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Gurus Benefits of Kirtan

Discussion in 'History of Sikhism' started by kaur-1, Mar 16, 2007.

  1. kaur-1

    kaur-1
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    Benefits of Kirtan

    Guru Arjan who compiled and grouped the hymns of Gurus and Bhagats under different ragas has mentioned the manifold benefits of Kirtan. There are four great objectives of human life: dharam (righteousness), arth (wealth), kam (success) and mokshu (salvation). All these four are achieved by kirtan [11], under the Lord’s will:

    “Whoever chants or listens to Kirtan, his evil consciousness disappears.
    All his wishes are fulfilled and his hopes are satisfied.” [12]


    Elsewhere Guru Arjan writes:

    “Man obtains dominion, comforts, enjoyments and eternal bliss by kirtan of the Holy Name and all his wishes are fulfilled.
    Nanak the slave says, one who is preordained by the Creator has his tasks accomplished.”[13]


    In addition to the above benefits, kirtan is the fountain of so many blessings, some of which are mentioned as follows:

    1) Remedy against Evil

    The devotional music clears the mind of the accumulated filth of previous existences. It gradually washes the inner consciousness and man becomes holy and spotless through the power of kirtan. Sacred music is regarded as a panacea of all ailments. It is a sure remedy for all the diseases of the mind. It removes evil inclinations and wicked thoughts. Guru Arjan Dev says:

    “The disciple who obtains the panacea of Thy Name, gets rid of the diseases of many births.
    O man, perform kirtan day and night, which is the fruitful avocation of human life.” [14]


    According to the Gurus, kirtan removes duality and the five vices of lust, anger, greed, wordly attachment and pride. It removes the root of selfishness-the ego-which leads to action and the consequent chain-reaction of cause and effect.

    2) Support of Life

    The Gurus regarded kirtan as their prop of life and their soul’s nourishment. Guru Arjan regarded it as a divine blessing and valued it as an aid to holy living. Referring to the devoted singers, he says:

    They acquire permanent seat in the Infinite Mansion.” [15]

    The Gurus thought kirtan particularly suitable to the house-holder’s way of life. Austerities and penances for family-people are terribly painful and irrelevant. So the best way of spiritual development for people with social commitment is sacred music. It produces a kind of detachment in the midst of family life. Guru Arjan says:

    “He who day and night chants kirtan remains detached in his household.” [16]

    Moreover the homely comparisons and analogies like the seed and the tree, the spider and the web, the river and the sea, the thread and the gems, the river and boat, the puppet and the puppeteer convey clearly moral and spiritual ideas through perfect melodies.

    3) Source of Virtue

    Kirtan purifies the mind and leads to a life of virtue. It produces a desire in the devotee to emulate the qualities which we associate with God, for example, truth, justice, compassion, fearlessness, etc. Kirtan reinforces ethical conduct. Guru Ramdas says:

    “Blessed is the destiny of the good people who by performing kirtan becomes virtuous persons.”[17]

    Guru Arjan refers of the noble life of the devotee and says:

    “He hears the kirtan and engages himself in meditation. This is the characteristic of holy life.” [18]

    This is a story current in Iran (Persia) about a group of Sikhs who had settled there in the eighteenth century in a place called “Duzdan” which literally means the place of thieves. Once the ruler of that country happened to pass incognita through that place early in the morning. At that time, the Sikhs who had gathered together in a house, as usual were performing kirtan. The ruler heard the sacred music, while standing outside and was much impressed by their devotion. He felt that the name of the town should be changed as it was not a place of thieves but of holy men. He changed the name of the town from “Duzdan” to “Zahindan” which means the city of pious. Such is the great influence of kirtan on people who belong to other faiths.

    4) Valuable Asset

    The Gurus regarded kirtan as an invaluable gem, a diamond, Guru Ramdas says:

    “God’s Name is the only jewel and ruby. Through it, truth, contentment and wisdom are obtained... Kirtan is a priceless diamond. It is an ocean of bliss and virtues.” [19]

    The comparison is appropriate for obvious reasons. Firstly, just as the diamond emits light, kirtan provides illumination in this dark world. It is beneficial to the physically and spiritually blind, because they can listen to kirtan and thus gain peace of mind. Secondly, kirtan pierces the heart just as the diamond cuts through a hard substance. Guru Ramdas says:

    “God Name is a diamond and a ruby, with which my soul and body are pierced .”[20]

    Thirdly like the diamond, kirtan is a permanent and stable asset. Guru Arjan affirms:

    “Kingdom, wealth and paraphernalia are of no use; God’s kirtan is my mainstay. This wealth is stable and everlasting.”[21]

    Thus kirtan is a permanent and valuable heritage both for its aesthetic and spiritual enrichment.

    5) Fountain of Bliss

    Hymns are generally sung in slow and sustained tones to create a feeling of repose or ‘spiritual pull’ so as to attune the mind to the thoughts of the Guru. As such the display of musical virtuosity is held under restraint. It is the Holy word which uplifts the mind; poetry and music are brought in to magnify its emotional appeal. Kirtan creates a congenial environment which helps devotion. By repeated hammering of shabad, the mind becomes stable.
    Kirtan creates a sense of true peace and spiritual aspiration. It is a sort of communion with Divinity. The minds of the devotees who perform or listen to kirtan are filled with zeal and fervour. They feel inwardly satisfied with the solace offered by sacred music:

    “There is forever joy and charm of spontaneous music. The saintly beings abide there and regard kirtan as their solid sustenance.”[22]

    6) Divine Nectar

    Kirtan of Gurbani is regarded as nectar or the water of immortality which liberates man from the bondage of materialism. The inner lotus blossoms by listening to sacred music and man’s soul is purified. Guru Ramdas puts it thus:

    “The nectar-like Bani is the divine essence; it resides within the God-oriented.
    The lotus of the heart is illumined, man’s light merges with the Supreme Light.”[23]

    The effect of kirtan is three-fold. Firstly, by listening to it, the aesthetic senses are satisfied; Secondly, the rasa (feeling) of kirtan delights the inner consciousness and offers spiritual nutrition; and thirdly, man’s soul is transported into a realm of ecstasy. Guru Arjan sums up the benefits of kirtan in the following lines:

    “Singing the Lord’s praise, the soul is illuminated and the mortal abides the Lord’s lotus feet. In the saints’ society, he is emancipated, Nanak says, he crosses the terrible world ocean.” [24].

    7) Bestower of salvation

    Kirtan, through high thinking and holy feeling removes the fear of death and cuts the chain of transmigration. The cycle of birth and death comes to an end. Guru Arjan says;

    “Day and night, sing kirtan of God, and you will never go into the cycle of transmigration”[25].

    The demons of death dare not approach the performer of kirtan, because, if by error they do so, they will be called to account by God. Kirtan is therefore the means of liberation or salvation of the individual. According to Guru Amardas, by singing praises to the Lord’s attributes, one is instinctively influenced by them. He says about the devoted singers:

    “They are full of bliss; by singing His virtues they merge in the Ocean of Virtue” [26]

    Source: Amrit Keertan Gutka ::page:SearchGurbani.com


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  3. spnadmin

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    Kaur1 ji

    This essay is like a prayer itself! For those who think that the ideas expressed here are either rubbish (Bah! Humbug!) or religious and therefore unprovable fantasies, they should open their ears and listen to the stories of individuals for whom many of the ideas have become real.

    There are two things in the essay that connect with me. Since listening to kirtaan daily, the fact is, trouble did not disappear from my life. However, many, many wonderful things have also happened. Things I would have never dared ask for; things that I could have never imagined. The other reality in this essay is that kirtaan does literally pierce the heart. Bibi Amarjit Kaur has a CD of banis; she sings rather than recites the 5 essential banis. The vibration of her voice when she sings Rehras penetrates right to the heart physically; sometimes it is even painful.

    There is a lot to study in this post. You do good katha.

    Respectfully
     
  4. kaur-1

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    aad0002 ji, Oh no, its not me doing the katha, I just post what i have read and find important to share. Gurbani Kirtan is an important subject to me so I thought I will post this from the source link indicated.
    BTW, Moorakh means fool or foolish (some say its a sinner).

    It says in gurbani we have to accept Dukh like Sukh. In spn there is post on this subject taken from an article I read and also see the post on Guru Arjan Dev ji. Another link for you 'Sikhiwiki' : Guru Arjan - SikhiWiki, free Sikh encyclopedia.

    I know nothing but am learning unfortunately making lots of mistakes along the way too.!! Thats why I called myself a moorakh.
     
  5. simpy

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    kljug mih kIrqnu prDwnw ]
    gurmuiK jpIAY lwie iDAwnw ]
    Awip qrY sgly kul qwry hir drgh piq isau jwiedw ]
     
  6. spnadmin

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    Surinder Kaur Cheema ji,

    Thank you for joining us in this quiet place on the forum.

    "In this Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Kirtan of the Lord's Praises are most sublime and exalted. Become Gurmukh, chant and focus your meditation. You shall save yourself, and save all your generations as well. You shall go to the Court of the Lord with honor."

    This shabd kind of makes me want to cry.

    Respectfully
     
  7. Archived_member2

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    Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakal!
    Dear all!

    In Kaljug Keertan becomes primal just as Koorh (falsehood).

    Gurdev is singing "kaljug rath agan kaa koorh agai rathvaahu." SGGS Ang 470-3
    In Kaljug, fire is the chariot and falsehood the charioteer.

    Singing about Kaljug He describes it also on Ang 1075-19 "kaljug meh keertan parDhaanaa." SGGS Ang 1075-19

    --------------

    The first and most important in Kaljug is Jap or Simran of Naam or Shabad.

    Gurdev says "kaljug meh raam naam ur Dhaar. bin naavai maathai paavai chhaar." SGGS Ang 1129-14
    In Kaljug let the Raam Naam dwell in heart. Without Naam is putting ashes on the forehead.

    In the same Shabad Guru Amardas Ji is singing further "kaljug meh raam naam hai saar."
    In Kaljug the essence is Raam Naam.

    One more example from Guru Raam Daas Jee is this "kaljug naam parDhaan padaarath bhagat janaa uDhray." SGGS Ang 995-6
    In Kaljug Naam is the primeval matter that grows upwards in heart of the worshipers.

    --------------

    In my view, Keertan is the praise of God resulted by the Simran of His true Naam.
    Today Keertan has turned out to be a good business for earning while imitating the Hymns from the Gurus without knowing true Simran.
    Who else is seeing Kaljug clearly than the Gurus?


    Balbir Singh
     
  8. spnadmin

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    Balbir ji,

    It will take some time for me to absorb what you have said.

    Yes, there are many raagis who have a very commercial presentation. There are some however who are teachers. This morning, after reading what Surinder Kaur ji had to say, I turned to Bhai Surinder Singh ji for spiritual company.

    There are also others.

    Thank you
     
  9. drkhalsa

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    Thanks for the wonderful post but I could not guess or find the answer to above question you asked at the end of the post.=

    can u elaborate further if p=ossible.=


    Thanks


    Jatinder Singh
     
  10. spnadmin

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    Dr. Kalsa ji,

    I was wondering myself. Balbir's answer depends on whether he was asking a rhetorical question, and, if he was, then the answer is, No one can see more clearly than the Gurus. But, Balbir ji makes a strong point for the topic of doing kirtan, for Kaljug is the 4th age, and without spiritual discipline, its importance will be lost on all of us, except the gurus. So that was very interesting and led to more thought and reflection.

    There is an interesting article about Kaljug at this link.
    Harjas.com - Articles - Kaljug

    Respectfully
     
  11. kaur-1

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    Dear Balbir Singh ji, The use of "resulted" threw me. Isnt Gurbani Keertan Naam jap - naam Simran?
     
  12. Archived_member2

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    Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakal!
    Dear all!

    Suppose a person eats ripened mangoes for the first time. He feels like praising its taste. The words and melody he uses to express it are Keertan. The true Keertan is the result of true Simran.

    I have heard people reciting slokas about the taste of mangoes, referring even the page and line number with commas and full-stops. A truthful person expresses his experience as it flows through his existence, not as they write it somewhere.

    Spiritually poor are those people who miss the original taste of God's Naam Simran but go on imitating others. In Kaljug they pretend to know while singing borrowed songs. This is the falsehood (Koorh).

    Some rare are blessed also. Listening them, is joyous. Rishis sang Vedas, Upnishads and Puranas their way. The Gurus sang Truth their way. The Truth is the same though.

    God wishes to hear Truth from us all. Strange, the preacher mind trains many to put a parrot recorder on.

    God created everyone unique to express His Truth in a unique way. This becomes possible flawlessly only after receiving True Naam as Gurprasaad.


    Balbir Singh
     
  13. simpy

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    Respected Kaur-1 Ji, aad0002 Ji and drkhalsa Ji,


    Kirtan: Singing the Glories of God/Guru

    so ikCu kir ijqu mYlu n lwgY ]
    hir kIrqn mih eyhu mnu jwgY ]

    pwrbRhmu hoAw shweI kQw kIrqnu suKdweI ]
    gur pUry kI bwxI jip Andu krhu inq pRwxI ]


    swDsMig hir kIrqnu gweIAY ]

    Anidnu kIrqnu kyvl bK´wnu ]
    igRhsq mih soeI inrbwnu ]

    kwhU Pl kI ieCw nhI bwCY ]
    kyvl Bgiq kIrqn sMig rwcY ]




    Ø The kirtan that happens as a result of Simran efforts that means liv Parm Pita Naal jur gai hai, Hari’s Simran and Kirtan, is being heard, felt, sung……….. everywhere, within and without. This is a very high Spiritual state, very rare reaches that state of mind…



    Ø The kirtan that we do with Jori Baaja, Sitar, Ravaab and tabla.... made of material goods, or we listen to recorded kirtan(this is also Guru di Daat)-

    Wakes up our mind,
    It revives the Divine Love in our hearts, that was already present there but we were unaware of it.
    Kirtan and reading Bani with one pointed concentration works on bringing up the sense of detachment(Vairaag).
    We sing glorifications of our Guru and Waheguru, alone or with others. i guess that is NEEDED, isn't it......
    Singing Gods praises(kirtan) make us stop thinking about other stuff, this is the best way to make our thought process tranquil.


    Guru Ji mentions singing of Bani many times-

    hau FwFI hir pRB Ksm kw hir kY dir AwieAw ]
    hir AMdir suxI pUkwr FwFI muiK lwieAw ]
    hir puiCAw FwFI sid kY ikqu AriQ qUM AwieAw ]
    inq dyvhu dwnu dieAwl pRB hir nwmu iDAwieAw ]
    hir dwqY hir nwmu jpwieAw nwnku pYnwieAw ]


    Kwlk kau Awdysu FwFI gwvxw ]
    nwnk jugu jugu eyku mMin vswvxw ]


    kir ikrpw sMqn scu kihAw ]
    srb sUK iehu Awnµdu lihAw ]
    swDsMig hir kIrqnu gweIAY ]
    khu nwnk vfBwgI pweIAY ]


    FwFI iqs no AwKIAY ij KsmY Dry ipAwru ]
    dir KVw syvw kry gur sbdI vIcwru ]
    FwFI dru Gru pwiesI scu rKY aur Dwir ]
    FwFI kw mhlu Aglw hir kY nwie ipAwir ]
    FwFI kI syvw cwkrI hir jip hir insqwir ]



    hau iqsu FwFI kurbwxu ij qyrw syvdwru ]
    hau iqsu FwFI bilhwr ij gwvY gux Apwr ]
    so FwFI Dnu DMnu ijsu loVy inrMkwru ]
    so FwFI BwgTu ijsu scw duAwr bwru ]
    Ehu FwFI quDu iDAwie klwxy idnu rYxwr ]
    mMgY AMimRq nwmu n AwvY kdy hwir ]
    kpVu Bojnu scu rhdw ilvY Dwr ]
    so FwFI guxvMqu ijs no pRB ipAwru ]



    hir kIrqnu suxY hir kIrqnu gwvY ]
    iqsu jn dUKu inkit nhI AwvY ]



    One point to be noted- Dhan Dhan Guru Sahibaan has arranged all the Bani under ragas and even taal(rhythm) is also specified for every Shabad. WHY???? so that Gurbani can be sung as well. - do we need more proof, do we???? 'NO'.

    All of the Bani is GURPRASAAD, Check at the beginnings of every new Chapter in Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji-do we need more proof????? -'NO'.

    Gurmukho let us not forget Gurbani Kirtan is Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Nanak Dev Sache Paatshah's initiated and approved tradition ………..




    forgive me please
     
  14. spnadmin

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    Surinder Kaur ji

    No one could have described more clearly than you the gift of kirtan, for it brings love to the heart. Why? Kirtan is felt and brings peace to the mind and leaves no room whatsoever in the mind for the noise of the day.

    No question what-so-ever.

    With thanks
     
    #13 spnadmin, Mar 21, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 21, 2007
  15. sahilmakkar1983

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    Great paaji great
    simply great...
    this is true.... without eating, praising is fake..
    without seeing GOD. his praise will not take us anywhere..
    thats why NAAMDEV JI SAYS
    ਜਬ ਦੇਖਾ ਤਬ ਗਾਵਾ
    जब देखा तब गावा ॥
    jab daykhaa tab gaavaa.
    When I see Him, I sing His Praises.

    ਤਉ ਜਨ ਧੀਰਜੁ ਪਾਵਾ ॥੧॥
    तउ जन धीरजु पावा ॥१॥
    ta-o jan Dheeraj paavaa. ||1||
    Then I, his humble servant, become patient. ||1||

    TRUE BHAGATS sang after seeing GOD.. not like us..



    AGAIN SAID AT PAGE NO 1113
    ਜਬ ਦੇਖਾਂ ਪਿਰੁ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਹਰਿ ਗੁਣ ਰਸਿ ਰਵਾ ਰਾਮ ॥
    जब देखां पिरु पिआरा हरि गुण रसि रवा राम ॥
    jab daykhaaN pir pi-aaraa har gun ras ravaa raam.
    When I see my Beloved Husband Lord, I chant the Lord's Glorious Praises with love.

    ਮੇਰੈ ਅੰਤਰਿ ਹੋਇ ਵਿਗਾਸੁ ਪ੍ਰਿਉ ਪ੍ਰਿਉ ਸਚੁ ਨਿਤ ਚਵਾ ਰਾਮ

    मेरै अंतरि होइ विगासु प्रिउ प्रिउ सचु नित चवा राम ॥
    mayrai antar ho-ay vigaas pari-o pari-o sach nit chavaa raam.
    My inner being blossoms forth; I continually utter, "Pri-o! Pri-o! Beloved! Beloved!

    ਪ੍ਰਿਉ ਚਵਾ ਪਿਆਰੇ ਸਬਦਿ ਨਿਸਤਾਰੇ ਬਿਨੁ ਦੇਖੇ ਤ੍ਰਿਪਤਿ ਆਵਏ
    प्रिउ चवा पिआरे सबदि निसतारे बिनु देखे त्रिपति न आवए ॥
    pari-o chavaa pi-aaray sabad nistaaray bin daykhay taripat na aav-ay.
    I speak of my Dear Beloved, and through the Shabad, I am saved. Unless I can see Him, I am not satisfied.

    ਸਬਦਿ ਸੀਗਾਰੁ ਹੋਵੈ ਨਿਤ ਕਾਮਣਿ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵਏ
    सबदि सीगारु होवै नित कामणि हरि हरि नामु धिआवए ॥
    sabad seegaar hovai nit kaaman har har naam Dhi-aav-ay.
    That soul-bride who is ever adorned with the Shabad, meditates on the Name of the Lord, Har, Har.

    ਦਇਆ ਦਾਨੁ ਮੰਗਤ ਜਨ ਦੀਜੈ ਮੈ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਮੁ ਦੇਹੁ ਮਿਲਾਏ
    दइआ दानु मंगत जन दीजै मै प्रीतमु देहु मिलाए ॥
    da-i-aa daan mangat jan deejai mai pareetam dayh milaa-ay.
    Please bless this beggar, Your humble servant, with the Gift of Mercy; please unite me with my Beloved.

    ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਗੋਪਾਲੁ ਧਿਆਈ ਹਮ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਵਿਟਹੁ ਘੁਮਾਏ ॥੨॥
    अनदिनु गुरु गोपालु धिआई हम सतिगुर विटहु घुमाए ॥२॥
    an-din gur gopaal Dhi-aa-ee ham satgur vitahu ghumaa-ay. ||2||
    Night and day, I meditate on the Guru, the Lord of the World; I am a sacrifice to the True Guru. ||2||

     
    #14 sahilmakkar1983, Mar 21, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 5, 2016
  16. Archived_member2

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    Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakal!
    Dear all!

    Jatinder Ji wants further explanation of the curiosity raised "Who else is seeing Kaljug clearly than the Gurus?"
    Only those whose conscious mind is now awakening by true Naam Simran may be aware of this.
    GurbAnee says "simar simar simar gur apunaa so-i-aa manu jaagaa-ee." SGGS Ang 758-6 Soohee, Guru Ram Das

    Kaur-1 Ji asked "Isnt Gurbani Keertan Naam jap - naam Simran?"
    Whole GurbAnee is the result of Naam Jap. Hari Keertan is what Hari (God) incites in an individual by repeating His Naam. Simran or Jap of Naam or Gurshabad is the beginning and never ending Truth.
    One who does Simran first (bhalkay uth har naam Dhi-aavai), reaches the state of DhyAn. Then his activities become singing Keertan (fir charhai divas gurbaanee gaavai).
    Gurdev is explaining here clearly the difference.

    Surinder Ji wrote "The kirtan that we do with Jori Baaja and tabla made of material goods, or we listen to recorded kirtan-Wakes up our mind."
    In my view, it is the Guru's message that has soothing effect in calling our mind to awake. It is not the Baajaa, Tabla, tape recorder nor the music. One can hear Joree, Baajaa and the tune without Guru's Words and feel the difference.

    Quote "Kirtan and reading Bani with one pointed concentration works on bringing up the sense of detachment(Vairaag)."
    Gurdev never suggested reading Baanee or Keertan as the technique to bring up detachments. Please provide one reference if possible. I will be grateful.
    Gurdev is explaining often that singing and reading anything without being blessed with Naam, is going astray.

    Quote "We sing glorifications of our Guru and Waheguru, alone or with others. i guess that is NEEDED, isn't it......"
    Sure. Nevertheless, come to know true Simran first, the most precious Naam Gurdev is suggesting.

    quote "Singing Gods praises(kirtan) make us stop thinking about other stuff, this is the best way to make our thought process tranquil."
    This is the deflective tactic of clever mind. One is now with thoughts analyzing Keertan. The true way to transcend the thought level is true Simran.

    Quote "One point to be noted- Dhan Dhan Guru Sahibaan has arranged all the Bani under ragas and even taal(rhythm) is also specified for every Shabad. WHY????"
    Please provide one reference from the Gurus where they asked us to sing their Hymns in RAgAs and Taals.
    I have found many Vaaks from Gurdev warning about singers who sing in RAgAs with Taals.

    Quote "Gurmukho let us not forget Kirtan is Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Nanak Dev Sache Paatshah di chalaaee hoi tradion……….."
    Guru NAnak Dev Jee is not the only Gurdev who started the praise of Hari (Keertan). Hari Keertan is the flow without obstructions as the result of true Naam Simran.
    Strange. Many pretend to imitate HIM.


    Balbir Singh
     
  17. sahilmakkar1983

    sahilmakkar1983
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    U r very true
    koi shak nahi
    Vaheguru da ehi hukam he ki ... sacha naam prapat karo.. te ode te chalde jao
     
  18. sahilmakkar1983

    sahilmakkar1983
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    Va paaji va
    ehi such he
    ehi such he
    bus ehi such he.. no body knows true simran..
    and yet they are talking about it.
    Simran is ongoing process... and it is unspoken word

    KIRTAM NAAM KATHE TERE JIBHA.. SATNAM TERA PARA PURBALA
    means :: our toungue recites the false names.. so our toungue cant say the true name. so it is unspoken.. SATNAM is power.. is cosmic vibration going in every being as stated in this lines:::
    ਗੁਪਤਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਰਤੈ ਵਿਚਿ ਕਲਜੁਗਿ ਘਟਿ ਘਟਿ ਹਰਿ ਭਰਪੂਰਿ ਰਹਿਆ
    गुपता नामु वरतै विचि कलजुगि घटि घटि हरि भरपूरि रहिआ ॥
    guptaa naam vartai vich kaljug ghat ghat har bharpoor rahi-aa.
    The Naam, the Name of the Lord, is hidden, but it is pervasive in the Dark Age. The Lord is totally pervading and permeating each and every heart.

    ਨਾਮੁ ਰਤਨੁ ਤਿਨਾ ਹਿਰਦੈ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਿਆ ਜੋ ਗੁਰ ਸਰਣਾਈ ਭਜਿ ਪਇਆ ॥੨॥
    नामु रतनु तिना हिरदै प्रगटिआ जो गुर सरणाई भजि पइआ ॥२॥
    naam ratan tinaa hirdai pargati-aa jo gur sarnaa-ee bhaj pa-i-aa. ||2||
    The Jewel of the Naam is revealed within the hearts of those who hurry to the Sanctuary of the Guru. ||2||

    GURUFATEH
     
    #17 sahilmakkar1983, Mar 21, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 5, 2016
  19. drkhalsa

    drkhalsa
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    Respected Balbir ji

    Thanks for wonderfull post as always and thanks for answering queries



    Respected Sahilmakkar ji
    I am trying to understand your post pls help.

    Does this means that some Moorakh/Agiyani like me who havent met god /havent recieved Naam should just keep quite and speak nothing about God



    Jatinder Singh
     
  20. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    Balbir Singh ji

    Also moorath, also unschooled in matters of Naam and Simran, I would ask you to consider my question.

    How can a person know whether his/her understanding of the benefits of kirtan is authentic?

    A short example from Christianity might help clarify my question. What is the true nature of the Holy Trinity? This question has provoked controversy among Christians over the centuries. Do Jesus, the incarnation of god, and the holy sprit emanate from a single godhead who is the all-knowing father-creator? Or are the father, the son and the holy ghost equal in relationship? Some religious thinkers will take a very scholarly approach and base their answer on scripture. Although they all use the same set of scriptures, they come to different conclusions (hence the Roman and Eastern churches). Other religious thinkers answer this question from the heart, using personal inspiration about the meaning of scripture to find an answer. Again, they also come to different conclusions. Many interpretations are possible.

    I am noticing that there are two different approaches (scholarly or intuitive) to understand the benefits of Kirtan. Which is the better way for a devotee to follow? Or are both necessary?

    Respectfully
     
  21. Archived_member2

    Archived_member2
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    Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakal!
    Dear all and Aad0002 Ji!

    Question "How can a person know whether his/her understanding of the benefits of kirtan is authentic?"
    A person, who is nourishing his existence with mayic poisons every day, needs to taste Amrit (Elixir) once at least. His understanding will not remain the same.

    Question "I am noticing that there are two different approaches (scholarly or intuitive) to understand the benefits of Kirtan. Which is the better way for a devotee to follow? Or are both necessary?"
    For the spiritual growth both are superficial. The true approach is with Naam, Prasaad from the Guru only.


    Balbir Singh
     

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