Rehabilitation or Decimation?

harry haller · #1 (**permalink**) 30-May-2012, 16:41 PM

Gurfatehji

There are a lot of unwholesome types out there, bullies, rapists, sexual deviants, drug dealers, pimps etc. The world is full of some quite nasty people. My own philosophy is to avoid such at all costs, rather than get involved, I find there are many innocent people that have fallen, and they take priority when I give my time to try and help.

So what we do when we come across the nasty people of the world, those for whom a certain way of life is normal, devoid of respect or kindness, whose only objective is to gain money, or indeed whatever they want through force and intimidation, on the one hand, Guru Nanakji rehabilitated thugs, on the other hand Guru Gobind Singhji decimated them, although I feel Bandaji possibly went a bit too far.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/38579-rehabilitation-or-decimation.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38579

My own feeling is that Creator gave us a brain, Guruji shows us how to use it, and it is up to us to use it wisely and adopt the correct retaliation as per the situation, however, there are those that feel the way of Guru Nanakji should always be a first consideration, just like those that feel the way of decimation should be the primary consideration. In my view there is no text book way to deal with any situation, I think a true Sikh should be a person capable of anything as per Sikh philosophy, and not mired in one extreme philsophy or another.

We must forgive, as such is good for the soul, but we must never forget, for that would be stupid,

comments welcome

Kamala · #2 (**permalink**) 31-May-2012, 09:05 AM

I don't understand what you are trying to say..

Luckysingh · #3 (**permalink**) 31-May-2012, 11:02 AM

I think it's a matter of keeping a balance, that's what I always try to do.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38579
We must try to forgive but it's not always easy.
In all fairness we can all argue that rapists may be given to long sentences, just to say as an example. It could be equivalent sentences to murderers let's say. Taking these views we may all vote that they be reduced so as to stop overcrowding and costs!!

BUT, if the rapist had raped your sister or wife, then would you still feel the same and be willing to forgive a few years off the sentence ??
Very unlikely!!!
So, personal affects do play a role no matter how strictly we adhere to laws and ethics.
This is where we have to personally maintain a correct balance with both approaches.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38579
But, trying to forgive is better than not even attempting it.

harry haller · #4 (**permalink**) 31-May-2012, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamala

I don't understand what you are trying to say..

Do you wish me to me mention a few Hindu deities to make it easier to understand Kamalaji?

Kamala · #5 (**permalink**) 01-Jun-2012, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harry haller

Do you wish me to me mention a few Hindu deities to make it easier to understand Kamalaji?

LoL, no thanks. I don't think I want to know after your rudeness..

Gyani Jarnail Singh · #6 (**permalink**) 01-Jun-2012, 06:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamala

LoL, no thanks. I don't think I want to know after your rudeness..

BUT that BAD behavior is MENTIONED IN GURBANI...like How SHIVA assumed the figure of a RISHI, went into his hut after the Rishi had gone for his morning bath, raped her....and then when the Rishi returned and found out about the RAPE of his beautiful wife by SHIVA the GOD...He CURSED SHIVA to have HUNDREDS of FEMALE VAGINAS all over his body (becasue he loved that part of the female anatomy badly enough to rape a wife of his own sisshya/follower) and he also CURSED the MOON by throiwng his wet towel at it !! (Becasue the Moon rose early to create impression that it was time for his bath....and also the cock who crowed early as well to cheat the Rishi..all Co-Conspirators of SHIVA the God !!
BTW the Peacock- fan feathers are used in Hindu mandirs/religious ceremonies because the "EYES" on the Feathers look similar to the Vaginas on Shivas Body....
DG proponents cite this "mere mention of vagina" as EQUAL to DG.s graphic descriptions of sex acts and ORGIES..like comparing a Biology book mention to a vulgar text and justifying that..
We have Brains and Gurbani instructs us..AAkleean Sahib Seveah...so we are able to judge and discern whether we are to "worship" such gods like Shiva or not...mere mention doesnt mean worship...

harry haller · #7 (**permalink**) 01-Jun-2012, 13:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamala

LoL, no thanks. I don't think I want to know after your rudeness..

Apologies Kamalaji,

it was never my intention to be rude, I just wondered if you found it easier to understand concepts using mythical figures from history, some people find it hard to conceptualise without imagery, without a reference point if you will, of course there is the fear that instead of digging beneath the imagery and discovering the message, you get stuck on the imagery, but I am sure you are discerning enough to realise that Bhenji

Kamala · #8 (**permalink**) 02-Jun-2012, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harry haller

Apologies Kamalaji,

it was never my intention to be rude, I just wondered if you found it easier to understand concepts using mythical figures from history, some people find it hard to conceptualise without imagery, without a reference point if you will, of course there is the fear that instead of digging beneath the imagery and discovering the message, you get stuck on the imagery, but I am sure you are discerning enough to realise that Bhenji

LoL, we have imagery of them.

Ishna · #9 (**permalink**) 02-Jun-2012, 18:36 PM

Harry, brother,

Quote:

So what we do when we come across the nasty people of the world, those for whom a certain way of life is normal, devoid of respect or kindness, whose only objective is to gain money, or indeed whatever they want through force and intimidation,

How does one judge a person to be such? The answer to your question lies in the extent to which you are willing and able to judge the other person.

I'm not sure you can compare Guru Nanak ji with Guru Gobind Singh ji in these matters. Guru Nanak worked with thugs 1:1, Guru Gobind Singh worked on the scale of war. I am given to understand he used gold-tipped arrows as compensation for the people he killed, and he authorised Bhai Kanhaiya to administer water and ointment to fallen soldiers. I wouldn't call that decimation and I wouldn't call the soldiers thugs.

Lucky ji makes a good point with his post.

It is a very difficult question you pose, Harry. It is double-edged. Do you remove the criminal entirely to save more innocent victims? Or do you give the criminal (who has already affected someone's entire life) the benefit of the doubt and allow them to ruin more lives on the off chance that they might rehabilitate?

A rapist who rapes, serves time, is released and lives the rest of their lives as a regular person has still got the better deal than the person who was raped who will carry that trauma for the rest of their lives.

What is justice? If justice has been satisfied, and rehabilitation has been effective, then everybody wins. But these days there is no justice and rehabilitation is rarely effective.