later became monotheistic and believed in contemplation of Naam. He being under the influence of Vedanta states about 3 things to refrain from including fish;

ਕਬੀਰ ਭਾਂਗ ਮਾਛੁਲੀ ਸੁਰਾ ਪਾਨਿ ਜੋ ਜੋ ਪ੍ਰਾਨੀ ਖਾਂਹਿ ॥ਤੀਰਥ ਬਰਤ ਨੇਮ ਕੀਏ ਤੇ ਸਭੈ ਰਸਾਤਲਿ ਜਾਂਹਿ ॥

Kabir Bhaang Maachulee Sura Paan Jo Jo Praanee Khaaneh, Teerath Barat Naym Keeay Tay Sabhay Rasaatal Jaaneh.

Kabir, the mortals who consume marijuana, fish and wine no matter what pilgrimages, fasts and rituals they follow, will all go to hell.-----Bhagat Kabir Slokes # 233, AGGS, Page, 1377-2 & 3

There have been references to the Hukamnama of Guru Har Gobind from the book of Hukamnamas by Dr. Ganda Singh to the effect that the Gurus forbid the eating of meat. This Hukamnama have been annulled by the above references and he him self being a good hunter makes the document erroneous.

Guru Nanak’s Raag Malar is devoted to meat eating. He recited it at Kurkchetar at the festival of solar eclipse while cooking the deer meat, to remove doubts and superstitions about its eating;

ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮੇ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਜੰਮੇ ਹਮ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੇ ਭਾਂਡੇ ॥ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਕਛੁ ਸੂਝੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਚਤੁਰੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਪਾਂਡੇ ॥

Maasahu Nimmay Maasahu Janmay Ham Maasai Kay Bhaanday, Gi-aan Dhi-aan Kachh Soojhai Naahee Chatur Kahaavai PaaNday.

In the flesh we are conceived and in the flesh we are born -- we are vessels of the flesh. You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar.

ਮਾਸੁ ਪੁਰਾਣੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਤੇਬਂ*ੀ ਚਹੁ ਜੁਗਿ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਮਾਣਾ ॥ ਪਾਂਡੇ ਤੂ ਜਾਣੈ ਹੀ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਿਥਹੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਉਪੰਨਾ ॥ਤੋਇਅਹੁ ਅੰਨੁ ਕਮਾਦੁ ਕਪਾਹਾਂ ਤੋਇਅਹੁ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣੁ ਗੰਨਾ ॥ਮਾਤ ਪਿਤਾ ਕੀ ਰਕਤੁ ਨਿਪੰਨੇ ਮਛੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਨ ਖਾਂਹੀ ॥ਇਸਤ੍ਰੀ ਪੁਰਖੈ ਜਾਂ ਨਿਸਿ ਮੇਲਾ ਓਥੈ ਮੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਹੀ ॥

Maas PuraaNee Maas Kataybeen Chaoh Jug Maas KamaaNaa, PaanDay Too JaaNai Hee Naahee Kithoh Maas Upunnaa, To-i-ahu Ann Kamaad KapaahaaN To-i-ahu Taribhavan Gannaa, Maat Pitaa Kee Rakat Nipannay Machhee Maas Na KhaaNhee, Istaree Purkhai JaaN Nis Maylaa Othai ManDh Kamaahee.

Meat is allowed in the Puraanas and in other Holy books. Throughout the four ages, meat has been used. O Pundit, you do not know where meat originated. Corn, sugar cane and cotton are produced from water. The three worlds came from water. They are produced from the blood of their mothers and fathers who do not eat fish or meat. But when men and women meet in the night, they come together in the flesh. -----Guru Nanak, Raag Malaar, AGGS, Page, 1290

The complete Sabd translated;

First, the mortal is conceived in the flesh, and then he dwells in the flesh. When he comes alive, his mouth takes flesh; his bones, skin and body are flesh. He comes out of the womb of flesh, and takes a mouthful of flesh at the breast. His mouth is flesh, his tongue is flesh; his breath is in the flesh. He grows up and is married, and brings his wife of flesh into his home. Flesh is produced from flesh; all relatives are made of flesh. When the mortal meets the True Guru, and realizes the Akal Purkh's Command, then he comes to be reformed. Releasing himself, the mortal does not find release; O, Nanak through empty words, one is ruined.

The fools argue about flesh and meat, but they know nothing about meditation and spiritual wisdom. What is called meat, and what is called a green vegetable? What leads to sin? It was the habit of the gods to kill the rhinoceros, and make a feast of the burnt offering. Those who renounce meat, and hold their noses when sitting near it, devour men at night. They practice hypocrisy, and make a show before other people, but they do not understand anything about meditation or spiritual wisdom. O Nanak, what can be said to the blind people?

They cannot answer, or even understand what is said. They alone are blind, who act blindly. They have no eyes in their hearts. They are produced from the blood of their mothers and fathers, but they do not eat fish or meat. But when men and women meet in the night, they come together in the flesh. In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh. You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar. O master, you believe that flesh on the outside is bad, but the flesh of those in your own home is good.

All beings and creatures are flesh; the soul has taken up its home in the flesh. They eat the uneatable; they reject and abandon what they could eat. They have a teacher who is blind. In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh. You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar. Meat is allowed in the Puraanas, meat is allowed in other religious scriptures and the Quran. Throughout the four ages, meat has been used. It is featured in sacred feasts and marriage festivities; meat is used in them.

Women, men, kings and emperors originate from meat. If you see them going to hell, then do not accept charitable gifts from them. The giver goes to hell, while the receiver goes to heaven -- look at this injustice. You do not understand your own self, but you preach to other people. O Pundit, you are very wise indeed. O Pundit, you do not know where meat originated. Corn, sugar cane and cotton are produced from water. The three worlds came from water. Water says, "I am good in many ways." But water takes many forms. Forsaking these delicacies, one becomes a true Sannyaasee, a detached hermit. Nanak reflects and speaks.

Conclusion:

Every material thing develops from water whether meat or vegetable. It is the remembering of God which is important rather than debating unnecessarily the merits of vegetables or of meat. Personal considerations must determine what is good or bad for a person. In AGGS there is no prohibition about eating or cooking meat. Guru Nanak cooked deer meat at the festival of the solar eclipse at Kurchetar to remove doubt and superstition. According to Vedanta philosophy called ahimsa, it is advised to refrain from injuring - physically, mentally or emotionally - anyone or any living creature, which has creped in to Sikh Faith. Guru Arjan in Raag Maru ponders;

ਹਕੁ ਹਲਾਲੁ ਬਖੋਰਹੁ ਖਾਣਾ ॥

Hak halāl bakẖorahu kẖāṇā.

Let what is earned righteously be your blessed food.-----Guru Arjan, Raag Maru, AGGS, Page, 1084-7


Virinder S. Grewal
 

❤️ CLICK HERE TO JOIN SPN MOBILE PLATFORM

Top