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Discussion in 'Hard Talk' started by Archived_Member16, Jun 26, 2009.

  1. Archived_Member16

    Archived_Member16
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    [SIZE=+3]Conversions 10 Secrets The Muslims Don't Want You To Know

    This was written by a Sikh brother.

    1. Islam is a totally MISSIONARY religion committed to making EVERYONE Muslim, according to the Koran the world is divided up into 2 parts, Dar-as-Islam (House of Faith) a title which applies to all Islamic countries and Dar-al-Harb (Household of War), land not yet surrendered to Allah, which is the rest of the world. It is the duty of every Muslim to wage Jihad (Holy War) against Kafirs, infidels and unbelievers what the Koran calls non-Muslims and make them submit to Islam. Violence against Kafirs is encouraged in the Koran, if gentle persuasion doesn?t work.

    2. Conversions of Sikh and Hindu men and women is becoming an increasing problem, hundreds of reported and verified conversions in the last few years. Dozens of cases were reported in October 1995 alone, when the new academic year tarted also converted. Universities in London, Bradford and Luton are particular problem areas.

    3. At the Hizb-ut-Tahrir ( HUT ) conference at the Wembley arena in August 1994, a Sikh was converted on stage in front of 8000 cheering and clapping Muslims. The Sikh girl then proceeded to attack Sikhism making particularly offensive statements against the Sikh Gurus. The audience laughed and continued to cheer. Some of this speech was televised on satellite T.V and on the HUTs pirate radio station. Muslim leaders at the conference called for an intensification of the campaign to bring Sikh and Hindu women to Islam. The same thing happened at HUTs Rally for Islam conference in Trafalgar Square, August 1995. This time 2 Hindu women were converted on stage in front of 2000 cheering Muslims. Again Muslim leaders demanded that Muslims boys try harder to convert Sikh and Hindu girls.

    4. The self appointed Muslim parliament of Britain passed a resolution demanding that the British government make it illegal for Muslim women to marry non-Muslim. It also called for the banning of conversions of Muslims to other faiths. Any Muslim who did convert was to be stoned to death according Islamic tradition. Thankfully, the British government did not take their demand seriously, but the event showed the Muslims double standards and hypocrisy.

    5. HUT leaders issued a directive in January 1995 to specially selected male members telling them to place Ads in personal columns of national newspapers inviting relationships from Asian women, they were told to write the religion and nationality of the girl were unimportant and be ambiguous about their own backgrounds by for example only describing themselves as Asian. They were further told to form intimate relationships with only Sikh and Hindu girls who replied with the aim of conversion. The expense of the Ads and any dates were to be paid by the HUT.

    6. Certain Muslims have taken to wearing Karas (Sikh steel bracelet) at Bhangra gigs with the aim of specifically seeking to meet Hindu and Sikh girls. When meeting the Girls, these people identify themselves in such a way that the girl does not realise that they are Muslim, for example by shortening the name Mohammed to Mohan. They form relationships with the girl and begin the slow path to conversion.

    7. A Muslim converting somebody, will never tell the person the whole story. For example when converting men they always leave out the part about having to be circumcised to become Muslim. After all what man would want half of his genitals cut off. Likewise girl converts are tricked into believing that men and women are equal to Islam. They are not told that rape victims according to the Koran have produce 4 Male witnesses of good character to say that they were raped or they will be charged with adultery and stoned according to Islamic tradition ( hundreds of cases where this has occurred are on file with Amnesty International, contact them for further information). Also according to the Koran, all man has to do to divorce his wife is say Talaq 3 times. For women of course getting a divorce is much harder. Besides which what woman wants to share her husband with three other women.

    The new method that they are employing is to change their names by deed poll to Mohan singh and Balraj singh , they add surnames on to Gill and Hayer are two of there favorites. Please check the person you are going to marry and there credentials through your parents or close relatives NAMES MEAN NOTHING THERE ARE BEING CHANGED BY DEED POLL IT ONLY COSTS THEM A COUPLE OF HUNDRED POUNDS , SUPPLIED BY THEY'RE FANATICAL ELDERS!!!!

    8. HUT leadership has instructed its members to specifically target problem groups of conversion. These include young teenage girls, people with social problems, the recently bereaved and victims of abuse as children. These people are considered to be weak willed and easily manipulated once identified the Muslim will try to convince their target that Islam will magically solve all their problems. Incidentally in 1992 the hut produced an article telling Muslim men to particularly target non-Muslim girls with plain or unattractive physical, facial or body features. These girls the article said would not be accustomed to this attention and would do anything to maintain a relationship. It went on to say that the discomfort you may feel in such relationships, especially if intimate is only temporary however the rewards you will receive in Heaven will last for eternity.

    9. The HUT has instructed Muslims to work in groups when converting, with one person forming a very close friendship with their target. The group then works to find out the strengths and weaknesses of the person involved and then will work accordingly. If for example, the person loves sport and is very athletic, they go on about how Islam actively encourages sport and how all the world's best sportsmen such as Muhammad Ali, Tyson and Imran Khan are Muslims. If the person has a strongly anti-white attitude, then they will stir up racial hatred against whites even more by talking about past white injustices against them. This policy has been used effectively with Afro-Caribbean's, with whom they talk about the slave trade and give Malcolm X as role model (Muslim groups leafleted black cinema audiences watching Malcolm X when it was released ). Similarly, the hard up have been offered well-paid jobs with Muslim businesses providing they convert.

    10. Forced conversions do occur. There have been many documented cases ( at least one in Southall ) when Sikh and Hindu girls have been taken to Pakistan by their Muslim boyfriends and forcibly converted. Those resisting are passed on to other Muslim men who keep the girl under lock and key, in some remote village without telephones. All the girls money and her passport are taken away. Other cases have occurred when Sikh and Hindu girls are photographed naked by their Muslim boyfriends, and are told to convert or else the photos will be published in magazines and sent to the girls family and friends. These are not tragically scare stories but facts.

    CONVERSIONS INTO ISLAM almost always occur out of a persons IGNORANCE or MISUNDERSTANDING of their own religion. Take time to understand your religion and educate others. The process of conversion is usually very SUBTLE and GRADUAL. It always occurs progressively UNDERMINING YOUR CULTURE and RELIGION through misquoting religious texts and falsifying historical events. Be on guard and stop them from speaking lies about your religion be you Sikh or Hindu. The HUT and other Muslim groups have said that they aim to make FRANCE, an ISLAMIC REPUBLIC by the year 2015 and Britain by 2025 through CONVERSIONS, IMMIGRATION and high MUSLIM BIRTH RATES. THE DIFFERENT WAYS THE HUT ARE ATTACKING US

    Fanatics are now vandalising books on Sikhism and religious texts such as the Guru Granth Sahib in Council, School, and college libraries. About 30% of the time this vandalism involves the writing of false propaganda and messages to the readers of the book. These messages usually attempts to UNDERMINE your faith by MISQUOTING religious texts and distorting reality. Check your local library especially if you live in an area with a history of trouble.

    Recent events have shown that groups have become increasingly envious of our prosperity in this country. They are now systematically trying their best to damage us financially. In some Mosques speakers have told worshippers to boycott Sikh and Hindu shops. However, the most obvious example of this economic sabotage would be that of the Bradford riots. These were not as the media have us believe merely a case of Asian youths uprising and fighting white fascist police brutality, but more a situation where gangs went on rampage, burning and looting non-Muslim property. The Economist Magazine ( June 17th 1995 edition ) reported that No Hindu nor Sikh youths took part, only Muslim males. Indian owned business were attacked. In fact other reports state that older, masked Muslims ( thought to be HUT ) went down the streets ahead of everyone else, and specifically marked out Sikh and Hindu shops with spray paint, for destruction by rioters following them. Don't be fooled by the Muslim media, Sikhs and Hindus were the victims of the Muslim riots in Bradford.

    The HUT produced and circulated articles in universities, stating that Jewish, Sikh and Hindu students were dogs and must be removed from higher education. (As reported in the Guardian, 31st October 1995 edition). The Muslims have realised that the power, respect, money and knowledge and influence brings makes us more powerful enemies. The exact strategy for preventing us from obtaining higher education has not yet been leaked, but the harassment and bullying Hindu and Sikh students at schools and colleges ( by such acts as the storming of West Thames college in Jan 1995 ) is bound to be a part of it. After all how can anyone work in places of such stress. Our youths must strive to get highly educated as they possibly can. University students should act as role models and encourage younger members of the community to get an education. This will greatly benefit not only you and your family, but help your community.

    Youths have been instructed to infiltrate any and every organisation and position of authority they can. They have also been told to keep their Islamic fundamentalist secret and subtly remove our community from a position within these organisations. For example, they have been directed to join Student Union bodies, the Media, anti-racist groups community groups, councils and political parties.
    Check out this ::::::CA&CC Press® AB

    [/SIZE]
     
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    #1 Archived_Member16, Jun 26, 2009
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  3. susan

    susan
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    This is reality. I know a member of a group in England that is helping in fighting back. They find these sick Muslims that target young Sikh girls and do street justice:boxing:
    It is a growing problem all over. I never realized how desperate some of these Muslims were. I believe if something or someone is so great you don't need to trick anyone, like the old saying goes "Honesty is the best policy".
     
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  4. vijaydeep Singh

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    Gurfateh

    Well Islam is not a big problem for us. If we have strong motivation, it is possible to make a Gurudwara Sahib at Mecca Shareef itself.

    Anyway first thing is that in case of Sikhs girls, if they want to have person from Muslim background wanting to be her husband, then she should tell him to convert first into Sikhism.

    Shri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, teach the live and let live tendency. Of the saintly nature.
    ਪੰਨਾ 1381, ਸਤਰ 19
    ਫਰੀਦਾ ਬੁਰੇ ਦਾ ਭਲਾ ਕਰਿ ਗੁਸਾ ਮਨਿ ਨ ਹਢਾਇ ॥
    फरीदा बुरे दा भला करि गुसा मनि न हढाइ ॥
    Farīḏā bure ḏā bẖalā kar gusā man na hadẖā▫e.
    Fareed, answer evil with goodness; do not fill your mind with anger.
    ਸੇਖ ਫਰੀਦ ਜੀ

    So we will have to restore to predatory concept told to us by Tenth Master.

    There has been a conspiracy by Anti Panthic forces to make Sikhs nincompoops by two ways.
    1. Making them ritualistic and unfit for normal human life.
    2. Making them confuse in their action by showing contradiction between spiritual text and temporal text of them. First they themselves bring in former, when link is shown between the both, then they ask for independence of the latter, while former could not survive without the latter.

    putting aside the inner weakness among us, we could see what weakness are there in Muslims, their sects etc.And often Punjabi Sikhs may not agree to marry their daughter to lower castes then how could they accommodate Muslims converted to Sikhism ?
     
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    #3 vijaydeep Singh, Jun 27, 2009
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  5. Hardas Singh

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    Vijaydeep Singh ji I find it interesting that you chose the words of Farid who was a Muslim.

    It might help if we had a handful of Muslims who are on our side and are willing to condemn these other Muslims.
     
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  6. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    In Suraj Parkash, Kavi Santokh Singh of the Nirmala Sect wrote about Guru Nanak's visit to Mecca and Medina
    because Mardana wanted to have the opportunity to visit these places.

    When they went to Mecca, they were denied entry into the Kaaba twice and the third time,
    Guru Nanak had to disguise himself as a Muslim in order to gain entry. During those times,
    it was the practise to blindfold the devotees while they passed the black stone.

    Guru Nanak told Mardana that Muslims are told not to worship idols but they blindfold the devotees
    so that their secret is concealed. They are actually worshipping the idol. They are idol worshippers.
    They are the kafirs themselves.
     
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  7. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    Testimony
    Khadijah Kaur, now a cherished member of the
    Holy Sikh Communion, has decided to share her
    story of how she came to fully embrace Sikh philosophy.
    Although she wished to give specific
    details of her conversion (her name, university,
    course etc) her name has been changed because,
    according to Islamic Law, if one leaves Islam the
    punishment is death, and Islamic organisations
    could not guarantee her safety.
    Khadijah’s story:
    “As a child, I was taught the Quran by rote. Although
    none of my family speaks a word of Arabic,
    I learnt how to read and write it. I was
    taught about the teachings of Islam and its undoubted
    superiority over all other religions and
    philosophies. I was also told that Muhammed was
    the most amazing human to ever live, and that
    he was God’s special messenger.
    But I am a born sceptic and a born scholar.
    Throughout my formative years, my curiosity
    about Islam was burning. Why had I never seen
    an English translation of the Quran? Why did my
    mother keep telling me not to socialise with the
    kuffran (non-Muslims)? Why was I never allowed
    to go to the Mosque?
    Whenever I asked my mother these questions,
    she replied that Islam does not allow one to
    question, it is akin to blasphemy.
    I hit 18 and university life dawned. I was going to
    study history and I was looking forward to the
    prospect of doing some real scholarly research on
    Islam at the university library.
    My first major interest was the life of Muhammad,
    a man who I had been told was the epitome
    of humanity. I was really looking forward to
    reading about a man who I thought stood for
    justice, tolerance and equality.

    But, I was dismayed by what I discovered. It was
    as if for my whole life I had been fed one long
    string of lies. I will not repeat what I discovered
    on these pages, but suffice to say, I am staunchly
    against paedophilia, incest, genocide and the
    legitimisation of rape.
    As a student of history, I was well aware of the
    correct verification procedures that need to be
    undertaken to ascertain the validity of a source.
    My Islamic sources were accurate, but I remained
    in denial for about a year or so.
    I tried to purge the facts from my mind, but it
    was no use; whenever I tried to continue my
    studies into Islam, I simply found more and more
    that I disagreed with.
    The Islamic idea that the role of woman is primarily
    procreation and raising children and not
    much else tipped me over the edge.
    I decided that I was Muslim no more. I, of
    course, kept this decision to myself.
    However, although I abandoned Islam, I was still
    very much a spiritual person; I still believed in
    God, although it was no longer the Islamic Allah.
    It was in my final year at university that my life
    was to radically change, never to be the same
    again.
    My study of Islam had also led me to look into
    other religions. I did not know much about the
    Sikh faith, I must confess, but the more and
    more I looked into it, the more and more I was
    attracted to its philosophy of humanitarianism,
    egalitarianism, charity, a strong work ethic and
    the equality of woman and man. It is a simple
    philosophy, and a beautiful one.
    I became wrapped in a study of Sikh Scripture
    and history; so much so that I decided to undertake
    my history dissertation on Sikh philosophy. I
    did not dare tell my family though; they have an
    unhealthy hatred for non-Muslims generally.

    I did not even tell any Sikhs; I didn’t even know
    any! Work for my dissertation led me to a Gurdwara
    library, and of course the Gurdwara itself. I
    tried to stop myself, but I couldn’t. I was becoming
    more and more obsessed with Sikh dharma and I
    knew that I agreed with its philosophy. It wasn’t a
    conscious thing really; I didn’t wake up one day
    and announce to myself and the world “I am a
    Sikh.”
    It just felt right; all the things that I believed in
    were to be found in Sikh Scripture.
    One day I decided to sit in the main hall and listen
    to a recitation of Guru Nanak’s japji Sahib. I knew
    the meaning of the words because I had studied
    them for my dissertation, and my parents spoke in
    chaste Punjabi. But even so, I was moved. I had
    never heard the words spoken as a melodious
    prayer.
    I have not told my parents about my new faith, nor
    do I intend to. I have not told many Sikhs either.
    Those Sikhs who do know have embraced me with
    open arms. The Sikh circles that I move in now
    confirm to me every day that I made the right
    choice: they live Sikh dharma through their actions
    – through their kind-heartedness and exemplary
    etiquette. I am at a happy point in my life.
    And I got a First for my dissertation!
    I just wanted to share my story,
    Guru Rakha, Khadijah Kaur”

    For more stories : http://www.projectnaad.com/wp-content/uploads/leaflets/muslim_converts_to_sikhism.pdf
     
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  8. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    Concept of Heaven
    The Quaran and Hadiths state that a Muslim man will
    get 72 virgins (Houris) when they go to heaven. In
    Sahih Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 402
    Narrated Abdullah bin Qais, Allah's Apostle said, "In
    Paradise there is a pavilion made of a single hollow
    pearl sixty miles wide, in each corner of which there
    are wives who will not see those in the other corners;
    and the believers will visit and enjoy them..."
    In Sikh dharma, Heaven is considered a part of the
    samsara cycle and not the same as liberation. The
    aim of a Sikh is to attain Mukti or liberation from the
    cycle of birth and death and this includes the 7 hells
    and 7 heavens.
     
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  9. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    Conversion to Another Faith
    If a Muslim wants to convert to another religion then the
    penalty is death. Hadith, Sahih Bukhari 4.260 Narrated
    Ikrima, "Ali burnt some people [hypocrites] and this
    news reached Ibn Abbas, who said, “Had I been in his
    place I would not have burnt them, as the Prophet said,
    ‘Don't punish (anybody) with Allah's Punishment.’ No
    doubt, I would have killed them, for the Prophet said, ‘If
    somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.”"
    In Sikh dharma, there is no punishment for choosing
    another faith. People are free to select whatever faith
    they want, because what matters is the actions that a
    person commits, not their religious title.

    http://www.projectnaad.com/wp-content/uploads/leaflets/sikhism_and_islam.pdf
     
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  10. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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  11. susan

    susan
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    Namjap Ji
    If these are the messages truly written in the Quran I am deeply saddened for these people (espacially the women) they could not get out alive even if they wanted to. It's like being a prisoner of your religion. This also explains alot to me about their actions. I wonder how many other Muslims out there feel the same way as Khadijah Kaur but are too terrified to speak up. it must be suffocating.
     
  12. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    I have often wondered myself as why muslim women continue to remain in the religion even after knowing about such facts.
    The answer might be in the conditioning over the years.
    Just like the analogy that a frog in the water which heats up slowly does not know it is being cooked.

    But there are women rights associations amongst them who daringly face physical harm
    from the male muslims for speaking up for their rights.

    Malaysia for example faces stringent Shariyah Law like this video will tell:-
    YouTube - Sharia & Malaysia - Part 3
     
  13. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    namjap ji

    In traditional societies, which is true of most cultures that are Islamic in the majority, if you leave your religion then you leave everything. Family, friends, language, and all the other aspects of culture that have defined you over a lifetime. This is asking a lot of anyone -- and in fact can be catastrophic for a Muslim woman for how then will she cope or survive. If she has the means to relocate and immigrate to a country where she has some chance of making on her own it could work. But even then it is very difficult. And if she is poor and uneducated these thoughts are not even within the realm of the thinkable.

    Earlier today I posted the story of a woman who left her husband and moved to be with her brother in the US. She was rejected and humiliated by him and also by neighbors who found her to be suspicious, unstable. Women on their own -- most Muslim women are not raised to be independent, must learn how to be independent, and when independent face social stigmas.

    This is the story I posted -- This woman has turned into a survivor, but the journey was very painful. Her story is amazing. Most women in any country could not do what she did.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/15/ny.../15muslim.html
     
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  14. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    :thumbup: :star::situps:
     
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  15. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    I was close to tears reading it. All I wanted to know was whether she is OK today 3 years later. Maybe call her up and have her over for a good meal.
     
  16. Randip Singh

    Randip Singh
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    I think these Muslim should worry about their own Muslim girls leaving their religion, and the behaviour of a lot of them.

    I think Sikh girls have wised up.

    Apparently the membership for this site:

    http://www.faithfreedom.org/


    Has shot up. It's run by ex-muslims.
     
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  17. Setarah

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    Waheguru... Im gettin really emotionally by reading this..
    I heard about this before.. its so bad.. that people do this.. But I think that Sikh girls should be aware as well.. cos u never know..
     
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  18. susan

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    Randip Singh Ji
    I agree with you. Back when my parents migrated to Canada,religion was not a focus point in our community.Everyone was just trying to fit in "Become Western". But I have realised that ,that's not who we all are.
    I was born and raised in Canada with freedom to come and go as I pleased. At any time some one could have brain washed me easily. (That thought terrifies me because I have 2 daughters of my own now). Not knowing anything about Sikhism except for the fact that we have 10 Guru's (not even knowing that Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is our lving Guru). I am very disappointed in my family that no one,not even my grandparents who went to the Gurdwara everyday never thought it was important enough to teach us about it.
    With Waheguru's Kirpa we now have Gurdwara's all over the world that are full of information,offering classes and camps catered to our young. My generation has woken up and realised that we need to pass on this great gift that our Guru's have given to us to our kids.
    I thank Waheguru everyday for all the magnificent people out there that have translated the messages of our Guru's into English. I also want to thank all those that consider Sikhism so precious and worth sharing that they unselfishly have created or participated in forums like this one to spread the Love of Sikhism.

    "Gun Gawa Nith Therae"
    "I continuously Sing Your Glorious Praises"
     
  19. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    Page 749, Line 9
    ਤਹਾ ਬੈਕੁੰਠੁ ਜਹ ਕੀਰਤਨੁ ਤੇਰਾ ਤੂੰ ਆਪੇ ਸਰਧਾ ਲਾਇਹਿ ॥੨॥
    तहा बैकुंठु जह कीरतनु तेरा तूं आपे सरधा लाइहि ॥२॥
    Ŧahā baikunṯẖ jah kīrṯan ṯerā ṯūʼn āpe sarḏẖā lā▫ihi. ||2||
    That place is heaven, where the Kirtan of the Lord's Praises are sung. You Yourself instill faith into us. ||2||
    Guru Arjan Dev - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
     
    • Like Like x 1
    #18 Astroboy, Jun 30, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 5, 2016
  20. Josh martin

    Josh martin
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    They find these sick Muslims that target young Sikh girls. and do street justice.
    2nd comment I have often wondered myself as why muslim women continue to remain in the religion even after knowing about such facts.
    3rd comment; It might help if we had a handful of Muslims who are on our side and are willing to condemn these other Muslims[quotes


    This is excatly what our Guru's would have done. Make them proud :)


    Khadijah Kaur but are too terrified to speak up. it must be suffocating.

    -prolly not as suffocating as comments above :)
     
  21. susan

    susan
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    Josh Martin Ji

    Please do go into detail regarding your comments. And how do you portray our comments?
     

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