☀️ JOIN SPN MOBILE
Forums
New posts
Guru Granth Sahib
Composition, Arrangement & Layout
ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
Ashtpadiyan (235-242)
Chhant (242-249)
Baavan Akhari (250-262)
Sukhmani (262-296)
Thittee (296-300)
Gauree kii Vaar (300-323)
Gurbani (323-330)
Ashtpadiyan (330-340)
Baavan Akhari (340-343)
Thintteen (343-344)
Vaar Kabir (344-345)
Bhagat Bani (345-346)
ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
Aasaavaree (409-411)
Ashtpadiyan (411-432)
Patee (432-435)
Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
Bhagat Bani (475-488)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
Asatpadhiya (634-642)
Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
Gurbani (876-902)
Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
New resources
Latest activity
Videos
New media
New comments
Library
Latest reviews
Donate
Log in
Register
What's new
New posts
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
Sign up
Log in
Discussions
Hard Talk
Bachittar Natak
Dasam Granth - A Critical Study
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="vijaydeep Singh" data-source="post: 7948" data-attributes="member: 313"><p><strong>Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth</strong></p><p></p><p>Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh</p><p></p><p>Then as Das starts today.It was both lavi and kushis in sodis as they came with Kal Rai to sanod.Adn Kal Ketu and his follwer the one who let them out of Lahore and Kasur(this aRea is Kekay and at later stage its capital was Jhelum towen.Thing to rember here is that step mother of Rama was from here and even our porus or Parwatershwar who fought with Alexender was king of this area.At present it lies in Pakistan).</p><p></p><p>Thenat Sanod thus there was a rise of sodis and they did many Yagnas and also they did some good works as Guru writes that they removed sins of family.But with time thier was a WAr among themselves(Not with Kal Ketu Family).</p><p></p><p>Das can give a bit more example how does surname changes.Sirdar Sahib was never Hindu so he could not imagine how caste works.He is justifed.Let ius see.</p><p></p><p>Moon Dynasty or Chandra Vansh.Out of them there were Kurus and Yadus.</p><p>In Kurus due to great Bharat King(Son of Dushaynt and Shkuntala and on whose name India is Bharat) That whole Brach of Kuuru was thence called Bharat Vanshi(Pronouced as Bhurut like u in cut).This continued till one of thier genration had king Pandu,Till then Kuru there were both Bharat Vanshi and Chandra Vanshi but Dushyant was not BharatVnashi as he was father of Bharat.So is the case of Fore Fathers of Raghu like Surya,Dalip,Sagar or Bhagirath(Who made Ganga touch plains).But his sons lie Dashrath or Rama were both Suraj/Sun Vanshi and Raghuvanshi.It thier surname can be changed then than why could not they be Sodis later on.</p><p></p><p>There is very good thing again in Vachitar Natak.It tells that Surya or moon etc were/are humans and not angels.Later on many Hindus also agreed to it.</p><p></p><p>See just before telling about his family he says(in Akalustat also he says the same that DEvta(Angel) ,Adev(Demons),Jachh,Kinar,Turk ,Hindu as influence of attire of various counteries it is part of Behold human race as one).</p><p></p><p>Have a look what is writtan in Vachitar Natak. Page 64 as per dasamgranth.org Vachitar Natak.</p><p></p><p>Sadh Karam Je Purakh Kamave.Nam Devta Jagat Kahave.Kukrit Karam Je Jag ?Mien Kare.NaM aSUR Tin ko Sab Dharehi..15..</p><p></p><p>Person who earns good deeds.World calles (that) name of Angel(call him/her Angel).If does bad deeds in world.All keep that's name as demon..15..</p><p></p><p>So can a Brahmin writes that or father of Das and Kala Afghan Sahib Tenth Master ?</p><p></p><p>Coming Back to Chandra Vansh so after Pandu his five sons were called Pandav and rest of Kurus remain Kauravs.</p><p></p><p>Even those Kurus who went with Pandavs to thier five city state called Indrprashta made on Khandav Van were thence Pandavs.</p><p></p><p>Same way could be said to Yadavs who were having a united tribal funditation in Braj.Shorsen was head of one part ,who was paternal Grand father of Krishna and Uggersen was his maternal Grand father and both were rulers.</p><p></p><p>At those time these tribes had various permutations and combitnations and Das is infact not as yet confired with how Yadavas were functioning but Sirdar Sahib at once passed the verdict.</p><p></p><p>Can he tell that why all Tarkhans weather or not having blood relationship with Ramgarhia Sardar(Jassa Singh Ji) or why all Kalal similarly become Ahluwalia.Then after some of them takin cannabis why thier is still a 'caste' or surname called Bhangu or Bhangi in Jatts of India or Pakistan.</p><p><a href="http://www.bhangoo.com/ws/b/main.html" target="_blank">http://www.bhangoo.com/ws/b/main.html</a></p><p></p><p>Das hope that answer to changing of surname by area or by great man is resoved.Even Sadiqis aND aNSAris also have some thing to do with role of thier forefathers realted holy Prophet.</p><p></p><p>Jews are Jews perhaps by judea and what about whole Isreal?</p><p></p><p>As per bhvishya Puran,Chauhan were son of tomar.(may be thier Agni Vansh story means bringing them to up word).</p><p></p><p>And needless to say thaT many coblers/taners use surname Ravidasi and many scavengers/sweepers use Valmiki.</p><p></p><p>Then coming Back to Vachitar Natak,There was an internal feud among Sodis.And Guru clearly tells that due to mammon or wealth they were fighting.It was Guru who is telling truth about wrongs happened in his family and why it became so himble that Guru Ramdas Ji also said,Hum Rulte Firte and he use to sell boiled Black grams.If Guru wrote relation with Rama then told also that his next Generation may not have been so great.Brahmins may not think such.#</p><p></p><p>Then later on it becomes clear that there was a feud based upon forefathers ie Lav and Kush and war which is Bad was due to Bad influence of ancestorage of Lava Or Kusha wich made lots of blood shed in sodis and caused lack of unity.</p><p></p><p>So by this Guru is telling us to lay off by feud realted to weather my father was a Brahmin or was a sultan or naything.What counts is what i am or what you are.</p><p></p><p>And then from this WAR.Greed ,Wealth,Ego and not rembering God casued that see Page No. 66.Das is not writing whole lines whcih are ondemoing War and facotrs which are casusing it.</p><p></p><p>From this War till Page No 70 Guru keeps on describing War.And it is full of Veer Rasa.Brahmin whould have devoted more Pages to family tree as they do in Haridwar and other places(May be from some documents in Hundi etc from Brahmin Guru could know his Family history which also he utised to preach Khalsa Panth to all.) But here a motivator is using WAR as medium to incite or rise courage in Sikhs.</p><p></p><p>So at last of this page Luvis(from sodis) won and Kushis(From Sodis) were defeated and went to Benaras.Thier they lived for Long and leanrt Vedas.Here first time another surname was also used.Lavi and Kushi.Like we have Kalsi fromm sub mils Kalsia as Gotra in Ramgarhias so could be thier we have two surname.In Virks we have sub Gotra Batth.Or say in Arora we may have Makkad,Kumra,Chhbra etc.In Hindus till this day it is possible.</p><p></p><p>Why Guru Ji told it here was he preaching hinduism?</p><p></p><p>No! He was opposing such system as such system lead to WAR and deaths.See the last four lines of same page 70.Whom so ever mighty(from Kushis ) were left ran taking thier life with them.</p><p></p><p>He is rahter opposing the gloryfication of the Family of Gurus and telling them to be just like anyother family as Guru were always against personal worship as that may spill over to family members like we see Wife of Gurbachan nirnakari is Raj Mata.And many such cases in hindus.</p><p>(To Be continued...)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="vijaydeep Singh, post: 7948, member: 313"] [b]Re: Thus Das starts about Dasham Granth[/b] Ek Oankar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh Then as Das starts today.It was both lavi and kushis in sodis as they came with Kal Rai to sanod.Adn Kal Ketu and his follwer the one who let them out of Lahore and Kasur(this aRea is Kekay and at later stage its capital was Jhelum towen.Thing to rember here is that step mother of Rama was from here and even our porus or Parwatershwar who fought with Alexender was king of this area.At present it lies in Pakistan). Thenat Sanod thus there was a rise of sodis and they did many Yagnas and also they did some good works as Guru writes that they removed sins of family.But with time thier was a WAr among themselves(Not with Kal Ketu Family). Das can give a bit more example how does surname changes.Sirdar Sahib was never Hindu so he could not imagine how caste works.He is justifed.Let ius see. Moon Dynasty or Chandra Vansh.Out of them there were Kurus and Yadus. In Kurus due to great Bharat King(Son of Dushaynt and Shkuntala and on whose name India is Bharat) That whole Brach of Kuuru was thence called Bharat Vanshi(Pronouced as Bhurut like u in cut).This continued till one of thier genration had king Pandu,Till then Kuru there were both Bharat Vanshi and Chandra Vanshi but Dushyant was not BharatVnashi as he was father of Bharat.So is the case of Fore Fathers of Raghu like Surya,Dalip,Sagar or Bhagirath(Who made Ganga touch plains).But his sons lie Dashrath or Rama were both Suraj/Sun Vanshi and Raghuvanshi.It thier surname can be changed then than why could not they be Sodis later on. There is very good thing again in Vachitar Natak.It tells that Surya or moon etc were/are humans and not angels.Later on many Hindus also agreed to it. See just before telling about his family he says(in Akalustat also he says the same that DEvta(Angel) ,Adev(Demons),Jachh,Kinar,Turk ,Hindu as influence of attire of various counteries it is part of Behold human race as one). Have a look what is writtan in Vachitar Natak. Page 64 as per dasamgranth.org Vachitar Natak. Sadh Karam Je Purakh Kamave.Nam Devta Jagat Kahave.Kukrit Karam Je Jag ?Mien Kare.NaM aSUR Tin ko Sab Dharehi..15.. Person who earns good deeds.World calles (that) name of Angel(call him/her Angel).If does bad deeds in world.All keep that's name as demon..15.. So can a Brahmin writes that or father of Das and Kala Afghan Sahib Tenth Master ? Coming Back to Chandra Vansh so after Pandu his five sons were called Pandav and rest of Kurus remain Kauravs. Even those Kurus who went with Pandavs to thier five city state called Indrprashta made on Khandav Van were thence Pandavs. Same way could be said to Yadavs who were having a united tribal funditation in Braj.Shorsen was head of one part ,who was paternal Grand father of Krishna and Uggersen was his maternal Grand father and both were rulers. At those time these tribes had various permutations and combitnations and Das is infact not as yet confired with how Yadavas were functioning but Sirdar Sahib at once passed the verdict. Can he tell that why all Tarkhans weather or not having blood relationship with Ramgarhia Sardar(Jassa Singh Ji) or why all Kalal similarly become Ahluwalia.Then after some of them takin cannabis why thier is still a 'caste' or surname called Bhangu or Bhangi in Jatts of India or Pakistan. [URL=http://www.bhangoo.com/ws/b/main.html]http://www.bhangoo.com/ws/b/main.html[/URL] Das hope that answer to changing of surname by area or by great man is resoved.Even Sadiqis aND aNSAris also have some thing to do with role of thier forefathers realted holy Prophet. Jews are Jews perhaps by judea and what about whole Isreal? As per bhvishya Puran,Chauhan were son of tomar.(may be thier Agni Vansh story means bringing them to up word). And needless to say thaT many coblers/taners use surname Ravidasi and many scavengers/sweepers use Valmiki. Then coming Back to Vachitar Natak,There was an internal feud among Sodis.And Guru clearly tells that due to mammon or wealth they were fighting.It was Guru who is telling truth about wrongs happened in his family and why it became so himble that Guru Ramdas Ji also said,Hum Rulte Firte and he use to sell boiled Black grams.If Guru wrote relation with Rama then told also that his next Generation may not have been so great.Brahmins may not think such.# Then later on it becomes clear that there was a feud based upon forefathers ie Lav and Kush and war which is Bad was due to Bad influence of ancestorage of Lava Or Kusha wich made lots of blood shed in sodis and caused lack of unity. So by this Guru is telling us to lay off by feud realted to weather my father was a Brahmin or was a sultan or naything.What counts is what i am or what you are. And then from this WAR.Greed ,Wealth,Ego and not rembering God casued that see Page No. 66.Das is not writing whole lines whcih are ondemoing War and facotrs which are casusing it. From this War till Page No 70 Guru keeps on describing War.And it is full of Veer Rasa.Brahmin whould have devoted more Pages to family tree as they do in Haridwar and other places(May be from some documents in Hundi etc from Brahmin Guru could know his Family history which also he utised to preach Khalsa Panth to all.) But here a motivator is using WAR as medium to incite or rise courage in Sikhs. So at last of this page Luvis(from sodis) won and Kushis(From Sodis) were defeated and went to Benaras.Thier they lived for Long and leanrt Vedas.Here first time another surname was also used.Lavi and Kushi.Like we have Kalsi fromm sub mils Kalsia as Gotra in Ramgarhias so could be thier we have two surname.In Virks we have sub Gotra Batth.Or say in Arora we may have Makkad,Kumra,Chhbra etc.In Hindus till this day it is possible. Why Guru Ji told it here was he preaching hinduism? No! He was opposing such system as such system lead to WAR and deaths.See the last four lines of same page 70.Whom so ever mighty(from Kushis ) were left ran taking thier life with them. He is rahter opposing the gloryfication of the Family of Gurus and telling them to be just like anyother family as Guru were always against personal worship as that may spill over to family members like we see Wife of Gurbachan nirnakari is Raj Mata.And many such cases in hindus. (To Be continued...) [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Discussions
Hard Talk
Bachittar Natak
Dasam Granth - A Critical Study
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
Accept
Learn more…
Top