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13-Nov-2011, 05:48 AM
|  | .jpg) hing beetle | | | Enrolled: May 9th, 2006
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| | | | | Akhand Paath and Sitting in Darbar Sahib
Gurfateh
Basic questions, your answers are appreciated:
On Akhand Paath (continuous reading of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji) Sikh Rehat Maryada states: " However, it should never be allowed to happen that the reader carries on the reading all by himself/herself and no member of the congregation or the family is listening in to the reading."
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/questions-and-answers/37585-akhand-paath-and-sitting-darbar-sahib.html
The Gurdwara I visit has a sound system which relays the reading of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji to other parts of the Gurdwara, like kitchen and langar hall. Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585
Does that mean it is OK to have no one in Darbar Sahib while the Akhand Paath is being read, or should there always be at least one person in darbar sahib purposefully listening?
If someone finds themselves to be the last person in darbar sahib, are they obliged to stay until someone else comes to listen?
Thanks
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13-Nov-2011, 06:13 AM
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| |  | | | Re: Akhand Paath and sitting in darbar sahib
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishna  Gurfateh
Basic questions, your answers are appreciated:
On Akhand Paath (continuous reading of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji) Sikh Rehat Maryada states: "However, it should never be allowed to happen that the reader carries on the reading all by himself/herself and no member of the congregation or the family is listening in to the reading."
The Gurdwara I visit has a sound system which relays the reading of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji to other parts of the Gurdwara, like kitchen and langar hall.
Does that mean it is OK to have no one in Darbar Sahib while the Akhand Paath is being read, or should there always be at least one person in darbar sahib purposefully listening?
If someone finds themselves to be the last person in darbar sahib, are they obliged to stay until someone else comes to listen?
Thanks
Ishna | Ishna ji,
Guru Fateh.
Let me make a confession. I have never fancied Akhand Paaths, especially when they were done at our house or anyone at my family's. It gave me more the sense of parroting and mechanical ritual than anything else. We do it because it is done in the Gurdwaras 101 non- stop Akhand Paaths etc etc. No where in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, it is mandated to have Akhand Paath.
I always felt uncomfortable although I played my part by volunteering because I love to read the paath aloud. So my volunteering has been for my own selfish reasons because I enjoy it and get into the groove and after about 10 minutes it is an experience that can not be put into words. But I love doing Sehaj Paath because of that at my own pace and again for the selfish enjoyment.
About 3 years ago during my daily walks at 3:30am, a thought came to my mind because my brother was going to have the Akhand Paath at his house.
First, we never hire any Paathi to do it, we all pitch in from the family. I asked all my neices,nephews and my kids who were attending the Akhand Paath to put their lap tops to a better use. We bought about 15 breakfast tables, set up the lap tops on each of them in the room where Akhand Paath was taking place and as every home has wi-fi now, all who were sitting were accompanying the paath over their lap tops. There is a presence of minimum 3 to 5 people during this when we have Akhand Paaths now.
Many have found their own way to enjoy this. The Shabad they happen to like, they delve deeper into it and try to understand it through the translations.
I tried to suggest the same thing at our Gurdwara but was vetoed.
So, now the Akhand Paaths at our homes in the US,Canada, UK and India take place like this and I personally do not feel bad about this ritual as I used to but despite all this, I still prefer my Sehaj Paaths.
Regards
Tejwant Singh  | | The following members appreciate Tejwant Singh Ji for the above message. | |
13-Nov-2011, 08:51 AM
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| | | | | Re: Akhand Paath and Sitting in Darbar Sahib
Quote:
Does that mean it is OK to have no one in Darbar Sahib while the Akhand Paath is being read, or should there always be at least one person in darbar sahib purposefully listening?
If someone finds themselves to be the last person in darbar sahib, are they obliged to stay until someone else comes to listen?
| I think there should be atleast one person present. And sangat should throng to hall when the Guru speaks, shouldn't they? Isn't that such a rare thing? Well it isn't maybe that's why we don't respect it the way we should? And I believe staying back while someone else is there to listen to Guru, is indeed very good manners! | | The following members appreciate Kanwaljit Singh Ji for the above message. | |
13-Nov-2011, 10:57 AM
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| |  | | | Re: Akhand Paath and Sitting in Darbar Sahib
Looks like we SIKHS have lost os much of our MOOJOH..that we have to use words like.."AT LEAST..one.....or..Last person should be OBLIGED to stay until a "replacement" crrives ( hwo may HATE the idea of having his head in the noose like that ?? Ever womndered about it ?? Have we SUNK so LOW...that we have to be "at least 1"..Obliged..etc etc to seek the Presence of our GURU ??? wheres the LOVE..the sense of JOY etc..all these Babas with their 101 larees of akhand paaths and buying and selling of ready made akhand paaths supermarket style....ready made salesman pathees who have absolutley nothing on their minds except MONEY...hence why so many have been caught sleeping on the job..or worse reading PORN on top of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji...chatting on their phones and basically whiling away the time until the replacement comes....AKIRTGHHANNTA..selfishness..basic animal instincts coming to the fore instead of what the GURU teaches... | | The following members appreciate Gyani Jarnail Singh Ji for the above message. | |
13-Nov-2011, 12:18 PM
| | hing beetle | | | Enrolled: May 9th, 2006
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| | | | | Re: Akhand Paath and Sitting in Darbar Sahib
Just to clarify, the wording of my question (ie, use of 'obliged to stay') was because I was being direct with my mundane question. I visited Gurdwara Sahib 11pm last night and found myself in the exact situation. When I arrived there was the paathi and a lady listening. I sat down to my first visit to an Akhand Paath on my own late at night and after 30 minutes the lady got up and left. And hence my pondering the question. A man came in shortly after, and sat down, and I wondered if there were teams of listeners like there are teams of paathis. Sure it's probably not ideal like Gyani ji has said, but ITS HAPPENING and no one wants to breach protocol / not use good manners. Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585
It is a curious ritual but I must say I very much enjoyed being in beautiful Darbar Sahib with the lights on low and the paathi reading steadily, and I closed my eyes and relaxed and listened as best I could and came out from Darbar Sahib outstandingly relaxed. Probably psychosomatic but hey, I'll read whatever I want into my own spirituality. Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585
Maybe the novelty will wear off when I've been to a few more. | | The following members appreciate Ishna Ji for the above message. | |
13-Nov-2011, 13:52 PM
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| |  | | | Re: Akhand Paath and Sitting in Darbar Sahib
Ishna Bhenji,
I understand your predicament completely, I have not been to that many Akand Paths, but I have to confess to not being too impressed by the way in which they have been conducted, to the point that the time was split into shifts with each person doing a 'duty', I was quite young at the time, but do recall telling jokes upstairs, only to be confronted by an angry Aunty who exclaimed that 'how would I like to get up at 2am and read the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji', it made it all sound like a huge inconvenience, rather than a pleasure, but this is the ritual that I hate in sikhism , the duty of path, the duty of Sewa, the duty of Simran, magic words and incantations taht bring good luck, for a house, for a new car, maybe we will see granthis selling their time on ebay to the highest bidder '3 day path', lets start the bidding at say £250 + a mobile phone, Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585
Guru Nanak ji fought long and hard to get away from ritual and for us to use our brains, common sense, logic, the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is not a deity, it is does not have feelings, it is not lonely, the information contained in it though is life changing, beautiful, enchanting, like reading Plato, Hesse, Aristotle, Darwin, Buddha, Freud, but with a few more wow moments,
My own opinion is that you should do what you feel is right for you, sit, enjoy, dwell, meditate, and then when it is time to go, go, anything else is ritualistic and imho less in line with what Guruji preached.
I would prefer to breach protocol than embrace ritual | | The following members appreciate harry haller Ji for the above message. | |
13-Nov-2011, 16:30 PM
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| | | | | Re: Akhand Paath and Sitting in Darbar Sahib
Harry Bhaji Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585
It would be hubris for the noob to march into their second ever Akhand Paath and disregard protocol. imho.
You can also read about Gurdwaras where they have multiple Akhand Paaths going on at the same time, where people do paath of Japji Sahib while the main Akhand Paath is going on. Very strange, very ritualistic. Perhaps there is a happy medium somewhere in there. Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585
And it is a shame that some Gyanis can read so much paath and still be so consumed by greed and ignorance. What does that say about the power of Gurbani then? |
14-Nov-2011, 09:05 AM
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| | | | | Re: Akhand Paath and Sitting in Darbar Sahib
ishna ji.. its written: And it is a shame that some Gyanis can read so much paath and still be so consumed by greed and ignorance. What does that say about the power of Gurbani then?Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585
the Babas and Mahapurashs wearing huge cholas (to cover their huge bellies better) and gol pugghs and multiple Malas (which Guru Nanak ji condemned as dikhawa )....love to relate tall tales such as.....POWER OF GURBANI.....a "waddeh baba ji" gave a young man a dirty sieve....and told him to fetch water form the river...although puzzled that how could a sieve be used to fetch water ( alternatively a Coal basket is also used - same effect) but he dutifully follows the Babas instructions....only to come to the foregone conclusion...Not a drop of water can be fetched via a sieve or coal basket !!..... and heres the TRICK "LESSON".....according to the baba Ji.."LOOK at the SIEVE.....( or coal basket)...isnt IT SHINING squeaky CLEAN !!..........well well..that what Gurbani can do to your Dirty Mann..even IF you just do the reading RITUALLY and for MONEY !!
But the problem is any ordinary sieve/coal basket WILL DEFINITELY becoem squeaky CLEAN after a few dips in the RIVER.....BUT it doesnt seem to be happening the same way with GRANTHIS and PATHIS..etc....?? So whats the PROBLEM ?? why do we have so many DIRTY MINDED Granthis, sewadaars who spent LIFE TIMES listening to Gurbani..etc etc... why do we have Granthis raping 5 year olds..?? why do we have RAPIST BABAS who have tons of Gurbani under their belts (tied to keep their huge bellies in check )
The ANSWER is....while the SIEVE/COAL BASKET is being actually and physically WASHED ( as it should be..hence the result is predictory )..... "reading for MONEY/ulterior motive" is NOT washing the Mann just as simply WAVING the black coal basket OVER the river will NEVER make it clean no matter if done for a thousand years !! Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37585
So these Babas and Mahapurashs are actually CHEATING you....The Young man should have been advised to take the Coal basket to the River Bank and Wave it about....then ritual reading of Gurbani could be compared equitably....washing the basket and comparing it to ritual reading of gurbani is like apples and oranges...then the Young man could see that waving the basket is the same as ritualized reading of Gurbani..USELESS.
WE SIKHS LOVE to hear these Baba stories..BUT IGNORE the FACTS that Baba Guru Nanak set before us....MOOT pleetee kapparr hoeyeh..deh SABOON leayeh oh dhoiyeh....Bharieah matt papan ke saang..uh dhopeh navehn ke Raang.... DIRTY CLOTHES are washed with Soap and water....Dirty Manns are cleaned with Naam Raang...ACTION is needed...careful DOING ACTION..not parrotting....of Gurbani...
Last edited by Gyani Jarnail Singh; 14-Nov-2011 at 09:08 AM.
Reason: left out the quote:
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14-Nov-2011, 16:12 PM
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| | | | | Re: Akhand Paath and Sitting in Darbar Sahib
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishna Harry Bhaji
It would be hubris for the noob to march into their second ever Akhand Paath and disregard protocol. imho.
You can also read about Gurdwaras where they have multiple Akhand Paaths going on at the same time, where people do paath of Japji Sahib while the main Akhand Paath is going on. Very strange, very ritualistic. Perhaps there is a happy medium somewhere in there.
And it is a shame that some Gyanis can read so much paath and still be so consumed by greed and ignorance. What does that say about the power of Gurbani then? | Ishna Bhenji,
imho, it is this protocol that is dragging sikhism back to hinduism, I would listen to my heart, it will never let you down, and knows much more than those that consider themselves knowledgable | 
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