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Anti-western Sentiment

Discussion in 'Convert's Corner' started by Ishna, Feb 13, 2016.

  1. Ishna

    Ishna
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    [I wasn't sure whether I should put this in my blog, or here. Apologies if it's not in the right place.]

    A thick skin is required of "Western Sikhs" as anti-western sentiment from some of our fellow Sikhs is bound to be apparent from time-to-tide.

    I can understand some of where it comes from (colonialism) and what feeds it today (racism, protection of culture and heritage).

    It's a bit rich for a "privileged Westerner" to come along and feast at the proverbial table of the Sikhs when, in history, we've already taken so much. Why should we deserve to savour the pearls of Sikhi, when Westerners ravaged the country, and some of us express such racist hatred throughout the world towards Sikhs and Indians even today.

    What impact has this had on you non-Punjabi "converts" to Sikhi? How do you transcend it? Do you ever feel like you a) don't deserve to be there, and b) that "they" don't want you there?

    Do you ever ponder that if the core of Sikhi is universal, why those core elements can't be expressed purely on the backdrop of our own cultures?
     
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  3. ActsOfGod

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    Guru Sahib's message is for all humanity, there is no exclusion, it is meant for everyone to savor and to better their lives. There is no guilt or blame, everyone deserves it regardless of their ethnicity or cultural/racial background.

    As for the hatred, Sikhs are like the flower that, even when being trampled underfoot, still gives off it's beautiful fragrance.

    Persecution is nothing new for Sikhs. Our history has been written in our blood. It is our heritage that we stood up for our principles and our defending truth, and we will continue to do so. Corrupt rulers and governments come and go, but the roots of Sikhi that was planted by Baba Nanak run deep, and they can never be destroyed. It is such a plant that they more they try to destroy it, the more it spreads and flourishes!

    [AoG]
     
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  4. Parma

    Parma United Kingdom
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    Sounds too much like my life story. ☺
     
  5. Inderjeet Kaur

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    If I ever hear another Punjabi Sikh say that all Western women (especially USAers) are whores, I refuse to hold myself responsible for my actions, although the law might. :angrysingh:This sort of disrespect must stop. True, customs and perhaps moral stands are different, but this sort of insult is unbecoming of any Sikh and it hurts and embarrasses me that my brothers (it's always a Singh) feel the need to engage in such slander.:angrykudi:
     
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  6. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    I do not believe that this sentiment is based on the colour of ones skin, it is based on the culture of our hearts, any new convert will bring a fresh and new perspective, will ask questions, as both yourself and @Harkiran Kaur ji have demonstrated, some of those questions, there are no answers for, some of those questions will shows flaws in understanding, it is in Indian culture to accept, without question, aspects of religion, which is why it has been so easy to bring Vedic and Abrahamic thought into Sikhism, no one is going to argue with an elder. It is, however, more in the western culture to question, to seek clarification, to expose double standards and hypocrisy, it is not a colour thing, it is a culture thing.
     
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  7. Parma

    Parma United Kingdom
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    Just! Example of society and how much interaction with different types of individual's can change a perspective. You look at a typical Singh or a typical Ali G type of character and the world assumes so much but knows so little. From modern day airport checking to credit scores, to work references you name it. Opinions matter. That is for society to understand itself in where it stands nobody is perfect but I guess yeh. Never judge a book by its cover lol〽✔:angrysingh::kaurhug::ikoankaar::seachlightsingh:. Some people can totally push it further if they wanted to all the way. Waheguru ji ki khalsa, Waheguru ji ki fathe! Sometimes its just something about that terminology that we all need to respect above all else; that sacred word that has a form and which was founded not by a formless but by a witness on earth does the world progress by a Shabad Guru by the kirpa of its form, I'll leave that for a real humble soul to ponder, a word is referenced in every holy book out there in every book within every philosophy based on knowledge if looked at in an engrossed indepth evaluation of its subject total in it all within every book and every philosophy the result of the messages and words this words terminology stands out above all else, who is the creator without creation= PEACE!! An author without the reader. Report a Mission, of Report; A Good Child.:bluekhanda: Khalsa Ki Fauj, Akal Purakh Ka Fauj. Certain types of Teachers really are the pets! Lol Waheguru, Waheguru! Ss Of Ministry Of :ikoankaar: Akal Purakh.
     
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    #6 Parma, Feb 13, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2016
  8. Parma

    Parma United Kingdom
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    From countries to Businesses to commodities I thought that the United Kingdom knew it's own authorities and institutions. Not foreign methodology when it comes to reporting educational purposes and special needs occasions and events on PEACE. Can I have my own newspaper the "titles"(maybe a miss spelling) are boring. Lol Goes to show we all need the attention of God no matter how big we get!:omgg:.lolly pop's! Lol. I'm quite peaceful I always was a Gurshant. Lol
     
    #7 Parma, Feb 13, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2016
  9. Joginder Singh Foley

    Joginder Singh Foley United Kingdom
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    The brits where in my country {Ireland} and we all know the eight and a half century history of exploitation theft and genocide there long before they found their way to India where does that leave this "White Western" Sikh

    :singhfacepalm::seachlightsingh:
     
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  10. Ishna

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    Does it ever make you feel... isolated? Or like... you need to embrace your Irish heritage (us vs them mentality, I suppose)?

    Or, has it ever made you feel this way on your Sikh journey?
     
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  11. Inderjeet Kaur

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    "For eight hundred years, we fought ya without fears
    And we'll fight you for 800 more. [Admin Singh ji would have a profanity-induced heart attack if I tried to post all the lyrics.]
    The world's longest war, I think 847 years now, if me arithmetic is correct.
    The history of the Irish people and the Sikh people has startling parallels. I point these out occasionally on my Facebook page. I believe the Irish have been blessed with a dominant chardi kala gene; Sikhs have to work at it more, but it's still the #1 marker of both Irish and Sikhs.
    I should perhaps start using my professional logo, a shamrock and a kirpan in an embracing circle here on SPN.

    You might, you will enjoy a eulogy I wrote for a dear friend of mine, Sean "Red" O'Connor who died a couple years ago. http://farunattainablesky.blogspot.com/2013/06/sean-red-oconnor-2013-in-memorium.html
     
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    #10 Inderjeet Kaur, Feb 14, 2016
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  12. Parma

    Parma United Kingdom
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    To my old comrades I would like to just say that from a Sikhs perspective that our histories are a combined type of system both affected by colonialism and both gone through hardships to develop that trust they lost as kids growing up. Always fully forevermore a dear friend of my truest Alliances regardless of wherever that journey may take us. God speed to warp speed and like star trek says when my time comes hopefully they'll remember that beam me up Scotty= (donkey) was actually beam me up Sikhi. Too much of a shared combined history what can I say but God bless. Hopefully with our types of heritages we can once again credit the creative natural force with a civilized peaceful existence of structures that a future world and civilization would embrace out of natural development of nature's natural beauty and resources. Leaving the comfort of snobbery to the one's whom in time will obviously realise who was for there benefit and who was against. Time shows the value of love and hate. Let's see if in time our communities can see each other as more than just good friends but as good families. Slowly developing together we keep everyone safe. We were always ahead of our classes or casts that they always try to box us in with. Humanity although we mistakenly over step the mark with each other sometimes the realisation is that we are all developed from a shared common ground. Earth. Nothing but good values and respect I offer my own country. By remembering all the time and effort been wasted in forming a sustainable relationship I am a true servant of humble, humility. I guess I have to say that the ones who hurt an innocent time will pay in God's natural own curve of light. When will they learn to treat there own let alone others with true love only the great spirit of time will tell. For any hard felt sentiments I would like to offer my sincerest apologies. Why I've been neglected and treated so badly as a fellow Brit let alone as an family member by whoever is incharge of that sentiment I will leave for you all to ponder, as a worldwide human species, I'll always wonder If love conquers all. All the best. Ek Onkar! They only ever needed to show love to one. They never realised the true values and sentiments of humanity and you have these others that try and level mention other parallels and sentiments to the power of one, disgraceful! What can you do when they cannot even aspire to the value of one. Ek Onkar read from were the innocence of Guru Granth Sahib Ji transends from; can anyone replicate or replace that. No. Good luck with the future! Lol. Peace.
     
    #11 Parma, Feb 14, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2016
  13. Harkiran Kaur

    Harkiran Kaur Canada
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    I have experienced both ends of the spectrum. Generally speaking the Sikhs who follow Sikh Rehet Maryada, don't associate with deras etc. are totally open, welcoming etc. Basics of Sikhi is doing a great job of spreading Sikhi through Parchar. And it's being noticed, as many people are coming to Sikhi through their work! My whole husband's family, all his co-workers and friends are very happy at my embracing Sikhi and even moreso since I took Amrit. Of course the news story helped a bit also.
    I have also encountered the dera mentality, who don't really like women very much to begin with and think we are to sit quietly shut up and listen while the men do all the leading etc. They are less welcoming in general, and even less so to western females because you know.... nasty western feminism. How dare us come into Sikhi with the idea that women should have equal treatment to men.

    There are different groups, sects, jathas in Sikhi. Generally AKJ (Akhand Kirtani Jatha) are VERY open to converts, and practice full equality of everyone. However their rehet is a bit more strict so some people find that hard to follow. But They are very welcoming to anyone who wants to follow Sikhi. They are also great at simran and kirtan and their samagams are second to none for the atmosphere and feeling you get.

    Anyway just find a group who will welcome you. If you go to a Gurdwara where they are suspicious, or think of you as not worthy etc. Leave, find another Gurdwara. Those Sikhs who think like that are not behaving as Sikhs should anyway. We should always associate with POSITIVE sangat.

    I was lucky here in my city, the sangat here was VERY VERY open. Our Gurdwara had already had a Gora as a president. And I came to Sikhi basically through him and his wife (well to the Gurdwara I mean, as I had studied years prior to that). Now I am on my second year serving on the management committee (treasurer last year and member at large this year). I am pretty close with most of the sangat here and they support me very much! When I managed to get the military to allow me to tie turban in uniform, the Gurdwara honoured me with siropa. I was so surprised and humbled I was in tears. I didnt feel like i had done something enough to deserve it. I have it kept in a special place. Actually I keep my nitnem gutka wrapped in it as the fabric is too stiff to use as a dastar.

    Anyway, both here and in India, I have never encountered negativity as a convert.

    Only in a few forums online, encountering the dera people and certain sampardas (groups) who seem to be against western females in particular because they see western women as too free (feminism). And somehow wanting to be treated equally or have equal opportunity to the SInghs must mean we hate men. LOL. (seriously, they do think this way!)
     

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